2023 Six Nations

[Jim Lahey]

I must say I thoroughly enjoyed watching England manshame NZ in the semis in 2019. Mainly because it was an epic rugby performance, which any real rugby man simply has to admire. It being against the Kiwis was the cherry on top.

After that I felt compelled to support them in the final.

[OomStruisbaai]

In 2025 the Springboks will be part of the 6 nations. After that a maybe a 6 nation team will win a WC.

[clydecloggie]

Big picture FF, big picture. We need a NH WC win so best if you don't dent their confidence this year.

No chance in hell I would see an England or Wales (pffrrrttt) RWC victory as a good thing. France, yes. Ireland, very grudgingly, yes - it's amazing how they've turned their fortunes around and probably deserve the ultimate prize for that. But not the other two.

I mean, Georgia winning it would be a great story but realistically there isn't another NH side that could win it.

If England or Wales make the RWC final (and due to the ludicrous draw, they could), I'm definitely supporting whichever SH side they're up against.

Ah, one of the ABE brigade.

Very much so. Nothing good happens when England win tournaments, in any sport.

[SaintK]

No chance in hell I would see an England or Wales (pffrrrttt) RWC victory as a good thing. France, yes. Ireland, very grudgingly, yes - it's amazing how they've turned their fortunes around and probably deserve the ultimate prize for that. But not the other two.

I mean, Georgia winning it would be a great story but realistically there isn't another NH side that could win it.

If England or Wales make the RWC final (and due to the ludicrous draw, they could), I'm definitely supporting whichever SH side they're up against.

Ah, one of the ABE brigade.

Very much so. Nothing good happens when England win tournaments, in any sport.

Oh dear. How sad.

[GogLais]

In 2025 the Springboks will be part of the 6 nations. After that a maybe a 6 nation team will win a WC.

But not a NH team.

[clydecloggie]

Ah, one of the ABE brigade.

Very much so. Nothing good happens when England win tournaments, in any sport.

Oh dear. How sad.

Possibly, yes. Great sporting nation, England, and some of their legendary players turn out to be more than half-decent human beings; Brian Moore and Will Carling, to name a few - who were possibly the 2nd and 3rd most-hated Englanders in Scotland around their time (nothing comes close to Thatcher, of course). But when England do well, braying is never far away so I much prefer for them to lose - early on, preferably.

It's different for women's teams, for some reason. The Lionesses winning the Euros was great and I hoped they'd win the final; and I found myself surprisingly neutral about the women's RWC final too - great game, happy for either side to win it.

But men's - cricket, football, rugby, hockey, I'm always happy to see England on the wrong side of a result.

Perhaps deep down I just want them in the same pit of despair Scotland is usually in. For company.

[fishfoodie]

If we beat the Frogs, I don't care how the rest of the results go.

All that matters is we smack the hosts around, & put some doubt in their minds.

Big picture FF, big picture. We need a NH WC win so best if you don't dent their confidence this year.

No chance in hell I would see an England or Wales (pffrrrttt) RWC victory as a good thing. France, yes. Ireland, very grudgingly, yes - it's amazing how they've turned their fortunes around and probably deserve the ultimate prize for that. But not the other two.

I mean, Georgia winning it would be a great story but realistically there isn't another NH side that could win it.

If England or Wales make the RWC final (and due to the ludicrous draw, they could), I'm definitely supporting whichever SH side they're up against.

If Ireland won it, it would be transformative.

If England, France, SA, NZ win it, it'll just be another large tier one nation win; but if Ireland win, then fans in Scotland, & Wales, & Argentina will look at their structures, & their Officials, & start to ask hard questions; because if Ireland can win it, why can't we, & why HAVEN'T we !

[Torquemada 1420]

Ireland GS [/EOT]

It wouldn't be like the French to surrender this early . . .

But yeah, you're right. The rest of you carnts may as well not bother showing up, or else you'll just have your arses handed to you's by a bunch of privately educated Dublin schoolboys and a couple of Kiwis. And PoM with his angry face.

Look at how the fixtures pan out. I'm a realist.

[Torquemada 1420]

Very much so. Nothing good happens when England win tournaments, in any sport.

Here's a thing. I suspect that if you are a non native living in a country that has some major sporting success, you are going to be subjected to some degree of jingoism. I would opine in most cases it's worse in, say, Italy, Spain and France. I've been in the latter 2 when something important was on (e.g. a 100m in the Olympics) and instead some trivial sh*te was being televised because a native was competing (e.g. synchronised, under water snail eating).

