So, coronavirus...

[Sandstorm]

7 day average for the UK now drops below 100, bit earlier than I expected.

#optimistic #keepgoing

BLM just two weeks ago, pubs re-opened tonight. Could go bad again.....

[Longshanks]

Stanley Johnson defends his trip to Greece

[-RB-]

7 day average for the UK now drops below 100, bit earlier than I expected.

#optimistic #keepgoing

BLM just two weeks ago, pubs re-opened tonight. Could go bad again.....

Dollars to doughnuts there'll be a spike with pubs reopening.

How's it looking there anyway, late evening now. I'm imagining a cross between between Mad Max and The Hunger Games.

[Carter's Choice]

7 day average for the UK now drops below 100, bit earlier than I expected.

#optimistic #keepgoing

Is that deaths or new cases?

[Saint]

7 day average for the UK now drops below 100, bit earlier than I expected.

#optimistic #keepgoing

Is that deaths or new cases?

That's deaths

[Carter's Choice]

7 day average for the UK now drops below 100, bit earlier than I expected.

#optimistic #keepgoing

Is that deaths or new cases?

That's deaths

F**king hell. God bless you guys.

[Jim Lahey]

Went down the pub last night with the old man for a few jars before having dinner at my folk’s.

The good thing is that it was busy which must be a huge relief for the owners and employees.

The bad thing is that its clear after a few pints social distancing doesn’t exist. Plus imagine the amount of single lads and lasses that were alone for 3 months out looking to shag the first thing they find. At 5.30pm it was like a cattle market so God knows what it was like at 10pm.

[Ymx]

Oh great.

We’ve got the plague to look forward to now.

COVID from Chinese bats
Plague from Mongolian marmots

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/worl ... 6.html?amp

Two brothers have contracted the plague after reportedly eating marmots in Mongolia.

The siblings – aged 27 and 16 – are believed to have caught the potentially deadly disease after hunting and then consuming the animal in the country, authorities have said.

Two suspected cases in the western Khovd province came back as the plague in laboratory tests, according to Mongolia’s National Centre for Zoonotic Diseases.

The ministry of health said earlier this week a 27-year-old patient was being treated with “marmot plague and secondary lung disease” according to a preliminary diagnosis.

He was in a “very severe condition” and had “multiple organ failure”, the department said.

Authorities are working to put in place a quarantine for the relevant areas in Khovd province, and have identified hundreds of people who came into first- or second-hand contact with the infected people

[Biffer]

Is that deaths or new cases?

That's deaths

F**king hell. God bless you guys.

Scotland Average less than one death and less than ten cases per day over the last week. For whatever reason England hasn’t Suppressed it to the same extent.

[Randolf]

I'm certainly not going to praise the way Westminster has handled the situation, however maybe watching how things go in England will help the another nations to make decisions for their future. It's a hard balancing act

Definitely. It's not fair for Drakeford to make such comments when his tactics have been to keep Wales behind England by 3 weeks to see what happens there first. He's done pretty much the very things Boris has done but in delay. Which is wise in a way but if you are going to do that then don't criticise the guy who goes first and you learn from or you are a coward.

You've got that wrong the r number in Wales is 0.8 so not a great of headroom plus our schools have gone back, and I think its a mistake to open up so quickly.
I don't know why somebody who's has to make the toughest decision in their political career, you would call them a coward, wouldn't like to make that call in what is a life or death situation.

There are some minor differences like children going back to school 2 days per week in Wales, itself an adaption of a failed "you go first" move by England. Broadly he's kept Wales around 3 weeks behind England in most respects. The cowardly behaviour is not in his decisions which I've described as wise. It is in the "you go first" then criticising the person who went first and who's failure you learned from.

[Plato’sCave]

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/ ... 2019-nine/

Has this been posted already?

[Longshanks]

Scotland Average less than one death and less than ten cases per day over the last week. For whatever reason England hasn’t Suppressed it to the same extent.

Maybe telling the English to "Stay the f*** Out?

https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/news/5 ... test-fury/

[Biffer]

Scotland Average less than one death and less than ten cases per day over the last week. For whatever reason England hasn’t Suppressed it to the same extent.

