Women's Rugby Thread

[Niegs]

It does feel like a lot of people use it as an excuse, but aren't praising the quality. Sat around a pub yesterday watching Wales and Canada be very bland, someone mentioned England's pro status, but I had to say that their domestic league is a big factor too, and that they've always been strong. There are girls with the knowledge and skills ours don't have, despite our previous (my thoughts on how many XVs programs there are at high schools across the country) dominance in schoolgirl numbers. Pro status has given England women the edge, but grassroots and RFU coach development, I think, has got them to stage where there are more and more youth teams attracting/developing great athletes. When I got involved with women's rugby in the early 00s, I remember there was still the odd England international who'd only taken the sport up at uni. You don't hear those types breaking through to top clubs any more, let alone international.

[Niegs]

How's this for an image!? French support for women's rugby is truly impressive!

[eldanielfire]

Piece form the Telegraph on what the Red Rose's strongest team will be for the RWC by different pundit.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/rugby-union ... 022-world/

Can't link pics form the Telegraph but absically most fo them go:

Cornborough-Cokayne-Bern
Ward-Aldcroft
Hunter-Cleal-Packer
Infante

Harrison-Rowland-Scarrett
Dow-Killdunne-Thompson.

The universal picks are Bern, Ward, Aldcroft, Packer, Cleall, Harrison, Scarrett, Dow and Killdunne. Though Cleall and Hunter were swapped between 6 and 8 in some picks.

I'm stunned that some (2 of the 4 pundits here) would ever pick an 9 over infante who criminally was left off the world player of the year list IMO. I wonder what exactly people see in Natasha Hunt, her dithering and slower delivery is clear to me these past 2 seasons. She isn't as quick as Infante nor as fast a passer and McDonald is far more rapid than her. It sounds a little about when people rave about Owen Farrell, just non descript, vague and unconvincing plaudits despite him not really showing a great skillset or even managing difficult games.

I can see Davis brings a little different to Cokayne. Though I'd go with Amy for France and their big, powerful scrum and forwards. On the right wing I think I can see why you'd swap Thompson and Breech though for the Black Ferns Thompsons superior defense is a must. A similar issue at 12, Amber Reed is a better game manager and has the fastest pass and is excellent in defense and organizing the defense but Rowland has an X-Factor where she can open up defenses. It's a case for whose bets for which opponent IMO.

I agree with Killdunne at 15, but I'm not sure her last ditch defense is the very best (but not worse than McKenna, maybe I'm spoilt as Waterman had the bets cover defense in the history of the game) and I'd deffo use every game in 2022 to play her there to ensure she's 100% on the detail. My alternative could be Abby Dow there whose often played there for Wasps and we can see her game breaking ability.

[Niegs]

Hunter over Matthews? Nah ...

Millar-Mills, Fleetwood, Aldcroft (giving Kath O'Donnell a lock spot - she injured?) are also better options, imo. Kabeya looked really active as a tackler and carrier, looking like she'll have a future in the 7 shirt. Packer to 6 when she's on. I don't know how old Wasps' Christiana Balogun is, or if she has aspirations to play internationally (some people probably have great careers already), but she's impressed me every time I've watched Wasps.

[ASMO]

Piece form the Telegraph on what the Red Rose's strongest team will be for the RWC by different pundit.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/rugby-union ... 022-world/

Can't link pics form the Telegraph but absically most fo them go:

Cornborough-Cokayne-Bern
Ward-Aldcroft
Hunter-Cleal-Packer
Infante

Harrison-Rowland-Scarrett
Dow-Killdunne-Thompson.

The universal picks are Bern, Ward, Aldcroft, Packer, Cleall, Harrison, Scarrett, Dow and Killdunne. Though Cleall and Hunter were swapped between 6 and 8 in some picks.

I'm stunned that some (2 of the 4 pundits here) would ever pick an 9 over infante who criminally was left off the world player of the year list IMO. I wonder what exactly people see in Natasha Hunt, her dithering and slower delivery is clear to me these past 2 seasons. She isn't as quick as Infante nor as fast a passer and McDonald is far more rapid than her. It sounds a little about when people rave about Owen Farrell, just non descript, vague and unconvincing plaudits despite him not really showing a great skillset or even managing difficult games.

