NPR

Something I find absolutely extraordinary is that none of the following XV were even involved in Scotland's 23 for yesterday's excellent performance:

Ollie Smith
Darcy Graham
Mark Bennett
Cameron Redpath
Sean Maitland
Adam Hastings
Ali Price
Rory Sutherland
Ewan Ashman
Simon Berghan
Sam Skinner
Scott Cummings
Rory Darge
Hamish Watson
Magnus Bradbury

Why is this extraordinary?
1. That's a bloody good team IMO. I don't think many would be too bothered about any of those players donning the shirt vs. Tonga and Romania this autumn, for instance;
2. There are three Lions in that team; and
3. At least five members of that team + the 23 will not be selected for the RWC squad.

Dare to dream? Nah, we know better...

charltom wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 10:00 pm Something I find absolutely extraordinary is that none of the following XV were even involved in Scotland's 23 for yesterday's excellent performance:

Ollie Smith
Darcy Graham
Mark Bennett
Cameron Redpath
Sean Maitland
Adam Hastings
Ali Price
Rory Sutherland
Ewan Ashman
Simon Berghan
Sam Skinner
Marshall Sykes
Rory Darge
Hamish Watson
Magnus Bradbury

Why is this extraordinary?
1. That's a bloody good team IMO. I don't think many would be too bothered about any of those players donning the shirt vs. Tonga and Romania this autumn, for instance;
2. There are three Lions in that team; and
3. At least five members of that team + the 23 will not be selected for the RWC squad.

Dare to dream? Nah, we know better...

Also Oli Kebble, Stuart McInally, Dave Cherry, D’Arcy Rae, Scott Cummings, Alex Craig, Jamie Hodgson, Dylan Richardson, Nick Haining, Andy Christie, Tom Gordon, Josh Bayliss, Scott Steele, Ben Vellacott, Ben Healy, Ross Thompson, Matt Scott, James Lang, Rory Hutchinson, Stafford McDowall, Damian Hoyland, Kyle Rowe and Cole Forbes. Who have all been in and around the squad in recent times.

Is there any word on Graham? Any chance he'll be involved on Saturday?

Yr Alban wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 10:16 pm

charltom wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 10:00 pm Something I find absolutely extraordinary is that none of the following XV were even involved in Scotland's 23 for yesterday's excellent performance:

Ollie Smith
Darcy Graham
Mark Bennett
Cameron Redpath
Sean Maitland
Adam Hastings
Ali Price
Rory Sutherland
Ewan Ashman
Simon Berghan
Sam Skinner
Marshall Sykes
Rory Darge
Hamish Watson
Magnus Bradbury

Why is this extraordinary?
1. That's a bloody good team IMO. I don't think many would be too bothered about any of those players donning the shirt vs. Tonga and Romania this autumn, for instance;
2. There are three Lions in that team; and
3. At least five members of that team + the 23 will not be selected for the RWC squad.

Dare to dream? Nah, we know better...

Also Oli Kebble, Stuart McInally, Dave Cherry, D’Arcy Rae, Scott Cummings, Alex Craig, Jamie Hodgson, Dylan Richardson, Nick Haining, Andy Christie, Tom Gordon, Josh Bayliss, Scott Steele, Ben Vellacott, Ben Healy, Ross Thompson, Matt Scott, James Lang, Rory Hutchinson, Stafford McDowall, Damian Hoyland, Kyle Rowe and Cole Forbes. Who have all been in and around the squad in recent times.

Yeah... but that's too many people for a XV!

