So, coronavirus...

Where goats go to escape
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laurent
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Raggs wrote: Mon Jun 14, 2021 12:37 pm
laurent wrote: Mon Jun 14, 2021 9:06 am
Slick wrote: Mon Jun 14, 2021 8:43 am Just had to rearrange the date for my 2nd jag which was meant to be next week - nothing available in the Lothian NHS until after the end of July :eek:

Stupid Moderna.

Off to the Hydro for me.
You dont' get the appointment with the 1st ?

That's kind of odd for planning.

Take up in younger groups is good in France so far.

https://www.lemonde.fr/les-decodeurs/ar ... navigator1
I'd expect take-up to look good for any age group at first, since everyone that wants it, can sign up and get it. What's concerning is the drop off level seems to be 80% for 65+ and potentially (not clear yet) lower for those younger. Indian variant is looking like it needs pretty high % uptake to be blocked. Is France going to get there?
We have blocked the English types early this time :P

flight from India were closed early and current infection rates keep dropping to a manageable level (Tracking is improving also as the phone tracing app is needed to hold your vaccination and to go to restaurants).
Ovals
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I like neeps wrote: Mon Jun 14, 2021 9:39 am
tabascoboy wrote: Mon Jun 14, 2021 7:40 am A sensible move ( given the failure to close borders in time ) but this king of thing doen't exactly help stop the resentment of many

Absolutely nobody is still following the rules though so there's no example to set.

It's just sad for the hospitality industry - euros and great weather they'd have made a good little sum of money next month.
I've just been into Southampton for the 1st time in about 18 months - I was surprised at how well people were following the SD and mask guidelines - all very disciplined and respectful.

Disappointing that They let the Delta variant in and it has cost us another 4 weeks of restrictions. Piss poor piece of Government.
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Marylandolorian
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An other good news, they’ll be able to produce 150 million doses monthly next quarters.

American biotechnology company Novavax announced Monday that its experimental COVID-19 vaccine was more than 90% effective against symptomatic disease in late-stage clinical trials.

Results from the Phase 3 trial, which enrolled nearly 30,000 participants across 119 sites in the United States and Mexico, show Novavax's recombinant protein-based vaccine, called NVX-CoV2373, provided 100% protection against moderate and severe cases of COVID-19, with an overall efficacy of 90.4%, according to a company press release.

https://abcnews.go.com/Health/novavax-a ... e_hero_hed
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Saint
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Marylandolorian wrote: Mon Jun 14, 2021 3:05 pm An other good news, they’ll be able to produce 150 million doses monthly next quarters.

American biotechnology company Novavax announced Monday that its experimental COVID-19 vaccine was more than 90% effective against symptomatic disease in late-stage clinical trials.

Results from the Phase 3 trial, which enrolled nearly 30,000 participants across 119 sites in the United States and Mexico, show Novavax's recombinant protein-based vaccine, called NVX-CoV2373, provided 100% protection against moderate and severe cases of COVID-19, with an overall efficacy of 90.4%, according to a company press release.

https://abcnews.go.com/Health/novavax-a ... e_hero_hed
Novovax have been struggling to bring UK manufacturing online since they announced their UK interim results - which is partly why they've not even approached the UK or US for authorisation yet. However, more vaccine uses more production facilities so can be brought online far faster than building new plants.
dpedin
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dpedin wrote: Fri May 28, 2021 1:24 pm
Sandstorm wrote: Fri May 28, 2021 12:50 pm
BnM wrote: Fri May 28, 2021 7:52 am Average age of those infected is 29. Which on one level is great, shows the impact on vaccines. On the other hand it calls into question the lifting of restrictions next month. There's a big Palestine march in Bradford planned for this weekend....
But it also shows that Bimbot is a dickhead when he claimed that the virus only kills old people. Lots of new admissions in the 30-39 age group in serious condition.