I can see Davis brings a little different to Cokayne. Though I'd go with Amy for France and their big, powerful scrum and forwards. On the right wing I think I can see why you'd swap Thompson and Breech though for the Black Ferns Thompsons superior defense is a must. A similar issue at 12, Amber Reed is a better game manager and has the fastest pass and is excellent in defense and organizing the defense but Rowland has an X-Factor where she can open up defenses. It's a case for whose bets for which opponent IMO.

I agree with Killdunne at 15, but I'm not sure her last ditch defense is the very best (but not worse than McKenna, maybe I'm spoilt as Waterman had the bets cover defense in the history of the game) and I'd deffo use every game in 2022 to play her there to ensure she's 100% on the detail. My alternative could be Abby Dow there whose often played there for Wasps and we can see her game breaking ability.

Breach over Thompson

[eldanielfire]

Hunter over Matthews? Nah ...

Hunter's nous and ruck work is better than Matthews. I also think Matthews is a far more impactful player off the bench than Hunter.

Millar-Mills, Fleetwood, Aldcroft (giving Kath O'Donnell a lock spot - she injured?) are also better options, imo. Kabeya looked really active as a tackler and carrier, looking like she'll have a future in the 7 shirt. Packer to 6 when she's on. I don't know how old Wasps' Christiana Balogun is, or if she has aspirations to play internationally (some people probably have great careers already), but she's impressed me every time I've watched Wasps.

my issue with Kabeya is her reading of the game isn't there. She doesn't do the right work in the right places yet and struggle to be a good link. Will tackle for ages but missed opportunities to slow or turnover ball and was turned over a few times against Canada when she carried. I'm big on Opensides having to make and execute the most important decisions in the most important moments. #

I've also liked Balogun before, liked a few examples, I'm perplexed as to why some good players get picked and others don't. I was hot on Heather Cowell for years before she was picked as well as Abby Dow at 15 and she's only just played there for the first time. I can only guess England have less depth at 9 the they do at lock. No one really challenges Marley at 7, I've said she's almsot England's most valuable player due to no one else quite having her skilset with her intensity on the biggest stage. Though I've maintained Poppy Cleall could play openside too, she's already got the most turnovers in the league already.

[eldanielfire]

Piece form the Telegraph on what the Red Rose's strongest team will be for the RWC by different pundit.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/rugby-union ... 022-world/

Can't link pics form the Telegraph but absically most fo them go:

Cornborough-Cokayne-Bern
Ward-Aldcroft
Hunter-Cleal-Packer
Infante

Harrison-Rowland-Scarrett
Dow-Killdunne-Thompson.

The universal picks are Bern, Ward, Aldcroft, Packer, Cleall, Harrison, Scarrett, Dow and Killdunne. Though Cleall and Hunter were swapped between 6 and 8 in some picks.

I'm stunned that some (2 of the 4 pundits here) would ever pick an 9 over infante who criminally was left off the world player of the year list IMO. I wonder what exactly people see in Natasha Hunt, her dithering and slower delivery is clear to me these past 2 seasons. She isn't as quick as Infante nor as fast a passer and McDonald is far more rapid than her. It sounds a little about when people rave about Owen Farrell, just non descript, vague and unconvincing plaudits despite him not really showing a great skillset or even managing difficult games.

I can see Davis brings a little different to Cokayne. Though I'd go with Amy for France and their big, powerful scrum and forwards. On the right wing I think I can see why you'd swap Thompson and Breech though for the Black Ferns Thompsons superior defense is a must. A similar issue at 12, Amber Reed is a better game manager and has the fastest pass and is excellent in defense and organizing the defense but Rowland has an X-Factor where she can open up defenses. It's a case for whose bets for which opponent IMO.

