President Biden and US politics catchall

[Uncle fester]

What's your take on Assange?

Textbook useful idiot.

Please elaborate.

According to the WikiLeaks website, its goal is "to bring important news and information to the public ... One of our most important activities is to publish original source material alongside our news stories so readers and historians alike can see evidence of the truth."

It doesn't list "furthering the ambitions of tinpot dictators by selectively leaking info designed to damage democratic institutions in opposing nations" but that appears to be their main achievement of late.

[Carter's Choice]

The 'early voter' lines in some American states are surreal. How could a country purporting to be the standard bearer for democracy allow its mechanisms of democracy decline to such a pathetic state. People reporting 10-12 hour waiting times just to vote.

Almost every state is reporting increased early voting; whether that benefits the Dems or the GOP remains to be seen.

[Un Pilier]

The 'early voter' lines in some American states are surreal. How could a country purporting to be the standard bearer for democracy allow its mechanisms of democracy decline to such a pathetic state. People reporting 10-12 hour waiting times just to vote.

Almost every state is reporting increased early voting; whether that benefits the Dems or the GOP remains to be seen.

I think the whole thing, including postal voting etc. is going to lead to a prolonged shitstorm. Trump has pretty much telegraphed he will dispute the postal vote outcome (unless he wins it, I guess.)

It’s all a bit of a farce, as you suggest. I was in the states during the Bush “hanging chad” debacle. It was bizarre.

[Fangle]

We have thirty three polling stations in our county which has a total population of about one million, not all which will be of voting age. I would suggest that is plenty. But because of Covid the voting process is slow. There are three weeks of early voting but people seem awfully keen to vote in the first couple of days. I reckon that next week and the week after the lines will be much shorter, which is when I’ll vote.

[Calculon]

Americans are either incapable, or unwilling to learn how to not to fuck up voting. Every four years it is the same story

[Ted.]

We have thirty three polling stations in our county which has a total population of about one million, not all which will be of voting age. I would suggest that is plenty. But because of Covid the voting process is slow. There are three weeks of early voting but people seem awfully keen to vote in the first couple of days. I reckon that next week and the week after the lines will be much shorter, which is when I’ll vote.

With a total population of ~103,700, we have 43 polling stations in Lower Hutt. Howe many individual polling booths that amounts to, I have no idea, but the lines I have seen in the states would not be tolerated here.

Mind you, politicians have no say at all as to how many voting stations there are, overall or in any particular electorate, where they are located or what the electorate the boundaries are.

[Bokkom]

Textbook useful idiot.

Please elaborate.

According to the WikiLeaks website, its goal is "to bring important news and information to the public ... One of our most important activities is to publish original source material alongside our news stories so readers and historians alike can see evidence of the truth."

It doesn't list "furthering the ambitions of tinpot dictators by selectively leaking info designed to damage democratic institutions in opposing nations" but that appears to be their main achievement of late.

We appreciate your opinion. Especially the part about "damage to democratic institutions". In my opinion, those institutions are corrupt from top to bottom and needs to be exposed.
Next question: What's your take on Assange's current trial? Both procedure and substance.

[Ted.]

Please elaborate.

According to the WikiLeaks website, its goal is "to bring important news and information to the public ... One of our most important activities is to publish original source material alongside our news stories so readers and historians alike can see evidence of the truth."

It doesn't list "furthering the ambitions of tinpot dictators by selectively leaking info designed to damage democratic institutions in opposing nations" but that appears to be their main achievement of late.

We appreciate your opinion. Especially the part about "damage to democratic institutions". In my opinion, those institutions are corrupt from top to bottom and needs to be exposed.
Next question: What's your take on Assange's current trial? Both procedure and substance.

Which particular democratic institutions are corrupt from top to bottom, therefore needing exposure by Assange?

