Official Lions selection, moaning and bitching thread

[SaintK]

My only real complaint would be Price, seems a very odd and unfair decision with him being our best back on Saturday. At least he will get on.

I also think Sutherland is a silly decision although Mako was good when he came on. There is no way that Bok scrum is going to be as bad this weekend.

Mish I haven't got too many complaints about, although I still think he deserves to start instead of Curry, but a bit of a waste on the bench - with a nod to JMK's point about the balance.

But of course you do
It was probably one of those 50/50 calls with Curry's versatility getting him the nod?

[shaggy]

My only real complaint would be Price, seems a very odd and unfair decision with him being our best back on Saturday. At least he will get on.

I also think Sutherland is a silly decision although Mako was good when he came on. There is no way that Bok scrum is going to be as bad this weekend.

Mish I haven't got too many complaints about, although I still think he deserves to start instead of Curry, but a bit of a waste on the bench - with a nod to JMK's point about the balance.

But of course you do
It was probably one of those 50/50 calls with Curry's versatility getting him the nod?

Without May he needs a new hobby horse!

[Hal Jordan]

I wouldn't be surprised if Curry plays the full 80, but if he goes down Gatland's going full on Jack Rowell with Faletau.

I always worry when Mako starts, he always seems to be better coming off the bench.

[Slick]

My only real complaint would be Price, seems a very odd and unfair decision with him being our best back on Saturday. At least he will get on.

I also think Sutherland is a silly decision although Mako was good when he came on. There is no way that Bok scrum is going to be as bad this weekend.

Mish I haven't got too many complaints about, although I still think he deserves to start instead of Curry, but a bit of a waste on the bench - with a nod to JMK's point about the balance.

But of course you do
It was probably one of those 50/50 calls with Curry's versatility getting him the nod?

Think that’s probably right. As lots of us have said, he’s either a starter or nothing in this squad

[Slick]

My only real complaint would be Price, seems a very odd and unfair decision with him being our best back on Saturday. At least he will get on.

I also think Sutherland is a silly decision although Mako was good when he came on. There is no way that Bok scrum is going to be as bad this weekend.

Mish I haven't got too many complaints about, although I still think he deserves to start instead of Curry, but a bit of a waste on the bench - with a nod to JMK's point about the balance.

But of course you do
It was probably one of those 50/50 calls with Curry's versatility getting him the nod?

Without May he needs a new hobby horse!

Eh? I don’t think I’ve ever said anything bad about Curry, just think Watson deserves a start.

[Yr Alban]

I know everyone has said the same already, but Murray over Price makes absolutely feck all sense after last week. Price was excellent - probably our third best player after Itoje and Lawes - and the Scottish player I thought least likely to be dropped. Even if it’s tactical it’s a bloody strange decision. If Murray had started last week, I’d have said it was the wrong decision, but I could understand it. Starting Price and then dropping him after that performance is unfathomable.

Other changes fine. Daly had to go, surprised he still benches. Harris deserves a shot. Mish probably ruined his own chances of starting with the tip tackle, even if he escaped a card. Vunipola did well after coming on, so any combo of the LHPs fine by me.

[notfatcat]

I wouldn't be surprised if Curry plays the full 80, but if he goes down Gatland's going full on Jack Rowell with Faletau.

I always worry when Mako starts, he always seems to be better coming off the bench.

I'm expecting an improved performance from Curry. It's in his nature to make rapid improvements when he's chucked into higher level scenarios. He'll probably be wearing underpants over his shorts by the third test and will be a contender for man of the series.

[Jock42]

But of course you do
It was probably one of those 50/50 calls with Curry's versatility getting him the nod?

Without May he needs a new hobby horse!

Eh? I don’t think I’ve ever said anything bad about Curry, just think Watson deserves a start.

Ah mate, people need to turn into some nationalistic thing.

[SaintK]

Without May he needs a new hobby horse!

Eh? I don’t think I’ve ever said anything bad about Curry, just think Watson deserves a start.