I agree with Killdunne at 15, but I'm not sure her last ditch defense is the very best (but not worse than McKenna, maybe I'm spoilt as Waterman had the bets cover defense in the history of the game) and I'd deffo use every game in 2022 to play her there to ensure she's 100% on the detail. My alternative could be Abby Dow there whose often played there for Wasps and we can see her game breaking ability.

Breach over Thompson

Breach doesn't have close to Thompson's defense though. We were remained in the 2nd Black Ferns test when Thompson almost stopped, or possibly did in some eyes, it was never checked, Woodman's Try in the last minute. I'd also point out Thompson plays a lot on the right wing, England's ladies have always provided many more opportunities on the left so Thompson's brilliant speed, footwork and finishing are a large reason why she has such a good strike rate (37 in 50 tests and she rarely plays the easy ones) coupled with pretty much always stopping her opposite number. Stopping the attacks or counters on the outside is essential when up against the Black Ferns and France. In those games Lydia Thompson is always who you want in there. And Breech is still an excellent option. I'll also add Breech is mostly a left winger.

[eldanielfire]

Fiona Tomas
@fi_tomas_
NEW - starting from this Sunday with Bristol Bears' game v Wasps, the BBC will show one
@Premier15s
game per round for the rest of the 2021-22 season. Games will be shown on the BBC Sport app, website and iPlayer, including the semi-final and final. Progress

[Lobby]

Fiona Tomas
@fi_tomas_
NEW - starting from this Sunday with Bristol Bears' game v Wasps, the BBC will show one
@Premier15s
game per round for the rest of the 2021-22 season. Games will be shown on the BBC Sport app, website and iPlayer, including the semi-final and final. Progress

The women's Barbarians match today will also be on the IPlayer and the red button, after the men's match is shown on BBC1. But this is good news for the women's game, particularly after the success of the England internationals shown on BBC2.

[Niegs]

This is NOT a fat-shaming, being a large lad myself, but Rachael Burford has gotten bigger during the injury layoff!

[eldanielfire]

This is NOT a fat-shaming, being a large lad myself, but Rachael Burford has gotten bigger during the injury layoff!

Is it a bad picture perhaps?

I thought Burford has always wasn't skinny, it's why she can be used as a crack ball option on top of her distribution skill-set.

[Niegs]

This is NOT a fat-shaming, being a large lad myself, but Rachael Burford has gotten bigger during the injury layoff!

Is it a bad picture perhaps?

I thought Burford has always wasn't skinny, it's why she can be used as a crack ball option on top of her distribution skill-set.

[laurent]

This is NOT a fat-shaming, being a large lad myself, but Rachael Burford has gotten bigger during the injury layoff!

Is it a bad picture perhaps?

I thought Burford has always wasn't skinny, it's why she can be used as a crack ball option on top of her distribution skill-set.

White Nonu-esque

He is likely to retire after his last double injury.

[eldanielfire]

This is NOT a fat-shaming, being a large lad myself, but Rachael Burford has gotten bigger during the injury layoff!

Is it a bad picture perhaps?

I thought Burford has always wasn't skinny, it's why she can be used as a crack ball option on top of her distribution skill-set.

Yeah, she deffo does look like she has packed on a few.

[tabascoboy]

Just saw this, shocking news

Siobhan Cattigan: Scotland international dies at age of 26

Scotland international and Stirling County back row Siobhan Cattigan has died at the age of 26. Cattigan won 19 caps between 2018 and 2021, having made her debut against Wales during the 2018 Six Nations.

She started all three matches in the 2021 competition, with her most recent appearance coming in the World Cup qualifier against Spain in September.

Scottish Rugby said their thoughts "go out to Siobhan's family and team-mates at this incredibly difficult time".

They added that specialist employees would provide support to those most closely affected.

[Niegs]

Excellent try from Bristol! ... and what a pass from 6!

[sturginho]

[SaintK]

Zoe Aldcroft has been named World Rugby's women's player of the year.......well deserved.

