The Official Scottish Rugby Thread

[I like neeps]

Due to injuries Hutchinson has played at 12 in 3 of the last 4 Saints games, I was worried his defence wouldn't be up to it but he showed up really well. I will show my ignorance and admit I don't really know what choices Scotland have at centre for the summer fixtures, would there be any chance of him playing at 12 or is he only seen as a 13?

Scott 12 Hutch 13 would be my choice. Not sure if Lang is 12 or 13?

So it looks as though they just forgot about Hutch and have remembered they have a decent centre there.

Lang wants to be a 10, should be best suited to 12, is actually probably a better 13. He's not great though and has had a very poor season. I'll be very surprised if he kicks on any time soon.

Hutchinson always strikes me as someone who struggles a bit with defence.

He's not a dominant defender but he's not a turnstile either. He's an incredible attacking player as well.

As a Quins fan would you rather have Hutch or Lang? Based on your Lang commantary I'm guessing Hutchinson. Same for Scotland fans!

[JM2K6]

Scott 12 Hutch 13 would be my choice. Not sure if Lang is 12 or 13?

So it looks as though they just forgot about Hutch and have remembered they have a decent centre there.

Lang wants to be a 10, should be best suited to 12, is actually probably a better 13. He's not great though and has had a very poor season. I'll be very surprised if he kicks on any time soon.

Hutchinson always strikes me as someone who struggles a bit with defence.

He's not a dominant defender but he's not a turnstile either. He's an incredible attacking player as well.

As a Quins fan would you rather have Hutch or Lang? Based on your Lang commantary I'm guessing Hutchinson. Same for Scotland fans!

Yes, Hutchinson. Lang really flatters to deceive and his final few outings for Quins were dire.

[Jock42]

Scott 12 Hutch 13 would be my choice. Not sure if Lang is 12 or 13?

So it looks as though they just forgot about Hutch and have remembered they have a decent centre there.

Lang wants to be a 10, should be best suited to 12, is actually probably a better 13. He's not great though and has had a very poor season. I'll be very surprised if he kicks on any time soon.

Hutchinson always strikes me as someone who struggles a bit with defence.

He's not a dominant defender but he's not a turnstile either. He's an incredible attacking player as well.

As a Quins fan would you rather have Hutch or Lang? Based on your Lang commantary I'm guessing Hutchinson. Same for Scotland fans!

Have you seen much of Lang? How does he compare to the current centres at Embra?

[I like neeps]

Lang wants to be a 10, should be best suited to 12, is actually probably a better 13. He's not great though and has had a very poor season. I'll be very surprised if he kicks on any time soon.

Hutchinson always strikes me as someone who struggles a bit with defence.

He's not a dominant defender but he's not a turnstile either. He's an incredible attacking player as well.

As a Quins fan would you rather have Hutch or Lang? Based on your Lang commantary I'm guessing Hutchinson. Same for Scotland fans!

Have you seen much of Lang? How does he compare to the current centres at Embra?

Have to say when I watch Quins I think he's fine but JMK knows better. He's definitely the weak spot in their very exciting backline.

Lang from what I've seen is a steady second distributor who can kick, can get on the outside and defends quite well. He's not running through anyone though. He has a much more rounded game than Taylor who is run hard and straight. And Dean who is capable of running, passing and defending well but never in the same match.

None are close to Hutchinson. Hutchinson is my favourite player to watch after Finn.

[westport]

U20's 6N broadcast details

Round 1 Saturday 19 June
Scotland v Ireland (kick-off 2pm)
Available to watch via BBC iPlayer and RTÉ One

Round 2 Friday 25 June
Scotland v England (kick-off 2pm)
Available to watch via BBC iPlayer, S4C Clic and the BBC Red Button

Round 3 Thursday 1 July
Scotland v Italy (kick-off 2pm)
Available to watch via BBC iPlayer, S4C Clic and the BBC Red Button

Round 4 Wednesday 7 July
Scotland v France (kick-off 5pm)
Available to watch via BBC iPlayer, S4C Clic, France4 and the BBC Red Button

Round 5 Tuesday 13 July
Scotland v Wales (kick-off 8pm)
Available to watch via BBC iPlayer and BBC Two Wales

[JM2K6]

He's not a dominant defender but he's not a turnstile either. He's an incredible attacking player as well.