In England's case, I think football is one category with which I'd agree. I've posted several times over the years how "the c**ts are still harping on about 1966". So, there is no way I'd ever want Eng to win a major football tournament because it would be insufferable. However, I expected the same after RWC03 and I was completely wrong: pretty much across the piece, those within and without rugby had dropped it in a matter of weeks. I accept that in the wider media and public space, rugby's lower profile will have had some part to play in that.

{EDIT} And, of course, the additional tension there exists between the rest of the UK and England exasperates the matter because, real or imagined, there is both proximity (e.g. the work space) and proclivity to laud it over one another.

[SaintK]

Very much so. Nothing good happens when England win tournaments, in any sport.

Oh dear. How sad.

Possibly, yes. Great sporting nation, England, and some of their legendary players turn out to be more than half-decent human beings; Brian Moore and Will Carling, to name a few - who were possibly the 2nd and 3rd most-hated Englanders in Scotland around their time (nothing comes close to Thatcher, of course). But when England do well, braying is never far away so I much prefer for them to lose - early on, preferably.

It's different for women's teams, for some reason. The Lionesses winning the Euros was great and I hoped they'd win the final; and I found myself surprisingly neutral about the women's RWC final too - great game, happy for either side to win it.

But men's - cricket, football, rugby, hockey, I'm always happy to see England on the wrong side of a result.

Perhaps deep down I just want them in the same pit of despair Scotland is usually in. For company.

Well, thank goodness two English rugby players who you hated at least turned out to be "half decent human beings". Hopefully one or two others will come along eventually.
And yeah, we all wear Barbour jackets and red needlecord trousers and drive Range Rovers and bray!
Surprised you even bother watching any sport when England are involved to be honest

[OomStruisbaai]

Boer Saffers for some reason hate the English. It's in our blood coming for ages. There must be a very good reason.

Myself changed. I like the English now. Maybe it's a Saint doing this to me.

I

[SaintK]

Boer Saffers for some reason hate the English. It's in our blood coming for ages. There must be a very good reason.

Myself changed. I like the English now. Maybe it's a Saint doing this to me.

I

I understand the historical/political reasons but in this day and age can't get my head round the continuing hate their sports teams thing because they're English

[Ovals]

Boer Saffers for some reason hate the English. It's in our blood coming for ages. There must be a very good reason.

Myself changed. I like the English now. Maybe it's a Saint doing this to me.

I

Our last two next door neighbours have been South African - and they've been really great. In fact, all the SA's i've got to know, have been great.

[clive]

Wales Team

15 Pence
14 Josh
13 North
12 Joe Hawkins
11 Rio Dyer
10 Biggs
9 Tomos
8 Toby
7 Tips
6 Mac
5 Beard
4 Alan
3 Fransis
2 Ken
1 G Thomas

Reps Baldwin Dillion Carre Reffell Jenkins Williams Cuthbert Webb

I like the centre partnership

9 Ospreys ton of experience, Wales win.

[GogLais]

Wales Team

15 Pence
14 Josh
13 North
12 Joe Hawkins
11 Rio Dyer
10 Biggs
9 Tomos
8 Toby
7 Tips
6 Mac
5 Beard
4 Alan
3 Fransis
2 Ken
1 G Thomas

Reps Baldwin Dillion Carre Reffell Jenkins Williams Cuthbert Webb

I like the centre partnership

9 Ospreys ton of experience, Wales win.

No huge surprises, not that I expected any. Gatland doesn't like Roberts as hooker then, agrees with me that he's just a bit too small at top level.

[OomStruisbaai]

Wales Team

15 Pence
14 Josh
13 North
12 Joe Hawkins
11 Rio Dyer
10 Biggs
9 Tomos
8 Toby
7 Tips
6 Mac
5 Beard
4 Alan
3 Fransis
2 Ken
1 G Thomas

Reps Baldwin Dillion Carre Reffell Jenkins Williams Cuthbert Webb

I like the centre partnership

9 Ospreys ton of experience, Wales win.

No Alwyn Jones?

[OomStruisbaai]

Boer Saffers for some reason hate the English. It's in our blood coming for ages. There must be a very good reason.

