Yep - good opinion piece that.
I'm in a boring training meeting so I am going to prattle on pretending that I know sh*t.
The Barrett star has long since burnt out. I unashamedly screamed at the TV in 2015 when Beaudy out sprinted a tired Aussie defence to dot down under the bar to guarantee our back to back RWC triumph. But that was 7 years ago - BB is slower now and that shows up his weaknesses that he can't escape with long gone rapid pace. His kicking from hand has never been great - his place kicking is bang average and his tactical nous is only good if he has proper talent outside him.
AB's need a solid brick wall at the back. How we would love a Mils Muliaina or a Christian Cullen or a Prime Dagg......or even a beige Leon MacDonald. Does McKenzie slot in at the back when he returns if he brings form with him? Is Will Jordan the guy who can make it his own?
Is Jack Goodhue one of the most important players to return to the AB's?
Cane is finished.....nice guy, lots of love for him.....but he is not Captain material and not a 7. Grace in at 8 and Savea moves to 7? But then who is 6.....Frizell? Fifita (too much of a liability?) Barrett? I genuinely don't know.
Then there is the front 3 - midfield - lack of world class options at 9 and who plays at wing (Foster seems desperate to fit Caleb Clarke in somewhere).
Is it so bad with Foster that we can perhaps accept a few wildcard entries who impressed during Super Rugby and maybe deserve a run out against international competition? Chances are we will be losing with a team of 'knowns'.....maybe look at some outsiders who might just step up?
FOSTER - NOW GONE 🎉 - congrats kiwis
Exactly..
And when Foster has gone... Sam Cane must go too...
A nice big, mobile loose trio with two good lineout jumpers...
6 Cullen Grace
7 Papalii
8 Sotutu
With Ardie coming off the bench tp wreak havoc with tiring defences...
Of course, I'll go with whatever Razor thinks is best...
)
Hard reading for nz supporters.Guy Smiley wrote: ↑Wed Aug 10, 2022 3:26 am https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/all ... hing-stock
OPINION: The accusation that the All Blacks are rudderless is unfair. They have plenty of rudders. The problem is that most of those rudders are pointing in different directions and the rest of the rudders are broken.
Sadly, the coach and the captain are broken. The picture of Sam Cane lying on the ground as Willie le Roux cantered over the line for the final try of the emphatic defeat to South Africa was stark and symbolic. The caption ‘down and out’ immediately came to mind.
Cane should be given time away from this environment to heal. The same is true for Foster. Both men need a break from the game. My understanding is that cutting Foster loose will also not cost the type of money that has been put out there.
There is surely a break clause in the contracts of all the All Blacks coaches given the hasty nature of last year’s contract extensions.
Stewart Mitchell, the chairman of the board, is a business consultant and there is plenty of other financial savvy on that NZ Rugby board. It is almost unthinkable that there would not be a break clause.
It should also be noted that the hiring and firing of the All Blacks coach is ultimately the responsibility of the board. I suspect from what he has said that Foster may be gone by now if it were down to Mark Robinson, the CEO.
But Robinson does not have the power to make that call. It is down to the board. They are responsible for the appointment of the coach and of the CEO.
And it wasn’t just the series loss to Ireland that has cost Foster his job security. There was also fury amongst senior management that the Sunday press conference after the series defeat by Ireland was cancelled and at appallingly short notice. That was seen as unacceptable and just about unprecedented. It was also seen as weak and an affront to the country.
So Foster really is on borrowed time. Under those circumstances it is not unreasonable to surmise that the appointment of Jason Ryan as forwards coach was also a way of preparing the ground for Scott Robertson, should he feel able to take over from Foster.
There is a contingency plan in place should Foster fail, and unfortunately there can be no doubt that he is failing, by his own admission.
When he took the job Foster said: “It’s up to me to show you that I’m innovative, I’ve got a sense of direction about where I want this team to go and to really grow and to get some mana back on the field which we felt we’ve lost a little bit”.