RWC squad (ignoring potential injuries) as I see it:

Stuart Hogg Blair Kinghorn
Darcy Graham Kyle Steyn
Huw Jones Chris Harris
Sione Tuipulotu Cameron Redpath
Duhan vd Merwe Sean Maitland/Ollie Smith
Finn Russell Adam Hastings
Ben White George Horne
Pierre Schoeman Rory Sutherland Jamie Bhatti
George Turner Fraser Brown Ewan Ashman
Zander Fagerson WP Nel Simon Berghan/Murphy Walker
Richie Gray Sam Skinner/Jonny Gray
Scott Cummings Grant Gilchrist
Rory Darge Hamish Watson
Jamie Ritchie Luke Crosbie
Matt Fagerson Jack Dempsey

Squad is 33 people. I can imagine one of the three-quarters being omitted in favour of a third scrum-half, e.g. Ali Price.

That's probably not too far off the RWC squad.

I like Darge and I think he is the future at 7 for Scotland, but, and it's a big but, he's still to prove himself as a consistent performer at international level. To be honest I am confident that he can do that, more importantly he needs to stay fit - I'm usually optimistic, but I keep seeing Ross Rennie in Darge, potentially world class, but he picks up a lot of injuries. He plays a position which picks up a lot of knocks and he plays it in a style style where he puts his body on the line all the time.
What's the prognosis on him at the moment? Is he due back soon?


Turning to Edinburgh's recent woeful league form, we have Scarlets away on Saturday coming, we could put out a decent side;

Venter, McBurney, McCallum, Young, Sykes, Haining, Boyle, Mata
Vellacott, Savala, Goosen, Lang, Bennett, Graham, Boff
Harrison, DeBruin, Atalifo, Phillips, Muncaster, Sheil, Jaco, Immelman.

That is hoping Boff and Graham are fit and not including some guys who may be released back to us to get some rugby - Hodgson, Skinner, Watson, Cherry, plus not knowing the fitness situation of Dean, McInally, Currie

charltom wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 11:44 pm

Yr Alban wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 10:16 pm

charltom wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 10:00 pm Something I find absolutely extraordinary is that none of the following XV were even involved in Scotland's 23 for yesterday's excellent performance:

Ollie Smith
Darcy Graham
Mark Bennett
Cameron Redpath
Sean Maitland
Adam Hastings
Ali Price
Rory Sutherland
Ewan Ashman
Simon Berghan
Sam Skinner
Marshall Sykes
Rory Darge
Hamish Watson
Magnus Bradbury

Why is this extraordinary?
1. That's a bloody good team IMO. I don't think many would be too bothered about any of those players donning the shirt vs. Tonga and Romania this autumn, for instance;
2. There are three Lions in that team; and
3. At least five members of that team + the 23 will not be selected for the RWC squad.

Dare to dream? Nah, we know better...

Also Oli Kebble, Stuart McInally, Dave Cherry, D’Arcy Rae, Scott Cummings, Alex Craig, Jamie Hodgson, Dylan Richardson, Nick Haining, Andy Christie, Tom Gordon, Josh Bayliss, Scott Steele, Ben Vellacott, Ben Healy, Ross Thompson, Matt Scott, James Lang, Rory Hutchinson, Stafford McDowall, Damian Hoyland, Kyle Rowe and Cole Forbes. Who have all been in and around the squad in recent times.

Yeah... but that's too many people for a XV!

Think we should go for it against France

dpedin wrote: ↑Sat Feb 11, 2023 11:43 am

Biffer wrote: ↑Sat Feb 11, 2023 12:37 am

I like neeps wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 6:42 pm

How come it will be more difficult? Wales don't have as good players as England and we're at home?

Because our biggest problem for the last five years has been mental barriers. We've got past them already with England,last Saturday was the cherry on that. We're not past the mental barriers with Wales.

You can have a team packed of the best 15 players but still that team can play shite if no-one knows what they are doing! As the first match in charge Borthwick chose a simple game plan and a team he thought could implement it. They struggled for a variety of reasons, a lot of his better players looked a bit lost, and in his second match Borthwick has changed the team and probably his tactics, significantly. Love him or hate him Gatland will set up his team to frustrate us and pick away at our weaknesses. We struggle against them particularly when they play Gatlandball. We struggle to break down their defence, they make the rucks a mess and we end up losing our discipline and concede penalties. They have picked a back row to spoil the breakdown and slow down our quick ball. It will be tight but I suspect we will win.