Maybe telling the English to "Stay the f*** Out?

https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/news/5 ... test-fury/

Stupid stuff from those guys. If you make a fair point whilst acting like a dick, people only remember you acting like a dick.

[-RB-]

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/ ... 2019-nine/

Has this been posted already?

Paywalled. Could you post the article?

[Slick]

Scotland Average less than one death and less than ten cases per day over the last week. For whatever reason England hasn’t Suppressed it to the same extent.

Maybe telling the English to "Stay the f*** Out?

https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/news/5 ... test-fury/

Stupid stuff from those guys. If you make a fair point whilst acting like a dick, people only remember you acting like a dick.

Yup, might have had a point without the SNP flag

[Sandstorm]

That's deaths

F**king hell. God bless you guys.

Scotland Average less than one death and less than ten cases per day over the last week. For whatever reason England hasn’t Suppressed it to the same extent.

Are we really comparing two nations with less than 5 mil people and huge swathes of emptiness each vs the UK?

[fishfoodie]

It took three months, from early March to June 22, for Florida to cross 100,000 new confirmed COVID-19 cases.

It took less than two weeks for the state to go from 100,000 to 200,000 cases — and the positive test rate keeps rising.

The 10,059 confirmed new novel coronavirus cases from Sunday’s Florida Department of Health update, the third highest single day total, behind Saturday and Thursday, shot the state’s pandemic case number to 200,111.

Read more here: https://www.miamiherald.com/news/corona ... rylink=cpy

The GOP is still planning on having people come from all over the US, to Florida; for pointless, useless, circle wank; & then disperse back to their home states. A kind of Political Darwinism

[Saint]

F**king hell. God bless you guys.

Scotland Average less than one death and less than ten cases per day over the last week. For whatever reason England hasn’t Suppressed it to the same extent.

Are we really comparing two nations with less than 5 mil people and huge swathes of emptiness each vs the UK?

Well, that's one constant between PR and NPR

[sorCrer]

https://edition.cnn.com/travel/article/ ... index.html

[stunt_cunt]

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/a ... d=12345688

Covid 19 coronavirus: Evidence grows that virus may have originated from outside China
Coronavirus may have lain dormant across the world and emerged when environmental conditions were right for it to thrive - rather than starting in China, an Oxford University expert believes.

Dr Tom Jefferson, senior associate tutor at the Centre for Evidence-Based Medicine (CEBM), at Oxford, and visiting professor at Newcastle University, argues that there is growing evidence that the virus was elsewhere before it emerged in Asia.

Last week, Spanish virologists announced they had found traces of the disease in samples of waste water collected in March 2019, nine months before the coronavirus disease was seen in China.Italian scientists have also found evidence of coronavirus in sewage samples in Milan and Turin, in mid-December, many weeks before the first case was detected, while experts have found traces in Brazil in November.

Jefferson believes that many viruses lie dormant throughout the globe and emerge when conditions are favourable. It also means they can vanish as quickly as they arrive.

"Where did Sars 1 go? It's just disappeared," he said "So we have to think about these things. We need to start researching the ecology of the virus, understanding how it originates and mutates.

"I think the virus was already here, here meaning everywhere. We may be seeing a dormant virus that has been activated by environmental conditions.

"There was a case in the Falkland Islands in early February. Now where did that come from? There was a cruise ship that went from South Georgia to Buenos Aires, and the passengers were screened and then on day eight, when they started sailing towards the Weddell Sea, they got the first case. Was it in prepared food that was defrosted and activated?

"The explanation for this could only be that these agents don't come or go anywhere. They are always here and something ignites them, maybe human density or environmental conditions, and this is what we should be looking for."

Jefferson believes that the virus may be transmitted through the sewage system or shared toilet facilities, not just through droplets expelled by talking, coughing and sneezing.

Writing in the Telegraph, Jefferson and Professor Carl Henegehan, director of the CEBM, call for an in-depth investigation similar to that carried out by John Snow in 1854, which showed cholera was spreading in London from an infected well in Soho.

Exploring why so many outbreaks happen at food factories and meatpacking plants could uncover major new transmission routes, they believe. It may be shared toilet facilities coupled with cool conditions that allow the virus to thrive.

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"We're doing a living review, extracting environmental conditions, the ecology of these viruses which has been grossly understudied," said Jefferson.