By his own words shall we judge him. Even the haka is now unconvincing. That mana has gone up in smoke. South Africa have far more ethnic challenges than New Zealand, far more healing to do from their brutal history, but they were the only team with mana on Saturday.
I remember a ball going loose from another aerial challenge and the two captains dived for it. But it was inevitably Siya Kolisi who regathered. There is only one rainbow nation and it is not the men in black. How evident that was on the pitch. South Africa were pulling in one direction, however limited. New Zealand didn’t know what they were up to.
There was one stark symbol of that muddle when Jordie Barrett came up for a high ball and Cane took him out in the air. Downed by his own captain. A couple of minutes later, Scott Barrett and Will Jordan also collided. And they are Super Rugby teammates.
So when I talk about rudders pointing in different directions, I think about Beauden Barrett and Richie Mo’unga or Jordie Barrett and Will Jordan. Did Jordan touch the ball in the first half? The Barrett brothers (Scott excepted who with Sam Whitelock was the All Blacks’ best on Saturday) were playing their own personal game. And not very well.
When Jordie gave Beauden the ball at the start of the match, Beauden shuffled infield and seemed to have no idea where he was going. It was symbolic. There was another moment when Handre Pollard missed touch from a penalty and Beauden had Caleb Clarke outside him, completely unmarked. Instead he kicked the ball back to South Africa.
There was a lot of that. New Zealand are short of territory in recent matches because Beauden’s choice of options has been poor. The moment Richie Mo’unga came on, that changed. He and David Havili went ping, ping and pinned South Africa in their 22. Unfortunately the All Blacks seemed so surprised to be there that they coughed the ball up.
The other huge difference that Mo’unga made was in his ability to attack the outside shoulder of the rush defence. Beauden was forever cutting back inside and losing momentum. By all means give the inside ball, but running back into the cover gave Malcolm Marx the opportunity for many a turnover.
I don’t think that Foster can save his job now. The noise is too loud. But imagine the irony if he now turned to the Crusaders as his saviours. Foster didn’t want one as captain. He does not want one as number eight. He does not want one as first five. He doesn’t want one as fullback. And he certainly doesn’t want one as coach. In fact, in nearly all the big decision-making positions Foster has turned elsewhere.
But it may be his only way out. When Foster heeded Beauden Barrett’s call that he wanted back in at No 10, he gave away his authority. Previous coaches would have rapped Beauden down and said that he would play where he was picked. But Foster gave into it.
It was the moment his number was up. From then on the Barretts have been largely running the show. That’s natural. They’re brothers. Who else are they going to be closer to. But it has not been good for the All Blacks.
Beauden and Jordie are both terrific athletic talents but they are not tactical geniuses. That shows in their lack of silverware. So it’s time to move this show on.
That goes back to the four horsemen of the apocalypse: Steve Tew, Steve Hansen, Graham Henry and Brent Impey. They came up with the absurd continuity theory.
Did they not think that all the beautiful minds in sport over the previous century would have tested that out? Liverpool Football Club did and it ultimately failed because the next in line is not always a brilliant head coach.
Liverpool discovered it for the nonsense it is, which is why they now have Jurgen Klopp in charge and are reaching for the stars. But the four horsemen believed their own foolishness and gave this country Foster.
“Keep the legacy,” said Impey, as pal Foster was ushered into his seat, “but refresh at the same time because this is a dynamic situation.”
Yeah, right. Lose to Argentina for the first time in history. Lose a home series to Ireland for the first time in history with record scores. Lose to South Africa by the worst score since 1928.
Sadly, the All Blacks are now a laughing stock. My Scottish mate asked if we could keep Foster in place until Scotland play New Zealand in November. Another commenter said; “I’m Welsh. Can we play you. I mean we are awful but who knows.”
Foster’s tenure is hanging by a thread. Why? “Is there a scissor shortage in New Zealand?’’ posted one online wit. It’s hard to argue with such gallows humour.
Springboks, Stormers and WP supporter.