Looks like I owe you an apology! Gatland managed to prove me wrong and pack a team full of shit players, pick shit tactics and play a shit game! To be fair they kept it tight for 40mins and we did struggle as I expected but thankfully the Welsh have not an iota of attacking nous in the team. Bigger is really just shit isn't he? We made a few changes to tactics at half time then ran them ragged in the second 40mins. Apart from Zander our discipline was excellent and we showed some fantastic shapes in the backs. By the end of the game we were scoring at will.

England however still proved that you can have a team full of good players yet still play shit. Despite dominance up front they insisted in kicking away good ball even when they had a 2 man overlap. They will be dangerous once they work out how to attack or even pass the ball in the backs! Farrell for all his positives is a real drag anchor on their attack and I still feel having Smith playing at 10 with fast ball from Van Poortvliet, Dombrandt at 8 and Lawerence doing his best Esterhuizen impersonation at 12 would be a better choice. Glad we played them first up.

Edinburgh sign Robin Hislop on a two year deal.

Biffer wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 1:03 pm Edinburgh sign Robin Hislop on a two year deal.

Good stuff.

I think his case is one that does show the challenges of developing props. Him leaving Edinburgh first time was one of those classic failures of the pro teams that fans chunter about but it took him 6 or 7 years of paying his dues in the Championship before he became a top level prop.

I wonder if this is another clue as to Venter leaving?

Anyway, I'm happy to welcome Hislop back to Embra

(I also wonder what this means re Sutherland? He is only supposed to be at Ulster for this season, they have Kitshoff coming in)

btw, is the Embra forum completely potted heid now?

I just tried to get on there and got a warning of "This account has been suspended" both on wifi and on data.

Tichtheid wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 1:24 pm I wonder if this is another clue as to Venter leaving?

Anyway, I'm happy to welcome Hislop back to Embra

(I also wonder what this means re Sutherland? He is only supposed to be at Ulster for this season, they have Kitshoff coming in)

Do we still have Auterac next season as well? I'm assuming this means Venter will be off. He'll be a great signing for whoever picks him up, he's turned into a really good player and is presumably not on big wages currently, given that we picked him up from Cheetahs where he hadn't played that much.

It's been years since I've been on there. Got reported once for "racism" after making a joke about Fifers

No idea about Auterac, I don't think the length of contract was stated at the time, you'd think it would be a year, that was what Moyano was on.

Jock42 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 1:32 pm It's been years since I've been on there. Got reported once for "racism" after making a joke about Fifers

Dearie me.


I like Martin Bell's write ups of the games.

robmatic wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 1:22 pm

Biffer wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 1:03 pm Edinburgh sign Robin Hislop on a two year deal.

Good stuff.

I think his case is one that does show the challenges of developing props. Him leaving Edinburgh first time was one of those classic failures of the pro teams that fans chunter about but it took him 6 or 7 years of paying his dues in the Championship before he became a top level prop.

I think he did actually play a fair few games before leaving. It's an improvement on recently when they don't even get a chance. See Millar-Mills is TH cover until the end of the six nations. Did one of Atalifo or De Bruin get injured? When does Scougall get a game?

Tichtheid wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 1:28 pm btw, is the Embra forum completely potted heid now?

I just tried to get on there and got a warning of "This account has been suspended" both on wifi and on data.

I think its banjoed, I get the same warning.

Biffer wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 1:03 pm Edinburgh sign Robin Hislop on a two year deal.

Good signing. Eliot Milar Mils has signed for tighthead cover for the rest of this year.

KingBlairhorn wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 4:02 pm

Biffer wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 1:03 pm Edinburgh sign Robin Hislop on a two year deal.

Good signing. Eliot Milar Mils has signed for tighthead cover for the rest of this year.

