The Official English Rugby Thread

[Joost]

Being reported in several places that Watson will come in for OHC and Lawes in for Itoje(!), who is benched. Otherwise no changes from last week.

Thought Maro was decent against Italy and not sure about the wisdom of parachuting Lawes straight back in with no recent game time. OHC is injured apparently, though hasn’t made much of an impact - thought he might be in trouble anyway.

Mail have Lawes onto the bench which sounds far more realistic.

We'll see though.

Apparently it’s based on the colour of the bibs they were wearing in training yesterday. Lawes on the bench would make much more sense!

[Oxbow]

Lawes has shown in the past that he can come into a side with pretty much no game time and still perform to a high standard, but it'd still be nonsense to start him at the moment, stick him on the bench and ease him back into the game.

[Rhubarb & Custard]

The charge they hit him with comes under the framework that allows the tackle course. Guessing it's more to do with hitting the head than being tackler.

It's not a Tackle Course, Tackle School is a tag used in the media, officially it's a Coaching Intervention Programme with a focus on foul play that leads to head injury

[Rhubarb & Custard]

Being reported in several places that Watson will come in for OHC and Lawes in for Itoje(!), who is benched. Otherwise no changes from last week.

Thought Maro was decent against Italy and not sure about the wisdom of parachuting Lawes straight back in with no recent game time. OHC is injured apparently, though hasn’t made much of an impact - thought he might be in trouble anyway.

Mail have Lawes onto the bench which sounds far more realistic.

We'll see though.

Apparently it’s based on the colour of the bibs they were wearing in training yesterday. Lawes on the bench would make much more sense!

Borthwick is inconsistent with who wears what colour bib when the camera crews are invited in, one might even suppose intentionally so

[Margin__Walker]

The journos have seemed pretty reliant on bib colours on training pics for their guesses in this regime so far. They're often right and can give a general idea, but just as often, just be what they were running for a few plays.

Implies things are fairly water tight so far on the proper leak front, which hasn't always been the case.

[Rhubarb & Custard]

A lot of the team isn't that hard to guess, only so many picks they could be wrong about

[ASMO]

England.jpg (614.72 KiB) Viewed 1142 times

[JM2K6]

The charge they hit him with comes under the framework that allows the tackle course. Guessing it's more to do with hitting the head than being tackler.

It's not a Tackle Course, Tackle School is a tag used in the media, officially it's a Coaching Intervention Programme with a focus on foul play that leads to head injury

Ah that makes more sense, thank you

[JM2K6]

Be interesting to see what happens if Slade has another shocker.

[ASMO]

Be interesting to see what happens if Slade has another shocker.

He will be made vice captain

[Hal Jordan]

Be interesting to see what happens if Slade has another shocker.

I'm putting that down to ring rustiness and hoping he'll do better.

But the general lack of outrage at the team indicates we're moving on, Youngs now appears to be no. 3, thank God.

[inactionman]

I'm getting my Anthony Watson smoke-blowing hat out of the cupboard.

[sockwithaticket]

Be interesting to see what happens if Slade has another shocker.

I'm putting that down to ring rustiness and hoping he'll do better.

But the general lack of outrage at the team indicates we're moving on, Youngs now appears to be no. 3, thank God.

Generous, he's generally a pretty mixed bag. Twelvetrees 2.0, an improvement on 1.0, but still replete with more errors than is optimal.

[Hal Jordan]

Be interesting to see what happens if Slade has another shocker.

I'm putting that down to ring rustiness and hoping he'll do better.

But the general lack of outrage at the team indicates we're moving on, Youngs now appears to be no. 3, thank God.

Generous, he's generally a pretty mixed bag. Twelvetrees 2.0, an improvement on 1.0, but still replete with more errors than is optimal.

I am aware of his limitations, but he usually does something good in the match to go altogether with his usual stuff ups.

[Kawazaki]

What I don't see much of that was a feature for much of the Jones era is England players putting energy and fizz onto the ball. Their alignment in attack is always flat and/or standing still which leaves very little margin for error or the ability to actually pass in front of the player as opposed to at/behind him (or forward). It's a timing issue but these are professionals, I often wonder what on earth the analysts are looking at let alone the players themselves.