[Hugo]

The US is flattered by the term democracy.

a) Voter suppression has been a key element of both parties election strategy since the end of the Civil war and the passage of the 15th amendment. The southern democrats employed black codes, literacy tests and grandfather clauses to deprive blacks of their constitutionally guaranteed right to vote. When they changed tack in the 1960s the GOP just filled the void and took over where they left off.

b) Big business has unfettered access to power via the lobbying industry and policy is a reflection of the wants of big business and capital rather than voters, consumers, labour etc. Corporations are able to massively outspend other organisations such as labour unions to promote their agendas and get the votes they need to pass legislation that favours them. As an example California currently has a proposition that is being voted on to make Uber, Lyft et al treat their contractors as employees and give them all the benefits and compensation that would entail. Naturally Uber oppose this and they have outspent their opponents something like 9:1 in terms of advertising.

c) as per b, policy very infrequently aligns with what average Americans who have been polled want. There is an identifiable disconnect between the will of the people and the actions of their elected representatives.

d) Extreme polarisation undermines democracy. True democracy is about collaboration and compromise, respectful dialogue, finding the middle ground etc. The growth of zero sum, winner take all mindsets prevents the development of situations which can be win-win for both sides. Instead what you have is you win, I lose where neither side wants to give an inch. Over time this completely destroys the fabric of society, civility etc.

e) No real choice. Your options are one of two mediocre parties who have a complete stranglehold on power or an irrelevant third party. If you vote for a third party in good conscience because you like their policies or you find the major two repellent you will likely be labelled as having "wasted your vote" which really epitomizes the lack of choice. You have no real agency as a voter when all the power is tied up in two parties whose views on a number of key issues such as abortion, gun rights, climate change, healthcare are diametrically opposed. The phenomenon of voting for "the lesser of two evils" is a further indication of just how sparse your options are, essentially voters have to figure out which of the two parties is the less shit or which will be the least damaging and then vote accordingly.

[Kiwias]

We have thirty three polling stations in our county which has a total population of about one million, not all which will be of voting age. I would suggest that is plenty. But because of Covid the voting process is slow. There are three weeks of early voting but people seem awfully keen to vote in the first couple of days. I reckon that next week and the week after the lines will be much shorter, which is when I’ll vote.

With a total population of ~103,700, we have 43 polling stations in Lower Hutt. Howe many individual polling booths that amounts to, I have no idea, but the lines I have seen in the states would not be tolerated here.

Mind you, politicians have no say at all as to how many voting stations there are, overall or in any particular electorate, where they are located or what the electorate the boundaries are.

I noticed something in the news recently that a county in Texas with population of 4m (the county alone) has one polling station. ONE.

[yermum]

e) No real choice. Your options are one of two mediocre parties who have a complete stranglehold on power or an irrelevant third party. If you vote for a third party in good conscience because you like their policies or you find the major two repellent you will likely be labelled as having "wasted your vote" which really epitomizes the lack of choice. You have no real agency as a voter when all the power is tied up in two parties whose views on a number of key issues such as abortion, gun rights, climate change, healthcare are diametrically opposed. The phenomenon of voting for "the lesser of two evils" is a further indication of just how sparse your options are, essentially voters have to figure out which of the two parties is the less shit or which will be the least damaging and then vote accordingly.

[Uncle fester]

Please elaborate.

According to the WikiLeaks website, its goal is "to bring important news and information to the public ... One of our most important activities is to publish original source material alongside our news stories so readers and historians alike can see evidence of the truth."

It doesn't list "furthering the ambitions of tinpot dictators by selectively leaking info designed to damage democratic institutions in opposing nations" but that appears to be their main achievement of late.

We appreciate your opinion. Especially the part about "damage to democratic institutions". In my opinion, those institutions are corrupt from top to bottom and needs to be exposed.
Next question: What's your take on Assange's current trial? Both procedure and substance.

There's a world of difference between exposing bad practice by the state with the ultimate intent of amending that bad practice and being a conduit for a hostile third party to selectively leak info that subverts events to the benefit of that third party.

If you can't see that difference, we're done here.

[JM2K6]

We have thirty three polling stations in our county which has a total population of about one million, not all which will be of voting age. I would suggest that is plenty.

lol

30,000 people per polling station? That's mad.

In the UK we had ~50,000 polling stations last time out. One for every 1,300 people, roughly. If you live in a city it's likely your polling station options are all within sane walking distance and there's rarely a queue.

