The Official English Rugby Thread

[inactionman]

Tom Youngs on indefinite leave from Tigers to care for his wife who is ill again

Leicester and ex-England hooker Tom Youngs is taking indefinite leave from the club to look after his ill wife.
The 34-year-old has not played this season and has been replaced as club captain by Ellis Genge.
"Tigers are offering support in all forms to Tom and the Youngs family during this period," the club said.
Tiffany Youngs was diagnosed with cancer in 2014 and Tom pulled out of England's tour of New Zealand that year to care for her.

Cancer can feck off. Horrible, horrible illness, thought the poor girl was through it but it's a bastard to get shot of.

[JM2K6]

Tom Youngs on indefinite leave from Tigers to care for his wife who is ill again

Leicester and ex-England hooker Tom Youngs is taking indefinite leave from the club to look after his ill wife.
The 34-year-old has not played this season and has been replaced as club captain by Ellis Genge.
"Tigers are offering support in all forms to Tom and the Youngs family during this period," the club said.
Tiffany Youngs was diagnosed with cancer in 2014 and Tom pulled out of England's tour of New Zealand that year to care for her.

Cancer can feck off. Horrible, horrible illness, thought the poor girl was through it but it's a bastard to get shot of.

Yeah, fucking hell. Fingers crossed for her.

[JM2K6]

Yeah. Watched the game and Malins is a real livewire on the wing, but you don't want him to have to make too many tackles like the one he missed on Muir.

Anyway, squad's up:



So the missing players stay missing. Dan Robson binned. Ollie Lawrence binned. Some strange selections (Furbank is all over the place at the moment; Callum Chick is not impressive. Nic Dolly? Trevor Davison?)

Can't see Watson being there, if eyeball diagnosis from Sunday is worth anything.

Give Lynagh a chance?

It's too soon for Radwan, let alone Lynagh.

[ASMO]

Manu will be broken again before the games Ewels? Furbank and Hill? And dont get me started on Youngs

[JM2K6]

Oh, no Marchant either, which considering he was making England squads before and has since gone up a level is a curious one.

[inactionman]

Yeah. Watched the game and Malins is a real livewire on the wing, but you don't want him to have to make too many tackles like the one he missed on Muir.

Anyway, squad's up:



So the missing players stay missing. Dan Robson binned. Ollie Lawrence binned. Some strange selections (Furbank is all over the place at the moment; Callum Chick is not impressive. Nic Dolly? Trevor Davison?)

Can't see Watson being there, if eyeball diagnosis from Sunday is worth anything.

Give Lynagh a chance?

It's too soon for Radwan, let alone Lynagh.

Was being a bit cheeky and thinking we could pin him to England, just in case.

[SaintK]

Oh, no Marchant either, which considering he was making England squads before and has since gone up a level is a curious one.

I'm amazed that Freeman has been selected ahead of him

[sockwithaticket]

Yeah. Watched the game and Malins is a real livewire on the wing, but you don't want him to have to make too many tackles like the one he missed on Muir.

Anyway, squad's up:



So the missing players stay missing. Dan Robson binned. Ollie Lawrence binned. Some strange selections (Furbank is all over the place at the moment; Callum Chick is not impressive. Nic Dolly? Trevor Davison?)

Felt England have missed Underhill but that latest bath result not exactly an advert for him.

He had some strong moments individually, as did a few others. I'd wager he and Watson will be absolutely fine slotted into the England team.

[Kawazaki]

This is peak Eddiot Jones.

Pig-headed, egotistical narcissistic fuckwit.

[sockwithaticket]

Oh, no Marchant either, which considering he was making England squads before and has since gone up a level is a curious one.

I'm amazed that Freeman has been selected ahead of him

I want to know what Slade does in training to keep getting selected. Marchant's a much more useful 13 option. If we play Farrell at 12 then you need a quick and or boshy strike runner outside him. Farrell/Slade just doesn't work and the latter's always been a bit underwhelming in the red rose while also currently being underwhelming for his club.