I suspect they were careful for a year to keep Mum and Grandad safe. Soon as the elderly got jabbed, their grown up kids forgot all about restrictions and started socialising all over. Plus back to school for their own children....
Now that we have a more virulent version of the virus dominant and spreading fast it would be sensible to not lift lockdown in June and try and get ahead with the vaccination programme. Whilst younger folk are a lot less likely to die of covid19, if we lift lockdown now we will just see lots and lots of cases and after that it's a numbers game - a % will need hospitalisation and a % of them will die. There is also the no small matter of long covid and possibly consigning young folk to many weeks or months of potentially serious ongoing health problems. With schools/colleges back and no plans to vaccinated u16s then we have an ideal environment in schools and colleges for the virus to spread asymptomatically across the wider community. It would make more sense to retain current lock down arrangements until schools finish up?

I see, as predicted, that EU countries and others are now thinking twice about allowing UK citizens to travel because of the Indian variant now being dominant. I just hope the Blonde Bumblecunt is satisfied with yet another major covid blunder! How much better position would we be in if he had closed the border to Indian travel and put in the proper isolation requirements at the right time, at the very least we would have bought a few extra weeks/months to get further ahead with the vaccination programme. He really is a useless Cnut of the first order!
Looks like the scientists won the battle! No easing of lock down for another 4 weeks. Thank feck for that.

As I warned back on 21st May the modelling was done and showed the (now called) Delta variant was a major risk heading into July/August. This was well known back in mid May and this decision could have been taken weeks ago but of course the G7 meeting was coming up and the Blonde Bumbelcunt didnt want to make any announcement before this meeting. So lets pretend we are waiting for the 'new data' when in reality this decision was made weeks ago. Also interesting the scientists are now talking about links with schools and colleges which have been acting like a covid clearing house for the new Delta variant. Still feel pretty uneasy about the assumption that kids are not affected by covid and it would appear we are trying to achieve herd immunity in u16s by stealth! On herd immunity the new variant's increased transmissibility would suggest we need to vaccinate in excess of 85% of pop.

I suspect the spread of the Delta variant is going to put us in the naughty corner for a lot of international travel for many weeks now. I would remain cautious about booking a summer holiday abroad.

Hope a journalist asks him at the briefing if not putting India into the Red early enough was worth it for the new trade deal he was hoping to get with Modi! He really is a useless and dangerous Cnut! We were so close to easing lock down and the useless Cnut, by not putting India into the red zone because of his own political post Brexit agenda, has completely fecked this up.
dpedin
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Why did GB News get to ask a question yet many others ie Beth Rigby from Sky not get a question?
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The Druid
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Just be thankfull that Peston did not appear.
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BnM
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COVID-19 vaccines made by Pfizer (PFE.N) and AstraZeneca (AZN.L) offer high protection of more than 90% against hospitalisation from the Delta coronavirus variant, a new analysis by Public Health England (PHE) showed on Monday.

PHE said that the Pfizer/Biontech COVID-19 vaccine was 96% effective against hospitalisation from the Delta variant after two doses, while Oxford/AstraZeneca's offered 92% protection against hospitalisation by Delta.

PHE said that those levels of protection were comparable to that against the Alpha variant, first identified in Kent, southeast England.

The analysis adds to evidence that, although the Delta variant reduces the effectiveness of vaccines against symptomatic infection, two doses of COVID-19 vaccine still protect against severe disease.
:thumbup:
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Marylandolorian
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^

Right now, about 10% of Covid-19 cases in the US can be attributed to the Delta variant, but that proportion is doubling every two weeks. They say that the Delta variant will probably take over as the dominant strain of coronavirus in the US..
Could be a major problem in the South where only 30% of the population has been vaccinated, (republican states). In my state 71% of the adult pop got at least 1 shot & 56% fully vax
Biffer
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Raggs wrote: Mon Jun 14, 2021 12:37 pm
laurent wrote: Mon Jun 14, 2021 9:06 am
Slick wrote: Mon Jun 14, 2021 8:43 am Just had to rearrange the date for my 2nd jag which was meant to be next week - nothing available in the Lothian NHS until after the end of July :eek:

Stupid Moderna.

Off to the Hydro for me.
You dont' get the appointment with the 1st ?

That's kind of odd for planning.