As a Quins fan would you rather have Hutch or Lang? Based on your Lang commantary I'm guessing Hutchinson. Same for Scotland fans!

Have you seen much of Lang? How does he compare to the current centres at Embra?

Have to say when I watch Quins I think he's fine but JMK knows better. He's definitely the weak spot in their very exciting backline.

Lang from what I've seen is a steady second distributor who can kick, can get on the outside and defends quite well. He's not running through anyone though. He has a much more rounded game than Taylor who is run hard and straight. And Dean who is capable of running, passing and defending well but never in the same match.

None are close to Hutchinson. Hutchinson is my favourite player to watch after Finn.

Lang basically ended up as 3rd choice 13 (Marchant and Northmore are better), 3rd-ish choice 10 (Smith is better but Lang is probably better than Herron and Edwards, being fair), and 3rd/4th choice 12 (Esterhuizen/Lasike are preferred for bosh, Tapuai for defensive nous) by the end of the season.

He needs to pick a position and play there, which is presumably what he's going to get next season, then he might develop into a decent player. He doesn't have the brains / experience / nous to be a useful utility back at the moment, and looks particularly lost in defence. He has some skills and athleticism and he's still young, so there's time.

[clydecloggie]

Announcement on the future of the Pro14, to be renamed as United Rugby Championship.

Looks a pretty decent format for 16 teams.

Glasgow and Edinburgh to be in the orphan pool with the two Italian sides; you play the other teams in your pool home and away, and the other 12 teams once. Top 2 of each pool qualify for the quarter finals. Pool winner qualifies for the European Champions Cup, and after removing those four from the (otherwise meaningless) overall table, four more teams qualify for Europe.

Golden opportunity for Glasgow and Edinburgh to go on a good run, with essentially only Benetton to worry about in their pool.

Two out of Ulster, Munster, Leinster, Connacht will not qualify for URC knock-outs and, in all probability, Europe. Same goes for the Saffer teams.

[Big D]

Announcement on the future of the Pro14, to be renamed as United Rugby Championship.

Looks a pretty decent format for 16 teams.

Glasgow and Edinburgh to be in the orphan pool with the two Italian sides; you play the other teams in your pool home and away, and the other 12 teams once. Top 2 of each pool qualify for the quarter finals. Pool winner qualifies for the European Champions Cup, and after removing those four from the (otherwise meaningless) overall table, four more teams qualify for Europe.

Golden opportunity for Glasgow and Edinburgh to go on a good run, with essentially only Benetton to worry about in their pool.

Two out of Ulster, Munster, Leinster, Connacht will not qualify for URC knock-outs and, in all probability, Europe. Same goes for the Saffer teams.

I suppose the "United Rugby Championship" is better than "The we have to fit South African teams in somewhere championship".

[Jock42]

Due to injuries Hutchinson has played at 12 in 3 of the last 4 Saints games, I was worried his defence wouldn't be up to it but he showed up really well. I will show my ignorance and admit I don't really know what choices Scotland have at centre for the summer fixtures, would there be any chance of him playing at 12 or is he only seen as a 13?

Scott 12 Hutch 13 would be my choice. Not sure if Lang is 12 or 13?

So it looks as though they just forgot about Hutch and have remembered they have a decent centre there.

And they've both just been named in the team of the week but the other way round

[robmatic]

He's not a dominant defender but he's not a turnstile either. He's an incredible attacking player as well.

As a Quins fan would you rather have Hutch or Lang? Based on your Lang commantary I'm guessing Hutchinson. Same for Scotland fans!