With my Wasps hat on I've no idea what Randall and Youngs have over Robson. Randall might be the better player someday, but he isn't yet.

Some of those forward selections are incredibly underwhelming. Chick?! What have Hill or Ewels done to show that they should be there? If Maro and LCD don't make it the Saffas will make mince of our tight five.

No Ford is absolute joke shop. Farrell is 12 or nothing at international level these days. Ford and Smith should be the squad's fly halves.

[Oxbow]

Who the hell is Nic Dolly, genuinely never heard of him. From a Saints perspective, not sure how Furbank is in there, and Freeman has only just come back from injury and shouldn't really be in the squad yet despite his obvious talent. I get the feeling that Eddie can be quite a petty man, Dave Ribbans was a shoo-in for the squad before he picked up his ban at the end of last season, now he can't get a look in, but shite like Ewels keep getting picked.

[Kawazaki]

Who the hell is Nic Dolly, genuinely never heard of him. From a Saints perspective, not sure how Furbank is in there, and Freeman has only just come back from injury and shouldn't really be in the squad yet despite his obvious talent. I get the feeling that Eddie can be quite a petty man, Dave Ribbans was a shoo-in for the squad before he picked up his ban at the end of last season, now he can't get a look in, but shite like Ewels keep getting picked.

The description petty doesn't even get close. He went past petty about 4 years ago.

[JM2K6]

Slade, for all his faults, has actually improved his running game this year. He has three tries already this season and has reeled off some pretty big breaks at times. He's a talent, but he's a defensive liability with a penchant for expensive mistakes and I don't know how much I trust him to stand up and be counted in a tough game.

There's so many players who've been surprisingly binned off that I can't help but think this is some ridiculous sacrificial squad designed to justify going back to the old guard as soon as we put in a ropey performance or two.

[Madness]

Traditional 23 missed out/injury/omitted, getting back to the stage where this would be the better team

Vunipola
George
Williams
Launchbury
Isiekwe
Willis
Curry
Vunipola

Robson
Ford
Daly
Lozowksi
Lawrence
Cokanasiga
Nowell


West, Barbeary, Heyes, Hill, Earls, Spencer, Simmonds, Marchant

[SaintK]

Who the hell is Nic Dolly, genuinely never heard of him. From a Saints perspective, not sure how Furbank is in there, and Freeman has only just come back from injury and shouldn't really be in the squad yet despite his obvious talent. I get the feeling that Eddie can be quite a petty man, Dave Ribbans was a shoo-in for the squad before he picked up his ban at the end of last season, now he can't get a look in, but shite like Ewels keep getting picked.

I'd forgotten Ribbans was the next lock off the rank in the summer until his ban
Ewels was very poor for Bath yesterday both as a lock and a captain. In fact he was hooked off at about 60 minutes! Yet another one that JOnes sees something in and everyone else doesn't!!!

[Torquemada 1420]

I don't even know who Blamire is!!

Looks weak........


{EDIT} This is very un-Jones like. Wholesale clear-outs and trusting in newbies. Has he had an epiphany or too many stims?

[inactionman]

Who the hell is Nic Dolly, genuinely never heard of him. From a Saints perspective, not sure how Furbank is in there, and Freeman has only just come back from injury and shouldn't really be in the squad yet despite his obvious talent. I get the feeling that Eddie can be quite a petty man, Dave Ribbans was a shoo-in for the squad before he picked up his ban at the end of last season, now he can't get a look in, but shite like Ewels keep getting picked.

I'd forgotten Ribbans was the next lock off the rank in the summer until his ban
Ewels was very poor for Bath yesterday both as a lock and a captain. In fact he was hooked off at about 60 minutes! Yet another one that JOnes sees something in and everyone else doesn't!!!

Ewels is a good player, the performance yesterday was poor but this goes above any one player (or the captain, for that matter).

I'm not sure I've seen a run of performances that would indicate England regular at this point, although he has had a fair few good games so he's not without merit - bear in mind Bath played well immediately post lockdown. It seems he gets a bit of stick which I'm not sure is always fair, almost like he's being knocked for not being Itoje.