Had a chance to rewatch the match. The ABs are really poor atm. I cannot see a different coach making any difference tbh. Players are just not of the quality we normally expect from NZ. Unless there are some very good players that are being overlooked it's going to be awhile before there is a difference.
No, that’s nonsense.
Watch these players in previous years or even in the Supe.
They’ve been run In to the ground with dreadful coaching and strategy, which has ruined cohesion, and now confidence.
These players when used correctly are the business.
Watch these players in previous years or even in the Supe.
They’ve been run In to the ground with dreadful coaching and strategy, which has ruined cohesion, and now confidence.
These players when used correctly are the business.
Your players were bullied across the park
-
Guy Smiley
- Posts: 6017
- Joined: Mon Jun 29, 2020 7:52 pm
We’ve had close to 10 years now of a coaching regime that hasn’t prioritised numbers over the ball. On top of that, we’re watching a team that clearly has no clear plan to play to… they’re constantly on the back foot trying to compensate for those two considerable factors.
Give the same team a different coach with a clear plan and you’d see a different performance.
Give them a new coach with ideas and the courage to drop name players not performing and you’d have a serious contest on your hands. NZ has the players. We’ve just got a shit coach and a shit admin…
You guys would be pretty familiar with that concept.
I’m watching a replay of the 2013 AB v Boks test at Jo’burg and the ABs’ play is not even remotely similar to the dross we are watching in the last 2~3 years. Plenty of players committed to the ruck and breakdown, providing excellent ball for the backs, good chasing of high kicks (Ben Smith the main one. God we miss him), backs who seem to have an idea of where their teammates are and link well with them, and superb defense against Boks’ attacking lineout mauls.Guy Smiley wrote: ↑Thu Aug 11, 2022 8:00 amWe’ve had close to 10 years now of a coaching regime that hasn’t prioritised numbers over the ball. On top of that, we’re watching a team that clearly has no clear plan to play to… they’re constantly on the back foot trying to compensate for those two considerable factors.
Give the same team a different coach with a clear plan and you’d see a different performance.
Give them a new coach with ideas and the courage to drop name players not performing and you’d have a serious contest on your hands. NZ has the players. We’ve just got a shit coach and a shit admin…
You guys would be pretty familiar with that concept.
Brodie and Sam W were absolute beasts, while Messam, McCaw, and Read more than matched the Boks back row.
I agree... the cattle are there... though opposition countries would love to believe the players are the problem...
We just need Razor in to prove us right.
Hey. I would love to agree with you. But your lot was getting hit backwards across the park at every contact. I have no idea how you can fix this. With defense so tight and rush defense you can't have that
These things can be turned around with more direction, alignment, timing, and motivation.Sards wrote: ↑Thu Aug 11, 2022 9:31 amHey. I would love to agree with you. But your lot was getting hit backwards across the park at every contact. I have no idea how you can fix this. With defense so tight and rush defense you can't have that
Look at this for a turn around
Yeah, this is the line I'm pedaling to anyone who'll listen to me (and that's not many
). But I'm calling them horses, not cattle - just for, you know, athleticism 
.Just hope we get the chance to see if we are backing the right horses..Snooze wrote: ↑Thu Aug 11, 2022 3:15 pmYeah, this is the line I'm pedaling to anyone who'll listen to me (and that's not many
I remember Australia in 2003 losing badly to NZ.. driven back in every tackle etc... then come the world cup a few weeks later..., they were like another team...Sards wrote: ↑Thu Aug 11, 2022 9:31 amHey. I would love to agree with you. But your lot was getting hit backwards across the park at every contact. I have no idea how you can fix this. With defense so tight and rush defense you can't have that
From the past.
And we were disappointed then.
Every year was worse and worse.
Not quite the “better and better” we were told.
The excuses, learnings, and excitement- this was way back in Dec 2020
And we were disappointed then.
Every year was worse and worse.
Not quite the “better and better” we were told.
However, that’s not necessarily due to anything the man in charge had control over.