[Kiwias]

We have thirty three polling stations in our county which has a total population of about one million, not all which will be of voting age. I would suggest that is plenty.

lol

30,000 people per polling station? That's mad.

In the UK we had ~50,000 polling stations last time out. One for every 1,300 people, roughly. If you live in a city it's likely your polling station options are all within sane walking distance and there's rarely a queue.

Japan had 47,000 polling stations, one for every 2,680, and I’ve never heard of long queues

[Thor Sedan]

So these emails about Hunter Biden that the GOP are touting as the end of Sleepy Joe.

What's the story? Seems like there is fraud accusations, dodgy circumstances and a trump supporter loving the attention.

[Un Pilier]

We have thirty three polling stations in our county which has a total population of about one million, not all which will be of voting age. I would suggest that is plenty.

lol

30,000 people per polling station? That's mad.

In the UK we had ~50,000 polling stations last time out. One for every 1,300 people, roughly. If you live in a city it's likely your polling station options are all within sane walking distance and there's rarely a queue.

Japan had 47,000 polling stations, one for every 2,680, and I’ve never heard of long queues

The ratios are starkly different to Fangle’s - however, his examples are open for three weeks for early voting? Are there more on Election Day I wonder?

[fishfoodie]

So these emails about Hunter Biden that the GOP are touting as the end of Sleepy Joe.

What's the story? Seems like there is fraud accusations, dodgy circumstances and a trump supporter loving the attention.

Did Hunter recently plead the fifth when interviewed by the Feds ?

How many criminal investigations are there ongoing against him ?

Was he forced to fold up his , "Charity", after an investigation that revealed massive fraud & abuse ?

Did he get patent protection in China in record time, when his father was threatening a trade war with them ?

..
..

Weaponizing Hunter is the latest in a succession of incredibly cretinous moves by the shitgibbon.

[RodneyRegis]

So these emails about Hunter Biden that the GOP are touting as the end of Sleepy Joe.

What's the story? Seems like there is fraud accusations, dodgy circumstances and a trump supporter loving the attention.

It's likely all bollocks, but the fact that Twitter and Facebook are throttling shares will cause a bit ogf a hoo-haa.

This is fun too.

[Thor Sedan]

So these emails about Hunter Biden that the GOP are touting as the end of Sleepy Joe.

What's the story? Seems like there is fraud accusations, dodgy circumstances and a trump supporter loving the attention.

Did Hunter recently plead the fifth when interviewed by the Feds ?

How many criminal investigations are there ongoing against him ?

Was he forced to fold up his , "Charity", after an investigation that revealed massive fraud & abuse ?

Did he get patent protection in China in record time, when his father was threatening a trade war with them ?

..
..

Weaponizing Hunter is the latest in a succession of incredibly cretinous moves by the shitgibbon.

I was just wondering if the collective circle jerk of the usual trump suspects were going to end up with....um.....egg on their faces.

I still think trump is going to win the election - America really is a sh*thole country when it comes down to it. And a small part of me will be following the news reports on the civil war with the same awe I followed the night vision images of the Gulf war in the 90's.

[Ted.]

lol

30,000 people per polling station? That's mad.

In the UK we had ~50,000 polling stations last time out. One for every 1,300 people, roughly. If you live in a city it's likely your polling station options are all within sane walking distance and there's rarely a queue.

Japan had 47,000 polling stations, one for every 2,680, and I’ve never heard of long queues

The ratios are starkly different to Fangle’s - however, his examples are open for three weeks for early voting? Are there more on Election Day I wonder?

We're voting this Saturday, in NZ, yet postal voting has been open since September the 30th, while the local polling stations have been open since 3 October. So no, the US is not anything special in that regard. Yet where I am, we have a polling station for every ~2,500 people. How many booths that translates to, I don't know.

[Ted.]

So these emails about Hunter Biden that the GOP are touting as the end of Sleepy Joe.

What's the story? Seems like there is fraud accusations, dodgy circumstances and a trump supporter loving the attention.

Did Hunter recently plead the fifth when interviewed by the Feds ?

How many criminal investigations are there ongoing against him ?

Was he forced to fold up his , "Charity", after an investigation that revealed massive fraud & abuse ?

