Cricket: T20 World Cup

[Thor Sedan]

Congrats NZ, well deserved. Annoyed that we lost this at the start of our innings and the end of theirs, given who got injured, but this has been great stuff from Mitchell and co.

Now go and win the title!

I have to apologise for the doubt about losing Mills. This match was perfect for his death bowling. Jordan completely lost it in the 17th.

But I guess that is T20 cricket - NZ we're gooooone at 104 for 2....and then Neesham.

Didn't think we had the middle order to do that.

I didn't expect Jordan to be the problem, honestly. But England fucked around a lot with their winning method because of the injuries.

Instead of just getting Vince in to open, they moved Bairstow up - which he clearly wasn't comfortable with, and it meant he wasn't there for the middle overs. With Mills gone, Rashid and Woakes had to bowl in the final overs and they conceded 34 between them in 12 balls. Jordan's meltdown could have been ameliorated with Mills available. The "machine" was definitely messed up.

But then perhaps Roy gets out second ball and Mills gets hit easily like in an earlier match. C'est la vie.

I was going to ask you what you thought of Bairstow opening.

[Wyndham Upalot]

Bairstow and Malan worried me from the outset. Batters who appeared to be lacking confidence and form, unfortunately that came to pass.

[JM2K6]

Malan did fine. Outperformed most of his teammates.

I was going to ask you what you thought of Bairstow opening.

He's not been in great form this tournament, tbh. I personally dislike him too, so I rarely miss a chance to have a go at him!

[Insane_Homer]

Stunning from Neesham, NZ had a mountain to climb with 80 from 40.

[Gumboot]

... and now there's going to be the time clash with the Ireland game.

Huh?

[Thor Sedan]

Malan did fine. Outperformed most of his teammates.

I was going to ask you what you thought of Bairstow opening.

He's not been in great form this tournament, tbh. I personally dislike him too, so I rarely miss a chance to have a go at him!

Is there a story there?

[JM2K6]

Malan did fine. Outperformed most of his teammates.

I was going to ask you what you thought of Bairstow opening.

He's not been in great form this tournament, tbh. I personally dislike him too, so I rarely miss a chance to have a go at him!

Is there a story there?

Nah, I just think he's an angry thick twat who the media love because of his dad and being a Yorkshire player - he's given a huge amount of leeway

[Ymx]

... and now there's going to be the time clash with the Ireland game.

Huh?

Yeah, they are on different days.

Rugby Saturday
Cricket WC Final Sunday

[Ymx]

Catching up late on this thread, but it looked over for us most of our innings. Needing 12 runs p/o for pretty much the last 10 overs.

Only got some hope after that Jordan over. Even then it seemed slim.

I couldn’t believe it when Williamson went out to a shot like that. Thought the pressure of the moment was too much. But the rest of the team stood up.

[convoluted]

... and now there's going to be the time clash with the Ireland game.

Huh?

Yeah, they are on different days.

Rugby Saturday
Cricket WC Final Sunday

I heard the commentator say "the final in 3 days time", so have just checked now and fantastic because you are correct.
It will cut instead into the Wales-Fiji game which I'm looking forward to, but flicking between ABs and BCs would have totally wrecked each of those games.

[Calculon]

Goodbye Poms.

Thought ypou said we'd walk it?

You need more Saffers!

England choked.

We all support the Black Caps in the final.

Will be great if they beat the Aussies.

I'm hoping Pak make the final and go all the way, but if it's the black caps against Australia I'll obviously be cheering for the black caps

[Torquemada 1420]

And that's goodnight folks.

And so it was. [/mockers]

Wow, I recorded that and watched when I got up. Finger nails are gone, couch has holes in the back from the size 11s but we're there.

3 formats - 3 finals. Love being a Kiwi cricket fan now.

I only hope I can do as good a job against the Aussies.

[JM2K6]

Yeah, all the weird mockers gods stuff makes cricket threads so very tiresome these days. Just post what you think, guys! It really doesn't matter!