Foster, having assisted Steve Hansen for eight years from 2012 to 2019, was appointed head coach of the New Zealand national side late last year.
This year, 2020, was hugely disrupted by COVID-19, with the international season not kicking off until October.
The All Blacks played just six tests this year – four against Australia followed by two against Argentina.
Contrast that with the original plan, which would have seen NZ host Wales and Scotland in July, before kicking off a six-game Rugby Championship followed by a four-match tour to Europe.
Needless to say, it wasn’t the easiest start to Foster’s reign – and that gave his critics ammunition to have a dig at the former Chiefs coach.
Speaking with the NZ Herald, Foster revealed that the disrupted season significantly impacted many of the coaching team’s plans for the year.
“It’s been a big learning curve,” Foster said of his first year in charge.
“We’ve got a new coaching group this year. We only had six tests to try things so we didn’t try all the changes we will end up making because we didn’t have enough games to do that. We had a new captain, new leadership group, 14 new or returning All Blacks in the extended squad and that involved bringing a whole lot of people up to speed.
“We were hoping for six brilliant consistent performances. We didn’t get them. That’s not unique in this business. Our job is to keep growing.
(Continue below ...)
“There’s a whole lot of unique leadership challenges that haven’t been there before with COVID and everything. I believe we dealt with that as best as we could.
“We didn’t get the overall consistency we desired. That’s disappointing but it was a year that was punctuated by some real highs and a couple of lows.”
Foster included bouncing back against Argentina in the All Blacks’ final game of the Tri-Nations as one of the highs, while the initial loss (the first-ever in New Zealand’s history) was undoubtedly one of the lowest points.
Those low points fueled critics, who were always on hand to take potshots at the new head coach – though Foster admitted he wasn’t hugely shocked by the attention.
“None of that surprised me. When you’re a head coach anywhere you live in that space. I always felt accountable when I was with the All Blacks the last eight years. Does it ramp up? Yes it does.
“I probably got used to it because when I got appointed there were a few people who decided I wasn’t the right person for the job and they’ve been reasonably relentless in saying that whenever they can. That hasn’t changed, so it’s not a surprise to me.
"My job is to absorb all that and make sure I don’t get hung up on it and focus on making this team better and better.”
The year clearly didn’t pan out the way Foster anticipated – in more ways than one – and the new head coach is looking forward to sinking his teeth back into the national set-up next season.
“My prevailing emotion is I feel like we’ve just started,” he said.
“2020 certainly met my expectations for the nature and challenge of the job. There’s no doubt from a personal side I know it’s a massive role with this team and this country so that part didn’t disappoint.”
The excuses, learnings, and excitement- this was way back in Dec 2020
-
Torquemada 1420
- Posts: 11155
- Joined: Thu Jul 02, 2020 8:22 am
- Location: Hut 8
-
Guy Smiley
- Posts: 6017
- Joined: Mon Jun 29, 2020 7:52 pm
The euphoria of a good win is one thing but it hardly compensated for 3 years of shit decisions, selections and tactics.
North Yorkshire not far from Leeds.
NZ finally play as we have been crying out for them to play these last 5 years... earn the right to go wide... and finally they did...
So why did Foster finally change tactics? Bet he doesn't learn from it... I hope he isn't given the chance.. but NZ Rugby are a gutless lot...
-
convoluted
- Posts: 516
- Joined: Thu Jul 02, 2020 5:00 pm
"That [the victory] was for all of us," Savea said. "For me personally that is my coach and I back him 100 per cent, side-by-side. He's been under a lot of pressure. I know he doesn't want to make it about himself, but I just want him to know that we have got his back and all the players have got his back.
"He's a great coach and he's got great coaches beside him, who back him 100 per cent. And I hope everyone that listens, that reads this, backs us."
Asked about whether he thinks that Foster should continue in the role, Savea reiterated what he'd already said.
"As I said he's my coach, that's it," he said.
"He's a great coach and he's got great coaches beside him, who back him 100 per cent. And I hope everyone that listens, that reads this, backs us."