[dpedin]

England.jpg

I would swap Smith for Farrell at 10 but otherwise a sensible looking team - Dombrandt at 8, speedy service from JVP and big runner at 12 is just what Smith needs. Everyone playing in their preferred positions and no 10 playing centre. It all depends on whether the team instructions are to continue kicking good ball away or not. Hopefully another weeks coaching will have locked in a few more backs moves? Should be plenty to thump the sorry Welsh.

[Kawazaki]

England.jpg

I would swap Smith for Farrell at 10 but otherwise a sensible looking team - Dombrandt at 8, speedy service from JVP and big runner at 12 is just what Smith needs. Everyone playing in their preferred positions and no 10 playing centre. It all depends on whether the team instructions are to continue kicking good ball away or not. Hopefully another weeks coaching will have locked in a few more backs moves? Should be plenty to thump the sorry Welsh.

I reckon the Welsh will be well up for this. The fans are very much in their corner regards the dispute with the WRU and England will just be the surrogate punchbag to take it all out on.

[JM2K6]

Smith's there to keep Ford's spot warm, I think. The dropping of Earl suggests to me that Borthwick wants continuity off the bench rather than a different style. Ford at his best is a world class tactical fly half and Borthwick knows that, so for a conservative game plan he's a brilliant option.

[Ovals]

Smith's there to keep Ford's spot warm, I think. The dropping of Earl suggests to me that Borthwick wants continuity off the bench rather than a different style. Ford at his best is a world class tactical fly half and Borthwick knows that, so for a conservative game plan he's a brilliant option.

Yeah - If Farrell isn't going to be subbed off, it makes sense to bring Ford on at FH as he's been more successful playing with Farrell at 12 than Smith has. Then all change post WC.

[Paddington Bear]

England.jpg

I would swap Smith for Farrell at 10 but otherwise a sensible looking team - Dombrandt at 8, speedy service from JVP and big runner at 12 is just what Smith needs. Everyone playing in their preferred positions and no 10 playing centre. It all depends on whether the team instructions are to continue kicking good ball away or not. Hopefully another weeks coaching will have locked in a few more backs moves? Should be plenty to thump the sorry Welsh.

I reckon the Welsh will be well up for this. The fans are very much in their corner regards the dispute with the WRU and England will just be the surrogate punchbag to take it all out on.

Really hard to tell what sort of Wales turn up, and indeed what sort of crowd. If we get ahead I suspect we'll win reasonably comfortably, but if we go behind its going to be a tough slog.

[ASMO]

England.jpg

I would swap Smith for Farrell at 10 but otherwise a sensible looking team - Dombrandt at 8, speedy service from JVP and big runner at 12 is just what Smith needs. Everyone playing in their preferred positions and no 10 playing centre. It all depends on whether the team instructions are to continue kicking good ball away or not. Hopefully another weeks coaching will have locked in a few more backs moves? Should be plenty to thump the sorry Welsh.

I would swap Smith for Farrell and Mitchell for JvP, i think Mitchell is a smarter 9 and plays more like Care, JvP for me is still a bit headless chicken.

[JM2K6]

Mitchell can do the headless chicken thing himself, it's not like he's not had a few shockers for Saints. He's a good bench option.

[Hal Jordan]

Both are a vast upgrade on Youngs, but so is my mother and she's in her 70s, had a stroke a few years ago and suffers from fibromyalgia.

[SaintK]

Mitchell can do the headless chicken thing himself, it's not like he's not had a few shockers for Saints. He's a good bench option.

Usually when he's getting slow ball. He gets quite a bit of that at Saints!!!

[Lobby]

I've not seen it mentioned elsewhere on here, but Gatland has rung the changes for the Welsh team on Saturday:

Wales: Leigh Halfpenny; Josh Adams, Mason Grady, Joe Hawkins, Louis Rees-Zammit; Owen Williams, Tomos Williams; Gareth Thomas, Ken Owens, Tomas Francis, Adam Beard, Alun Wyn Jones, Christ Tshiunza, Justin Tipuric, Taulupe Faletau.

