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Seems unlikely he'll figure again this season. They have Villiere, Wainiqolo, Cordin and Luc (has been playing FB) too and all are rapid so it's a big name injury that's not really hurt them except in the intl window.
Wise choice.TheFrog wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 3:00 amBeen busy celebrating my youngest 18th birthday, starting with a brunch that prevented me from seeing more than 15min in passing of the game.Torquemada 1420 wrote: ↑Sat May 14, 2022 2:46 pm No sign of La Soule or Frog to comment on Leinster's ruck speed? Commentary calling it "ridiculous" with average being under a second. Where are Jelonch, Cros and Elstadt in slowing this down? Bearing in mind that Baille, Marchand and Dupont are among the best, non back rowers at turnovers in world rugby.
From what I saw it was one way traffic, with the Toulouse players completely spent.
When you win all the collisions in rugby, it becomes easy. And Leinster execution was excellent quality as well.
Whilst too many in France have heads up arses in regards Ntamack, finally, the rest of the world is waking up to his desperately deep limitations.fishfoodie wrote: ↑Sat May 14, 2022 3:45 pmHe's a luxury you can't afford at this level of the game
I'll be honest, I watched that game and at no point did I think he was the problem, the absolute dogshit midfield and the lack of real threat on the wings were a much bigger problem. Not much he can do with such a paucity of talent outside him in that game.Torquemada 1420 wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 6:09 amWhilst too many in France have heads up arses in regards Ntamack, finally, the rest of the world is waking up to his desperately deep limitations.fishfoodie wrote: ↑Sat May 14, 2022 3:45 pmHe's a luxury you can't afford at this level of the game
Romain Ntamack might be able to tear defences apart from time to time but ask him to manage a close game of rugby in the manner of Sexton and you’ll be disappointed.
There’s a reason why he’s never quite been a fixture in the French 10 jersey and today we saw why. When faced with a defence of the pace and intellect of Leinster, his armoury is somewhat bare and he resorts to standing too deep, and offloading ill-judged passes for his team-mates to take the contact that he refuses to take himself. In terms of game management and intellect, Sexton was playing rugby at a different level today.
Although I suspect Jake has just been c'n'p ing my posts from the match threads.
Ntamack was part of a team that under performed yesterday, spent forwards and as you mentioned, even a worth midfield. Leinster is a very, very well organised team though and they nullified ST. ST needs to become street wise in the rucks and adapt better to the ref and his interpretations. They lost the physical battle across the pitch. Leinster played the entire game with short passes behind the first receiver to attract the defence and it was fairly pathetic that ST did not adapt to that. Ergo, Leinster are rightful winners. They will face a tougher opposition in the final in the midfield regardless of which team comes through in the other semi final.JM2K6 wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 10:40 amI'll be honest, I watched that game and at no point did I think he was the problem, the absolute dogshit midfield and the lack of real threat on the wings were a much bigger problem. Not much he can do with such a paucity of talent outside him in that game.Torquemada 1420 wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 6:09 amWhilst too many in France have heads up arses in regards Ntamack, finally, the rest of the world is waking up to his desperately deep limitations.fishfoodie wrote: ↑Sat May 14, 2022 3:45 pm
He's a luxury you can't afford at this level of the game
Romain Ntamack might be able to tear defences apart from time to time but ask him to manage a close game of rugby in the manner of Sexton and you’ll be disappointed.
There’s a reason why he’s never quite been a fixture in the French 10 jersey and today we saw why. When faced with a defence of the pace and intellect of Leinster, his armoury is somewhat bare and he resorts to standing too deep, and offloading ill-judged passes for his team-mates to take the contact that he refuses to take himself. In terms of game management and intellect, Sexton was playing rugby at a different level today.
Although I suspect Jake has just been c'n'p ing my posts from the match threads.
Toulouse seem a really lopsided team, quality front row, best player in the world at 9, good 10, good 15, and extremely variable everywhere else.