Did he get patent protection in China in record time, when his father was threatening a trade war with them ?

..
..

Weaponizing Hunter is the latest in a succession of incredibly cretinous moves by the shitgibbon.

The reports from the various US intelligence agencies do not support the GOP smear campaign.

[Rinkals]

According to the WikiLeaks website, its goal is "to bring important news and information to the public ... One of our most important activities is to publish original source material alongside our news stories so readers and historians alike can see evidence of the truth."

It doesn't list "furthering the ambitions of tinpot dictators by selectively leaking info designed to damage democratic institutions in opposing nations" but that appears to be their main achievement of late.

We appreciate your opinion. Especially the part about "damage to democratic institutions". In my opinion, those institutions are corrupt from top to bottom and needs to be exposed.
Next question: What's your take on Assange's current trial? Both procedure and substance.

There's a world of difference between exposing bad practice by the state with the ultimate intent of amending that bad practice and being a conduit for a hostile third party to selectively leak info that subverts events to the benefit of that third party.

If you can't see that difference, we're done here.

I suspect the question wasn't asked in order to get opinions on Assange but rather to expose what Bokkom views as hypocrisy in those who do not support Trump.

[Fangle]

We have thirty three polling stations in our county which has a total population of about one million, not all which will be of voting age. I would suggest that is plenty.

lol

30,000 people per polling station? That's mad.

In the UK we had ~50,000 polling stations last time out. One for every 1,300 people, roughly. If you live in a city it's likely your polling station options are all within sane walking distance and there's rarely a queue.

Early voting is spread over 18 days. And my guess is that of the 1 million only about 60-70% would be of voting age. So your calculations are way off. But you like to be disparaging and aggressive about Americans. I’ll bet that when I go in my wait will be under 15 minutes.

[Woddy]

Americans are either incapable, or unwilling to learn how to not to fuck up voting. Every four years it is the same story

I haven't watched the video, but from the still at the start with the expected timings for each voter, they appear to be voting backwards. If they turned around and walked forwards, it might speed things up a little.

[average joe]

Obviously the guys at the front of the line would have been there longer than the ones at the rear.

[Woddy]

fair enough. I took them as waiting times to reach the front of the queue.

[Hal Jordan]

So these emails about Hunter Biden that the GOP are touting as the end of Sleepy Joe.

What's the story? Seems like there is fraud accusations, dodgy circumstances and a trump supporter loving the attention.

Did Hunter recently plead the fifth when interviewed by the Feds ?

How many criminal investigations are there ongoing against him ?

Was he forced to fold up his , "Charity", after an investigation that revealed massive fraud & abuse ?

Did he get patent protection in China in record time, when his father was threatening a trade war with them ?

..
..

Weaponizing Hunter is the latest in a succession of incredibly cretinous moves by the shitgibbon.

I was just wondering if the collective circle jerk of the usual trump suspects were going to end up with....um.....egg on their faces.

I still think trump is going to win the election - America really is a sh*thole country when it comes down to it. And a small part of me will be following the news reports on the civil war with the same awe I followed the night vision images of the Gulf war in the 90's.

I don't think he's going to win it, but I strongly believe that he is going to steal it by any means necessary.

[Bokkom]

The US is flattered by the term democracy.

a) Voter suppression has been a key element of both parties election strategy since the end of the Civil war and the passage of the 15th amendment. The southern democrats employed black codes, literacy tests and grandfather clauses to deprive blacks of their constitutionally guaranteed right to vote. When they changed tack in the 1960s the GOP just filled the void and took over where they left off.

b) Big business has unfettered access to power via the lobbying industry and policy is a reflection of the wants of big business and capital rather than voters, consumers, labour etc. Corporations are able to massively outspend other organisations such as labour unions to promote their agendas and get the votes they need to pass legislation that favours them. As an example California currently has a proposition that is being voted on to make Uber, Lyft et al treat their contractors as employees and give them all the benefits and compensation that would entail. Naturally Uber oppose this and they have outspent their opponents something like 9:1 in terms of advertising.

c) as per b, policy very infrequently aligns with what average Americans who have been polled want. There is an identifiable disconnect between the will of the people and the actions of their elected representatives.