Talking of tightheads and referencing the earlier conversation on SQ tighthead depth being terrible, I hope the SRU are having a good look at former U20 Will Hurd. I mentioned him getting some gametime a few months back and that has continued into this year with a combination of bench and starting spots in the Tigers team. Given Dan Cole is starting tighthead there and they also have Joe Heyes who is an emerging England player (7 caps at 23) that's a pretty decent effort. Worth a look for Edinburgh with Nel probably retiring at the end of the year.

KingBlairhorn wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 4:02 pm

Biffer wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 1:03 pm Edinburgh sign Robin Hislop on a two year deal.

Good signing. Eliot Milar Mils has signed for tighthead cover for the rest of this year.

Was with us in the 2017-18 season, from memory he even played in an 1872 Cup match

mos_eisely_ wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 6:31 pm

KingBlairhorn wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 4:02 pm

Biffer wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 1:03 pm Edinburgh sign Robin Hislop on a two year deal.

Good signing. Eliot Milar Mils has signed for tighthead cover for the rest of this year.

Was with us in the 2017-18 season, from memory he even played in an 1872 Cup match

Yeah, re-signing is more accurate i suppose. He was SQ IIRC too…?

KingBlairhorn wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 7:16 pmYeah, re-signing is more accurate i suppose. He was SQ IIRC too…?

He is Scottish qualified and has sister who has played for Scotland, and said sister's twin sister has played for England. They have a Scottish mother.

weegie01 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 7:44 pm

KingBlairhorn wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 7:16 pmYeah, re-signing is more accurate i suppose. He was SQ IIRC too…?

He is Scottish qualified and has sister who has played for Scotland, and said sister's twin sister has played for England. They have a Scottish mother.

Funny, despite the slightly unusual surname I never made the connection!

weegie01 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 7:44 pm

KingBlairhorn wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 7:16 pmYeah, re-signing is more accurate i suppose. He was SQ IIRC too…?

He is Scottish qualified and has sister who has played for Scotland, and said sister's twin sister has played for England. They have a Scottish mother.

So his other sister then?

And over in the West Coast - Warriors confirm Rory Darge has returned to full training

https://glasgowwarriors.org/squad-updat ... s38Kr3qmCE

Dogbert wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 8:52 pm And over in the West Coast - Warriors confirm Rory Darge has returned to full training

https://glasgowwarriors.org/squad-updat ... s38Kr3qmCE

Good news.

Fingers crossed for him.

Biffer wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 8:24 pm

weegie01 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 7:44 pm

KingBlairhorn wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 7:16 pmYeah, re-signing is more accurate i suppose. He was SQ IIRC too…?

He is Scottish qualified and has sister who has played for Scotland, and said sister's twin sister has played for England. They have a Scottish mother.

So his other sister then?

Well yes, but I thought it worth mentioning that the girls are twins and played for different countries.

Glasgow - Ulster this weekend in what is likely to be a defining fixture for Glasgow's chances of a home QF.

Some great players released back to Glasgow from the Scotland camp, including Price and Dempsey, so it should be a much better team than usual in the 6N fallow week.

How are we feeling about that one?

Ulster are coming off the back of 2 good results against Stormers & Sale , and will be less disrupted from missing 6Nations players .

Be interested to see who actually gets Game time from the released Scottish Glasgow Players

My best guess at the Glasgow Team would be

Bhatti
Matthews
Sordoni
Bean
du Preez
Gordon
Vailanu
Dempsey
Price
Jordan
Forbes
Johnson
McDowall
Cancelliere
Smith/McKay

No real 13 as the backline is a bit bare without Sione / Shuggie or Kyle.

In Franco we Trust

Dogbert wrote: ↑Tue Feb 14, 2023 2:24 pm Ulster are coming off the back of 2 good results against Stormers & Sale , and will be less disrupted from missing 6Nations players .