Don't you think Toulouse sluggish pace could have to do with their lack of freshness coming into this game?Torquemada 1420 wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 6:06 amWise choice.TheFrog wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 3:00 amBeen busy celebrating my youngest 18th birthday, starting with a brunch that prevented me from seeing more than 15min in passing of the game.Torquemada 1420 wrote: ↑Sat May 14, 2022 2:46 pm No sign of La Soule or Frog to comment on Leinster's ruck speed? Commentary calling it "ridiculous" with average being under a second. Where are Jelonch, Cros and Elstadt in slowing this down? Bearing in mind that Baille, Marchand and Dupont are among the best, non back rowers at turnovers in world rugby.
From what I saw it was one way traffic, with the Toulouse players completely spent.
When you win all the collisions in rugby, it becomes easy. And Leinster execution was excellent quality as well.
At ruck time, the ability of the players to get in support and clear the ruck or take a pop pass made defending almost futile. They were consistently delivering sub two second ruck retention, outrageous considering they were up against five starting French Grand Slammers.
Compare this to the sluggish and isolated running of the Toulouse carriers, who time and time again ran into contact and then struggled to present the ball due to the slowness of their own support. You can rightly conclude that it was the speed of ruck that allowed Leinster so much freedom with which to run.
Comparing Sexton and Ntmack on this game doesn't make sense. Sexton was playing behind a dominating pack, on the front foot while Ntamack was coping with a whole team under pressure.Torquemada 1420 wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 6:09 amWhilst too many in France have heads up arses in regards Ntamack, finally, the rest of the world is waking up to his desperately deep limitations.fishfoodie wrote: ↑Sat May 14, 2022 3:45 pmHe's a luxury you can't afford at this level of the game
Romain Ntamack might be able to tear defences apart from time to time but ask him to manage a close game of rugby in the manner of Sexton and you’ll be disappointed.
There’s a reason why he’s never quite been a fixture in the French 10 jersey and today we saw why. When faced with a defence of the pace and intellect of Leinster, his armoury is somewhat bare and he resorts to standing too deep, and offloading ill-judged passes for his team-mates to take the contact that he refuses to take himself. In terms of game management and intellect, Sexton was playing rugby at a different level today.
Although I suspect Jake has just been c'n'p ing my posts from the match threads.
I agree with your analysis. I think posted this elsewhere, but this year's Toulouse team is a shadow of last year's.JM2K6 wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 10:40 amI'll be honest, I watched that game and at no point did I think he was the problem, the absolute dogshit midfield and the lack of real threat on the wings were a much bigger problem. Not much he can do with such a paucity of talent outside him in that game.Torquemada 1420 wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 6:09 amWhilst too many in France have heads up arses in regards Ntamack, finally, the rest of the world is waking up to his desperately deep limitations.fishfoodie wrote: ↑Sat May 14, 2022 3:45 pm
He's a luxury you can't afford at this level of the game
Romain Ntamack might be able to tear defences apart from time to time but ask him to manage a close game of rugby in the manner of Sexton and you’ll be disappointed.
There’s a reason why he’s never quite been a fixture in the French 10 jersey and today we saw why. When faced with a defence of the pace and intellect of Leinster, his armoury is somewhat bare and he resorts to standing too deep, and offloading ill-judged passes for his team-mates to take the contact that he refuses to take himself. In terms of game management and intellect, Sexton was playing rugby at a different level today.
Although I suspect Jake has just been c'n'p ing my posts from the match threads.
Toulouse seem a really lopsided team, quality front row, best player in the world at 9, good 10, good 15, and extremely variable everywhere else.
Today's game will be intriguing between one club that deliberately opted for a smaller pack in the name of playing a fast game and a team with a monster pack. I doubt the lighter pack could beat Leinster though and therefore I'll be backing La Rochelle.La soule wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 11:21 amNtamack was part of a team that under performed yesterday, spent forwards and as you mentioned, even a worth midfield. Leinster is a very, very well organised team though and they nullified ST. ST needs to become street wise in the rucks and adapt better to the ref and his interpretations. They lost the physical battle across the pitch. Leinster played the entire game with short passes behind the first receiver to attract the defence and it was fairly pathetic that ST did not adapt to that. Ergo, Leinster are rightful winners. They will face a tougher opposition in the final in the midfield regardless of which team comes through in the other semi final.JM2K6 wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 10:40 amI'll be honest, I watched that game and at no point did I think he was the problem, the absolute dogshit midfield and the lack of real threat on the wings were a much bigger problem. Not much he can do with such a paucity of talent outside him in that game.Torquemada 1420 wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 6:09 am
Whilst too many in France have heads up arses in regards Ntamack, finally, the rest of the world is waking up to his desperately deep limitations.