"There is quite a lot of evidence that huge amounts of the virus in sewage all over the place, and an increasing amount of evidence there is faecal transmission. There is a high concentration where sewage is 4C, which is the ideal temperature for it to be stabled and presumably activated. And meatpacking plants are often at 4C.

"These meat packing clusters and isolated outbreaks don't fit with respiratory theory, they fit with people who haven't washed their hands properly.

"These outbreaks need to be investigated properly with people on the ground one by one. You need to do what [medical hygiene developer] John Snow did. You question people, and you start constructing hypotheses that fit the facts, not the other way around."

[Biffer]

F**king hell. God bless you guys.

Scotland Average less than one death and less than ten cases per day over the last week. For whatever reason England hasn’t Suppressed it to the same extent.

Are we really comparing two nations with less than 5 mil people and huge swathes of emptiness each vs the UK?

Well, e.g. the Northwest and northeast of England are very comparable. Significant rural areas but most of the population concentrated in one area. Also, cities like Glasgow and Edinburgh have directly comparable cities in England. So there are comparisons to be made. As I’ve said before, this is about comparing differences and likenesses, so just saying ‘wha, there’s no comparison’ is equally invalid.

[Biffer]

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/a ... d=12345688

Covid 19 coronavirus: Evidence grows that virus may have originated from outside China
Coronavirus may have lain dormant across the world and emerged when environmental conditions were right for it to thrive - rather than starting in China, an Oxford University expert believes.

Dr Tom Jefferson, senior associate tutor at the Centre for Evidence-Based Medicine (CEBM), at Oxford, and visiting professor at Newcastle University, argues that there is growing evidence that the virus was elsewhere before it emerged in Asia.

Last week, Spanish virologists announced they had found traces of the disease in samples of waste water collected in March 2019, nine months before the coronavirus disease was seen in China.Italian scientists have also found evidence of coronavirus in sewage samples in Milan and Turin, in mid-December, many weeks before the first case was detected, while experts have found traces in Brazil in November.

Jefferson believes that many viruses lie dormant throughout the globe and emerge when conditions are favourable. It also means they can vanish as quickly as they arrive.

"Where did Sars 1 go? It's just disappeared," he said "So we have to think about these things. We need to start researching the ecology of the virus, understanding how it originates and mutates.

"I think the virus was already here, here meaning everywhere. We may be seeing a dormant virus that has been activated by environmental conditions.

"There was a case in the Falkland Islands in early February. Now where did that come from? There was a cruise ship that went from South Georgia to Buenos Aires, and the passengers were screened and then on day eight, when they started sailing towards the Weddell Sea, they got the first case. Was it in prepared food that was defrosted and activated?

"The explanation for this could only be that these agents don't come or go anywhere. They are always here and something ignites them, maybe human density or environmental conditions, and this is what we should be looking for."

Jefferson believes that the virus may be transmitted through the sewage system or shared toilet facilities, not just through droplets expelled by talking, coughing and sneezing.

Writing in the Telegraph, Jefferson and Professor Carl Henegehan, director of the CEBM, call for an in-depth investigation similar to that carried out by John Snow in 1854, which showed cholera was spreading in London from an infected well in Soho.

Exploring why so many outbreaks happen at food factories and meatpacking plants could uncover major new transmission routes, they believe. It may be shared toilet facilities coupled with cool conditions that allow the virus to thrive.

Subscribe to Premium
"We're doing a living review, extracting environmental conditions, the ecology of these viruses which has been grossly understudied," said Jefferson.

"There is quite a lot of evidence that huge amounts of the virus in sewage all over the place, and an increasing amount of evidence there is faecal transmission. There is a high concentration where sewage is 4C, which is the ideal temperature for it to be stabled and presumably activated. And meatpacking plants are often at 4C.

"These meat packing clusters and isolated outbreaks don't fit with respiratory theory, they fit with people who haven't washed their hands properly.

"These outbreaks need to be investigated properly with people on the ground one by one. You need to do what [medical hygiene developer] John Snow did. You question people, and you start constructing hypotheses that fit the facts, not the other way around."

That’s really interesting, and worth further investigation and consideration. What bothers me about it though is how does a cross species boundary get crossed in multiple places independently at the same time, when it hadn’t previously?

