He obviously didn't pull that out of his backside. He mentions at least twice that he sourced a lot of the video from The Hundred Years' War: All Blacks vs Springboks by Jamie Wall, (a Kiwi author) which one would assume has been rigorously researched and have some local perspective of the impact.
No, I mean that racism towards the indigenous population never existed in New Zealand. It was only ever a South African affliction.Blake wrote: ↑Fri Aug 30, 2024 2:21 pmHe obviously didn't pull that out of his backside. He mentions at least twice that he sourced a lot of the video from The Hundred Years' War: All Blacks vs Springboks by Jamie Wall, (a Kiwi author) which one would assume has been rigorously researched and have some local perspective of the impact.
It's easy to shit on YouTubers, but if that assertion is incorrect, maybe Jamie Wall is at fault. I'll have to check out that book I guess.
Haven't read Jamie Wall, and haven't read Squidges post. But genuinely I very surprised to hear that I as a white man person changed my treatment of Maori or anyone because of Bok tour. I genuinely never knew of anyone who looked at our treatment (hate that word anyway, I didn;t treat anyone,just were mates/family, or otherwise as always in the country before or after tour) It's funny how someone who writes an article can seemingly tell us how we felt or acted etc because of a tour. I was around in NZ about 27yo when tour took place, so perhaps you could just ask the likes of me?Blake wrote: ↑Fri Aug 30, 2024 2:21 pmHe obviously didn't pull that out of his backside. He mentions at least twice that he sourced a lot of the video from The Hundred Years' War: All Blacks vs Springboks by Jamie Wall, (a Kiwi author) which one would assume has been rigorously researched and have some local perspective of the impact.
It's easy to shit on YouTubers, but if that assertion is incorrect, maybe Jamie Wall is at fault. I'll have to check out that book I guess.
Fair enough, it's only my opinion... we're all subjective when it comes to stuff like this. I did want to throw some sort of background on him though... I'm pretty sure he's not so much a rugby writer as some sort of opportunist who has managed to work his way into a paying gig. I first noticed him doing online commentary, on the Tribe app. Now he's writing on rugby for Radio NZ. I'm always disappointed by people who write about going down the outside edge when they're referring to the wing or touchline. I think it's a rugby league import as I've noticed a couple of other commentators here in NZ doing it.
Think you will find the tour of 1981 turned a lot of Kiwis off having sporting relationships with South Africa, due to the, you know, racism in the Republic.Blake wrote: ↑Fri Aug 30, 2024 7:47 pm So it is utterly inconceivable that the tensions caused by the Springbok Tour in 1981 created the environment to expose some hypocrisy within some sections of New Zealand and led to the creation of some needed reforms?
Pity, because it would’ve been a neat story.
I was 20 when the tour took place. I remember the social mayhem that surrounded it and the extremes people went to to protest against it. We've all heard or read the story now but it bears emphasis... that tour split the country into two camps and there is nothing in living memory that comes close to it for impact.Blake wrote: ↑Fri Aug 30, 2024 7:47 pm So it is utterly inconceivable that the tensions caused by the Springbok Tour in 1981 created the environment to expose some hypocrisy within some sections of New Zealand and led to the creation of some needed reforms?
Pity, because it would’ve been a neat story.
OomStruisbaai wrote: ↑Sat Aug 31, 2024 3:23 am The 1981 Springbok tour delivered rugby from heaven. Rugby was the winner over politics.
I support Waikato because of that match that never happened.
Obviously he didn't research what the reason was.boere wors wrote: ↑Sat Aug 31, 2024 8:14 am https://amp.rugbypass.com/news/straight ... an-empire/
Who is this idiot?! Not only that the eben story can be easily explained, but mocking someone with severe health issues to look like jabba is quite something
It's unbelievable. Scotty Stevenson you moron... and Ben Smith you idiot for printing it..Sards wrote: ↑Sat Aug 31, 2024 11:12 amObviously he didn't research what the reason was.boere wors wrote: ↑Sat Aug 31, 2024 8:14 am https://amp.rugbypass.com/news/straight ... an-empire/
Who is this idiot?! Not only that the eben story can be easily explained, but mocking someone with severe health issues to look like jabba is quite something
Besides. Huge to have Eben suddenly on the bench.
This is my feeling as well.Guy Smiley wrote: ↑Fri Aug 30, 2024 8:28 pmI was 20 when the tour took place. I remember the social mayhem that surrounded it and the extremes people went to to protest against it. We've all heard or read the story now but it bears emphasis... that tour split the country into two camps and there is nothing in living memory that comes close to it for impact.Blake wrote: ↑Fri Aug 30, 2024 7:47 pm So it is utterly inconceivable that the tensions caused by the Springbok Tour in 1981 created the environment to expose some hypocrisy within some sections of New Zealand and led to the creation of some needed reforms?
Pity, because it would’ve been a neat story.
Within that context, there will be various narratives, stories etc. There have always been strong bonds and mutual respect between sections of Maori and Pakeha society here, just as there has been strong antipathy or even hostility. You'll get various versions of that being talked about all of the time.
I don't remember anything about what you're talking about really coming to the fore but I was a long way from the action and memory is not reliable.
Something slightly off topic though... I do remember the marches and occupation of land in the name of Maori Land Rights that had picked up speed through the 70s, culminating in the occupation of Bastion Point in Auckland. That movement was something of a catalyst for the changes that unfolded in the years following and I think the tremendous progress NZ made in the 30 or so years after that has to be credited to that movement...
and that movement alone. It's fucking stupid to try and claim the protests over the 81 tour had any great influence in leading to the reforms that took place. Suggesting that is ignorant and condescending... it's patronising.
I left NZ in 1985. I returned from time to time over the next 30 years before moving back. The changes here with regard to recognition of Maori culture and language are profound and ongoing with struggles that have reached the highest court in the country multiple times and the Law rewritten to recognise the fundamental principles of the Treaty of Waitangi... Te Tiriti.
I'm sure a couple of blokes in a pub giving each other the upward flick and a fist bump played their part in it.