Romain Ntamack might be able to tear defences apart from time to time but ask him to manage a close game of rugby in the manner of Sexton and you’ll be disappointed.
There’s a reason why he’s never quite been a fixture in the French 10 jersey and today we saw why. When faced with a defence of the pace and intellect of Leinster, his armoury is somewhat bare and he resorts to standing too deep, and offloading ill-judged passes for his team-mates to take the contact that he refuses to take himself. In terms of game management and intellect, Sexton was playing rugby at a different level today.
Although I suspect Jake has just been c'n'p ing my posts from the match threads.
Toulouse seem a really lopsided team, quality front row, best player in the world at 9, good 10, good 15, and extremely variable everywhere else.
Torque's pavlovian and systemic dislike of Toulouse being well documented across the years, people should pay very little attention to his point of view. Hatred can be irrational.
On the recruitment front, Barassi is a good additional as is Retière as you mentioned. I reckon Capuozzo will end up on the wing more than he would like I guess. Ramos will get more involved at FH and Ntamack in the centre. Roumat is coming in in the the backrow. Flamant + Meafu can do the job in the second row.TheFrog wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 12:10 pmI agree with your analysis. I think posted this elsewhere, but this year's Toulouse team is a shadow of last year's.JM2K6 wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 10:40 amI'll be honest, I watched that game and at no point did I think he was the problem, the absolute dogshit midfield and the lack of real threat on the wings were a much bigger problem. Not much he can do with such a paucity of talent outside him in that game.Torquemada 1420 wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 6:09 am
Whilst too many in France have heads up arses in regards Ntamack, finally, the rest of the world is waking up to his desperately deep limitations.
Romain Ntamack might be able to tear defences apart from time to time but ask him to manage a close game of rugby in the manner of Sexton and you’ll be disappointed.
There’s a reason why he’s never quite been a fixture in the French 10 jersey and today we saw why. When faced with a defence of the pace and intellect of Leinster, his armoury is somewhat bare and he resorts to standing too deep, and offloading ill-judged passes for his team-mates to take the contact that he refuses to take himself. In terms of game management and intellect, Sexton was playing rugby at a different level today.
Although I suspect Jake has just been c'n'p ing my posts from the match threads.
Toulouse seem a really lopsided team, quality front row, best player in the world at 9, good 10, good 15, and extremely variable everywhere else.
They need upgrades in the second row, bacrow, center and wings. And what do they do? They buy 2 fullbacks.... granted they also signed Barassi who is a good center and Retiere who is a decent winger. But that is not going to help them compensate for their current shortcomings.
Pretty sure LAR will edge it too. Final will be a good day outTheFrog wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 12:12 pmToday's game will be intriguing between one club that deliberately opted for a smaller pack in the name of playing a fast game and a team with a monster pack. I doubt the lighter pack could beat Leinster though and therefore I'll be backing La Rochelle.La soule wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 11:21 amNtamack was part of a team that under performed yesterday, spent forwards and as you mentioned, even a worth midfield. Leinster is a very, very well organised team though and they nullified ST. ST needs to become street wise in the rucks and adapt better to the ref and his interpretations. They lost the physical battle across the pitch. Leinster played the entire game with short passes behind the first receiver to attract the defence and it was fairly pathetic that ST did not adapt to that. Ergo, Leinster are rightful winners. They will face a tougher opposition in the final in the midfield regardless of which team comes through in the other semi final.JM2K6 wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 10:40 am
I'll be honest, I watched that game and at no point did I think he was the problem, the absolute dogshit midfield and the lack of real threat on the wings were a much bigger problem. Not much he can do with such a paucity of talent outside him in that game.
Toulouse seem a really lopsided team, quality front row, best player in the world at 9, good 10, good 15, and extremely variable everywhere else.
Torque's pavlovian and systemic dislike of Toulouse being well documented across the years, people should pay very little attention to his point of view. Hatred can be irrational.