[JM2K6]

I think he's knocked for doing fuck-all in pretty much every single England game. What does he do well?!

[Margin__Walker]

I don't even know who Blamire is!!

Looks weak........


{EDIT} This is very un-Jones like. Wholesale clear-outs and trusting in newbies. Has he had an epiphany or too many stims?

Probably because Newcastle games are seldom televised.

[JM2K6]

Yeah, if you've watched Newcastle then Blamire shows up pretty well for them. I don't know if he's really international quality yet, but he did play pretty well for England in the summer, too.

Callum Chick on the other hand is one of those players I just don't get.

[Margin__Walker]

Yeah, I'd have Tom Willis in before Chick.

Although Chick did have a cracking game last time I watched him (which was actually last season as Newcastle are never on TV...)

[Kawazaki]

I'm not sure I've seen a run of performances that would indicate England regular at this point, although he has had a fair few good games so he's not without merit - bear in mind Bath played well immediately post lockdown. It seems he gets a bit of stick which I'm not sure is always fair, almost like he's being knocked for not being Itoje.

It just always comes back to selection inconsistency from Jones. He says he has no interest at all in club form, that it's a poor indicator of who will be a good test player. So what is his yardstick? Summer test matches against USA and Canada. Opposition that would struggle to stay in the top half of the Championship. And then there's his blind spots, players that are undroppable regardless of club or test form who keep out players in better form and/or hamstring the team to crowbar them in. And then there are those that are lauded by the press and fans that he just ignores as if to spite them that he knows better. And of course there's the abysmal succession management. The drop off in certain positions is massive because he's just ignored options for years. His record with assistant coaches is similarly risible.

He's the greatest clear and present danger to English rugby in the last 20 years in my opinion. He's out of control, an ego looking for a weekly fix. As long as he remains in control of the England team then forget winning again.

[JM2K6]

Yeah, I'd have Tom Willis in before Chick.

Although Chick did have a cracking game last time I watched him (which was actually last season as Newcastle are never on TV...)

I was happy to consider Willis right up until Dallaglio started making out he was playing as well as Simmonds & Dombrandt, and demanded he be included (just before Simmonds started freestyling all over Wasps)

[Margin__Walker]

Yeah, I'd have Tom Willis in before Chick.

Although Chick did have a cracking game last time I watched him (which was actually last season as Newcastle are never on TV...)

I was happy to consider Willis right up until Dallaglio started making out he was playing as well as Simmonds & Dombrandt, and demanded he be included (just before Simmonds started freestyling all over Wasps)

Ha, fair enough.

Agree on Blamire btw. Good lively prem player, but I'm not sure whether his ceiling is too much higher than that

[JM2K6]

Yeah, I'd have Tom Willis in before Chick.

Although Chick did have a cracking game last time I watched him (which was actually last season as Newcastle are never on TV...)

I was happy to consider Willis right up until Dallaglio started making out he was playing as well as Simmonds & Dombrandt, and demanded he be included (just before Simmonds started freestyling all over Wasps)

Ha, fair enough.

Agree on Blamire btw. Good lively prem player, but I'm not sure whether his ceiling is too much higher than that

I think he might well be good enough in future, just seems like an odd time to get him in at the expense of an experienced quality international like Jamie George, who seems to be carrying the can for the failings of his teammates and a slight dip in his own form. George is still the second best hooker in the country...

[sockwithaticket]

It seems extra weird to bin the likes of George and Ford when players like Youngs and Farrell have managed to go for extended periods with indifferent form yet being undroppable.

[Kawazaki]

It seems extra weird to bin the likes of George and Ford when players like Youngs and Farrell have managed to go for extended periods with indifferent form yet being undroppable.

Weirder still to watch Bath get beaten 17-71 at home on Sunday by Saracens and then pick more of the Bath team to play for England on the Monday.

The man's a fucking idiot.

[SaintK]

It seems extra weird to bin the likes of George and Ford when players like Youngs and Farrell have managed to go for extended periods with indifferent form yet being undroppable.