Ah mate, people need to turn into some nationalistic thing.

of course

[Line6 HXFX]

The Sky Sports Lions are not just a little bit corporate, they are all corporate.

You are supporting a brand.
Colgate toothpaste.

Just another perspective into why no one should really give a shit about who works for them, during a day shift..unless you own or have shares in the company...but even then you would just care about the bottom line.

I know you could say that about any rugby team...but I would argue not to the extent of the Sky Sports Lions.

We don't live in a world where if you are a customer or a serious fanatic of a brand, you are not manipulated, exploited, and where they are not just held in contempt and trolled to keep you interested.

Pick your brands wisely gentlemen.

[Big D]

I think someone is trying to manipulate us into buying Colgate.

[Gumboot]

The Sky Sports Lions are not just a little bit corporate, they are all corporate.

You are supporting a brand.
Colgate toothpaste.

Just another perspective into why no one should really give a shit about who works for them, during a day shift..unless you own or have shares in the company...but even then you would just care about the bottom line.

I know you could say that about any rugby team...but I would argue not to the extent of the Sky Sports Lions.

We don't live in a world where if you are a customer or a serious fanatic of a brand, you are not manipulated, exploited, and where they are not just held in contempt and trolled to keep you interested.

Pick your brands wisely gentlemen.

Will do.

[notfatcat]

I think someone is trying to manipulate us into buying Colgate.

Refry is a corporate shill for Colgate-Palmolive. It's Sensodyne for me from now on.

[Kawazaki]

I think I liked Refry better when we thought he just had mental health problems.

[Margin__Walker]

Rassie's latest if anyone fancies sitting through an hour long ref whinge. Getting a bit embarrassing now.

[Raggs]

Rassie's latest if anyone fancies sitting through an hour long ref whinge. Getting a bit embarrassing now.

It's gone beyond the amusing now... just a bit sad.

EDIT - Jesus, just skipped to the end and he's moaning about not straight lineouts.

[tc27]

Rassie is unfortunately damaging his reputation but probably successfully put the pressure on the refs ahead of a very big game this weekend (and no-one really talking about the world champs loosing their first competitive home game).


Anyway regarding the Curry/Watson discussion - both excellent players but after watching Squidge's video on the first test it was interesting to note that Curry was being used frequently as the primary chaser on kicks - might be why he's still preferred. Also the penalty he conceded for the late tackle on Faf was almost certainly a consequence something he was told to do so probaly did not count against him.

[Torquemada 1420]

Murray for Price is a sure sign we ran too much ball...

Mad call, probably going to be based on something weird like Murray defending Faf better or some shit. Mako starting could go badly wrong. Harris has earned it. Watson dropping out is a curious one, especially given Faletau's done the sum total of fuck all to deserve a squad place and Conan did fine in the first Test. Who the fuck plays 7 if Curry goes down?

That call alone has caused me to pick the Boks to win on Saturday.

As you say, bringing in Faletau just because Watson had one brainfart tackle moment is a bit odd.

[Biffer]

Rassie’s hour long ref criticism is sure proof that Gatland has won the off field battle. Surely even his own players must be looking at that and thinking what the fuck.

[Biffer]

Rassie's latest if anyone fancies sitting through an hour long ref whinge. Getting a bit embarrassing now.

It's gone beyond the amusing now... just a bit sad.

EDIT - Jesus, just skipped to the end and he's moaning about not straight lineouts.

I haven’t watched because, well, why the fuck would you. But apparently around 45 minutes he actually says “we don’t want to nitpick every decision”.

[Big D]

Rassie is unfortunately damaging his reputation but probably successfully put the pressure on the refs ahead of a very big game this weekend (and no-one really talking about the world champs loosing their first competitive home game).

What he has done probably will hurt he Boks more than help to be honest. If the refs get really strict it will hurt them too. The scrum where they claim the prop got hurt it could easily have been a penalty to the Lions.