Asked about whether he thinks that Foster should continue in the role, Savea reiterated what he'd already said.
"As I said he's my coach, that's it," he said.
-
convoluted
- Posts: 516
- Joined: Thu Jul 02, 2020 5:00 pm
Obviously that win would never have happened without Ryan's input with the forwards over the last 2 weeks.
The best thing about the triumph is that Robertson would now feel there's something there that he can work with, even as soon as Argentina in a fortnight if offered the position that early.
It had been such a mess that surely many of us feared Robertson wouldn't go anywhere near the ABs for the rest of the year at best, if not until even post-World Cup.
The best thing about the triumph is that Robertson would now feel there's something there that he can work with, even as soon as Argentina in a fortnight if offered the position that early.
It had been such a mess that surely many of us feared Robertson wouldn't go anywhere near the ABs for the rest of the year at best, if not until even post-World Cup.
-
Guy Smiley
- Posts: 6017
- Joined: Mon Jun 29, 2020 7:52 pm
Mark Robinson will front NZ media at 5.30NZT tonight, just in time for the evening news.
I was over at a mate's last night for beers. We were going to get up and watch it live, joking we were toasting the closing hours of the Fozzie regime. He bailed, messaging me @ 2.45 saying he was too tired... so we watched the recording this morning about 7ish. My insomnia had kicked in so I checked scores at 1/2 time then imposed a self blackout to be surprised by whatever happened.
The frustrating thing about the game is the way simple selection changes worked so well... after most of the country had been screaming for those changes (or similar) for two years. I know you can't lay blame or credit entirely on single players but you have to admit RichieMo straightened the attack out.
The front row was immense. Commentary pre game said they had 9 test starts between them
Cane was good. He was flattened a couple of times and slipped off a tackle quite badly at one stage, but he was good.
Rieko was on fire. He allowed guys to get around him too easily but his speed closed them down just as easily. He was everywhere. Humble in his acceptance of the MOTM award, too... really impressive.
Havili did some really good things, but he still tries to do too much sometimes and it gooses him up. He combines well with RMo.
Jordie... well, he did what fullbacks should do and didn't really make any mistakes to speak of so I guess he'll be rated as Brilliant and Genius for that. He had a good game. Jordan was likewise good down back and both were excellent under the high ball. Caleb Clark... jesus. That missed tackle was a howler. He seems to struggle to find good field placement,.
Anyway... everyone lifted and played, for most of the game, with real intensity and precision. A Smith's days are numbered though, surely.
oh... and Beaudy... fuck ing hell.
Will it be enough to save Fozzie's job? Personally, I hope not. One good result can't disguise the formline or his stats. Finally players he has deliberately bypassed repeatedly and seeing them perform isn't a ringing endorsement of his judgement as a coach.A leopard and its spots, basically.
I was over at a mate's last night for beers. We were going to get up and watch it live, joking we were toasting the closing hours of the Fozzie regime. He bailed, messaging me @ 2.45 saying he was too tired... so we watched the recording this morning about 7ish. My insomnia had kicked in so I checked scores at 1/2 time then imposed a self blackout to be surprised by whatever happened.
The frustrating thing about the game is the way simple selection changes worked so well... after most of the country had been screaming for those changes (or similar) for two years. I know you can't lay blame or credit entirely on single players but you have to admit RichieMo straightened the attack out.
The front row was immense. Commentary pre game said they had 9 test starts between them
Cane was good. He was flattened a couple of times and slipped off a tackle quite badly at one stage, but he was good.
Rieko was on fire. He allowed guys to get around him too easily but his speed closed them down just as easily. He was everywhere. Humble in his acceptance of the MOTM award, too... really impressive.
Havili did some really good things, but he still tries to do too much sometimes and it gooses him up. He combines well with RMo.