Herring, Hendo and McCloskey will be missing, probably not Stockdale

Be interested to see who actually gets Game time from the released Scottish Glasgow Players

I hope Cummings gets a run, even if it's from the bench

weegie01 wrote: ↑Tue Feb 14, 2023 1:13 pm

Biffer wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 8:24 pm

weegie01 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 7:44 pm
He is Scottish qualified and has sister who has played for Scotland, and said sister's twin sister has played for England. They have a Scottish mother.

So his other sister then?

Well yes, but I thought it worth mentioning that the girls are twins and played for different countries.

Yeah, I realise that, it was just a bit convoluted

Just read a thing on Twitter which maybe sums up the size of the task ahead (I haven’t confirmed the stats, so apols if they are completely wrong):

’An amazing fact about France is that they scored 19 points despite only spending 53 seconds in Ireland’s 22.

‘An amazing fact about Ireland is that they kept France out of their 22 for 79 minutes and 7 seconds.’

Yr Alban wrote: ↑Tue Feb 14, 2023 6:18 pm Just read a thing on Twitter which maybe sums up the size of the task ahead (I haven’t confirmed the stats, so apols if they are completely wrong):

’An amazing fact about France is that they scored 19 points despite only spending 53 seconds in Ireland’s 22.

‘An amazing fact about Ireland is that they kept France out of their 22 for 79 minutes and 7 seconds.’

From rough memory, Steyn’s second was about fifteen seconds in the 22, Kinghorn’s was about 5 seconds, Turner’s about 15 seconds. So probably time for a fourth. Easy.

Biffer wrote: ↑Tue Feb 14, 2023 7:00 pm

Yr Alban wrote: ↑Tue Feb 14, 2023 6:18 pm Just read a thing on Twitter which maybe sums up the size of the task ahead (I haven’t confirmed the stats, so apols if they are completely wrong):

’An amazing fact about France is that they scored 19 points despite only spending 53 seconds in Ireland’s 22.

‘An amazing fact about Ireland is that they kept France out of their 22 for 79 minutes and 7 seconds.’

From rough memory, Steyn’s second was about fifteen seconds in the 22, Kinghorn’s was about 5 seconds, Turner’s about 15 seconds. So probably time for a fourth. Easy.

Scotland average 4 points per visit to the 22, over the two games. To do it once is excellent, to do it twice in a row is ludicrous. They are more ruthless and clinical in the 22 than either France or Ireland. I'm sure the French and Irish analysts are sitting behind their laptops devising plans to keep Scotland away from the 22, which is a good problem to have if you're Scotland.

In all honesty I still can't see Scotland beating Ireland, that team just doesn't have any weak spots. But France, even in Paris - they just might.

clydecloggie wrote: ↑Tue Feb 14, 2023 8:54 pm

Biffer wrote: ↑Tue Feb 14, 2023 7:00 pm

Yr Alban wrote: ↑Tue Feb 14, 2023 6:18 pm Just read a thing on Twitter which maybe sums up the size of the task ahead (I haven’t confirmed the stats, so apols if they are completely wrong):

’An amazing fact about France is that they scored 19 points despite only spending 53 seconds in Ireland’s 22.

‘An amazing fact about Ireland is that they kept France out of their 22 for 79 minutes and 7 seconds.’

From rough memory, Steyn’s second was about fifteen seconds in the 22, Kinghorn’s was about 5 seconds, Turner’s about 15 seconds. So probably time for a fourth. Easy.

Scotland average 4 points per visit to the 22, over the two games. To do it once is excellent, to do it twice in a row is ludicrous. They are more ruthless and clinical in the 22 than either France or Ireland. I'm sure the French and Irish analysts are sitting behind their laptops devising plans to keep Scotland away from the 22, which is a good problem to have if you're Scotland.

In all honesty I still can't see Scotland beating Ireland, that team just doesn't have any weak spots. But France, even in Paris - they just might.

Aye. I suspect France will probably edge us by 5 or so, though it could go either way. Ireland will likely beat us by 15. We’re at home, but they are deservedly the best side in the world and, as you say, they don’t have any weaknesses.