[Caley_Red]

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/a ... d=12345688

Covid 19 coronavirus: Evidence grows that virus may have originated from outside China
Coronavirus may have lain dormant across the world and emerged when environmental conditions were right for it to thrive - rather than starting in China, an Oxford University expert believes.

Dr Tom Jefferson, senior associate tutor at the Centre for Evidence-Based Medicine (CEBM), at Oxford, and visiting professor at Newcastle University, argues that there is growing evidence that the virus was elsewhere before it emerged in Asia.

Last week, Spanish virologists announced they had found traces of the disease in samples of waste water collected in March 2019, nine months before the coronavirus disease was seen in China.Italian scientists have also found evidence of coronavirus in sewage samples in Milan and Turin, in mid-December, many weeks before the first case was detected, while experts have found traces in Brazil in November.

Jefferson believes that many viruses lie dormant throughout the globe and emerge when conditions are favourable. It also means they can vanish as quickly as they arrive.

"Where did Sars 1 go? It's just disappeared," he said "So we have to think about these things. We need to start researching the ecology of the virus, understanding how it originates and mutates.

"I think the virus was already here, here meaning everywhere. We may be seeing a dormant virus that has been activated by environmental conditions.

"There was a case in the Falkland Islands in early February. Now where did that come from? There was a cruise ship that went from South Georgia to Buenos Aires, and the passengers were screened and then on day eight, when they started sailing towards the Weddell Sea, they got the first case. Was it in prepared food that was defrosted and activated?

"The explanation for this could only be that these agents don't come or go anywhere. They are always here and something ignites them, maybe human density or environmental conditions, and this is what we should be looking for."

Jefferson believes that the virus may be transmitted through the sewage system or shared toilet facilities, not just through droplets expelled by talking, coughing and sneezing.

Writing in the Telegraph, Jefferson and Professor Carl Henegehan, director of the CEBM, call for an in-depth investigation similar to that carried out by John Snow in 1854, which showed cholera was spreading in London from an infected well in Soho.

Exploring why so many outbreaks happen at food factories and meatpacking plants could uncover major new transmission routes, they believe. It may be shared toilet facilities coupled with cool conditions that allow the virus to thrive.

Subscribe to Premium
"We're doing a living review, extracting environmental conditions, the ecology of these viruses which has been grossly understudied," said Jefferson.

"There is quite a lot of evidence that huge amounts of the virus in sewage all over the place, and an increasing amount of evidence there is faecal transmission. There is a high concentration where sewage is 4C, which is the ideal temperature for it to be stabled and presumably activated. And meatpacking plants are often at 4C.

"These meat packing clusters and isolated outbreaks don't fit with respiratory theory, they fit with people who haven't washed their hands properly.

"These outbreaks need to be investigated properly with people on the ground one by one. You need to do what [medical hygiene developer] John Snow did. You question people, and you start constructing hypotheses that fit the facts, not the other way around."

That’s really interesting, and worth further investigation and consideration. What bothers me about it though is how does a cross species boundary get crossed in multiple places independently at the same time, when it hadn’t previously?

Yeah, I think the principles of Ockham's razor and most probable cause will triumph in the end.

[Raggs]

The Mar 2019 test looks unlikely to me. Lots of ways to get a false positive, and when doing so many tests on past samples, you'd almost expect a false positive here or there.

[CM11]

On the 'it's been in our bodies all along thing'. Don't tell the 5G activists about this, they'll be insufferable.

[Biffer]

On the 'it's been in our bodies all along thing'. Don't tell the 5G activists about this, they'll be insufferable.

I’ve not seen anyone say that except maybe an utter lunatic.

[Sandstorm]

Last week, Spanish virologists announced they had found traces of the disease in samples of waste water collected in March 2019, nine months before the coronavirus disease was seen in China.

Spanish Flu MKII. Makes sense.

[Biffer]

Last week, Spanish virologists announced they had found traces of the disease in samples of waste water collected in March 2019, nine months before the coronavirus disease was seen in China.

Spanish Flu MKII. Makes sense.

Spanish flu came from the USA originally, it’s a great case study in the politics of diseases.