I assume he hasn't went over the numerous times the Boks were in front of the kicker (just the Lions obv.), a couple of scrum offences etc.

[dkm57]

Or the numerous times the Bok fatties were blatantly loitering on the wrong side of the breakdown obstructingt the 9 from passing to the backs.

[Kawazaki]

Rassie's latest if anyone fancies sitting through an hour long ref whinge. Getting a bit embarrassing now.

Just watched about 20mins of that towards the end. It's embarrassing. Looks like he's been drinking as well.

He should really be charged with bringing the game into disrepute.

[sorCrer]

Rassie's latest if anyone fancies sitting through an hour long ref whinge. Getting a bit embarrassing now.

Just watched about 20mins of that towards the end. It's embarrassing. Looks like he's been drinking as well.

He should really be charged with bringing the game into disrepute.

Possibly what he wants.

"If you guys [World Rugby] request that I’m not involved further with this Test match, no problem. If you request that I’m not a water carrier, no problem. If you think this was going over the top and this shouldn’t go out to the media, then I did this in my personal capacity, not as part of the Springboks and I will withdraw myself as part of the Springbok management team," Erasmus said

[Kawazaki]

Suicide by cop.


It's extremely unprofessional. He's likely screwed any chance he had of coaching any other test side after he's finished with South Africa.

[sorCrer]

Suicide by cop.


It's extremely unprofessional. He's likely screwed any chance he had of coaching any other test side after he's finished with South Africa.

I don't think he wants to. As I said earlier, I suspect he didn't even want the Bok job anymore and someone has convinced him to stay on as 'director of rugby'.

This is what he said in 2019 before the final: "It is probably my last Test -- it is my last test match that I will be the head coach".

[Uncle fester]

World rugby are going to have to do something because if this is let go, others will take note and do their own "mind games".

Would get out of control very quickly.

[notfatcat]

It's all a cunning plan.

[Biffer]

Russell in next week. Get him going Full Finn.

[Big D]

Some god awful performances today.

Murray, Biggar, VdM, Watson and Hogg in thr backs should all be under pressure for their places. Watson probably keeping his spot.

AWJ, Conan, Curry at least from the forwards should be looked at being replaced.

Said on the match thread that we should stick Smith and/or Finn in. No point dying by a thousand papaercuts.

[Hal Jordan]

Put Lawes in the engine room where he should play alongside Itoje.

Curry was anonymous.

8 is a real problem. Conan does nothing for me and Faletau is a shadow of himself at the moment.

[Yr Alban]

Some god awful performances today.

Murray, Biggar, VdM, Watson and Hogg in thr backs should all be under pressure for their places. Watson probably keeping his spot.

AWJ, Conan, Curry at least from the forwards should be looked at being replaced.

Said on the match thread that we should stick Smith and/or Finn in. No point dying by a thousand papaercuts.

None of the Scots lads had a good game today, though to be fair I’m struggling to think of a Lion who did.

I still don’t understand why on Earth Gatland has picked VdM, when the game plan doesn’t play to his strengths at all.

I expect Williams will get his shot in place of Hogg next week, unless it’s in place of one of the wingers. No arguments with that - Hogg didn’t have a great game - but by the same token, Curry was completely anonymous today and I’d expect Watson to get a shot from the start.

TBH it was a bad day at the office for the whole squad.

[dpedin]

Some god awful performances today.

Murray, Biggar, VdM, Watson and Hogg in thr backs should all be under pressure for their places. Watson probably keeping his spot.

AWJ, Conan, Curry at least from the forwards should be looked at being replaced.

Said on the match thread that we should stick Smith and/or Finn in. No point dying by a thousand papaercuts.

None of the Scots lads had a good game today, though to be fair I’m struggling to think of a Lion who did.

I still don’t understand why on Earth Gatland has picked VdM, when the game plan doesn’t play to his strengths at all.