Weirder still to watch Bath get beaten 17-71 at home on Sunday by Saracens and then pick more of the Bath team to play for England on the Monday.

The man's a fucking idiot.

Yes quite!!!!

[fishfoodie]

I think Eddie checks all the papers, for the guesses on who will be in the squad; & then picks a combination of players that means no-one gets close to the correct selection.

It makes as much sense as any other theory of how he does it.

[Kawazaki]

Convince me I'm wrong;

England scrumhalves who are better players than Ben Youngs;

All better...
van Poortvliet (Leicester)
Quirke (Sale)
Randall (Bristol)
Spencer (Bath)
Robson (Wasps)
Mitchell (Northampton)
Care (Harlequins)

Maybe better...
Maunder (Exeter)
Young (Newcastle)
Wigglesworth (Leicester)
+ Heinz (Worcester)

[Madness]

Convince me I'm wrong;

England scrumhalves who are better players than Ben Youngs;

All better...
van Poortvliet (Leicester)
Quirke (Sale)
Randall (Bristol)
Spencer (Bath)
Robson (Wasps)
Mitchell (Northampton)
Care (Harlequins)

Maybe better...
Maunder (Exeter)
Young (Newcastle)
Wigglesworth (Leicester)

I'm no Youngs defender but I'd rather have him than most of the others. At his best, admittedly becoming rarer and rarer these days I think he can be close to world class, however in last few years most of his international performances have been nowhere near that. He's been picked for the Lions a couple of times and by lots of England coaches but the real issue is the complete lack of a back up.

You could start Youngs, watch the first 20 mins and if its one of the good games leave him on if not pull him before half time, he never improves in a game, and get his back up on but this is where Jones has really fucked it and not developed anyone since Care was dropped. Heinz, Maunder, Spencer, Mitchell and especially Robson not really given a chance.

[Kawazaki]

Convince me I'm wrong;

England scrumhalves who are better players than Ben Youngs;

All better...
van Poortvliet (Leicester)
Quirke (Sale)
Randall (Bristol)
Spencer (Bath)
Robson (Wasps)
Mitchell (Northampton)
Care (Harlequins)

Maybe better...
Maunder (Exeter)
Young (Newcastle)
Wigglesworth (Leicester)

I'm no Youngs defender but I'd rather have him than most of the others. At his best, admittedly becoming rarer and rarer these days I think he can be close to world class, however in last few years most of his international performances have been nowhere near that. He's been picked for the Lions a couple of times and by lots of England coaches but the real issue is the complete lack of a back up.

You could start Youngs, watch the first 20 mins and if its one of the good games leave him on if not pull him before half time, he never improves in a game, and get his back up on but this is where Jones has really fucked it and not developed anyone since Care was dropped. Heinz, Maunder, Spencer, Mitchell and especially Robson not really given a chance.

No I'm not convinced. Although I will add Heinz to the maybe list. Forgot about him!

[Torquemada 1420]

I think Eddie checks all the papers, for the guesses on who will be in the squad; & then picks a combination of players that means no-one gets close to the correct selection.

It makes as much sense as any other theory of how he does it.

You might be on to something.

[Oxbow]

Cowan-Dickie out, George in.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/58970985

[SaintK]

Cowan-Dickie out, George in.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/58970985

Any news on Itoje aand Watson yet?

[Margin__Walker]

Cowan-Dickie out, George in.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/58970985

Any news on Itoje aand Watson yet?

Itoje seems fine. Watson ruptured ACL...

[SaintK]

Cowan-Dickie out, George in.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/58970985

Any news on Itoje aand Watson yet?

Itoje seems fine. Watson ruptured ACL...

Ahh shit! Watson really does have bad luck with major injuries

[ASMO]

Marchant been called up to replace him, not a bad call.

[JM2K6]

Two injuries, two players called up who should've been there anyway.

[fishfoodie]

Two injuries, two players called up who should've been there anyway.

Well it makes a change from calling up players, breaking them; & sending them back to their clubs.

Eddie has streamlined the process !