Have you seen much of Lang? How does he compare to the current centres at Embra?

Have to say when I watch Quins I think he's fine but JMK knows better. He's definitely the weak spot in their very exciting backline.

Lang from what I've seen is a steady second distributor who can kick, can get on the outside and defends quite well. He's not running through anyone though. He has a much more rounded game than Taylor who is run hard and straight. And Dean who is capable of running, passing and defending well but never in the same match.

None are close to Hutchinson. Hutchinson is my favourite player to watch after Finn.

I wonder if Taylor will go back to 13 (think he played there for u20s?). Lang may not be outstanding, but having someone in the centres who can pass the ball will be a definite step up for Edinburgh.

[KingBlairhorn]

Announcement on the future of the Pro14, to be renamed as United Rugby Championship.

Looks a pretty decent format for 16 teams.

Glasgow and Edinburgh to be in the orphan pool with the two Italian sides; you play the other teams in your pool home and away, and the other 12 teams once. Top 2 of each pool qualify for the quarter finals. Pool winner qualifies for the European Champions Cup, and after removing those four from the (otherwise meaningless) overall table, four more teams qualify for Europe.

Golden opportunity for Glasgow and Edinburgh to go on a good run, with essentially only Benetton to worry about in their pool.

Two out of Ulster, Munster, Leinster, Connacht will not qualify for URC knock-outs and, in all probability, Europe. Same goes for the Saffer teams.

I suppose the "United Rugby Championship" is better than "The we have to fit South African teams in somewhere championship".

I'm looking forward to it - how could you not see the addition of 4 super rugby sides including a slew of recent world cup winners as anything but a positive. I think G and E definitely have an advantage for Heineken Cup qualification like Clyde says.

I believe the new format will cut down on the overlap with international weekends. There will still be players out with return to play protocols, however hopefully the disruption will be less.

Rumours that a significant element will be FTA. I would be surprised if they are moving away from Premier Sports but you never know.

[robmatic]

Just seen that the European Champions Cup will keep that horrific 24 team format for next season so I'm taking back all my reservations about the URC as it definitely won't be the worst cross-border competition.

[Big D]

I'm looking forward to it - how could you not see the addition of 4 super rugby sides including a slew of recent world cup winners as anything but a positive. I think G and E definitely have an advantage for Heineken Cup qualification like Clyde says.

I believe the new format will cut down on the overlap with international weekends. There will still be players out with return to play protocols, however hopefully the disruption will be less.

Rumours that a significant element will be FTA. I would be surprised if they are moving away from Premier Sports but you never know.

It is a fair bit of turd (pro xx) polishing. It isn't going to solve the issues with the pro xx. The fixture list will have an unfair impact on the season unless planned properly, if it can be, because between say the AIs and European games there is no way teams are sending full squads to SA.

Then there is the increased travel for players, still unlikely to see full strength teams as regularly as the league really needs, playing 4 games v the Italian teams, and this type of format in various guises have failed before.

[Tichtheid]

I'm looking forward to it - how could you not see the addition of 4 super rugby sides including a slew of recent world cup winners as anything but a positive. I think G and E definitely have an advantage for Heineken Cup qualification like Clyde says.

I believe the new format will cut down on the overlap with international weekends. There will still be players out with return to play protocols, however hopefully the disruption will be less.

Rumours that a significant element will be FTA. I would be surprised if they are moving away from Premier Sports but you never know.

It is a fair bit of turd (pro xx) polishing. It isn't going to solve the issues with the pro xx. The fixture list will have an unfair impact on the season unless planned properly, if it can be, because between say the AIs and European games there is no way teams are sending full squads to SA.

Then there is the increased travel for players, still unlikely to see full strength teams as regularly as the league really needs, playing 4 games v the Italian teams, and this type of format in various guises have failed before.

The only "fair" way to do it with 16 teams would be to have a two-tier league system, top 8, lower 8, 16 fixtures home and away, promotion and relegation.