Replacements: Bradley Roberts, Rhys Carre, Dillon Lewis, Dafydd Jenkins, Tommy Reffell, Kieran Hardy, Dan Biggar, Nick Tompkins.

I get why he felt he had to make changes after their capitulation to the Scots, but I'm not sure bringing some of the OAPs back into the pack is the right move in the circumstances.

[JM2K6]

I've not seen it mentioned elsewhere on here, but Gatland has rung the changes for the Welsh team on Saturday:

Wales: Leigh Halfpenny; Josh Adams, Mason Grady, Joe Hawkins, Louis Rees-Zammit; Owen Williams, Tomos Williams; Gareth Thomas, Ken Owens, Tomas Francis, Adam Beard, Alun Wyn Jones, Christ Tshiunza, Justin Tipuric, Taulupe Faletau.

Replacements: Bradley Roberts, Rhys Carre, Dillon Lewis, Dafydd Jenkins, Tommy Reffell, Kieran Hardy, Dan Biggar, Nick Tompkins.

I get why he felt he had to make changes after their capitulation to the Scots, but I'm not sure bringing some of the OAPs back into the pack is the right move in the circumstances.

They almost always manage to roll back the years against us tbf

[Ovals]

I've not seen it mentioned elsewhere on here, but Gatland has rung the changes for the Welsh team on Saturday:

Wales: Leigh Halfpenny; Josh Adams, Mason Grady, Joe Hawkins, Louis Rees-Zammit; Owen Williams, Tomos Williams; Gareth Thomas, Ken Owens, Tomas Francis, Adam Beard, Alun Wyn Jones, Christ Tshiunza, Justin Tipuric, Taulupe Faletau.

Replacements: Bradley Roberts, Rhys Carre, Dillon Lewis, Dafydd Jenkins, Tommy Reffell, Kieran Hardy, Dan Biggar, Nick Tompkins.

I get why he felt he had to make changes after their capitulation to the Scots, but I'm not sure bringing some of the OAPs back into the pack is the right move in the circumstances.

They almost always manage to roll back the years against us tbf

Yeah - you can bet that, if they've got one big performance in them this 6N, it'll be against us.

[Paddington Bear]

I've not seen it mentioned elsewhere on here, but Gatland has rung the changes for the Welsh team on Saturday:

Wales: Leigh Halfpenny; Josh Adams, Mason Grady, Joe Hawkins, Louis Rees-Zammit; Owen Williams, Tomos Williams; Gareth Thomas, Ken Owens, Tomas Francis, Adam Beard, Alun Wyn Jones, Christ Tshiunza, Justin Tipuric, Taulupe Faletau.

Replacements: Bradley Roberts, Rhys Carre, Dillon Lewis, Dafydd Jenkins, Tommy Reffell, Kieran Hardy, Dan Biggar, Nick Tompkins.

I get why he felt he had to make changes after their capitulation to the Scots, but I'm not sure bringing some of the OAPs back into the pack is the right move in the circumstances.

They almost always manage to roll back the years against us tbf

Yeah - you can bet that, if they've got one big performance in them this 6N, it'll be against us.

So many of the same names that have been giving me sleepless nights for years. I think it’s 50/50 as to whether they come out storming or just fall apart

[Kawazaki]

They've picked the huge young centre. I wonder if he runs like a back or runs like Steward?

[SaintK]

Pretty poor fare from Bath v Bristol
Bath need a forwards line out and attack coach
Bristol need a discipline coach
Bath leading 10 7 despite Francis missing 3 kicks

[sockwithaticket]

Pretty poor fare from Bath v Bristol
Bath need a forwards line out and attack coach
Bristol need a discipline coach
Bath leading 10 7 despite Francis missing 3 kicks

Caught the last 15, definitely seems like picking the U20s was the better choice.