I am not impressed by what I have seen from Meafu so far. And I have the feeling the Arnold brothers aren't at their best any longer.La soule wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 12:21 pm On the recruitment front, Barassi is a good additional as is Retière as you mentioned. I reckon Capuozzo will end up on the wing more than he would like I guess. Ramos will get more involved at FH and Ntamack in the centre. Roumat is coming in in the the backrow. Flamant + Meafu can do the job in the second row.
Bottom line is they are not going to win all competition every year.
JM2K6 wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 10:40 amI'll be honest, I watched that game and at no point did I think he was the problem, the absolute dogshit midfield and the lack of real threat on the wings were a much bigger problem. Not much he can do with such a paucity of talent outside him in that game.Torquemada 1420 wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 6:09 amWhilst too many in France have heads up arses in regards Ntamack, finally, the rest of the world is waking up to his desperately deep limitations.fishfoodie wrote: ↑Sat May 14, 2022 3:45 pm
He's a luxury you can't afford at this level of the game
Romain Ntamack might be able to tear defences apart from time to time but ask him to manage a close game of rugby in the manner of Sexton and you’ll be disappointed.
There’s a reason why he’s never quite been a fixture in the French 10 jersey and today we saw why. When faced with a defence of the pace and intellect of Leinster, his armoury is somewhat bare and he resorts to standing too deep, and offloading ill-judged passes for his team-mates to take the contact that he refuses to take himself. In terms of game management and intellect, Sexton was playing rugby at a different level today.
Although I suspect Jake has just been c'n'p ing my posts from the match threads.
Toulouse seem a really lopsided team, quality front row, best player in the world at 9, good 10, good 15, and extremely variable everywhere else.
They looked sluggish the previous against Munster (in normal time, let alone extra time) but were able to overpower them.TheFrog wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 12:03 pmDon't you think Toulouse sluggish pace could have to do with their lack of freshness coming into this game?Torquemada 1420 wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 6:06 amWise choice.TheFrog wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 3:00 am
Been busy celebrating my youngest 18th birthday, starting with a brunch that prevented me from seeing more than 15min in passing of the game.
From what I saw it was one way traffic, with the Toulouse players completely spent.
When you win all the collisions in rugby, it becomes easy. And Leinster execution was excellent quality as well.
At ruck time, the ability of the players to get in support and clear the ruck or take a pop pass made defending almost futile. They were consistently delivering sub two second ruck retention, outrageous considering they were up against five starting French Grand Slammers.
Compare this to the sluggish and isolated running of the Toulouse carriers, who time and time again ran into contact and then struggled to present the ball due to the slowness of their own support. You can rightly conclude that it was the speed of ruck that allowed Leinster so much freedom with which to run.
Don't give me wrong, Leinster were lethal in their execution but Toulouse clearly lacked energy.
With a fully energized team, it would have been a battle of the proportion of France-Ireland in the 6N except that i think Ireland would have won this time.
The fat lad that got sin binned? Doesn't look very well conditioned even for a tight five forward. Will Skelton became amazing once Saracens got him in shape, maybe Meafu could benefit from a kick up the arse to do the same.TheFrog wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 1:03 pmI am not impressed by what I have seen from Meafu so far. And I have the feeling the Arnold brothers aren't at their best any longer.La soule wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 12:21 pm On the recruitment front, Barassi is a good additional as is Retière as you mentioned. I reckon Capuozzo will end up on the wing more than he would like I guess. Ramos will get more involved at FH and Ntamack in the centre. Roumat is coming in in the the backrow. Flamant + Meafu can do the job in the second row.
Bottom line is they are not going to win all competition every year.
I feel sorry for Ramos. He is an excellent player and will end up being second choice either at 10 or at 15. Either that or Jaminet will be buried. Because Ramos is much safer a fullback.