I expect Williams will get his shot in place of Hogg next week, unless it’s in place of one of the wingers. No arguments with that - Hogg didn’t have a great game - but by the same token, Curry was completely anonymous today and I’d expect Watson to get a shot from the start.

TBH it was a bad day at the office for the whole squad.

That was one of the most boring games of rugby I have watched for years ... and I survived watching Edinburgh during the Solomon years!

Furlong and Henshaw are the only ones safe. VdM is a ball in hand player, he makes yards, beats defenders and scores tries for fun - so why play a gameplan where he never gets the ball? The SAs will have been delighted to see how the Lions played and that VdM wasn't give the ball in space. I have no idea how the Lions thought they were going to score tries? Actually Gatland is probably not interested in tries, he was going to win the game by winning the territory game and kicking penalties.

I had to laugh at the desperate attempts of the Sky commentators to try and make the game seem interesting, they failed!

[JM2K6]

Congrats to the Lions for the 112 metres they ran with ball in hand.

[Sards]

Very strange gameplan from the BILs second half. Kicking wasn't working.....why stick with it. Like they were determined to win one cleanly at any cost

[Tichtheid]

Some god awful performances today.

Murray, Biggar, VdM, Watson and Hogg in thr backs should all be under pressure for their places. Watson probably keeping his spot.

AWJ, Conan, Curry at least from the forwards should be looked at being replaced.

Said on the match thread that we should stick Smith and/or Finn in. No point dying by a thousand papaercuts.

None of the Scots lads had a good game today, though to be fair I’m struggling to think of a Lion who did.

I still don’t understand why on Earth Gatland has picked VdM, when the game plan doesn’t play to his strengths at all.

I expect Williams will get his shot in place of Hogg next week, unless it’s in place of one of the wingers. No arguments with that - Hogg didn’t have a great game - but by the same token, Curry was completely anonymous today and I’d expect Watson to get a shot from the start.

TBH it was a bad day at the office for the whole squad.

That was one of the most boring games of rugby I have watched for years ... and I survived watching Edinburgh during the Solomon years!

Furlong and Henshaw are the only ones safe. VdM is a ball in hand player, he makes yards, beats defenders and scores tries for fun - so why play a gameplan where he never gets the ball? The SAs will have been delighted to see how the Lions played and that VdM wasn't give the ball in space. I have no idea how the Lions thought they were going to score tries? Actually Gatland is probably not interested in tries, he was going to win the game by winning the territory game and kicking penalties.

I had to laugh at the desperate attempts of the Sky commentators to try and make the game seem interesting, they failed!

I thought Harris was decent for an hour or so, probably the best Lions back

[dpedin]

None of the Scots lads had a good game today, though to be fair I’m struggling to think of a Lion who did.

I still don’t understand why on Earth Gatland has picked VdM, when the game plan doesn’t play to his strengths at all.

I expect Williams will get his shot in place of Hogg next week, unless it’s in place of one of the wingers. No arguments with that - Hogg didn’t have a great game - but by the same token, Curry was completely anonymous today and I’d expect Watson to get a shot from the start.

TBH it was a bad day at the office for the whole squad.

That was one of the most boring games of rugby I have watched for years ... and I survived watching Edinburgh during the Solomon years!

Furlong and Henshaw are the only ones safe. VdM is a ball in hand player, he makes yards, beats defenders and scores tries for fun - so why play a gameplan where he never gets the ball? The SAs will have been delighted to see how the Lions played and that VdM wasn't give the ball in space. I have no idea how the Lions thought they were going to score tries? Actually Gatland is probably not interested in tries, he was going to win the game by winning the territory game and kicking penalties.

I had to laugh at the desperate attempts of the Sky commentators to try and make the game seem interesting, they failed!

I thought Harris was decent for an hour or so, probably the best Lions back

Yeh your right, solid in defence and didnt miss a tackle, pity he and Henshaw didnt have any ball to attack with. Must be a strange game for these guys just watching the ball ping over their head all game and trying to pick up scraps from dropped catches.