The honour follows an impressive Autumn Series for the 25-year-old, in which she captained the Red Roses for the first time.
Aldcroft is the fourth England player to win the award following Michaela Staniford (2012), Sarah Hunter (2016) and Emily Scarratt (2019).
"I'm so proud," she said. "I'm very honoured to accept the award."
She added her advice for the next generation of female players was: "Be yourself, work hard and keep your feet on the ground."

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/59588927

[Niegs]

As someone who doesn't like 'over-dressing' when unnecessary, I'm down the Bryony's look compared to the pro media person on the left.

[Niegs]

I love this... see props in front of you, hammer down and go! (She had another amazing break that, iirc, led to the try below, also spotting a weak link in the defensive line).



Big carry from Konkel (and lazy tackling from three internationals)

[eldanielfire]

As someone who doesn't like 'over-dressing' when unnecessary, I'm down the Bryony's look compared to the pro media person on the left.

I actually like the outfit on the left, it's a cute little number, I don't find that overdressing myself. I might have a thing for smart knee high boots and socks though. I did like Kat Merchant's recent outfits for commentating, they are on her Instagram.

[eldanielfire]

I love this... see props in front of you, hammer down and go! (She had another amazing break that, iirc, led to the try below, also spotting a weak link in the defensive line).



Big carry from Konkel (and lazy tackling from three internationals)

Yeah, a shame they missed Scott's break and turn of speed for that 2nd Kronkel try. I've found a number of times this season Emily Scott has impressed me. I was surprised at how poorly Zoe Harrison played. She reverted a bit to her poorer England showings a few years ago.

I think Middleton has a massive headache to get just 30 players for the world cup.

[tabascoboy]

Interesting to see Poland given an invitation spot in the World Series 7s

HSBC Spain Sevens, Malaga pools, 21-23 January

Women's

Pool A: Spain, Australia, Ireland, Poland
Pool B: USA, Canada, Fiji, New Zealand
Pool C: Russia, Brazil, France, England

[Niegs]

Dave Ward handed a week's ban for either telling a 4th official to fuck off or telling one of his coaches to tell the official to do just that.

[laurent]

One of the try of the year by the french ladies

Also an old clubmate gets a Leinster Job. Tania coached at Clontarf

[Niegs]

Unless I missed it in the speed read, the article didn't specifically say what she did to her back?

[eldanielfire]

Wales contracted players:




Forwards:Alisha Butchers, Natalia John, Siwan Lillicrap, Carys Phillips, Gwenllian Pyrs and Donna Rose are involved as are backs Kiera Bevan, Hannah Jones, Ffion Lewis, Lisa Neumann, Elinor Snowsill and Jasmine Joyce.

Good choices. The only one I'd question is Donna Rose, who I have yet to see really put in a big performance for Wales at test level and she isn't the best scrummager.

I'd have also considered Georgia Evans who is morphing into a really world class forward, Cerys Hale whose a superb prop and Bethan Lewis whose growing as a great Openside in the making who always puts in a huge shift at center and is massive in defense for Wales.

[Niegs]

With an article in the Telegraph about DMP's woes, I wondered' about Exeter after seeing rosters posted.



Forwards: Spain, Can, Can, Wales, Ned , Eng, USA, USA
Backs: Eng, USA, Ire, Spain, South Africa, USA, Eng


Part of me is swinging around to thinking "it's not so bad for the comp, making teams stronger than the likes of DMP, and the locals will benefit from playing alongside experienced internationals" ... but when most of your squad are hired guns and these other teams are struggling or clubs are excluded when they don't have a sugar daddy fronting the money (plus 'Chiefs'), it just doesn't sit quite right with me.

[Niegs]

Quins were pretty crap, so should only have themselves to blame, but it was a bit of a shambles of a refereeing job in the last few minutes.

Conversion kick to tie, Ex player's feet are set but she goes up on her toes while breathing. Quins players rush and ref allows it. She's like "Wha?" but kicks anyway and just misses. Argues the point that she hadn't moved forward so should get a re-do, ref's having none of it.