There is no way on earth that would fly.

This proposed set up is a long way off perfect, but I can't see how else it could have been done

[Big D]

I'm looking forward to it - how could you not see the addition of 4 super rugby sides including a slew of recent world cup winners as anything but a positive. I think G and E definitely have an advantage for Heineken Cup qualification like Clyde says.

I believe the new format will cut down on the overlap with international weekends. There will still be players out with return to play protocols, however hopefully the disruption will be less.

Rumours that a significant element will be FTA. I would be surprised if they are moving away from Premier Sports but you never know.

It is a fair bit of turd (pro xx) polishing. It isn't going to solve the issues with the pro xx. The fixture list will have an unfair impact on the season unless planned properly, if it can be, because between say the AIs and European games there is no way teams are sending full squads to SA.

Then there is the increased travel for players, still unlikely to see full strength teams as regularly as the league really needs, playing 4 games v the Italian teams, and this type of format in various guises have failed before.

The only "fair" way to do it with 16 teams would be to have a two-tier league system, top 8, lower 8, 16 fixtures home and away, promotion and relegation.

There is no way on earth that would fly.

This proposed set up is a long way off perfect, but I can't see how else it could have been done

And that is my point, it didn't need to happen. It is being done for two reasons, one of which feeds into the other. The SA sides need somewhere to play and will bring with them TV money, which is fine but it isn't going to help when teams start rotating there squad during the season to avoid international players being burnt out.

It is also potentially damaging to ever having both Edinburgh and Glasgow in the big European cup/United rugby nations cup or whatever they will call it when the SA teams are in it. Which for the long term outlook of Scottish Rugby is far from ideal.

[Big D]

I think G and E definitely have an advantage for Heineken Cup qualification like Clyde says.

In the short term it does. Long term it'll hamper the chances of both getting into the big cup.

[mos_eisely_]

Interesting to see that they're saying there won't be URC matches on International weekends

[Jock42]

McBurney comes in for Cherry who has a hand injury.

Scotland A match on Channel 4 on 27th at 1400.

[KingBlairhorn]

I think G and E definitely have an advantage for Heineken Cup qualification like Clyde says.

In the short term it does. Long term it'll hamper the chances of both getting into the big cup.

Why? One guaranteed from each group (which you would hope would be one of our teams). The other has an opportunity for up to 20 significantly easier points than the likes of Irish and SA second placed team. You would think the Welsh have a distinct advantage also with their perennially shit pro teams.

[Begbie]

I'm fairly certain he hasn't, but has Watson ever been used as a lineout jumper before? Just caught a clip of the Lions training and he's the jumper. Could be interesting.

[Yr Alban]

I'm fairly certain he hasn't, but has Watson ever been used as a lineout jumper before? Just caught a clip of the Lions training and he's the jumper. Could be interesting.

The cynic in me says this will be the excuse used for picking one of the others.

[Big D]

I think G and E definitely have an advantage for Heineken Cup qualification like Clyde says.

In the short term it does. Long term it'll hamper the chances of both getting into the big cup.

Why? One guaranteed from each group (which you would hope would be one of our teams). The other has an opportunity for up to 20 significantly easier points than the likes of Irish and SA second placed team. You would think the Welsh have a distinct advantage also with their perennially shit pro teams.

At the moment it is 8 from 12. When the SA teams are allowed to qualify it is 8 from 16 with 4 tougher games on the ledger. These will be far better equipped teams than the previous SA teams that entered the league.

Those 20 points, assuming E and G take 20 points which is a big assumption would be eaten up pretty quickly. The class sides; the SA sides and top 3 Irish sides are likely to pick up 10 v them (in this hypothetical "everyone pumps the Italian teams" scenario). Then E and G have to play all the other sides.

I don't think it is possible for 4 from a conference to get in but the SA and 3 Irish teams will pick up plenty points.