Myself changed. I like the English now. Maybe it's a Saint doing this to me.

I

Our last two next door neighbours have been South African - and they've been really great. In fact, all the SA's i've got to know, have been great.

My dad refuse to speak English. I remember him walking out the room when they play God safe the queen before tests on the radioThe reason why my English is so shite. When I try to speak English on my phone, my MRS laugh at me. Ask for afrikaans speakers on our help lines is like waiting another hour after waiting an hour.

Fuck but at least I try.

[SaintK]

Wales Team

15 Pence
14 Josh
13 North
12 Joe Hawkins
11 Rio Dyer
10 Biggs
9 Tomos
8 Toby
7 Tips
6 Mac
5 Beard
4 Alan
3 Fransis
2 Ken
1 G Thomas

Reps Baldwin Dillion Carre Reffell Jenkins Williams Cuthbert Webb

I like the centre partnership

9 Ospreys ton of experience, Wales win.

No Alwyn Jones?

Yes at 4
For some reason Clive couldn’t be arsed to put their full names in

[OomStruisbaai]

Wales Team

15 Pence
14 Josh
13 North
12 Joe Hawkins
11 Rio Dyer
10 Biggs
9 Tomos
8 Toby
7 Tips
6 Mac
5 Beard
4 Alan
3 Fransis
2 Ken
1 G Thomas

Reps Baldwin Dillion Carre Reffell Jenkins Williams Cuthbert Webb

I like the centre partnership

9 Ospreys ton of experience, Wales win.

No Alwyn Jones?

Yes at 4
For some reason Clive couldn’t be arsed to put their full names in

The guy is a true legend of rugby. I watch him giving his best for Ospreys

[clive]

Alun Wyn Jones He's gonna play for 40 then, Dafffyd Jenkins on early second half.

[SaintK]

Alun Wyn Jones He's gonna play for 40 then, Dafffyd Jenkins on early second half.

Jenkins is an outstanding prospect

[clive]

Alun Wyn Jones He's gonna play for 40 then, Dafffyd Jenkins on early second half.

Jenkins is an outstanding prospect

Yes indeed.

[Slick]

Alun Wyn Jones He's gonna play for 40 then, Dafffyd Jenkins on early second half.

Oh bollocks, this time of year comes round quick

[sockwithaticket]

Wales Team

15 Pence
14 Josh
13 North
12 Joe Hawkins
11 Rio Dyer
10 Biggs
9 Tomos
8 Toby
7 Tips
6 Mac
5 Beard
4 Alan
3 Fransis
2 Ken
1 G Thomas

Reps Baldwin Dillion Carre Reffell Jenkins Williams Cuthbert Webb

I like the centre partnership

9 Ospreys ton of experience, Wales win.

No Alwyn Jones?

Yes at 4
For some reason Clive couldn’t be arsed to put their full names in

Ovals did a much better team post on the previous page. Even managed to spell alun right.

[clive]

No Alwyn Jones?

Yes at 4
For some reason Clive couldn’t be arsed to put their full names in

Ovals did a much better team post on the previous page. Even managed to spell alun right.

Its Alun with a capital A.

[Paddington Bear]

Clive: welcome back

[GogLais]

Alun Wyn Jones He's gonna play for 40 then, Dafffyd Jenkins on early second half.

Oh bollocks, this time of year comes round quick

Probably what AWJ thinks.

[sockwithaticket]

Yes at 4
For some reason Clive couldn’t be arsed to put their full names in

Ovals did a much better team post on the previous page. Even managed to spell alun right.

Its Alun with a capital A.

He lost the right to capitalisation with his shite performances on the last Lions tour.

[Dogbert]

Oh dear. How sad.

Possibly, yes. Great sporting nation, England, and some of their legendary players turn out to be more than half-decent human beings; Brian Moore and Will Carling, to name a few - who were possibly the 2nd and 3rd most-hated Englanders in Scotland around their time (nothing comes close to Thatcher, of course). But when England do well, braying is never far away so I much prefer for them to lose - early on, preferably.

It's different for women's teams, for some reason. The Lionesses winning the Euros was great and I hoped they'd win the final; and I found myself surprisingly neutral about the women's RWC final too - great game, happy for either side to win it.

But men's - cricket, football, rugby, hockey, I'm always happy to see England on the wrong side of a result.

Perhaps deep down I just want them in the same pit of despair Scotland is usually in. For company.