d) Extreme polarisation undermines democracy. True democracy is about collaboration and compromise, respectful dialogue, finding the middle ground etc. The growth of zero sum, winner take all mindsets prevents the development of situations which can be win-win for both sides. Instead what you have is you win, I lose where neither side wants to give an inch. Over time this completely destroys the fabric of society, civility etc.

e) No real choice. Your options are one of two mediocre parties who have a complete stranglehold on power or an irrelevant third party. If you vote for a third party in good conscience because you like their policies or you find the major two repellent you will likely be labelled as having "wasted your vote" which really epitomizes the lack of choice. You have no real agency as a voter when all the power is tied up in two parties whose views on a number of key issues such as abortion, gun rights, climate change, healthcare are diametrically opposed. The phenomenon of voting for "the lesser of two evils" is a further indication of just how sparse your options are, essentially voters have to figure out which of the two parties is the less shit or which will be the least damaging and then vote accordingly.

Utterly, utterly corrupt dumpster fire of a sham democracy.

[JM2K6]

We have thirty three polling stations in our county which has a total population of about one million, not all which will be of voting age. I would suggest that is plenty.

lol

30,000 people per polling station? That's mad.

In the UK we had ~50,000 polling stations last time out. One for every 1,300 people, roughly. If you live in a city it's likely your polling station options are all within sane walking distance and there's rarely a queue.

Early voting is spread over 18 days. And my guess is that of the 1 million only about 60-70% would be of voting age. So your calculations are way off. But you like to be disparaging and aggressive about Americans. I’ll bet that when I go in my wait will be under 15 minutes.

I didn't choose "voting age" for the UK numbers either. So it's a fair comparison. I'm not disparaging and aggressive about Americans. I think hardcore Trump supporters are fucking vile, sure, but it's America the country and the current shitshow that is the GOP that gets my ire.

If it's less than 15 minutes, that's brilliant! But you'd never see hours-long queues in the UK like America is suffering with at the moment. What America does is not normal in a modern democracy.

[sturginho]

I seem to remember there being some high profile shenanigans in 2010 (or 2015 possibly) in a london constituency where there were long queues and some people didnt manage to vote before the station closed at 10pm. But that's an isolated incident compared to what seems to be normal behaviour in the US?

[Saint]

I seem to remember there being some high profile shenanigans in 2010 (or 2015 possibly) in a london constituency where there were long queues and some people didnt manage to vote before the station closed at 10pm. But that's an isolated incident compared to what seems to be normal behaviour in the US?

I;m not sure if it was the case then, but now the rule is that you have to join the queue (if there is one) by 10pm. As long as you do that they will hold the station open till you've voted.

The reality though is that I've never seen a polling day queue at all in person in the UK in 24 years of voting - and it;s a national headline if there is a queue that takes 30 minutes


However in the US this seems to happen every time out. So there's a lesson to be learnt from that - until you realise that the whole setup is a partisan affair rather than being run by an impartial independent organisation

[Fangle]

I can only talk about my county in Georgia where the organizing is done by county officials not politicians.

Now our voting process my be slower than elsewhere.


You fill in a short form - name, address and signature.
An official checks that against your driver’s license and checks on the computer if you are there
A magnetic card is issued.
You go to your booth and make your selections - in this case eighteen of them - for President, Senators, congressman, and for many state positions, and three referendums on state constitution amendments.

You then review your votes, and press the Vote key.
A hard copy is printed out to check that the computer wasn’t hacked to change your vote.
You return your magnetic card
The voting terminal gets wiped down to disinfect it for the next voter.

[fishfoodie]

I can only talk about my county in Georgia where the organizing is done by county officials not politicians.

Now our voting process my be slower than elsewhere.


You fill in a short form - name, address and signature.
An official checks that against your driver’s license and checks on the computer if you are there
A magnetic card is issued.
You go to your booth and make your selections - in this case eighteen of them - for President, Senators, congressman, and for many state positions, and three referendums on state constitution amendments.

You then review your votes, and press the Vote key.
A hard copy is printed out to check that the computer wasn’t hacked to change your vote.
You return your magnetic card
The voting terminal gets wiped down to disinfect it for the next voter.