Take up in younger groups is good in France so far.

https://www.lemonde.fr/les-decodeurs/ar ... navigator1
I'd expect take-up to look good for any age group at first, since everyone that wants it, can sign up and get it. What's concerning is the drop off level seems to be 80% for 65+ and potentially (not clear yet) lower for those younger. Indian variant is looking like it needs pretty high % uptake to be blocked. Is France going to get there?
Where are you getting those drop off numbers? In Scotland the reported figures for second doses are over 95% for all the over 60 age bands, others are catching up (55-59 @ 83%, 50-54 66%, these still being worked through).
And are there two g’s in Bugger Off?
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Raggs
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Biffer wrote: Mon Jun 14, 2021 7:40 pm
Raggs wrote: Mon Jun 14, 2021 12:37 pm
laurent wrote: Mon Jun 14, 2021 9:06 am

You dont' get the appointment with the 1st ?

That's kind of odd for planning.

Take up in younger groups is good in France so far.

https://www.lemonde.fr/les-decodeurs/ar ... navigator1
I'd expect take-up to look good for any age group at first, since everyone that wants it, can sign up and get it. What's concerning is the drop off level seems to be 80% for 65+ and potentially (not clear yet) lower for those younger. Indian variant is looking like it needs pretty high % uptake to be blocked. Is France going to get there?
Where are you getting those drop off numbers? In Scotland the reported figures for second doses are over 95% for all the over 60 age bands, others are catching up (55-59 @ 83%, 50-54 66%, these still being worked through).
Talking about the French numbers, as posted by Laurent and linked in his post.
Give a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
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Insane_Homer
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Someone still needs to sober up after the big weekend bender on the south coast.

“Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true.”
Biffer
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Raggs wrote: Mon Jun 14, 2021 7:49 pm
Biffer wrote: Mon Jun 14, 2021 7:40 pm
Raggs wrote: Mon Jun 14, 2021 12:37 pm

I'd expect take-up to look good for any age group at first, since everyone that wants it, can sign up and get it. What's concerning is the drop off level seems to be 80% for 65+ and potentially (not clear yet) lower for those younger. Indian variant is looking like it needs pretty high % uptake to be blocked. Is France going to get there?
Where are you getting those drop off numbers? In Scotland the reported figures for second doses are over 95% for all the over 60 age bands, others are catching up (55-59 @ 83%, 50-54 66%, these still being worked through).
Talking about the French numbers, as posted by Laurent and linked in his post.
Ah, right 👍

Bit of me thinks that sending notification of separate appointments is more likely to get people to turn up for both. More cumbersome administratively but more effective. Needs a behavioural scientist to comment though...
And are there two g’s in Bugger Off?
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BnM
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22+ being invited from tomorrow. They need a text or letter before they can book.
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Openside
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BnM wrote: Tue Jun 15, 2021 9:38 am 22+ being invited from tomorrow. They need a text or letter before they can book.
My 21 yr SD old got a text from GP Surgery today, she is booked in tomorrow morning.
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Saint
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Local surgery announced today that they've now invited every 18+ in the town and local area, and their final first jab session is scheduled for this Friday. After that people can still get a first jab through a mass vax centre
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Raggs
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From the weekend, 18+ will be able to get their jabs here. Pretty happy with that. Will obviously take time to get them all done. Just Have to hope for high uptake and opening it up for 12-17 year olds now.
Give a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
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BnM
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I do wonder about potential conflict between parents and kids. Do they have the right to stop their kids getting vaccinated or to force them to?
Happyhooker
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BnM wrote: Tue Jun 15, 2021 9:25 pm I do wonder about potential conflict between parents and kids. Do they have the right to stop their kids getting vaccinated or to force them to?
What age are the kids??
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Saint
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BnM wrote: Tue Jun 15, 2021 9:25 pm I do wonder about potential conflict between parents and kids. Do they have the right to stop their kids getting vaccinated or to force them to?
In the UK the law is pretty clear as to who has responsibility/rights and when that's transferred from parents to the child.

15 and under, it's down to someone with parental responsibility. There are occasions where an under 16 is allowed to contest this, and there's a defined test to prove this. It would be an extremely rare case that would over-rule parental consent.

