NPR

ia801310 wrote: ↑Sat Aug 20, 2022 2:10 pm
I would argue that the problem is even worse in the Green/Climate Change movement. There is nothing more white, upper middle class and bourgeois social-justice warrior than a climate change rally (with the possible exception of Glastonbury. The likes of XR, just stop oil and extinction rebellion are just a bourgeois social-justice warrior temper tantrum about the fact that the working class don't know what's best for them.

Biffer wrote: ↑Sat Aug 20, 2022 3:06 pm Yeah, the right wing middle and upper class never tries to tell the poor what’s good for them right enough.

That attitude isn’t left or right wing, it’s class. People like to pretend it’s just the other side that does it, and unconsciously justify to them selves.

Torquemada 1420 wrote: ↑Sat Aug 20, 2022 6:18 am

weegie01 wrote: ↑Fri Aug 19, 2022 9:01 pm It is not a contradiction at all. Your 'private profits and public losses' comment shows you misunderstand my post.

If the Govt has distorted the market in some way such that it prevents a private firm from making a profit, then there is nothing wrong in the Govt compensating the firms for the market distortion. But, as I said above, only for that and not for commercial risk or incompetence. Or they can of course just nationalise and take a larger proportion of the economy into state hands.

Saying a certain type of business should or should not be state owned depends on a whole number of factors. There are core things (eg defence) I see no argument for private provision. Outside that, I see no reason why a state organisation is necessarily better than properly regulated private firms in delivering particular services.

Govts distort markets pretty much 100% of the time:
- regulation (which you mention but assumes the pie "properly")
- tariffs
are 2 examples. Name me a market NOT affected by either of these?

On your but in red, BECAUSE a monopoly can be a properly regulated private firm and it will still always be a bad thing for the consumer. I give you water....

Torquemada 1420 wrote: ↑Sat Aug 20, 2022 4:10 pm

Biffer wrote: ↑Sat Aug 20, 2022 3:06 pm Yeah, the right wing middle and upper class never tries to tell the poor what’s good for them right enough.

That attitude isn’t left or right wing, it’s class. People like to pretend it’s just the other side that does it, and unconsciously justify to them selves.

If that's aimed at me, you need to read my post again. The bit where I say it "closes the circle to the right" i.e. in the end, both parties end up as dictating to the masses. But it's always a worse look for the Left because everyone expects the Right to be self serving.

Torquemada 1420 wrote: ↑Sat Aug 20, 2022 4:10 pm

Biffer wrote: ↑Sat Aug 20, 2022 3:06 pm Yeah, the right wing middle and upper class never tries to tell the poor what’s good for them right enough.

That attitude isn’t left or right wing, it’s class. People like to pretend it’s just the other side that does it, and unconsciously justify to them selves.

If that's aimed at me, you need to read my post again. The bit where I say it "closes the circle to the right" i.e. in the end, both parties end up as dictating to the masses. But it's always a worse look for the Left because everyone expects the Right to be self serving.

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Thu Aug 18, 2022 3:35 pm

Torquemada 1420 wrote: ↑Thu Aug 18, 2022 3:17 pm

Raggs wrote: ↑Thu Aug 18, 2022 3:14 pm

It's more that perhaps our mortgage repayments could have been lower, or we could have got a better property.

Thems the rubs. You can't really time the house market unless you are prepared to wait for a long time.

Ain't that the truth !

You could also add; "& are very lucky"

I waited a long time, because I saw Ireland had an unsustainable bubble, but I still had to wait for years, & then I got lucky, when I got offered redundancy, & my payoff & savings made it possible to buy without having a mortgage. Which was just as well, because the Banks weren't going to offer me a Mortgage when I was only a wet week in my new job.

Uncle fester wrote: ↑Sat Aug 20, 2022 6:05 pm

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Thu Aug 18, 2022 3:35 pm

Torquemada 1420 wrote: ↑Thu Aug 18, 2022 3:17 pm
Thems the rubs. You can't really time the house market unless you are prepared to wait for a long time.

Ain't that the truth !