Did submitting your taxes take as long ?

That's the real comparison.

The same group of people who qualify to vote every few years; have to submit their tax forms every year; & in that case, the Government has no problem providing a single online option, to make sure everyone, in every state, can submit their taxes by tax day.

Now why is it that in a Federal Election, it's so hard for them to do the same thing online ?

[Saint]

I can only talk about my county in Georgia where the organizing is done by county officials not politicians.

Now our voting process my be slower than elsewhere.


You fill in a short form - name, address and signature.
An official checks that against your driver’s license and checks on the computer if you are there
A magnetic card is issued.
You go to your booth and make your selections - in this case eighteen of them - for President, Senators, congressman, and for many state positions, and three referendums on state constitution amendments.

You then review your votes, and press the Vote key.
A hard copy is printed out to check that the computer wasn’t hacked to change your vote.
You return your magnetic card
The voting terminal gets wiped down to disinfect it for the next voter.

Under the direction of the secretary of state for Georgia. Currently a position held by Brad Raffensperger, a Republican elected to office in 2018. He is directly responsible for everything to do with how many polling locations there are, how they're staffed, where they are, etc. Every single official in the process us responsible and accountable to him directly. If he genuinely acts in good faith then it works, but it's ridiculously open to abuse, and it's pretty typical across the other states

[mat the expat]

The reality though is that I've never seen a polling day queue at all in person in the UK in 24 years of voting - and it;s a national headline if there is a queue that takes 30 minutes

I've worked several elections in Oz - because it's mandatory you often get queues.

It always moves fast though - typically every school and town hall/council chamber is a polling station.

I live in one of the main Restaurant strips and we get surges of people who realise they will get fined if they don't vote queuing before heading out for the night.

I've shut the door on a couple of people - but there was no queue, they were just too late

[Ali Cadoo]

Caught the last ten mins of Trump's town hall bidness... he wasn't the dribbling moron I was hoping to see. He made some good points, handled some interesting questions well, had some old dear tell him he had a handsome smile... I'm assuming the rest of the time he was awful, but he seemed pretty lucid and sharp for what I saw.

I'm actually a little annoyed. I await the scathing John Oliver review with baited breath.

[Kiwias]

Caught the last ten mins of Trump's town hall bidness... he wasn't the dribbling moron I was hoping to see. He made some good points, handled some interesting questions well, had some old dear tell him he had a handsome smile... I'm assuming the rest of the time he was awful, but he seemed pretty lucid and sharp for what I saw.

I'm actually a little annoyed. I await the scathing John Oliver review with baited breath.

I guess you missed his spectacular diatribe when asked about QAnon.

[Ali Cadoo]

Caught the last ten mins of Trump's town hall bidness... he wasn't the dribbling moron I was hoping to see. He made some good points, handled some interesting questions well, had some old dear tell him he had a handsome smile... I'm assuming the rest of the time he was awful, but he seemed pretty lucid and sharp for what I saw.

I'm actually a little annoyed. I await the scathing John Oliver review with baited breath.

I guess you missed his spectacular diatribe when asked about QAnon.

Yeah, I'd assumed that the rest of the time he was awful. I'm just reading up on all the eviscerations...

[Kiwias]

Caught the last ten mins of Trump's town hall bidness... he wasn't the dribbling moron I was hoping to see. He made some good points, handled some interesting questions well, had some old dear tell him he had a handsome smile... I'm assuming the rest of the time he was awful, but he seemed pretty lucid and sharp for what I saw.

I'm actually a little annoyed. I await the scathing John Oliver review with baited breath.

I guess you missed his spectacular diatribe when asked about QAnon.

Yeah, I'd assumed that the rest of the time he was awful. I'm just reading up on all the eviscerations...

I watched perhaps 10 mins, on and off. His defense of being $400m in debt personally guaranteed was pretty ugly.

[Niegs]

Biden was great. Not only answered questions clearly, offering some explanations why he wouldn't commit to some statements too.

I even felt like he's got a natural and likeable manner of speaking that isn't forced like some politicians.