Once you hit 16, you are assumed to be able to provide performed consent, but if they refuse something that's offered and a medical professional or their parents believe it's the wrong choice, that's covered by the Mental Capacity Act of 2005 and for the Court of Protection to make a ruling. It usually needs fairly clear that the 16/17 year old doesn't have mental capacity to provide/deny consent - the presumption is that they do, so the onus is on the other party to prove otherwise.
Happyhooker
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Saint wrote: Tue Jun 15, 2021 10:31 pm
BnM wrote: Tue Jun 15, 2021 9:25 pm I do wonder about potential conflict between parents and kids. Do they have the right to stop their kids getting vaccinated or to force them to?
In the UK the law is pretty clear as to who has responsibility/rights and when that's transferred from parents to the child.

15 and under, it's down to someone with parental responsibility. There are occasions where an under 16 is allowed to contest this, and there's a defined test to prove this. It would be an extremely rare case that would over-rule parental consent.

Once you hit 16, you are assumed to be able to provide performed consent, but if they refuse something that's offered and a medical professional or their parents believe it's the wrong choice, that's covered by the Mental Capacity Act of 2005 and for the Court of Protection to make a ruling. It usually needs fairly clear that the 16/17 year old doesn't have mental capacity to provide/deny consent - the presumption is that they do, so the onus is on the other party to prove otherwise.
Having worked in mental health on the legal side (albeit quite a few years ago), what you say is technically correct, but I've seen it challenged and overturned on many an occasion (both up and down in the age groups)
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Saint
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Happyhooker wrote: Tue Jun 15, 2021 10:35 pm
Saint wrote: Tue Jun 15, 2021 10:31 pm
BnM wrote: Tue Jun 15, 2021 9:25 pm I do wonder about potential conflict between parents and kids. Do they have the right to stop their kids getting vaccinated or to force them to?
In the UK the law is pretty clear as to who has responsibility/rights and when that's transferred from parents to the child.

15 and under, it's down to someone with parental responsibility. There are occasions where an under 16 is allowed to contest this, and there's a defined test to prove this. It would be an extremely rare case that would over-rule parental consent.

Once you hit 16, you are assumed to be able to provide performed consent, but if they refuse something that's offered and a medical professional or their parents believe it's the wrong choice, that's covered by the Mental Capacity Act of 2005 and for the Court of Protection to make a ruling. It usually needs fairly clear that the 16/17 year old doesn't have mental capacity to provide/deny consent - the presumption is that they do, so the onus is on the other party to prove otherwise.
Having worked in mental health on the legal side (albeit quite a few years ago), what you say is technically correct, but I've seen it challenged and overturned on many an occasion (both up and down in the age groups)
Mental health is precisely where it's supposed to be challenged and why the laws exist.
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Margin__Walker
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You'd like to think it's not going to be an issue worth worrying too much about. Cases where there is any kind of conflict between child and parents will hopefully be statistically insignificant.
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Saint
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Margin__Walker wrote: Tue Jun 15, 2021 10:45 pm You'd like to think it's not going to be an issue worth worrying too much about. Cases where there is any kind of conflict between child and parents will hopefully be statistically insignificant.
That would be the expectation certainly. I suspect that you're more likely to see conflicts between the two parents (you only need one to consent), or when there's a local protection order and the parents have a different opinion to social services

EDIT - and right now it's still completely speculative. No vaccine is recommended yet in the UK for anyone under 18, and I suspect that they won't be unless the adult population rate isn't high enough for herd immunity. If something does become recommended it's likely only going to be for 16/17 year olds (on the basis they're likely to progress to the recommended list before this becomes a background issue anyway) unless there's a new variant which really does change the risk factor for younger children
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Raggs
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Think delta already changes the risk for children.