Great piece by Jarrod Kimber on this game: https://wickets.substack.com/p/new-zealand-find-a-way

[Torquemada 1420]

I didn't expect Jordan to be the problem, honestly. But England fucked around a lot with their winning method because of the injuries.

Instead of just getting Vince in to open, they moved Bairstow up - which he clearly wasn't comfortable with, and it meant he wasn't there for the middle overs. With Mills gone, Rashid and Woakes had to bowl in the final overs and they conceded 34 between them in 12 balls. Jordan's meltdown could have been ameliorated with Mills available. The "machine" was definitely messed up.

But then perhaps Roy gets out second ball and Mills gets hit easily like in an earlier match. C'est la vie.

Maybe the real mistake was Eng not doing what you suggested with Roy's injury i.e. augment the bowling. Torygraph pointed out that bowling Woakes at the death was questionable: he's bowled 3 death.... overs in the comp and they went for 57! Coincidentally what Eng's overs 17-19 went for (I think).

Personally, I wondered why Moeen saw no action. Especially at this ground with the slightly longer boundaries.

[Torquemada 1420]

Yeah, all the weird mockers gods stuff makes cricket threads so very tiresome these days. Just post what you think, guys! It really doesn't matter!

Great piece by Jarrod Kimber on this game: https://wickets.substack.com/p/new-zealand-find-a-way

And we only do it in the cricket. Why is it such a superstitious sport? Shepherd lifting his leg on Nelsons being a classic example.

[Thor Sedan]

Yeah, all the weird mockers gods stuff makes cricket threads so very tiresome these days. Just post what you think, guys! It really doesn't matter!

Great piece by Jarrod Kimber on this game: https://wickets.substack.com/p/new-zealand-find-a-way

Yes - but problem is that if you doubt your side - or genuinely talk up the other side - the appeasement of the mockers is levelled at you.

Me personally - I genuinely thought England would roll NZ. And I thought they would do it pretty easily. NZ haven't really been that good throughout the tournament - whereas England have been - at times - irresistible. We lost Lockie and had to rely on Milne (who proved me wrong in this game), we don't have particularly good spinners, our batting line up is short.

You said that Roy and Mills were a loss - I didn't agree. I guess we can't really judge whether Roy would have been a difference as he could have gone first ball. But I admit that the loss of Mills was far more damaging than I thought it would be. Jordan just lost it in the 17th - not just length - but line as well. I doubt Mills would have shipped 20+ had he been bowling.

But no one could have predicted Jimmy's innings. In the space of 17 deliveries NZ went from a 19% chance of winning - to a 75% chance.

I think NZ cricket supporters are still trying to get past the fact that we are NZ cricket supporters. We are used to a team that are constant underdogs - capable of upsetting the more illustrious teams every now and then. We aren't used to being at the top table....although 3 finals in a row would suggest that we perhaps need to believe in the team a little bit more.

[JM2K6]

Yeah, all the weird mockers gods stuff makes cricket threads so very tiresome these days. Just post what you think, guys! It really doesn't matter!

Great piece by Jarrod Kimber on this game: https://wickets.substack.com/p/new-zealand-find-a-way

Yes - but problem is that if you doubt your side - or genuinely talk up the other side - the appeasement of the mockers is levelled at you.

Me personally - I genuinely thought England would roll NZ. And I thought they would do it pretty easily. NZ haven't really been that good throughout the tournament - whereas England have been - at times - irresistible. We lost Lockie and had to rely on Milne (who proved me wrong in this game), we don't have particularly good spinners, our batting line up is short.

You said that Roy and Mills were a loss - I didn't agree. I guess we can't really judge whether Roy would have been a difference as he could have gone first ball. But I admit that the loss of Mills was far more damaging than I thought it would be. Jordan just lost it in the 17th - not just length - but line as well. I doubt Mills would have shipped 20+ had he been bowling.