Edit - and yes, I know you were firmly tongue in check there

[lilyw]

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/a ... d=12345688

That’s really interesting, and worth further investigation and consideration. What bothers me about it though is how does a cross species boundary get crossed in multiple places independently at the same time, when it hadn’t previously?

Yeah, I think the principles of Ockham's razor and most probable cause will triumph in the end.

There was a really interesting article in The Sunday Times yesterday (behind paywall so I can't post it, I read it in the paper edition) about an outbreak in Southern China in 2012 in which 6 people died after clearing bat faeces from an abandoned mine. The Wuhan lab sequenced the genome and published it - it apparently is the same as the genome referenced in the latest outbreak. They also took samples from the mine back to the lab in Wuhan and continued to work on them there.

Of course the fact that the latest outbreak apparently originated in Wuhan is entirely co-incidental (and they are now happy that the famous wet market was not the source).

[Sandstorm]

Last week, Spanish virologists announced they had found traces of the disease in samples of waste water collected in March 2019, nine months before the coronavirus disease was seen in China.

Spanish Flu MKII. Makes sense.

Spanish flu came from the USA originally, it’s a great case study in the politics of diseases.

Edit - and yes, I know you were firmly tongue in check there

Just writing Trump's first tweet for him today.

[CM11]

On the 'it's been in our bodies all along thing'. Don't tell the 5G activists about this, they'll be insufferable.

I’ve not seen anyone say that except maybe an utter lunatic.

Sorry, you can read the above article and interpret the 'dormant everywhere' as dormant in our bodies.

[Biffer]

On the 'it's been in our bodies all along thing'. Don't tell the 5G activists about this, they'll be insufferable.

I’ve not seen anyone say that except maybe an utter lunatic.

Sorry, you can read the above article and interpret the 'dormant everywhere' as dormant in our bodies.

Ahhh, right. Got to say I don’t think that’s what they’re suggesting.

[CM11]

I’ve not seen anyone say that except maybe an utter lunatic.

Sorry, you can read the above article and interpret the 'dormant everywhere' as dormant in our bodies.

Ahhh, right. Got to say I don’t think that’s what they’re suggesting.

Neither do I but you know these types will twist anything. It's only a stone's throw from what they've been saying.

[Biffer]

Neither do I but you know these types will twist anything. It's only a stone's throw from what they've been saying.

fair enough

[FujiKiwi]

If it’s been “lying dormant” rather than jumping from bats in Wuhan, then where has it been, if not in our bodies? Where are they suggesting it’s been lurking?

[Biffer]

If it’s been “lying dormant” rather than jumping from bats in Wuhan, then where has it been, if not in our bodies? Where are they suggesting it’s been lurking?

Other species, environments where conditions support it. Difficult to say without seeing any published research from the guy about what he means.

[Sandstorm]

If it’s been “lying dormant” rather than jumping from bats in Wuhan, then where has it been, if not in our bodies? Where are they suggesting it’s been lurking?

Wake up man! It's been living harmlessly in all our bodies for almost a decade until 5G!

[FujiKiwi]

If it’s been “lying dormant” rather than jumping from bats in Wuhan, then where has it been, if not in our bodies? Where are they suggesting it’s been lurking?

Other species, environments where conditions support it. Difficult to say without seeing any published research from the guy about what he means.

Well, then I don’t see how that is a contradiction of the idea that the virus jumped from a bat in Wuhan. It just seems to be suggesting an explanation for the possible Wuhan origin. Not a contradiction of it.

[Biffer]

If it’s been “lying dormant” rather than jumping from bats in Wuhan, then where has it been, if not in our bodies? Where are they suggesting it’s been lurking?

Other species, environments where conditions support it. Difficult to say without seeing any published research from the guy about what he means.

Well, then I don’t see how that is a contradiction of the idea that the virus jumped from a bat in Wuhan. It just seems to be suggesting an explanation for the possible Wuhan origin. Not a contradiction of it.

Yep, that’s what it sounds like. It’s just the telegraph further hitting their ‘no lockdown, reopen everything’ agenda imo.

[TB63]

If it’s been “lying dormant” rather than jumping from bats in Wuhan, then where has it been, if not in our bodies? Where are they suggesting it’s been lurking?

Wake up man! It's been living harmlessly in all our bodies for almost a decade until 5G!

Don't forget it's also being spread by chemtrails..