You could also add; "& are very lucky"

I waited a long time, because I saw Ireland had an unsustainable bubble, but I still had to wait for years, & then I got lucky, when I got offered redundancy, & my payoff & savings made it possible to buy without having a mortgage. Which was just as well, because the Banks weren't going to offer me a Mortgage when I was only a wet week in my new job.

Lucky you. Did same here but then redundancy to one of our incomes torpedoed that plan.

Uncle fester wrote: ↑Sat Aug 20, 2022 7:48 pm Presume they would have been in negative equity if they did that?

Raggs wrote: ↑Sat Aug 20, 2022 8:10 pm What an amazing idea, cos currently, right, the GPs have nothing on their plate and have tons of appointments available.... and they all study finances on the side...

I like neeps wrote: ↑Sat Aug 20, 2022 8:15 pm

Raggs wrote: ↑Sat Aug 20, 2022 8:10 pm What an amazing idea, cos currently, right, the GPs have nothing on their plate and have tons of appointments available.... and they all study finances on the side...

I guess the plan is when people are so cold they become ill the GP is authorised to give them a loan? I presume you don't get to book a GP just because you've run out of money.

Not that you can book a GP at the minute anyway.

Raggs wrote: ↑Sat Aug 20, 2022 8:22 pm

I like neeps wrote: ↑Sat Aug 20, 2022 8:15 pm

Raggs wrote: ↑Sat Aug 20, 2022 8:10 pm What an amazing idea, cos currently, right, the GPs have nothing on their plate and have tons of appointments available.... and they all study finances on the side...

I guess the plan is when people are so cold they become ill the GP is authorised to give them a loan? I presume you don't get to book a GP just because you've run out of money.

Not that you can book a GP at the minute anyway.

I mean thinking about it sensibly, it's a perfect idea, since that way nothing will actually happen, and the poor can get fucked, just like usual.

I like neeps wrote: ↑Sat Aug 20, 2022 8:15 pm

Raggs wrote: ↑Sat Aug 20, 2022 8:10 pm What an amazing idea, cos currently, right, the GPs have nothing on their plate and have tons of appointments available.... and they all study finances on the side...

I guess the plan is when people are so cold they become ill the GP is authorised to give them a loan? I presume you don't get to book a GP just because you've run out of money.

Not that you can book a GP at the minute anyway.

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Sat Aug 20, 2022 8:04 pm

Uncle fester wrote: ↑Sat Aug 20, 2022 7:48 pm Presume they would have been in negative equity if they did that?

Nope, hence my not being as sympathetic as I might have otherwise been. They could have sold the two rentals, & cleared a smallish profit ~10-15k, & considerably reduced their stress, & exposure.

weegie01 wrote: ↑Sat Aug 20, 2022 4:11 pm According to the National Audit Office, compared to the OECD the UK manages at the same time to have some of the lowest levels of Govt regulations coupled with the highest levels of complexity of regulation. Which is pretty much a recipe for disaster.

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Sat Aug 20, 2022 9:46 pm It was interesting to see the Govester trash Dizzy Lizzys financial fantasies today. I suppose it isn't surprising, because people have been commenting for the last couple of years, that this isn't the time to be PM.

It feels increasingly like the brighter ones in the Tory Party, are positioning themselves to be in the next Leadership race, because (a) this one is done, & (b) the life expectancy of Liz's is about the same as one of those Goldfish you win at the Fair; & after that, even if Labour win, they'll be under enormous pressure from inside, & out, & I wouldn't be shocked if they only lasted 2-3 years.

In summary; shit time to be PM for the next 3-4 years, & even the Bumblecunt will be fancying his chances of being the next Tory Leader

GPs could write prescriptions for money off energy bills for the most vulnerable under a plan drawn up by the Treasury, as Liz Truss’s team signalled more help with costs now forecast to top £6,000 next year.
The unusual proposal would mean people could consult their doctor for an assessment on whether they are struggling enough to require help with their bills.