But no one could have predicted Jimmy's innings. In the space of 17 deliveries NZ went from a 19% chance of winning - to a 75% chance.

I think NZ cricket supporters are still trying to get past the fact that we are NZ cricket supporters. We are used to a team that are constant underdogs - capable of upsetting the more illustrious teams every now and then. We aren't used to being at the top table....although 3 finals in a row would suggest that we perhaps need to believe in the team a little bit more.

You're test champions and made the final of the ODI world cup, clearly a good side!

England were really good right up until the injuries, but even before that there were signs that teams could get at them, especially in a format where a single over can change so much. But everyone was so keen to overrate us for a variety of reasons, very few of them based in good faith.

Totally understand NZ fans going into this being worried and rating England as favourites, but people were being deliberately blinkered beyond that I think.

[Lemoentjie]

I really hope the Black Caps manage to win the final. I don't think they can take anymore heartbreak. Poor Jimmy Neesham.

[Thor Sedan]

But everyone was so keen to overrate us for a variety of reasons, very few of them based in good faith.

I think the view of England in this tourney was very much based on the results they produced.

Destroyed (an admittedly awful West Indies side), cruised past Bangladesh, embarrassed Australia and didn't really raise a sweat against Sri Lanka. You guys were looking like joint best - if not the best in the tournament.

I still can't work out if the SA game was a drop off in intensity because the semi final was achieved no matter what - or if it was England coming up against a competitive team for the first time?

[Paddington Bear]

Yeah, all the weird mockers gods stuff makes cricket threads so very tiresome these days. Just post what you think, guys! It really doesn't matter!

Great piece by Jarrod Kimber on this game: https://wickets.substack.com/p/new-zealand-find-a-way

And we only do it in the cricket. Why is it such a superstitious sport? Shepherd lifting his leg on Nelsons being a classic example.

Individual sport within a team game. Breeds superstition.

[Kiwias]

Yeah, all the weird mockers gods stuff makes cricket threads so very tiresome these days. Just post what you think, guys! It really doesn't matter!

Great piece by Jarrod Kimber on this game: https://wickets.substack.com/p/new-zealand-find-a-way

Yes - but problem is that if you doubt your side - or genuinely talk up the other side - the appeasement of the mockers is levelled at you.

Me personally - I genuinely thought England would roll NZ. And I thought they would do it pretty easily. NZ haven't really been that good throughout the tournament - whereas England have been - at times - irresistible. We lost Lockie and had to rely on Milne (who proved me wrong in this game), we don't have particularly good spinners, our batting line up is short.

You said that Roy and Mills were a loss - I didn't agree. I guess we can't really judge whether Roy would have been a difference as he could have gone first ball. But I admit that the loss of Mills was far more damaging than I thought it would be. Jordan just lost it in the 17th - not just length - but line as well. I doubt Mills would have shipped 20+ had he been bowling.

But no one could have predicted Jimmy's innings. In the space of 17 deliveries NZ went from a 19% chance of winning - to a 75% chance.

I think NZ cricket supporters are still trying to get past the fact that we are NZ cricket supporters. We are used to a team that are constant underdogs - capable of upsetting the more illustrious teams every now and then. We aren't used to being at the top table....although 3 finals in a row would suggest that we perhaps need to believe in the team a little bit more.

You're test champions and made the final of the ODI world cup, clearly a good side!

England were really good right up until the injuries, but even before that there were signs that teams could get at them, especially in a format where a single over can change so much. But everyone was so keen to overrate us for a variety of reasons, very few of them based in good faith.

Totally understand NZ fans going into this being worried and rating England as favourites, but people were being deliberately blinkered beyond that I think.

We diehard BC fans have decades of being raised up and then dashed to the rocks by a team that could on its day beat anyone but which seemed irredeemably incapable of sustaining a decent level of performance, being famous for snatching defeat out of the jaws of victory with an astounding frequency. The sustained excellence of the last decade is still very fresh for us.