Jordie... well, he did what fullbacks should do and didn't really make any mistakes to speak of so I guess he'll be rated as Brilliant and Genius for that. He had a good game. Jordan was likewise good down back and both were excellent under the high ball. Caleb Clark... jesus. That missed tackle was a howler. He seems to struggle to find good field placement,.
Anyway... everyone lifted and played, for most of the game, with real intensity and precision. A Smith's days are numbered though, surely.
oh... and Beaudy... fuck ing hell.
Will it be enough to save Fozzie's job? Personally, I hope not. One good result can't disguise the formline or his stats. Finally players he has deliberately bypassed repeatedly and seeing them perform isn't a ringing endorsement of his judgement as a coach.A leopard and its spots, basically.
His defence is woeful - just so casual and clueless. His lack of commitment and aggression is really concerning.Guy Smiley wrote: ↑Sun Aug 14, 2022 2:31 amCaleb Clark... jesus. That missed tackle was a howler. He seems to struggle to find good field placement,.
And call me old-fashioned, but I rather like our test wings to score tries. To be deadly finishers who turn half-chances into five-pointers. Clarke couldn't even score from 10 metres out with acres of space and only a Saffer lock in front of him. Sure he can break the line, but then he either runs away from his support or falls over himself.
Just for comparison, our best previous left wings during the pro era all got off to rip-roaring starts: in his first seven tests, Lomu scored 7 tries, Sivivatu scored 9, Savea 10 and Rokocoko 11... Clarke has one.
But most of the Kiwi rugby hacks seem to love him for some reason.
I can't wait to get ALB or Goodhue back fit and Ioane back to his best position of 11.Gumboot wrote: ↑Sun Aug 14, 2022 3:51 amHis defence is woeful - just so casual and clueless. His lack of commitment and aggression is really concerning.Guy Smiley wrote: ↑Sun Aug 14, 2022 2:31 amCaleb Clark... jesus. That missed tackle was a howler. He seems to struggle to find good field placement,.
And call me old-fashioned, but I rather like our test wings to score tries. To be deadly finishers who turn half-chances into five-pointers. Clarke couldn't even score from 10 metres out with acres of space and only a Saffer lock in front of him. Sure he can break the line, but then he either runs away from his support or falls over himself.
Just for comparison, our best previous left wings during the pro era all got off to rip-roaring starts: in his first seven tests, Lomu scored 7 tries, Sivivatu scored 9, Savea 10 and Rokocoko 11... Clarke has one.
But most of the Kiwi rugby hacks seem to love him for some reason.
-
Guy Smiley
- Posts: 6017
- Joined: Mon Jun 29, 2020 7:52 pm
To be fair, that succession of wings is just precociously ridiculous
I don't get the love for him either. ALB was on the sidelines for yesterday's NPC game with Waikato. He looked to be involved with some sort of role with them, wearing the gear.
I don't get the love for him either. ALB was on the sidelines for yesterday's NPC game with Waikato. He looked to be involved with some sort of role with them, wearing the gear.
And Jack Goodhue came on for the last 20mins vs Waikato. Get the fitter of the two into the ABs and push R Ioane out to 11.Guy Smiley wrote: ↑Sun Aug 14, 2022 4:14 am To be fair, that succession of wings is just precociously ridiculous
I don't get the love for him either. ALB was on the sidelines for yesterday's NPC game with Waikato. He looked to be involved with some sort of role with them, wearing the gear.
-
Guy Smiley
- Posts: 6017
- Joined: Mon Jun 29, 2020 7:52 pm
Agreed. Just imagine a back three featuring Jordan and Rieko.Kiwias wrote: ↑Sun Aug 14, 2022 4:24 amAnd Jack Goodhue came on for the last 20mins vs Waikato. Get the fitter of the two into the ABs and push R Ioane out to 11.Guy Smiley wrote: ↑Sun Aug 14, 2022 4:14 am To be fair, that succession of wings is just precociously ridiculous
I don't get the love for him either. ALB was on the sidelines for yesterday's NPC game with Waikato. He looked to be involved with some sort of role with them, wearing the gear.