Well, thank goodness two English rugby players who you hated at least turned out to be "half decent human beings". Hopefully one or two others will come along eventually.
And yeah, we all wear Barbour jackets and red needlecord trousers and drive Range Rovers and bray!
Surprised you even bother watching any sport when England are involved to be honest

That pretty much covers the East Coast Finlay & Farqhuar brigade that inhabits Murrayfield though

[Paddington Bear]

Possibly, yes. Great sporting nation, England, and some of their legendary players turn out to be more than half-decent human beings; Brian Moore and Will Carling, to name a few - who were possibly the 2nd and 3rd most-hated Englanders in Scotland around their time (nothing comes close to Thatcher, of course). But when England do well, braying is never far away so I much prefer for them to lose - early on, preferably.

It's different for women's teams, for some reason. The Lionesses winning the Euros was great and I hoped they'd win the final; and I found myself surprisingly neutral about the women's RWC final too - great game, happy for either side to win it.

But men's - cricket, football, rugby, hockey, I'm always happy to see England on the wrong side of a result.

Perhaps deep down I just want them in the same pit of despair Scotland is usually in. For company.

Well, thank goodness two English rugby players who you hated at least turned out to be "half decent human beings". Hopefully one or two others will come along eventually.
And yeah, we all wear Barbour jackets and red needlecord trousers and drive Range Rovers and bray!
Surprised you even bother watching any sport when England are involved to be honest

That pretty much covers the East Coast Finlay & Farqhuar brigade that inhabits Murrayfield though

Yes I’ve always assumed any Scots making that criticism of us have either never been to Murrayfield or assume we haven’t!

[Slick]

I must say I thoroughly enjoyed watching England manshame NZ in the semis in 2019. Mainly because it was an epic rugby performance, which any real rugby man simply has to admire. It being against the Kiwis was the cherry on top.

After that I felt compelled to support them in the final.

Not for me at that one, was firmly hoping for a loss. However, surprised myself in 2003 by supporting them as much as any Inglander.

Also support them in cricket

[fishfoodie]

Took a look at the bookies to see what way sentiment was going, & man it's a mixed bag.

The only clear consensus is France beating Italy, & after that they've Ireland beating Wales, but they're not terribly generous on the odds, & probably the only value was on Ireland winning by >6 pts. The England v Scotland is all over the map, so it looks like the bookies aren't/weren't any the wiser over where Scab nose will go with selections, or which Scottish side will turn up.

[PCPhil]

Big picture FF, big picture. We need a NH WC win so best if you don't dent their confidence this year.

No chance in hell I would see an England or Wales (pffrrrttt) RWC victory as a good thing. France, yes. Ireland, very grudgingly, yes - it's amazing how they've turned their fortunes around and probably deserve the ultimate prize for that. But not the other two.

I mean, Georgia winning it would be a great story but realistically there isn't another NH side that could win it.

If England or Wales make the RWC final (and due to the ludicrous draw, they could), I'm definitely supporting whichever SH side they're up against.

If Ireland won it, it would be transformative.

If England, France, SA, NZ win it, it'll just be another large tier one nation win; but if Ireland win, then fans in Scotland, & Wales, & Argentina will look at their structures, & their Officials, & start to ask hard questions; because if Ireland can win it, why can't we, & why HAVEN'T we !

Best to get the 1/4 final out the way first.

[Line6 HXFX]

Boer Saffers for some reason hate the English. It's in our blood coming for ages. There must be a very good reason.

Myself changed. I like the English now. Maybe it's a Saint doing this to me.

I

I understand the historical/political reasons but in this day and age can't get my head round the continuing hate their sports teams thing because they're English

I mean rugby is boring, so they have to wrap the product all up nicely and encourage all these Nationalist symbols, culture, history and encourage all this and bring it tkbthe fore .. as part of the product..because most of the time we are just watching kicks or scrums, and just paid 130 quid for the priviledge.

If not for all this nationalist rivalry and history, we are just looking at two commercial competitors going at it really. Two brands of toothpaste essentially. Just endless Marketing and PR, before during and after matches.

And who would give a shit.

So they have to dredge and stir it all up.


Oh and plus if we stole all your resources, natural, mineral human, whilst sending you all our pensioners and oddballs and kept you in a state of utter penury to the extent you can never escape us democratically, you would fucking hate us too.