[Insane_Homer]

I think it all comes down to whether the kiwi-Saffa (Conway) can out perform the Eng-Saffa (Malan 41 from 30)

called it

[JM2K6]

But everyone was so keen to overrate us for a variety of reasons, very few of them based in good faith.

I think the view of England in this tourney was very much based on the results they produced.

Destroyed (an admittedly awful West Indies side), cruised past Bangladesh, embarrassed Australia and didn't really raise a sweat against Sri Lanka. You guys were looking like joint best - if not the best in the tournament.

I still can't work out if the SA game was a drop off in intensity because the semi final was achieved no matter what - or if it was England coming up against a competitive team for the first time?

I agree people rating England was warranted, but the point blank refusal to admit that England had weaknesses, that they were damaged by the injuries, and that the loss to SA even happened(!) was over the top. The crap wickets we've all had to play on have made life very difficult for some teams, too. We all know people wanted to make out that England were unbeatable for bad faith reasons. No-one's unbeatable in T20s, let alone a side with actual problems!

We lost the SA game because in-for-Mills Mark Wood was very expensive and we got flogged in the death overs - we also had Roy getting hurt and while none of the bats bar Bairstow really failed, no-one kicked on; largely the problem was in the field, not when we were batting.

Wood's played two matches in this tournament - combined figures of zero wickets for 81 runs. He's wildly overrated and every single time he does anything good, the entire cricketing establishment and the media start anointing him as England's secret weapon. SA were 73/1 after 10 overs. He then bowled two overs that cost 24 runs, forcing Morgan to switch to someone else for a bit, meaning Wood had to bowl death overs, which were also expensive. Jordan showed his weaknesses then too, 16 runs off the final over.

Kimber's piece I linked has a lot of good analysis but it does ignore Mark Wood. It does show Jordan is pretty expensive even though he is a death bowler, and Mills is streets ahead. If we'd won that game it would've been a huge credit to the batsmen, but while they did pretty well, they couldn't reel in the sheer number of runs we'd conceded.

[JM2K6]

I think it all comes down to whether the kiwi-Saffa (Conway) can out perform the Eng-Saffa (Malan 41 from 30)

called it

Apart from Conway getting 46 from 38, a much slower strike rate...

[handyman]

Pak vs NZ final, who's with me?

[Calculon]

Fuck, Australia won the toss

[Insane_Homer]

I think it all comes down to whether the kiwi-Saffa (Conway) can out perform the Eng-Saffa (Malan 41 from 30)

called it

Apart from Conway getting 46 from 38, a much slower strike rate...

Last time I check 46 was still > 41, so I'm taking it!

[Torquemada 1420]

Fuck, Australia won the toss

I want to be upset by this but after Wasim's "genius" moment of opting to bat first in the 1999 final, I think Pak sometimes better when those decisions are taken from their hands!

[Thor Sedan]

I think this is the first time I have ever heard the Pakistan national anthem!?!

[Torquemada 1420]

Pak vs NZ final, who's with me?

Pak has never beaten Aus.

[Torquemada 1420]

FFS. 2 4s missed out on.

[handyman]

Pak vs NZ final, who's with me?

Pak has never beaten Aus.

Well, today seems like a good day.

[Torquemada 1420]

Phew. Rizwan trying to get out.

[Thor Sedan]

Oof.....Warner puts a tough one down.

[OomStruisbaai]

Come on ya Aussies!

[Torquemada 1420]

FFS Rizwan. Calm down.

[Thor Sedan]

FFS Rizwan. Calm down.

His heartrate must be 200bpm

[Thor Sedan]

Well that will calm him!

[Torquemada 1420]

Well that will calm him!

Nope. He'll end up running Barbar out.

[Thor Sedan]

Blimey.....camera man finding some VERY attractive women in the crowd.

Annnnnnnd......also a Pakistan man digging deeeep in his nose!