NPR

Better performance from Dizzy personally, than previously, but all too late from the lack of support from her own benches.

Sounds like the long threatened bonfire of workers rights, is the sop to the ERG nutters, to make up for losing their tax cuts. We'll see if she retains the power to stick to her renewed promise to keep the triple-lock, or if Hunt will prevail. We'll get an idea of her control with this Fracking vote, it's equally unpopular with her MPs, as they know they'll have to carry the can.

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 11:47 am Better performance from Dizzy personally, than previously, but all too late from the lack of support from her own benches.

Sounds like the long threatened bonfire of workers rights, is the sop to the ERG nutters, to make up for losing their tax cuts. We'll see if she retains the power to stick to her renewed promise to keep the triple-lock, or if Hunt will prevail. We'll get an idea of her control with this Fracking vote, it's equally unpopular with her MPs, as they know they'll have to carry the can.

Truss didnt answer any of Starmer's questions and used the broken crutch of supported fuel costs - now only 6 months - and attacking the unions - who incidentally enjoy far more public support that this Gov. Starmer made her look like a puppet PM, which she is. She bought time of a few days or weeks at most. Coming out for a few well prepared and staged events a week is not leadership, as soon as she gets into unprepared territory she turns to jelly and collapses into useless soundbites - see the BBC interview the other night. In the interim we continue with a Gov who have no support from anywhere propped up by MPs until they can finish digging the escape tunnel.

https://www.bmj.com/content/365/bmj.l2164

Interesting article on IEA by BMJ

More troubles for Dizzy

One of the prime minister's most senior advisers has been suspended, the BBC understands.

Jason Stein, a special adviser to Liz Truss, is to face a formal investigation by the Propriety and Ethics Team in Whitehall.

Ovals wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 12:18 pm More troubles for Dizzy

One of the prime minister's most senior advisers has been suspended, the BBC understands.

Jason Stein, a special adviser to Liz Truss, is to face a formal investigation by the Propriety and Ethics Team in Whitehall.

Evidently he was the one who briefed the press with this:

Last night, a No 10 source denied that Javid had ever been considered for the role now filled by Hunt. “The prime minister laughed out loud at the suggestion,” they said. “She has sat in the cabinet with Javid for ten years and she knows who is good and who is shit.”

Some takeaways from that.

1. Prime Moron has gone back to saying it's all international conditions. If there was a credible fiscal policy in place this lie wouldn't matter, but when there isn't it's a different story and what government ministers say has added weight.

2. Hunt committed to ending the triple lock on pensions, Prime Moron has now said that will not happen. What has to happen is going to be hugely politically damaging for the Tories, the fiscal hole is huge and they've increased it, if there's no political will among the executive to agree to a plan and then no will among Tory MPs to vote it all through, then it doesn't happen and the crisis gets worse.

3. There seems a general lack of ability to think ahead. This happened after the BoE intervention that gave a breather too, they all just went back to their bullshit took no action and pretended it was over. The current breather has only been provided by Hunt deleting almost the entire mini budget and accepting the UK was largely responsible, they're using this breather to revert to their default "cake and eat it" mode.

4. No mention of Brexit, when a lot of the fiscal hole is leaving the CU/SM. The political difficulty the Tories are facing now, is because they weren't honest that this would be costly, if they had been it wouldn't have happened.


... 2 and 3 are the big ones, not convinced getting rid of Prime Moron fixes them either. A prolonged crisis stretching into next year looks possible, and it's all because of 4.

dpedin wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 9:13 am ............scrapping tax cuts but keeping bankers bonuses, reducing public spending but reducing tax on banks profits....................

I have not been following this closely, but I don't see the issue with these.

As far as I can see total tax on banks profits has gone up. The combined increase in CT and reduction in the surcharge nets off to a 1% increase for banks (from 27% to 28%). Bank tax may not have gone up as much as other sector's tax, but it has gone up and remains higher than other sectors. Had the bank surcharge remained at 8% over 25%, it would have made the task of retaining the operations of international banks in the UK harder.

Apart from the optics, I'm not sure what the issue with allowing bankers to be paid higher bonus is. Since the cap is expressed as a multiple of salary, when the cap was imposed a lot of base salaries just went up to compensate. If bonus increases do materialise, it just means more tax at 45% coming into HMRC.

As I say, I am not following this forensically so am happy to be corrected.

_Os_ wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 12:21 pm Some takeaways from that.

1. Prime Moron has gone back to saying it's all international conditions. If there was a credible fiscal policy in place this lie wouldn't matter, but when there isn't it's a different story and what government ministers say has added weight.

2. Hunt committed to ending the triple lock on pensions, Prime Moron has now said that will not happen. What has to happen is going to be hugely politically damaging for the Tories, the fiscal hole is huge and they've increased it, if there's no political will among the executive to agree to a plan and then no will among Tory MPs to vote it all through, then it doesn't happen and the crisis gets worse.