You hate us anyway.

[clydecloggie]

Well, thank goodness two English rugby players who you hated at least turned out to be "half decent human beings". Hopefully one or two others will come along eventually.
And yeah, we all wear Barbour jackets and red needlecord trousers and drive Range Rovers and bray!
Surprised you even bother watching any sport when England are involved to be honest

That pretty much covers the East Coast Finlay & Farqhuar brigade that inhabits Murrayfield though

Yes I’ve always assumed any Scots making that criticism of us have either never been to Murrayfield or assume we haven’t!

It's why here in the West, Edinburgh is colloquially referred to as England - Ah'm doon the M8, wee visit to England de noo.

Or, as Kevin Bridges said when a punter shouted "Edinburgh" in answer to his question of "where y'all from then?": "Any other English in?"

[robmatic]

Oh dear. How sad.

Possibly, yes. Great sporting nation, England, and some of their legendary players turn out to be more than half-decent human beings; Brian Moore and Will Carling, to name a few - who were possibly the 2nd and 3rd most-hated Englanders in Scotland around their time (nothing comes close to Thatcher, of course). But when England do well, braying is never far away so I much prefer for them to lose - early on, preferably.

It's different for women's teams, for some reason. The Lionesses winning the Euros was great and I hoped they'd win the final; and I found myself surprisingly neutral about the women's RWC final too - great game, happy for either side to win it.

But men's - cricket, football, rugby, hockey, I'm always happy to see England on the wrong side of a result.

Perhaps deep down I just want them in the same pit of despair Scotland is usually in. For company.

Well, thank goodness two English rugby players who you hated at least turned out to be "half decent human beings". Hopefully one or two others will come along eventually.
And yeah, we all wear Barbour jackets and red needlecord trousers and drive Range Rovers and bray!
Surprised you even bother watching any sport when England are involved to be honest

Having to watch England with English commentators fawning over them is probably a big reason for the antipathy in the other home nations. Generally you're only a minute or two into a football game before they start talking about 1966.

[Paddington Bear]

Possibly, yes. Great sporting nation, England, and some of their legendary players turn out to be more than half-decent human beings; Brian Moore and Will Carling, to name a few - who were possibly the 2nd and 3rd most-hated Englanders in Scotland around their time (nothing comes close to Thatcher, of course). But when England do well, braying is never far away so I much prefer for them to lose - early on, preferably.

It's different for women's teams, for some reason. The Lionesses winning the Euros was great and I hoped they'd win the final; and I found myself surprisingly neutral about the women's RWC final too - great game, happy for either side to win it.

But men's - cricket, football, rugby, hockey, I'm always happy to see England on the wrong side of a result.

Perhaps deep down I just want them in the same pit of despair Scotland is usually in. For company.

Well, thank goodness two English rugby players who you hated at least turned out to be "half decent human beings". Hopefully one or two others will come along eventually.
And yeah, we all wear Barbour jackets and red needlecord trousers and drive Range Rovers and bray!
Surprised you even bother watching any sport when England are involved to be honest

Having to watch England with English commentators fawning over them is probably a big reason for the antipathy in the other home nations. Generally you're only a minute or two into a football game before they start talking about 1966.

Have you ever heard Scots/Welsh/Irish commentators?

[Slick]

Love the Six nations

None of us ever get tired of this shit.

[clydecloggie]

Well, thank goodness two English rugby players who you hated at least turned out to be "half decent human beings". Hopefully one or two others will come along eventually.
And yeah, we all wear Barbour jackets and red needlecord trousers and drive Range Rovers and bray!
Surprised you even bother watching any sport when England are involved to be honest

Having to watch England with English commentators fawning over them is probably a big reason for the antipathy in the other home nations. Generally you're only a minute or two into a football game before they start talking about 1966.

Have you ever heard Scots/Welsh/Irish commentators?

I may have occasionally listened to those paragons of jingoism Bill McLaren and Andrew Cotter, yes, why?

[Paddington Bear]

Having to watch England with English commentators fawning over them is probably a big reason for the antipathy in the other home nations. Generally you're only a minute or two into a football game before they start talking about 1966.

Have you ever heard Scots/Welsh/Irish commentators?

I may have occasionally listened to those paragons of jingoism Bill McLaren and Andrew Cotter, yes, why?

The failure to name Andy Nicol is notable and sickening