[C T]

Some god awful performances today.

Murray, Biggar, VdM, Watson and Hogg in thr backs should all be under pressure for their places. Watson probably keeping his spot.

AWJ, Conan, Curry at least from the forwards should be looked at being replaced.

Said on the match thread that we should stick Smith and/or Finn in. No point dying by a thousand papaercuts.

Got to admit that I think Watson was the worst of the back three. I wasn't counting but I think the high balls taken/not taken must have looked a bit like this:

Hogg - 5/3
Watson 0 or 1?/3
IrnDu 0 or 1?/2

Hogg of course missed the tackle for the Boks try, but Watson missed a tackle in exactly the same move, 1 tackle before Hogg missed his. You then of course have Watson's rotten potato of a pass which Hogg was getting crucified for earlier on tour.

All of the back 3 were mince to be fair, but Hogg wasn't clearly the worst. I'd make a case for him being the best of a bad bunch. Wouldn't mind at all seeing Williams in, probably for Watson, or IrnDu if the game plan is the same.

Funny how quickly the back three have gone from being such an area of strength to a big concern. Game plan doesn't exactly help them showcase their strengths.

[Yr Alban]

None of the Scots lads had a good game today, though to be fair I’m struggling to think of a Lion who did.

I still don’t understand why on Earth Gatland has picked VdM, when the game plan doesn’t play to his strengths at all.

I expect Williams will get his shot in place of Hogg next week, unless it’s in place of one of the wingers. No arguments with that - Hogg didn’t have a great game - but by the same token, Curry was completely anonymous today and I’d expect Watson to get a shot from the start.

TBH it was a bad day at the office for the whole squad.

That was one of the most boring games of rugby I have watched for years ... and I survived watching Edinburgh during the Solomon years!

Furlong and Henshaw are the only ones safe. VdM is a ball in hand player, he makes yards, beats defenders and scores tries for fun - so why play a gameplan where he never gets the ball? The SAs will have been delighted to see how the Lions played and that VdM wasn't give the ball in space. I have no idea how the Lions thought they were going to score tries? Actually Gatland is probably not interested in tries, he was going to win the game by winning the territory game and kicking penalties.

I had to laugh at the desperate attempts of the Sky commentators to try and make the game seem interesting, they failed!

I thought Harris was decent for an hour or so, probably the best Lions back

In that game, that’s like the nicest Nazi

[JM2K6]

Some god awful performances today.

Murray, Biggar, VdM, Watson and Hogg in thr backs should all be under pressure for their places. Watson probably keeping his spot.

AWJ, Conan, Curry at least from the forwards should be looked at being replaced.

Said on the match thread that we should stick Smith and/or Finn in. No point dying by a thousand papaercuts.

Got to admit that I think Watson was the worst of the back three. I wasn't counting but I think the high balls taken/not taken must have looked a bit like this:

Hogg - 5/3
Watson 0 or 1?/3
IrnDu 0 or 1?/2

Hogg of course missed the tackle for the Boks try, but Watson missed a tackle in exactly the same move, 1 tackle before Hogg missed his. You then of course have Watson's rotten potato of a pass which Hogg was getting crucified for earlier on tour.

All of the back 3 were mince to be fair, but Hogg wasn't clearly the worst. I'd make a case for him being the best of a bad bunch. Wouldn't mind at all seeing Williams in, probably for Watson, or IrnDu if the game plan is the same.

Funny how quickly the back three have gone from being such an area of strength to a big concern. Game plan doesn't exactly help them showcase their strengths.

Hogg spent about a hour missing or knocking on practically every ball that came near him, plus failed to make any impact when he did run it, getting pinged or turned over. He improved a bit into the second half but the only way he wasn't the worst of the back three is if you consider VDM's shocking discipline to be more of a problem. Agree no one was good but sadly Hogg's personal nightmare set the tone and went a long way towards the Lions losing the kicking game so badly.