3. There seems a general lack of ability to think ahead. This happened after the BoE intervention that gave a breather too, they all just went back to their bullshit took no action and pretended it was over. The current breather has only been provided by Hunt deleting almost the entire mini budget and accepting the UK was largely responsible, they're using this breather to revert to their default "cake and eat it" mode.

4. No mention of Brexit, when a lot of the fiscal hole is leaving the CU/SM. The political difficulty the Tories are facing now, is because they weren't honest that this would be costly, if they had been it wouldn't have happened.

... 2 and 3 are the big ones, not convinced getting rid of Prime Moron fixes them either. A prolonged crisis stretching into next year looks possible, and it's all because of 4.

Post BREXIT I recall saying that the UK would continue to be a decent place to live. My thesis was that the UK economy would continue to grow, but much more slowly than it would have done to give a relative decline. Which would allow the BREXIT proponents to claim victory as they would point to the absolute growth, not the relative decline.

Never did I imagine things would go so wrong, so fast.

SaintK wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 12:21 pm

Ovals wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 12:18 pm More troubles for Dizzy

One of the prime minister's most senior advisers has been suspended, the BBC understands.

Jason Stein, a special adviser to Liz Truss, is to face a formal investigation by the Propriety and Ethics Team in Whitehall.

Evidently he was the one who briefed the press with this:

Last night, a No 10 source denied that Javid had ever been considered for the role now filled by Hunt. “The prime minister laughed out loud at the suggestion,” they said. “She has sat in the cabinet with Javid for ten years and she knows who is good and who is shit.”

.............and also the reason that Sajid did not ask the question he was due to at PMQ's. Utterly dysfunctional!!!!

Biffer wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 2:01 pm

Or maybe even 33%?

SaintK wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 1:57 pm

SaintK wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 12:21 pm

Ovals wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 12:18 pm More troubles for Dizzy

Evidently he was the one who briefed the press with this:

Last night, a No 10 source denied that Javid had ever been considered for the role now filled by Hunt. “The prime minister laughed out loud at the suggestion,” they said. “She has sat in the cabinet with Javid for ten years and she knows who is good and who is shit.”

.............and also the reason that Sajid did not ask the question he was due to at PMQ's. Utterly dysfunctional!!!!

Ah !

I wondered what the response to the Non-Entity MP who got the first question was about. Everyone knew what was supposed to have happened, & saw that the fix was in.

As much as it might be risible coming from Truss or anyone connected to her, Javid being 'incandescent' over being described as shit is a bit much. Other than Wallace, is there any senior Tory who has handled their brief even adequately over the last several years?

Slightly surprised to find that there's an ethics committee investigating Stein. Thought the Tories had managed to hobble any such body.

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 2:47 pm As much as it might be risible coming from Truss or anyone connected to her, Javid being 'incandescent' over being described as shit is a bit much. Other than Wallace, is there any senior Tory who has handled their brief even adequately over the last several years?

Slightly surprised to find that there's an ethics committee investigating Stein. Thought the Tories had managed to hobble any such body.

From Peston

Javid said his condition for not hijacking #PMQs is Stein would be suspended and there should be investigation by Cabinet Office’s Propriety and Ethics committee. Stein has duly been suspended and probe is happening. But it won’t end there, because Stein is confident he cannot be sanctioned for what happened, which carries the implication others in Downing St are to blame. No wonder so many Tory MPs say Truss simply cannot continue in office.

The whole 3 Line Whip for the Fracking motion is very sneaky, basically to vote with Labour or abstain would mean that a letter of no confidence previously submitted would be considered null and void as that MP is no longer a Conservative MP. So MPs will have to vote against the motion in order to have any chance of kicking Truss out. What a massive stinking turd our democracy is right now.

tabascoboy wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 3:08 pm The whole 3 Line Whip for the Fracking motion is very sneaky, basically to vote with Labour or abstain would mean that a letter of no confidence previously submitted would be considered null and void as that MP is no longer a Conservative MP. So MPs will have to vote against the motion in order to have any chance of kicking Truss out. What a massive stinking turd our democracy is right now.

Quite clever political machinations really. But again, if there was say 100 Tory MPs saying they're voting against this they'd U-turn here. They won't kick out a sizeable number. The Tory MPs can end this if they want to. They just don't want to right now.

Not confirmed AFAIK but...

I like neeps wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 3:16 pm

tabascoboy wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 3:08 pm The whole 3 Line Whip for the Fracking motion is very sneaky, basically to vote with Labour or abstain would mean that a letter of no confidence previously submitted would be considered null and void as that MP is no longer a Conservative MP. So MPs will have to vote against the motion in order to have any chance of kicking Truss out. What a massive stinking turd our democracy is right now.

Quite clever political machinations really. But again, if there was say 100 Tory MPs saying they're voting against this they'd U-turn here. They won't kick out a sizeable number. The Tory MPs can end this if they want to. They just don't want to right now.

I'm not sure it's sneaky at all. They'd lose it if it were anything else and Truss would be dead in the water, well even more dead than at present.

tabascoboy wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 3:25 pm Not confirmed AFAIK but...