Biffer wrote: ↑Sun Aug 21, 2022 10:47 am This isn’t a genuine idea, it’s a flood the zone with shit tactic.

ia801310 wrote: ↑Mon Jul 11, 2022 5:04 pm My order of preference for PM

1. Patel
2. Badenoch
3. Sunak
4. Zahawi

ia801310 wrote: ↑Sat Aug 20, 2022 10:08 pm I think Kemi is a shoe-in

_Os_ wrote: ↑Mon Jul 18, 2022 10:08 pm The Tory far right's refusal to get behind one candidate, means it's now likely that Sunak will have enough support to start boosting whichever candidate he would rather face. The far right are even getting behind the candidate opinion polls of the public thought came last/second last in both debates (Badenoch), having already got rid of the candidate the same polls showed came first/second (Tugendhat). The swivel eyed loons from UKIP/Brexit Party/Britain First that have infiltrated them then help vote for the most right wing and least electable candidate whoever that is.

There's a strong chance that whoever becomes PM this all gets repeated next year. Very obvious if Sunak becomes PM, there's a large Tory constituency that will refuse to accept it and immediately start trying to replace him. Also very obvious if it's Mordaunt/Truss/Badenoch, they will be forced to compromise by reality (NI protocol etc), the far right will start ranting about their favourite thing, "betrayal", then demand the removal of the candidate they themselves supported. Johnson could even stand again.

They're a huge fucking mess and still poll at 31%.

ia801310 wrote: ↑Sat Aug 20, 2022 10:08 pm

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Sat Aug 20, 2022 9:46 pm It was interesting to see the Govester trash Dizzy Lizzys financial fantasies today. I suppose it isn't surprising, because people have been commenting for the last couple of years, that this isn't the time to be PM.

It feels increasingly like the brighter ones in the Tory Party, are positioning themselves to be in the next Leadership race, because (a) this one is done, & (b) the life expectancy of Liz's is about the same as one of those Goldfish you win at the Fair; & after that, even if Labour win, they'll be under enormous pressure from inside, & out, & I wouldn't be shocked if they only lasted 2-3 years.

In summary; shit time to be PM for the next 3-4 years, & even the Bumblecunt will be fancying his chances of being the next Tory Leader

The GP plan is madness. They will be flooded with appointments as 30 million people all try to see their GP in a single week.

I think Kemi is a shoe-in

I like neeps wrote: ↑Sun Aug 21, 2022 12:15 pm

ia801310 wrote: ↑Sat Aug 20, 2022 10:08 pm

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Sat Aug 20, 2022 9:46 pm It was interesting to see the Govester trash Dizzy Lizzys financial fantasies today. I suppose it isn't surprising, because people have been commenting for the last couple of years, that this isn't the time to be PM.

It feels increasingly like the brighter ones in the Tory Party, are positioning themselves to be in the next Leadership race, because (a) this one is done, & (b) the life expectancy of Liz's is about the same as one of those Goldfish you win at the Fair; & after that, even if Labour win, they'll be under enormous pressure from inside, & out, & I wouldn't be shocked if they only lasted 2-3 years.

In summary; shit time to be PM for the next 3-4 years, & even the Bumblecunt will be fancying his chances of being the next Tory Leader

The GP plan is madness. They will be flooded with appointments as 30 million people all try to see their GP in a single week.

I think Kemi is a shoe-in

As leader of the opposition maybe. But people who can't afford their bills aren't going to be interested in the culture wars no matter how much the Times and Mail want to play them. And Kemi went big on the culture wars.

The big problem for any Tory leader really is this winter and into next summer everyone is going to be materially poorer with a fair amount of poverty, a fair amount of negative equity and a complete feeling of malaise. Doesn't matter who is in charge for that they're done.

I like neeps wrote: ↑Sun Aug 21, 2022 2:17 pm

A winter crisis but in summer.

I like neeps wrote: ↑Sun Aug 21, 2022 12:15 pm

ia801310 wrote: ↑Sat Aug 20, 2022 10:08 pm

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Sat Aug 20, 2022 9:46 pm It was interesting to see the Govester trash Dizzy Lizzys financial fantasies today. I suppose it isn't surprising, because people have been commenting for the last couple of years, that this isn't the time to be PM.