Have you seen the likes of Marchand, Baille, Flament or Cros playing for France? How Baille is in support of Dupont and passes swiftly to his inside support, how Marchand can offload to offer a try to his lock etc... ?ASMO wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 2:12 pm Toulouse problem is that tbeir forwards are just not dynamic, they just want to pick and smash ad infinitum. Additionally their pivot Ntamack is just quite ordinary, i have to agree withTorq here, he is just all hype and very little substance.(he is a very poor mans Marcus Smith)
Tackle looked perfect to me, Racing cant hold on to the ball at the moment, their lineout is a bit of a dogs dinner too
I dont buy the tiredness excuse, they were equally poor against MunsterTheFrog wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 2:20 pmHave you seen the likes of Marchand, Baille, Flament or Cros playing for France? How Baille is in support of Dupont and passes swiftly to his inside support, how Marchand can offload to offer a try to his lock etc... ?ASMO wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 2:12 pm Toulouse problem is that tbeir forwards are just not dynamic, they just want to pick and smash ad infinitum. Additionally their pivot Ntamack is just quite ordinary, i have to agree withTorq here, he is just all hype and very little substance.(he is a very poor mans Marcus Smith)
These guys had just no gaz. The Munster semi was the nail in their coffin.
Forwards were not in it indeed. ST is not yet sure to be qualified and it will be a tough end to their season.ASMO wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 2:12 pm Toulouse problem is that tbeir forwards are just not dynamic, they just want to pick and smash ad infinitum. Additionally their pivot Ntamack is just quite ordinary, i have to agree withTorq here, he is just all hype and very little substance.(he is a very poor mans Marcus Smith)
He does have nice hair thoughLa soule wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 2:27 pmForwards were not in it indeed. ST is not yet sure to be qualified and it will be a tough end to their season.ASMO wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 2:12 pm Toulouse problem is that tbeir forwards are just not dynamic, they just want to pick and smash ad infinitum. Additionally their pivot Ntamack is just quite ordinary, i have to agree withTorq here, he is just all hype and very little substance.(he is a very poor mans Marcus Smith)
As for Ntamack, he will be around for the next few years both for ST & France and I bet he will win more silver with both. For the national team, if he is not good enough, there's still Jalibert, Carbonnel, Hastoy and others. He is not the only option. If he is not good enough, he will simply not get picked.
And the shoes, have you seen the shoes?ASMO wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 2:30 pmHe does have nice hair thoughLa soule wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 2:27 pmForwards were not in it indeed. ST is not yet sure to be qualified and it will be a tough end to their season.ASMO wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 2:12 pm Toulouse problem is that tbeir forwards are just not dynamic, they just want to pick and smash ad infinitum. Additionally their pivot Ntamack is just quite ordinary, i have to agree withTorq here, he is just all hype and very little substance.(he is a very poor mans Marcus Smith)
As for Ntamack, he will be around for the next few years both for ST & France and I bet he will win more silver with both. For the national team, if he is not good enough, there's still Jalibert, Carbonnel, Hastoy and others. He is not the only option. If he is not good enough, he will simply not get picked.
Then it must be the coaching because these guys- Flament excepted - looked world class during the 6N.ASMO wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 2:22 pmI dont buy the tiredness excuse, they were equally poor against MunsterTheFrog wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 2:20 pmHave you seen the likes of Marchand, Baille, Flament or Cros playing for France? How Baille is in support of Dupont and passes swiftly to his inside support, how Marchand can offload to offer a try to his lock etc... ?ASMO wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 2:12 pm Toulouse problem is that tbeir forwards are just not dynamic, they just want to pick and smash ad infinitum. Additionally their pivot Ntamack is just quite ordinary, i have to agree withTorq here, he is just all hype and very little substance.(he is a very poor mans Marcus Smith)
These guys had just no gaz. The Munster semi was the nail in their coffin.
Backrow? You sure?TheFrog wrote: ↑Sun May 15, 2022 12:10 pm They need upgrades in the second row, bacrow, center and wings. And what do they do? They buy 2 fullbacks.... granted they also signed Barassi who is a good center and Retiere who is a decent winger. But that is not going to help them compensate for their current shortcomings.
Bearing in mind that 2/3rd of that backrow is France's current backrow.These HEC games that all are all French ties are always sh*t. Interestingly Bernol had LaR to win this and I thought no way: in the battle of the flaky FHs, West is a mile worse than Russell.
No. They won't. As it happens, we know it's LaR but Racing are clueless against sustained physicality as was shown when sh*tehouse Sale had them under the cosh for an age.
It's an accusation that could reasonably aimed at all of the T14 sides bar