"Sources claimed the move was at the behest of the new chancellor, Jeremy Hunt, who has taken over control of the government’s economic response following Truss’s disastrous mini-budget, but who they claimed was now “pulling the strings”.

Braverman was an outspoken critic of Truss’s U-turn on the top rate of tax, suggesting she thought the prime minister had fallen victim to a “coup” earlier this month. Some Tory MPs on the libertarian right of the party have been left dismayed by the prime minister’s subsequent moves to ditch other tax cuts."

I like neeps wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 3:16 pm

tabascoboy wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 3:08 pm The whole 3 Line Whip for the Fracking motion is very sneaky, basically to vote with Labour or abstain would mean that a letter of no confidence previously submitted would be considered null and void as that MP is no longer a Conservative MP. So MPs will have to vote against the motion in order to have any chance of kicking Truss out. What a massive stinking turd our democracy is right now.

Quite clever political machinations really. But again, if there was say 100 Tory MPs saying they're voting against this they'd U-turn here. They won't kick out a sizeable number. The Tory MPs can end this if they want to. They just don't want to right now.

Dangerous game of Chicken, when all those MPs know you're fucked by the end of the month anyway !

tabascoboy wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 8:25 am FFS

Looks like she is toast !!!... Good riddance

tabascoboy wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 3:25 pm Not confirmed AFAIK but...

But she's not been sacked!!!!!

No 10 denied that Braverman had been sacked but did not respond to requests for clarification about the nature of her departure.

Edit
Or maybe she was..........by Hunt!

There is speculation that Grant Shapps, the former transport secretary who strongly backed Rishi Sunak in the Conservative leadership race, will replace Braverman in another sudden revamp of Truss’s government …
Sources claimed the move was at the behest of the new chancellor, Jeremy Hunt, who has taken over control of the government’s economic response following Truss’s disastrous mini-budget, but who they claimed was now “pulling the strings”.

Just when you think the Tories can't make this any more of a shitshow, they suddenly do...

Oh this tweet was very quickly deleted, guess he didn't take a few seconds to read the room

Andy Crater MP
@MrAndy_Crater
·
1m
Very sad to see Suella Braverman leave her role. Her ideologies would have driven our fine country forward through these difficult times.

Conservative MP for Warrington South

SaintK wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 3:31 pm

tabascoboy wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 3:25 pm Not confirmed AFAIK but...

But she's not been sacked!!!!!

No 10 denied that Braverman had been sacked but did not respond to requests for clarification about the nature of her departure.

Edit
Or maybe she was..........by Hunt!

There is speculation that Grant Shapps, the former transport secretary who strongly backed Rishi Sunak in the Conservative leadership race, will replace Braverman in another sudden revamp of Truss’s government …
Sources claimed the move was at the behest of the new chancellor, Jeremy Hunt, who has taken over control of the government’s economic response following Truss’s disastrous mini-budget, but who they claimed was now “pulling the strings”.

I suspect it was her that briefed against Sajid Javed in very uncomplimentary terms .................

Braverman story now confirmed by BBC - "resigned" apparently.

Tichtheid wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 3:40 pm Braverman story now confirmed by BBC - "resigned" apparently.

I am hearing sacked....... security issue !!!

The sun god wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 3:41 pm

Tichtheid wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 3:40 pm Braverman story now confirmed by BBC - "resigned" apparently.

I am hearing sacked....... security issue !!!

Due to an 'honest mistake' whatever that means !!

The sun god wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 3:41 pm

Tichtheid wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 3:40 pm Braverman story now confirmed by BBC - "resigned" apparently.

I am hearing sacked....... security issue !!!

My wife had to tell one or two executives or board members that the CEO/Chair had lost confidence in them, they then "resigned".

The UKs Minister for QAnon gone, for sharing security information on private phone. ..... three weeks into the job.

Not the only reason, but one of a number

It's almost as if appointing people for loyalty, instead of ability is a really, really shit idea ?

and the Dizzy is a truely fucking awful Leader

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 3:44 pm The UKs Minister for QAnon gone, for sharing security information on private phone. ..... three weeks into the job.

Not the only reason, but one of a number

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 3:44 pm The UKs Minister for QAnon gone, for sharing security information on private phone. ..... three weeks into the job.

Not the only reason, but one of a number

This is somehow the way I imagine that a UKIP Government would have ( not ) worked, people acting first in a massive hissy fit and thinking much, much later...

tabascoboy wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 3:43 pm

Can she sack the Minister that admitted to illegally sharing Prescription medicines next ?

This is hilarious

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 3:47 pm Can she sack the Minister that admitted to illegally sharing Prescription medicines next ?

Not slimming pills I presume !!!

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 3:44 pm The UKs Minister for QAnon gone, for sharing security information on private phone. ..... three weeks into the job.

Not the only reason, but one of a number

It's almost as if appointing people for loyalty, instead of ability is a really, really shit idea ?

and the Dizzy is a truely fucking awful Leader

Coffey next please!

tabascoboy wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 3:56 pm

Sounds like Peston is still swallowing the bullshit he's fed from No.10

This is Hunts appointment; not Dizzys