It feels increasingly like the brighter ones in the Tory Party, are positioning themselves to be in the next Leadership race, because (a) this one is done, & (b) the life expectancy of Liz's is about the same as one of those Goldfish you win at the Fair; & after that, even if Labour win, they'll be under enormous pressure from inside, & out, & I wouldn't be shocked if they only lasted 2-3 years.

In summary; shit time to be PM for the next 3-4 years, & even the Bumblecunt will be fancying his chances of being the next Tory Leader

The GP plan is madness. They will be flooded with appointments as 30 million people all try to see their GP in a single week.

I think Kemi is a shoe-in

As leader of the opposition maybe. But people who can't afford their bills aren't going to be interested in the culture wars no matter how much the Times and Mail want to play them. And Kemi went big on the culture wars.

The big problem for any Tory leader really is this winter and into next summer everyone is going to be materially poorer with a fair amount of poverty, a fair amount of negative equity and a complete feeling of malaise. Doesn't matter who is in charge for that they're done.

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Sun Aug 21, 2022 2:39 pm

I like neeps wrote: ↑Sun Aug 21, 2022 2:17 pm

A winter crisis but in summer.

i.e. not a crisis at all, but the new normal, with a gradual slide downwards, as NHS workers get fed up, & emigrate

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Sun Aug 21, 2022 2:39 pm

I like neeps wrote: ↑Sun Aug 21, 2022 2:17 pm

A winter crisis but in summer.

i.e. not a crisis at all, but the new normal, with a gradual slide downwards, as NHS workers get fed up, & emigrate

dpedin wrote: ↑Sun Aug 21, 2022 3:30 pm

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Sun Aug 21, 2022 2:39 pm

I like neeps wrote: ↑Sun Aug 21, 2022 2:17 pm

A winter crisis but in summer.

i.e. not a crisis at all, but the new normal, with a gradual slide downwards, as NHS workers get fed up, & emigrate

NHS hitting the obvious and predictable wall with its workforce.

- NHS pay has fallen dramatically in recent years and is well below what it was in real and relative terms 12 years ago once inflation is taken into account.
- Lots of NHS workers stayed on or returned beyond retirement to help out during covid. They are now leaving.
- The baby boom peak of staff is still working its way through the workforce and the nursing and midwifery workforces are worst hit with higher age profiles and retiral rates.
- Brexit put barriers in place for new EU recruitment and existing EU staff faced with increased costs of staying and living in this country plus the 'we don't want you' messaging.
- The pension changes are hitting hard - the NHS implemented the current scheme illegally according to the courts (age discrimination) and have had to do a fix which meant many could take opportunity to retire earlier than planned and worktheir final years via banks and agencies instead of being tied into a 67 retiral age. Also the pension taxation rules restricting both annual and lifetime pension pot accruals, particularly the lifetime allowance being fixed for 5 years, is hitting older higher paid staff, mostly consultants, who are all being advised to reduce working hours to avoid crippling HMRC bills. I have mates who got £25k HMRC bills this year. Any inflation matching pay increase for this cohort will mean huge HMRC bills as pension is based on ave salary and years service.
- Many staff are just knackered and have left due to the sheer toil and unremitting toll of working through covid, many have serious mental health issues as a result.
- NHS staff were disproportionately hit by covid and many died, many of their colleagues have watched this with their own inadequate PPE and support and thought why should they expose themselves to this?
- The UK Gov is not training enough doctors, dentists, nurses and midwives to sustain the current workforce let alone get us to the levels of staffing seen elsewhere in the UK. Why - to save money, don't believe the lack of training capacity nonsense, it could be done.
- Many junior or newly qualified staff leave asap to work abroad to get better pay or working conditions.

I could go on. I know of some hospitals with 25% nursing vacancy rates with no hope of recruitment to fill all the gaps - what does this mean - beds/wards closed and theatres and surgeons sitting idle as there are no theatre staff. All this was entirely predicable before and during the pandemic. It is easy to model and indeed modelling has been done. Why hasn't something been done - cost and, particularly in England, a political determination to run down the NHSand nudge patients into the private sector. However they forget the private sector does no training of doctors, dentists, nurses and midwives so where the feck the private sector is going to get its workforce when he NHS collapses god only knows! It is a shitshow of enormous proportions!

dpedin wrote: ↑Sun Aug 21, 2022 11:02 am

Biffer wrote: ↑Sun Aug 21, 2022 10:47 am This isn’t a genuine idea, it’s a flood the zone with shit tactic.