I’d love to think otherwise, especially with one eye on the RWC, but there it is.

clydecloggie wrote: ↑Tue Feb 14, 2023 8:54 pm

Biffer wrote: ↑Tue Feb 14, 2023 7:00 pm

Yr Alban wrote: ↑Tue Feb 14, 2023 6:18 pm Just read a thing on Twitter which maybe sums up the size of the task ahead (I haven’t confirmed the stats, so apols if they are completely wrong):

’An amazing fact about France is that they scored 19 points despite only spending 53 seconds in Ireland’s 22.

‘An amazing fact about Ireland is that they kept France out of their 22 for 79 minutes and 7 seconds.’

From rough memory, Steyn’s second was about fifteen seconds in the 22, Kinghorn’s was about 5 seconds, Turner’s about 15 seconds. So probably time for a fourth. Easy.

Scotland average 4 points per visit to the 22, over the two games. To do it once is excellent, to do it twice in a row is ludicrous. They are more ruthless and clinical in the 22 than either France or Ireland. I'm sure the French and Irish analysts are sitting behind their laptops devising plans to keep Scotland away from the 22, which is a good problem to have if you're Scotland.

In all honesty I still can't see Scotland beating Ireland, that team just doesn't have any weak spots. But France, even in Paris - they just might.

Yeah, that’s where I am.

As much as I want them to win the GS, how good would that last weekend be if Scotland rely on England winning (provided they dig out obviously), as a sporting, and drinking, spectacle it would be great drama.

Jock42 wrote: ↑Tue Feb 14, 2023 9:43 pm As much as I want them to win the GS, how good would that last weekend be if Scotland rely on England winning (provided they dig out obviously), as a sporting, and drinking, spectacle it would be great drama.

Aye, and if they don’t, it gives us another reason to have a go at them

I think Ireland are worth their current number one ranking, but they are no McCaw's and Carter's All Blacks, and even they could be beaten, if not very often.

The one thing we mustn't do is think we can't win.


The number 7 selection over the next two games is a conundrum, on the one hand you want Crosbie's abrasiveness and carrying ability, and perhaps even more so, to use him as a fourth jumper.
On the other hand, if Watson is fit and firing, you want him on the ground, killing their ruck speed and making a nuisance of himself.

So far Gray and Gilchrist have performed well in the lineout, we'll need to be even better against France and Ireland. We'll need to be squeaky clean around the park, I'm looking particularly at the older Fagerson here.

Clichés exist in rugby because they are true, if we get parity in the set piece and can hold our own at the breakdown and if we stick to our lines in defence, when we get a chance to pull the trigger we have some attacking moves

Tichtheid wrote: ↑Tue Feb 14, 2023 9:54 pm I think Ireland are worth their current number one ranking, but they are no McCaw's and Carter's All Blacks, and even they could be beaten, if not very often.

The one thing we mustn't do is think we can't win.


The number 7 selection over the next two games is a conundrum, on the one hand you want Crosbie's abrasiveness and carrying ability, and perhaps even more so, to use him as a fourth jumper.
On the other hand, if Watson is fit and firing, you want him on the ground, killing their ruck speed and making a nuisance of himself.

So far Gray and Gilchrist have performed well in the lineout, we'll need to be even better against France and Ireland. We'll need to be squeaky clean around the park, I'm looking particularly at the older Fagerson here.

Clichés exist in rugby because they are true, if we get parity in the set piece and can hold our own at the breakdown and if we stick to our lines in defence, when we get a chance to pull the trigger we have some attacking moves

So we’ve exorcised the Twickenham bogey (twice) and we’ve beaten a Wales side under Gatland. There’s one more record I want rid of: I really don’t want Sexton to finish his career never having lost to any Scottish side. He doesn’t play many URC games any more, so basically we have two shots at it, and our best chance will be at MF.