Under this last seasons system we are more likely to see both sides in the big cup.

[Tichtheid]

I wouldn't object to Edinburgh getting better, good enough to be top eight in a league including the SA teams, then we might have a chance of doing something in Europe.

[robmatic]

We might even see a different focus to the season if our domestic competition is more competitive, provides decent TV money and has more media attention than we have become accustomed to with the various Celtic leagues.

[Biffer]

We might even see a different focus to the season if our domestic competition is more competitive, provides decent TV money and has more media attention than we have become accustomed to with the various Celtic leagues.

Also, fewer games means that points matter more so less likely to see sides field weakened teams.

18 league games + 11 internationals + minimum 2 european games is 31. As opposed to the previous 35. If you’re aiming for 28-30 games max for a player, then far less need for missing games for big names.

[Slick]

I'm more worried about the inevitable coming of the 7 Nations than this.

[Begbie]

I'm more worried about the inevitable coming of the 7 Nations than this.

Aye, same here.

[KingBlairhorn]

In the short term it does. Long term it'll hamper the chances of both getting into the big cup.

Why? One guaranteed from each group (which you would hope would be one of our teams). The other has an opportunity for up to 20 significantly easier points than the likes of Irish and SA second placed team. You would think the Welsh have a distinct advantage also with their perennially shit pro teams.

At the moment it is 8 from 12. When the SA teams are allowed to qualify it is 8 from 16 with 4 tougher games on the ledger. These will be far better equipped teams than the previous SA teams that entered the league.

Those 20 points, assuming E and G take 20 points which is a big assumption would be eaten up pretty quickly. The class sides; the SA sides and top 3 Irish sides are likely to pick up 10 v them (in this hypothetical "everyone pumps the Italian teams" scenario). Then E and G have to play all the other sides.

I don't think it is possible for 4 from a conference to get in but the SA and 3 Irish teams will pick up plenty points.

Under this last seasons system we are more likely to see both sides in the big cup.

I think a lot will depend on the detail of the fixture list - how equitable will that be? If one of our teams end up playing Munster, Leinster, Bulls, Sharks etc. all away in the same season then it will be tough. At the end of the day though, one Scottish team should be more or less guaranteed qualification which is the same as now. The other gets a big head start over the other tougher groups which they don't have now, it seems to me that there is an advantage there. I agree however, that it will be very very tough to take one of the other 4 champs cup places - there will be some excellent teams missing out. A mate of mine who is an Ulster fan, for instance, sees it being much harder now for them to qualify. At the heart of this though is a simply question; if Edinburgh/Glasgow can't even finish mid table in the league, why should we expect them to qualify for Europe?

[KingBlairhorn]

I'm more worried about the inevitable coming of the 7 Nations than this.

Aye, same here.

I, for one, welcome our new South African overlords.

[KingBlairhorn]

Why? One guaranteed from each group (which you would hope would be one of our teams). The other has an opportunity for up to 20 significantly easier points than the likes of Irish and SA second placed team. You would think the Welsh have a distinct advantage also with their perennially shit pro teams.

At the moment it is 8 from 12. When the SA teams are allowed to qualify it is 8 from 16 with 4 tougher games on the ledger. These will be far better equipped teams than the previous SA teams that entered the league.

Those 20 points, assuming E and G take 20 points which is a big assumption would be eaten up pretty quickly. The class sides; the SA sides and top 3 Irish sides are likely to pick up 10 v them (in this hypothetical "everyone pumps the Italian teams" scenario). Then E and G have to play all the other sides.

I don't think it is possible for 4 from a conference to get in but the SA and 3 Irish teams will pick up plenty points.

Under this last seasons system we are more likely to see both sides in the big cup.