I suspect it'll be approved for 12+ soon but probably won't be the same push. I do hope it's widely taken up though since that's the problematic age range at the moment in terms of growing spread, and that will allow it to overcome herd immunity since the school population is almost a separate one to the country ideal.
Give a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
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Sandstorm
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Margin__Walker wrote: Tue Jun 15, 2021 10:45 pm You'd like to think it's not going to be an issue worth worrying too much about. Cases where there is any kind of conflict between child and parents will hopefully be statistically insignificant.
Except when it comes to Covid “statically insignificant” usually results in a massive stampede by many towards stupidity.
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Insane_Homer
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Getting a bit annoyed now with a first world problem.

had my first Vax in April (booked online, done at center near work).

GP surgery has now text spammed me 5 times since Friday, telling me to book vax appointment. Can't reply or make it stop.

I now have to waste my time and theirs by calling up (gone from 7th in the queue to 5th in 10 mins, so shouldn't take too long... :problem: ) to get them to update their fucking records & stop harassing me because apparently a £36 billion system can't cross reference.
“Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true.”
Biffer
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Insane_Homer wrote: Wed Jun 16, 2021 11:09 am Getting a bit annoyed now with a first world problem.

had my first Vax in April (booked online, done at center near work).

GP surgery has now text spammed me 5 times since Friday, telling me to book vax appointment. Can't reply or make it stop.

I now have to waste my time and theirs by calling up (gone from 7th in the queue to 5th in 10 mins, so shouldn't take too long... :problem: ) to get them to update their fucking records & stop harassing me because apparently a £36 billion system can't cross reference.
Are they not telling you to get your second one?
And are there two g’s in Bugger Off?
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Insane_Homer
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Biffer wrote: Wed Jun 16, 2021 11:15 am
Insane_Homer wrote: Wed Jun 16, 2021 11:09 am Getting a bit annoyed now with a first world problem.

had my first Vax in April (booked online, done at center near work).

GP surgery has now text spammed me 5 times since Friday, telling me to book vax appointment. Can't reply or make it stop.

I now have to waste my time and theirs by calling up (gone from 7th in the queue to 5th in 10 mins, so shouldn't take too long... :problem: ) to get them to update their fucking records & stop harassing me because apparently a £36 billion system can't cross reference.
Are they not telling you to get your second one?
Nope,
"This is a reminder to book your COVID-19 vaccinations"

& my second is booked for 1 July, so they should know that too.
“Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true.”
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Saint
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Insane_Homer wrote: Wed Jun 16, 2021 11:09 am Getting a bit annoyed now with a first world problem.

had my first Vax in April (booked online, done at center near work).

GP surgery has now text spammed me 5 times since Friday, telling me to book vax appointment. Can't reply or make it stop.

I now have to waste my time and theirs by calling up (gone from 7th in the queue to 5th in 10 mins, so shouldn't take too long... :problem: ) to get them to update their fucking records & stop harassing me because apparently a £36 billion system can't cross reference.
That's the surgeries platform not taking the feed correctly from the NHS
Dinsdale Piranha
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Saint wrote: Wed Jun 16, 2021 11:36 am
Insane_Homer wrote: Wed Jun 16, 2021 11:09 am Getting a bit annoyed now with a first world problem.

had my first Vax in April (booked online, done at center near work).

GP surgery has now text spammed me 5 times since Friday, telling me to book vax appointment. Can't reply or make it stop.

I now have to waste my time and theirs by calling up (gone from 7th in the queue to 5th in 10 mins, so shouldn't take too long... :problem: ) to get them to update their fucking records & stop harassing me because apparently a £36 billion system can't cross reference.
That's the surgeries platform not taking the feed correctly from the NHS
Something that has become apparent recently is the massive variation in quality of GP's computer systems. My practice computerised over 20 years ago and getting my vaccine booked and setting up the NHS app were trivial. I have friends who despite trying still can't see any of their records online and can't get the NHS app to work.

It is getting much better but there's still too many non automated processes in the NHS/GP's systems. I donated plasma yesterday and today got a reminder for my next appointment on friday - that's a big cock-up that required me to actually 'phone somebody to fix.
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Saint
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Dinsdale Piranha wrote: Wed Jun 16, 2021 11:45 am
Saint wrote: Wed Jun 16, 2021 11:36 am
Insane_Homer wrote: Wed Jun 16, 2021 11:09 am Getting a bit annoyed now with a first world problem.

had my first Vax in April (booked online, done at center near work).