Agreed - just bollox! I can imagine the GPs and the RCGP being really pleased that they are now responsible for financial assessments of patients as well as their medical needs. All they will need is a quick 2 day training programme to become a financial advisor and then off they go. Just utter hogwash.

pigsy wrote: ↑Sun Aug 21, 2022 8:33 pm Government cut med school places by 30%
This year because they are expensive....no long term planning. Many of the candidates I know this year are just going to shove off and so something different

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Sat Aug 20, 2022 9:46 pm It was interesting to see the Govester trash Dizzy Lizzys financial fantasies today. I suppose it isn't surprising, because people have been commenting for the last couple of years, that this isn't the time to be PM.

It feels increasingly like the brighter ones in the Tory Party, are positioning themselves to be in the next Leadership race, because (a) this one is done, & (b) the life expectancy of Liz's is about the same as one of those Goldfish you win at the Fair; & after that, even if Labour win, they'll be under enormous pressure from inside, & out, & I wouldn't be shocked if they only lasted 2-3 years.

In summary; shit time to be PM for the next 3-4 years, & even the Bumblecunt will be fancying his chances of being the next Tory Leader

Slick wrote: ↑Mon Aug 22, 2022 9:30 am

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Sat Aug 20, 2022 9:46 pm It was interesting to see the Govester trash Dizzy Lizzys financial fantasies today. I suppose it isn't surprising, because people have been commenting for the last couple of years, that this isn't the time to be PM.

It feels increasingly like the brighter ones in the Tory Party, are positioning themselves to be in the next Leadership race, because (a) this one is done, & (b) the life expectancy of Liz's is about the same as one of those Goldfish you win at the Fair; & after that, even if Labour win, they'll be under enormous pressure from inside, & out, & I wouldn't be shocked if they only lasted 2-3 years.

In summary; shit time to be PM for the next 3-4 years, & even the Bumblecunt will be fancying his chances of being the next Tory Leader

Yes, it was pretty obvious right from the beginning that no one with anything about them, either good or bad, had any interest in this race. It's a very temporary position

Tory leadership frontrunner Liz Truss could give the government a double-figure bounce in the polls once she is installed in No 10, according to internal Labour analysis.
A memo drawn up by Keir Starmer’s director of strategy, Deborah Mattinson, claimed the foreign secretary could dramatically improve Conservative fortunes.
The document, dated 18 August and leaked to the Guardian, comes amid speculation that Truss could be tempted to capitalise on the upswing and call a snap general election.

SaintK wrote: ↑Mon Aug 22, 2022 9:37 am

Slick wrote: ↑Mon Aug 22, 2022 9:30 am

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Sat Aug 20, 2022 9:46 pm It was interesting to see the Govester trash Dizzy Lizzys financial fantasies today. I suppose it isn't surprising, because people have been commenting for the last couple of years, that this isn't the time to be PM.

It feels increasingly like the brighter ones in the Tory Party, are positioning themselves to be in the next Leadership race, because (a) this one is done, & (b) the life expectancy of Liz's is about the same as one of those Goldfish you win at the Fair; & after that, even if Labour win, they'll be under enormous pressure from inside, & out, & I wouldn't be shocked if they only lasted 2-3 years.

In summary; shit time to be PM for the next 3-4 years, & even the Bumblecunt will be fancying his chances of being the next Tory Leader

Yes, it was pretty obvious right from the beginning that no one with anything about them, either good or bad, had any interest in this race. It's a very temporary position

Don't count your chickens

Tory leadership frontrunner Liz Truss could give the government a double-figure bounce in the polls once she is installed in No 10, according to internal Labour analysis.
A memo drawn up by Keir Starmer’s director of strategy, Deborah Mattinson, claimed the foreign secretary could dramatically improve Conservative fortunes.
The document, dated 18 August and leaked to the Guardian, comes amid speculation that Truss could be tempted to capitalise on the upswing and call a snap general election.