[SaintK]

Pretty poor fare from Bath v Bristol
Bath need a forwards line out and attack coach
Bristol need a discipline coach
Bath leading 10 7 despite Francis missing 3 kicks

Caught the last 15, definitely seems like picking the U20s was the better choice.

Forgot about the U20's!!!
My eyes were bleeding by the end the match was so error strewn. Francis missed yet another kick at goal to win it for Bath
What the hell Russell will make of this when he joins next season, I have no idea?

[duke]

Pretty poor fare from Bath v Bristol
Bath need a forwards line out and attack coach
Bristol need a discipline coach
Bath leading 10 7 despite Francis missing 3 kicks

Caught the last 15, definitely seems like picking the U20s was the better choice.

Forgot about the U20's!!!
My eyes were bleeding by the end the match was so error strewn. Francis missed yet another kick at goal to win it for Bath
What the hell Russell will make of this when he joins next season, I have no idea?

The match wasn’t any better in the flesh.

Did Francis ever goal kick at Saints? It seemed very odd that he was kicking when Spencer has been doing so with reasonable accuracy and Bailey was on the park in the second half too.

[dpedin]

Caught the last 15, definitely seems like picking the U20s was the better choice.

Forgot about the U20's!!!
My eyes were bleeding by the end the match was so error strewn. Francis missed yet another kick at goal to win it for Bath
What the hell Russell will make of this when he joins next season, I have no idea?

The match wasn’t any better in the flesh.

Did Francis ever goal kick at Saints? It seemed very odd that he was kicking when Spencer has been doing so with reasonable accuracy and Bailey was on the park in the second half too.

He kicked a bit when he was at Edinburgh and he was pretty shite then! Can't believe he still has a role as place kicker with any team TBH.

[SaintK]

Caught the last 15, definitely seems like picking the U20s was the better choice.

Forgot about the U20's!!!
My eyes were bleeding by the end the match was so error strewn. Francis missed yet another kick at goal to win it for Bath
What the hell Russell will make of this when he joins next season, I have no idea?

The match wasn’t any better in the flesh.

Did Francis ever goal kick at Saints? It seemed very odd that he was kicking when Spencer has been doing so with reasonable accuracy and Bailey was on the park in the second half too.

Only if Biggar or Grayson weren't playing!

[duke]

Forgot about the U20's!!!
My eyes were bleeding by the end the match was so error strewn. Francis missed yet another kick at goal to win it for Bath
What the hell Russell will make of this when he joins next season, I have no idea?

The match wasn’t any better in the flesh.

Did Francis ever goal kick at Saints? It seemed very odd that he was kicking when Spencer has been doing so with reasonable accuracy and Bailey was on the park in the second half too.

Only if Biggar or Grayson weren't playing!

That’s what I thought, there were a couple that any half decent kicker would have got. Not that we deserved anything, losing 3 attacking lineouts on the bounce in the first half was symptomatic of the way the team is playing

[geordie_6]

Any in particular to watch out for in the u20s?

[sockwithaticket]

Any in particular to watch out for in the u20s?

In the backs Ma'asi - White is looking like a great centre option, big lad capable of crashing it up, but he's not just a bosher. Makes some cracking defensive reads, has an eye for a line and is picking up a fair few try assists. Bracken (yes, son of), looks like he could be the next bright young spark at 9 we all want to be picking up caps

Up front Chessum's younger brother has been impressing at lock. I'd expect to see the pair of them packing down for the senior team at some point in the near future. Fisilau continues to show himself as a versatile and dogged back rower. The four props are absolute monsters, huge young men. However, that only counts for so much. There's a long line of big young props whose scrummaging just didn't make it to the senior game. McArthur seems to have the most hype.

[sockwithaticket]

Managed to find a stream of Saints - Glaws (stream is via Peacock, so another day when 0/3 Prem games are broadcast in the UK, but all of them are available in the USA ), Saints have been surprisingly good and everyone owes it to themselves to check out Dingwall's try. Lovely team effort with some sublime offloading.

[Margin__Walker]

To be fair PRTV is now an option for the non televised games. For a fiver you can still watch them if it's a legit option you were looking for.