I think a lot will depend on the detail of the fixture list - how equitable will that be? If one of our teams end up playing Munster, Leinster, Bulls, Sharks etc. all away in the same season then it will be tough. At the end of the day though, one Scottish team should be more or less guaranteed qualification which is the same as now. The other gets a big head start over the other tougher groups which they don't have now, it seems to me that there is an advantage there. I agree however, that it will be very very tough to take one of the other 4 champs cup places - there will be some excellent teams missing out. A mate of mine who is an Ulster fan, for instance, sees it being much harder now for them to qualify. At the heart of this though is a simply question; if Edinburgh/Glasgow can't even finish mid table in the league, why should we expect them to qualify for Europe?

Just to add to this - my understanding is that we play the teams in our group home and away. We then follow that by playing all teams home or away. That means three games a season against each of Zebre, Bennetton and Einburgh/Glasgow. That's a big advantage over say, Ulster, who have three games a season against each of Leinster, Munster and Connacht.

[Biffer]

At the moment it is 8 from 12. When the SA teams are allowed to qualify it is 8 from 16 with 4 tougher games on the ledger. These will be far better equipped teams than the previous SA teams that entered the league.

Those 20 points, assuming E and G take 20 points which is a big assumption would be eaten up pretty quickly. The class sides; the SA sides and top 3 Irish sides are likely to pick up 10 v them (in this hypothetical "everyone pumps the Italian teams" scenario). Then E and G have to play all the other sides.

I don't think it is possible for 4 from a conference to get in but the SA and 3 Irish teams will pick up plenty points.

Under this last seasons system we are more likely to see both sides in the big cup.

I think a lot will depend on the detail of the fixture list - how equitable will that be? If one of our teams end up playing Munster, Leinster, Bulls, Sharks etc. all away in the same season then it will be tough. At the end of the day though, one Scottish team should be more or less guaranteed qualification which is the same as now. The other gets a big head start over the other tougher groups which they don't have now, it seems to me that there is an advantage there. I agree however, that it will be very very tough to take one of the other 4 champs cup places - there will be some excellent teams missing out. A mate of mine who is an Ulster fan, for instance, sees it being much harder now for them to qualify. At the heart of this though is a simply question; if Edinburgh/Glasgow can't even finish mid table in the league, why should we expect them to qualify for Europe?

Just to add to this - my understanding is that we play the teams in our group home and away. We then follow that by playing all teams home or away. That means three games a season against each of Zebre, Bennetton and Einburgh/Glasgow. That's a big advantage over say, Ulster, who have three games a season against each of Leinster, Munster and Connacht.

Don't think so - it's everyone in our group home and away then everyone else home or away. 6 games in the group plus 12 games outside the group gives 18 which lines up with the 9 home games in the season ticket.

[charltom]

You've mis-read it.

It's home and away against the three teams in our pool.
It's home or away against the other 12 teams.

You don't play anyone three times unless you meet them in the playoffs.

[Jock42]

Super 6 back at the end of next month. Definitely making the effort to get to a match or 2.

[Slick]

Fantastic! Will also be making some big efforts.

More excited than I necessarily should be actually!

[Tichtheid]

Fantastic! Will also be making some big efforts.

More excited than I necessarily should be actually!

it's the prospect of getting to see live sport, at last.

A nine hundred mile round trip every week is a bit too much for me, unfortunately, though I will get to see one or two rounds.

[I like neeps]

Summer rugby! Finally!!

[Biffer]

Great news. A bit of good weather in August could make for a few grand days out. Three grounds to choose from in Edinburgh and maybe a wee day trip to Melrose.

[KingBlairhorn]

You've mis-read it.

It's home and away against the three teams in our pool.
It's home or away against the other 12 teams.

You don't play anyone three times unless you meet them in the playoffs.

Less a case of misreading and more a case of being a bit dense I think.

[Big D]

At the heart of this though is a simply question; if Edinburgh/Glasgow can't even finish mid table in the league, why should we expect them to qualify for Europe?

I never said it shouldn't be merit based.

My point was longer term it is less likely that both Edinburgh and Glasgow make the big European cup.

[Big D]

Skinner out of the tour suspended.