However, Ex given a soft penalty and kick for the lineout. In the ensuing phase or two, Ex get another pen for a really soft 'not rolling away' pen. Kick the three pointer to win the game.

[Niegs]

Not having an ambulance on site seems an extreme reason to call off a game, no? https://warriors.co.uk/2022/01/16/state ... sps-women/

You don't take safety lightly, of course, but if you have a team doctor to treat extreme emergencies until one called could arrive, then it's not so bad? There will be countless games going each weekend without an ambulance on site.

[Lobby]

Not having an ambulance on site seems an extreme reason to call off a game, no? https://warriors.co.uk/2022/01/16/state ... sps-women/

You don't take safety lightly, of course, but if you have a team doctor to treat extreme emergencies until one called could arrive, then it's not so bad? There will be countless games going each weekend without an ambulance on site.

Perhaps they were worried that, if required, an ambulance might take 5 hours + to arrive.

[Lobby]

Quins were pretty crap, so should only have themselves to blame, but it was a bit of a shambles of a refereeing job in the last few minutes.

Conversion kick to tie, Ex player's feet are set but she goes up on her toes while breathing. Quins players rush and ref allows it. She's like "Wha?" but kicks anyway and just misses. Argues the point that she hadn't moved forward so should get a re-do, ref's having none of it.

However, Ex given a soft penalty and kick for the lineout. In the ensuing phase or two, Ex get another pen for a really soft 'not rolling away' pen. Kick the three pointer to win the game.

Garcia was by some way the best player on show. Ironic that the referee’s error meant Exeter were able to win rather than settling for a draw.

[Niegs]

NZ doing over-kill on the internal issue? Maybe. On the surface, it does sound like the sort of thing that team leaders could chat with coaching staff about.

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/on-the-insid ... -expensive

[eldanielfire]

The remained part timers of the Welsh system:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/60054710

Wales Women: First nine semi-professional players announced by WRU
Last updated on1 minute ago1 minute ago.
From the sectionWelsh Rugby
Semi-pro players
The first group of Wales women's semi-professional players (Kat Evans is absent)
The latest group of female players to accept paid Welsh Rugby Union contracts has been announced.

The retainer deals have been signed by nine different players, making them semi-professional, with up to six more to be added in the coming weeks.

They include Gwen Crabb, Georgia Evans, Kat Evans, Cerys Hale, Abbie Fleming, Bethan Lewis, Kerin Lake, Caitlin Lewis and Niamh Terry.

It follows the 12 fully professional deals announced earlier this month.

They semi-professional players will train alongside with the full-time players at the National Centre of Excellence at the Vale Resort, near Cardiff between one and three days a week.

Gloucester-Hartpury duo Hale and Lake are the most experienced players in the group with 35 and 33 caps respectively, while Saracens hooker Evans only made her debut against Japan in the autumn.

Wales women head coach Ioan Cunningham said the retained players are a "vital addition" to the women's performance programme.

"Some of them were very close to being offered full-time contracts, and all made a huge contribution to our autumn campaign, both on the pitch and in the training environment so are all deserving of this chance," he said.

"Ultimately, the retainer contracts provide an opportunity to have more contact time with more players which will be a huge positive.

"It gives the players the ability to learn more about the game, to complete more training sessions, improve their strength and fitness along with other areas that will contribute towards the team's performance."

Wales women have two training camps in the next few weeks and Cunningham says there is an opportunity for players to impress and earn the remaining contracts.

[eldanielfire]

With an article in the Telegraph about DMP's woes, I wondered' about Exeter after seeing rosters posted.



Forwards: Spain, Can, Can, Wales, Ned , Eng, USA, USA
Backs: Eng, USA, Ire, Spain, South Africa, USA, Eng


Part of me is swinging around to thinking "it's not so bad for the comp, making teams stronger than the likes of DMP, and the locals will benefit from playing alongside experienced internationals" ... but when most of your squad are hired guns and these other teams are struggling or clubs are excluded when they don't have a sugar daddy fronting the money (plus 'Chiefs'), it just doesn't sit quite right with me.