GP surgery has now text spammed me 5 times since Friday, telling me to book vax appointment. Can't reply or make it stop.

I now have to waste my time and theirs by calling up (gone from 7th in the queue to 5th in 10 mins, so shouldn't take too long... :problem: ) to get them to update their fucking records & stop harassing me because apparently a £36 billion system can't cross reference.
That's the surgeries platform not taking the feed correctly from the NHS
Something that has become apparent recently is the massive variation in quality of GP's computer systems. My practice computerised over 20 years ago and getting my vaccine booked and setting up the NHS app were trivial. I have friends who despite trying still can't see any of their records online and can't get the NHS app to work.

It is getting much better but there's still too many non automated processes in the NHS/GP's systems. I donated plasma yesterday and today got a reminder for my next appointment on friday - that's a big cock-up that required me to actually 'phone somebody to fix.
The real issue is the enormous misconception that GPs are part of the NHS. They're private businesses who have contracts with the NHS over minimum services and standards they have to deliver
TheNatalShark
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CureVac's interim trial results show only a 47% effectiveness against sickness, so not boding well as another cheaper option, especially as they've been in pre-production for a few months now. Hopefully final results nudges above 50% and WHO approves so developing countries can get those produced doses

https://www.curevac.com/en/2021/06/16/c ... te-cvncov/
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Saint
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TheNatalShark wrote: Wed Jun 16, 2021 10:04 pm CureVac's interim trial results show only a 47% effectiveness against sickness, so not boding well as another cheaper option, especially as they've been in pre-production for a few months now. Hopefully final results nudges above 50% and WHO approves so developing countries can get those produced doses

https://www.curevac.com/en/2021/06/16/c ... te-cvncov/
Was Curevac supposed to be a lost cost option? They were talking about "ethical margins" but my understanding was that it would still be $40+ per dose - it's an mRNA so don't see any world where it's sub $10
TheNatalShark
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The initial price comes from the Belgian minister leak, suggesting standard €12 a shot back in Dec for
first world but as they began production CureVac have been making noises in the past few months about being able to outcompete Pfizer at price for the developing world market.

https://mobile.reuters.com/article/amp/idUSKBN2800IC

I forgot it's one the more closely associated Bill Gates ones. Ironic for the conspiracy theorists.
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Calculon
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Children in the UK unlikely to be vaccinated

https://www.bbc.com/news/health-57496074

Correct decision IMO
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Raggs
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Calculon wrote: Thu Jun 17, 2021 7:39 am Children in the UK unlikely to be vaccinated

https://www.bbc.com/news/health-57496074

Correct decision IMO
Why?

Delta variant leads to 1 in 100 children ending up in hospital.

That's not to mention the fact that delta variant pushes the % requirement for herd immunity up, to a point where we're unlikely to reach it with adults alone.

And the expert actually said: He said he was "veering towards not vaccinating children" because of the need to get the vaccine into the arms of more hard-to-reach adults instead.

So rather than using limited supplies on children, it was better to get it into adult arms first.
Give a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
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BnM
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Sometimes the vaccination isn't being recorded correctly against your NHS records. And it's GPs who either haven't been briefed or can't be arsed are referring people to 119 who can't do anything and have to refer them back. A lot of texts at the moment going out to encourage people to being their appointments closer to 8 weeks instead of 12 between them. Keep an eye on the NHS app and when that's showing the vaccine you know it's done correctly.
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TB63
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Daughter works for Track and Trace Wales, now advising 14 day isolation due to Delta variant..

Also, a lot more cases than are being reported in the news....
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BnM
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TB63 wrote: Thu Jun 17, 2021 9:16 am Daughter works for Track and Trace Wales, now advising 14 day isolation due to Delta variant..

Also, a lot more cases than are being reported in the news....
If you have symptoms or a positive test you can't book an appointment for 28 days. Really strict about it. Hospitalisations have slightly gone up in my area but they were at zero for weeks. Death rate seems good though still.
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