Yeah Exeter Women is just taking the piss now. Why expand the league to 10 team from 8 if all you do is increase the foreign players by 2 full teams?

I'm dubious on the whole "playing with better players improves the England players, justification. Of course even less so when barely any English players actually play. We see in New Zealand that they can produce top quality players with basically little to no foreign players along them.

[Niegs]

With an article in the Telegraph about DMP's woes, I wondered' about Exeter after seeing rosters posted.



Forwards: Spain, Can, Can, Wales, Ned , Eng, USA, USA
Backs: Eng, USA, Ire, Spain, South Africa, USA, Eng


Part of me is swinging around to thinking "it's not so bad for the comp, making teams stronger than the likes of DMP, and the locals will benefit from playing alongside experienced internationals" ... but when most of your squad are hired guns and these other teams are struggling or clubs are excluded when they don't have a sugar daddy fronting the money (plus 'Chiefs'), it just doesn't sit quite right with me.

Yeah Exeter Women is just taking the piss now. Why expand the league to 10 team from 8 if all you do is increase the foreign players by 2 full teams?

I'm dubious on the whole "playing with better players improves the England players, justification. Of course even less so when barely any English players actually play. We see in New Zealand that they can produce top quality players with basically little to no foreign players along them.

Yeah, I guess I'm thinking of internationals with a ton of experience who can teach an individual nuances of their position... but great coaching can also do that as shown by the crop of England 'youngsters' who are / nearly are the best in the world at their positions.

Canadian forwards seem to just crash into the closest defender (well, tbf) so not sure what that adds if you can find and train to a good standard a big English woman.

The RFU's Warrior Weekend initiative (and others?) seems to be encouraging more and more women to give rugby a shot. It'd be nice to see us do ... anything ... to attract more women to the game.

[tabascoboy]

Women's Rugby World Cup 2021: Scotland in play-off final after Hong Kong and Samoa withdraw

Scotland will now face a one-off play-off against Kazakhstan or Colombia to reach the delayed 2021 Women's Rugby World Cup finals after Hong Kong and Samoa withdrew from qualifying.

Both nations pulled out because of Covid-19 travel restrictions.

Hong Kong were due to face Kazakhstan to determine Asia's representative in a four-team round-robin play-off, while Samoa were representing Oceania.

The top-seeded Scots will now go straight into the 25 February final.

[eldanielfire]

I only loosely follow Sevens for the Olympics, but Poland beating Canada is a huge huge result:

[eldanielfire]

With an article in the Telegraph about DMP's woes, I wondered' about Exeter after seeing rosters posted.



Forwards: Spain, Can, Can, Wales, Ned , Eng, USA, USA
Backs: Eng, USA, Ire, Spain, South Africa, USA, Eng


Part of me is swinging around to thinking "it's not so bad for the comp, making teams stronger than the likes of DMP, and the locals will benefit from playing alongside experienced internationals" ... but when most of your squad are hired guns and these other teams are struggling or clubs are excluded when they don't have a sugar daddy fronting the money (plus 'Chiefs'), it just doesn't sit quite right with me.

Yeah Exeter Women is just taking the piss now. Why expand the league to 10 team from 8 if all you do is increase the foreign players by 2 full teams?

I'm dubious on the whole "playing with better players improves the England players, justification. Of course even less so when barely any English players actually play. We see in New Zealand that they can produce top quality players with basically little to no foreign players along them.

Yeah, I guess I'm thinking of internationals with a ton of experience who can teach an individual nuances of their position... but great coaching can also do that as shown by the crop of England 'youngsters' who are / nearly are the best in the world at their positions.

Canadian forwards seem to just crash into the closest defender (well, tbf) so not sure what that adds if you can find and train to a good standard a big English woman.

The RFU's Warrior Weekend initiative (and others?) seems to be encouraging more and more women to give rugby a shot. It'd be nice to see us do ... anything ... to attract more women to the game.

Indeed. I've many criticisms but the RFU have mostly been very much in front when developing women's rugby at all levels.

[eldanielfire]

Wales training squad: