NPR

Good to see both teams do a circle.

Deon Fourie has been great tonight.

Sandstorm wrote: Sun Oct 01, 2023 8:48 pm 49-18
Good enough

No injuries except Mapimpi...


That's the best result

Not sure what it is with the boks this year but handling in the opposition 22 has been bad all season long. Messing up so many scoring opportunities. At least the kicking was on point tonight. Libbok on one of his kicking nights tonight. But that tends to mean the next game it will be all over the place.
Pollard has to start. I would also prefer Esterhuizen over De Allende.

Esterhuizen and Fourie were fantastic tonight. Thor and Reinach too.

We miss Jacob Dweba.

The Pollard / Libbok use was good tonight.


Hats off to Tonga. They gave us a very good match.Their scrum was excellent.

Just imagine Tonga getting more regular game time.

I was hoping for double that points difference.

Boks now on 15 points and +117 points difference. Boks going out would need a Scotland win by 21 points, with four tries, and Ireland would need four tries. Which means a 40 to 50 point Scotland win with Ireland scoring 20 to 30 points. That looks incredibly unlikely especially when Scotland don't need a try bonus, they just need to win by 8 or more points and to prevent Ireland getting a bonus point.

Looks like the Boks are through. Playing France or the All Blacks is the same difference, but France is at home so you would rather not play them, on the other hand better to play France in the quarter than the final (the ref is going to go full Homer for France if it's close at the end, he's not going to give a pen if it means France losing, but it'll be a lot worse in a final).

_Os_ wrote: Sun Oct 01, 2023 9:57 pm I was hoping for double that points difference.

Boks now on 15 points and +117 points difference. Boks going out would need a Scotland win by 21 points, with four tries, and Ireland would need four tries. Which means a 40 to 50 point Scotland win with Ireland scoring 20 to 30 points. That looks incredibly unlikely especially when Scotland don't need a try bonus, they just need to win by 8 or more points and to prevent Ireland getting a bonus point.

Looks like the Boks are through. Playing France or the All Blacks is the same difference, but France is at home so you would rather not play them, on the other hand better to play France in the quarter than the final (the ref is going to go full Homer for France if it's close at the end, he's not going to give a pen if it means France losing, but it'll be a lot worse in a final).

Agree that boks are through, but give me France any time over NZ

boere wors wrote: Sun Oct 01, 2023 10:15 pm

_Os_ wrote: Sun Oct 01, 2023 9:57 pm I was hoping for double that points difference.

Boks now on 15 points and +117 points difference. Boks going out would need a Scotland win by 21 points, with four tries, and Ireland would need four tries. Which means a 40 to 50 point Scotland win with Ireland scoring 20 to 30 points. That looks incredibly unlikely especially when Scotland don't need a try bonus, they just need to win by 8 or more points and to prevent Ireland getting a bonus point.

Looks like the Boks are through. Playing France or the All Blacks is the same difference, but France is at home so you would rather not play them, on the other hand better to play France in the quarter than the final (the ref is going to go full Homer for France if it's close at the end, he's not going to give a pen if it means France losing, but it'll be a lot worse in a final).

Agree that boks are through, but give me France any time over NZ

Really needed two or three more tries or less Tonga tries to make it 100% certain.

I cannot see this Ireland side shipping 50 points, which in reality is what would need to happen. For all sides to finish on 15 both Scotland and Ireland would need a four try bonus with Scotland winning, and for the Boks to go out Scotland would need 21 points on top of that. It means Scotland getting 7 tries/50 points over Ireland, and probably more once Sexton's kicking is taken into account (what does an Ireland good enough to score 4 tries end up scoring? 30 to 40 surely?) . If it were to happen, it would need something like Scotland being in the match and both sides scoring, then Ireland collapsing and Scotland being totally dominant, it would have to be quite a strange match. Ireland can go an entire 6N only conceding 60 or so points. It's not totally impossible though, just extremely unlikely. A slightly better Bok points difference would've pushed it out into being impossible.

This contact (no card) gave Mapimpi a blowout fracture of his cheekbone. Still rate him as our best left wing. No chance this Bok management plays injured players or keeps them in the squad, that's his RWC done then. Replacement called up before the quarter, wonder how close Am is.

That info on Mapimpi is from the Bok press conference. Funny question from a French journo at the end who asks Nienaber what would happen if the Scots and Irish fixed their match, to which Nienaber replies match fixing isn't allowed.

_Os_ wrote: Sun Oct 01, 2023 9:57 pm I was hoping for double that points difference.

Boks now on 15 points and +117 points difference. Boks going out would need a Scotland win by 21 points, with four tries, and Ireland would need four tries. Which means a 40 to 50 point Scotland win with Ireland scoring 20 to 30 points. That looks incredibly unlikely especially when Scotland don't need a try bonus, they just need to win by 8 or more points and to prevent Ireland getting a bonus point.

Looks like the Boks are through. Playing France or the All Blacks is the same difference, but France is at home so you would rather not play them, on the other hand better to play France in the quarter than the final (the ref is going to go full Homer for France if it's close at the end, he's not going to give a pen if it means France losing, but it'll be a lot worse in a final).

You don't know who will ref the final but you've already decided you know what he will do.

You're expressing the cliched paranoia people associate with Bok supporters.

_Os_ wrote: Sun Oct 01, 2023 11:40 pm This contact (no card) gave Mapimpi a blowout fracture of his cheekbone. Still rate him as our best left wing. No chance this Bok management plays injured players or keeps them in the squad, that's his RWC done then. Replacement called up before the quarter, wonder how close Am is.

I see World Rugby has taken the video down, first something on that, then back to this piece of awful refereeing. World Rugby are doing a good job of preventing as much visibility of the RWC as possible, almost every video is taken down within hours. The official highlights they put out are rubbish, mostly just tries and sometimes not all of the tries. No compilations of scrums, lineouts, tackles. The people running this sport don't actually understand what generates new interest in rugby, it's not BaaBaas tries, it's all the things World Rugby is ashamed of: the macho stuff, the physical contact, the complexity. NFL has pretty touchdowns, but the people running that sport know what the USP of their sport is and aren't ashamed of it (it's not the touchdowns).

Back to this appalling bit of refereeing. Pearce says it's foul play because there's head contact between a tackler and ball carrier, and awards a penalty but no card. He says Mapimpi is "already falling to his knees" (he is not) and there is a "low degree of danger". Mapimpi was immediately down and out, if he wasn't out cold it was something close to that, Pearce decided to play on just like Brace did when Grant Williams was knocked out cold against the Pumas and play continued with a motionless prostrate Williams right next to the ruck/play. It was immediately obvious Mapimpi was fucked, it was such an obvious concussion there was no HIA and he was immediately subbed off. His face was visibly swollen. I have no clue how Pearce decides there is a "low degree of danger" like it's something subjective he can decide, when the player was badly injured from what he had decided was foul play.

Every Bok match I've said there's neck holds/head shots/borderline seatbelt tackles, mostly going in on our wide runners and our close in ball carriers. None of it gets called, now a Bok wing has a serious head injury, from ball carrier/tackler contact that World Rugby is focusing heavily on and it's just a penalty.

I could only stay awake for the first half, but it was job done by then. We did well to absorb their hits and then counter when we could.

Reinarch really stood out for me. His workrate is unbelievable. Pity a couple of his kicks went out on the full, but apart from that he really was outstanding.

Guy Smiley wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 2:55 am

_Os_ wrote: Sun Oct 01, 2023 9:57 pm I was hoping for double that points difference.

Boks now on 15 points and +117 points difference. Boks going out would need a Scotland win by 21 points, with four tries, and Ireland would need four tries. Which means a 40 to 50 point Scotland win with Ireland scoring 20 to 30 points. That looks incredibly unlikely especially when Scotland don't need a try bonus, they just need to win by 8 or more points and to prevent Ireland getting a bonus point.

Looks like the Boks are through. Playing France or the All Blacks is the same difference, but France is at home so you would rather not play them, on the other hand better to play France in the quarter than the final (the ref is going to go full Homer for France if it's close at the end, he's not going to give a pen if it means France losing, but it'll be a lot worse in a final).

You don't know who will ref the final but you've already decided you know what he will do.

You're expressing the cliched paranoia people associate with Bok supporters.

English after the '03 final, Kiwis after the '07 quarter, French after the '11 final ... they were all very calm about the ref. Of course there's a high chance of the ref going Homer when the hosts are playing, even more so in a final. Any side not preparing for that however they can (not really much that can be done about a full insane Homer) isn't preparing properly. All the sides do referee analysis already.

You should be thanking the Boks. They put up a decent score and secured 5 points, without using a lot of our best players (Ireland and Scotland used their best teams to play Tonga and got similar scores to the Boks). It forces both Ireland and Scotland to pick their best teams when they play in what is basically a knockout game. Then probably Ireland plays you seven days later, having not rotated their squad or rested anyone. Less "bad paranoid Bokke" more "thank you so much Bokke".

_Os_ wrote: Sun Oct 01, 2023 11:40 pm This contact (no card) gave Mapimpi a blowout fracture of his cheekbone. Still rate him as our best left wing. No chance this Bok management plays injured players or keeps them in the squad, that's his RWC done then. Replacement called up before the quarter, wonder how close Am is.

The Tongan player is so low that his knee touches the ground. Not sure how much lower he could have gotten.

laurent wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 7:13 am

_Os_ wrote: Sun Oct 01, 2023 11:40 pm This contact (no card) gave Mapimpi a blowout fracture of his cheekbone. Still rate him as our best left wing. No chance this Bok management plays injured players or keeps them in the squad, that's his RWC done then. Replacement called up before the quarter, wonder how close Am is.

The Tongan player is so low that his knee touches the ground. Not sure how much lower he could have gotten.

There was plenty mitigation in that tackle. I do feel very sorry for Mapimpi though. Last world cup game. I almost lost my dinner when Pearce was trying his best to give Eben a yellow, how in the actual fuck was he going to do that? Thank goodness the AR and TMO talked him down from his temporary insanity. It scares the living crap out of me that some refs are absolutely willing to make ridiculous decisions like that, the RWC 1/4ers coming up.

LoveOfTheGame wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 8:01 am

laurent wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 7:13 am

_Os_ wrote: Sun Oct 01, 2023 11:40 pm This contact (no card) gave Mapimpi a blowout fracture of his cheekbone. Still rate him as our best left wing. No chance this Bok management plays injured players or keeps them in the squad, that's his RWC done then. Replacement called up before the quarter, wonder how close Am is.

The Tongan player is so low that his knee touches the ground. Not sure how much lower he could have gotten.

There was plenty mitigation in that tackle. I do feel very sorry for Mapimpi though. Last world cup game. I almost lost my dinner when Pearce was trying his best to give Eben a yellow, how in the actual fuck was he going to do that? Thank goodness the AR and TMO talked him down from his temporary insanity. It scares the living crap out of me that some refs are absolutely willing to make ridiculous decisions like that, the RWC 1/4ers coming up.

Spot on. The mapimpi tackle looked unfortunate rather, rugby incident. Likewise Eben, I also spilled my beer when Pearce started the yellow card dialogue. But well done in the end from the other refs.

LoveOfTheGame wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 8:01 am

laurent wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 7:13 am

_Os_ wrote: Sun Oct 01, 2023 11:40 pm This contact (no card) gave Mapimpi a blowout fracture of his cheekbone. Still rate him as our best left wing. No chance this Bok management plays injured players or keeps them in the squad, that's his RWC done then. Replacement called up before the quarter, wonder how close Am is.

The Tongan player is so low that his knee touches the ground. Not sure how much lower he could have gotten.

There was plenty mitigation in that tackle. I do feel very sorry for Mapimpi though. Last world cup game. I almost lost my dinner when Pearce was trying his best to give Eben a yellow, how in the actual fuck was he going to do that? Thank goodness the AR and TMO talked him down from his temporary insanity. It scares the living crap out of me that some refs are absolutely willing to make ridiculous decisions like that, the RWC 1/4ers coming up.

Real sad for Mapimpi an exciting player to watch.

Bit different on Etzebeh though accidental (shoulder to the head) he was a step too far and took the player in the air so you could argue reckless dangerous play to give a yellow...

laurent wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 8:13 am Bit different on Etzebeh though accidental (shoulder to the head) he was a step too far

The guy jumped into him after being pushed by his own player, that player's head hit Eben in the chest while standing upright.

Our discipline has been outstanding.
And our defence

Insane_Homer wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 8:29 am

laurent wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 8:13 am Bit different on Etzebeh though accidental (shoulder to the head) he was a step too far

The guy jumped into him after being pushed by his own player, that player's head hit Eben in the chest while standing upright.

Don't misquote please

I don't mind the decision about Mapimpi, there was no reckless intent.

However, the ref clearly said it was a low level of danger. His world cup is over, how is that a low level of danger?

And if that sort of incident is going to be seen as a penalty only, they need to start applying that same level of reasoning to many of the other cards we're seeing.

laurent wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 8:38 am

Insane_Homer wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 8:29 am

laurent wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 8:13 am Bit different on Etzebeh though accidental (shoulder to the head) he was a step too far

The guy jumped into him after being pushed by his own player, that player's head hit Eben in the chest while standing upright.

Don't misquote please

eh? Did you not state the underlined bit (shoulder to the head)

assfly wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 8:44 am I don't mind the decision about Mapimpi, there was no reckless intent.

However, the ref clearly said it was a low level of danger. His world cup is over, how is that a low level of danger?

And if that sort of incident is going to be seen as a penalty only, they need to start applying that same level of reasoning to many of the other cards we're seeing.

Yep agree. Thought the ref was outstanding in this match.

Insane_Homer wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 8:50 am

laurent wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 8:38 am

Insane_Homer wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 8:29 am

The guy jumped into him after being pushed by his own player, that player's head hit Eben in the chest while standing upright.

Don't misquote please

eh? Did you not state the underlined bit (shoulder to the head)

You cut the sentence to suit your need. Just fuck off if you want to do that.

Also feel sorry for Mapimpi and have to eat humble pie with Kriel. He is in outstanding form.

laurent wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 9:08 am

Insane_Homer wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 8:50 am

laurent wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 8:38 am Don't misquote please

eh? Did you not state the underlined bit (shoulder to the head)

You cut the sentence to suit your need. Just fuck off if you want to do that.

laurent wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 7:13 am

_Os_ wrote: Sun Oct 01, 2023 11:40 pm This contact (no card) gave Mapimpi a blowout fracture of his cheekbone. Still rate him as our best left wing. No chance this Bok management plays injured players or keeps them in the squad, that's his RWC done then. Replacement called up before the quarter, wonder how close Am is.

The Tongan player is so low that his knee touches the ground. Not sure how much lower he could have gotten.

Pearce said foul play penalty, Pearce said no card and used "low degree of danger" as mitigation. The tackled player was fucked right there in front of him and Pearce is talking like "degree of danger" like it's a subjective thing he can decide. How this was reffed until Pearce made it up, was the tackler is responsible for what happens in the tackle. In that video on the slow mo, it did look like the tackler thrusts up (his head into Mapimpi's), but it was fast, irrelevant anyway Pearce was wrong.

Mapimpi is now out of the RWC, fractured eye socket. Over a month out.

assfly wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 8:44 am I don't mind the decision about Mapimpi, there was no reckless intent.

However, the ref clearly said it was a low level of danger. His world cup is over, how is that a low level of danger?

And if that sort of incident is going to be seen as a penalty only, they need to start applying that same level of reasoning to many of the other cards we're seeing.

The intent is irrelevant, that's never been how it is reffed.

Agree with the last sentence, I'm fine with it being reffed this way. The Boks should be allowed to do it too though, rather than the Boks not being allowed to do it and it not being called when it's done to Bok players.

_Os_ wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 10:41 am

assfly wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 8:44 am I don't mind the decision about Mapimpi, there was no reckless intent.

However, the ref clearly said it was a low level of danger. His world cup is over, how is that a low level of danger?

And if that sort of incident is going to be seen as a penalty only, they need to start applying that same level of reasoning to many of the other cards we're seeing.

The intent is irrelevant, that's never been how it is reffed.

Agree with the last sentence, I'm fine with it being reffed this way. The Boks should be allowed to do it too though, rather than the Boks not being allowed to do it and it not being called when it's done to Bok players.

Os, you know every ref and neutral is trying to get the "filthy Boks" carded every chance they get, despite us being probably the cleanest we've ever been! And have fuck-all cards this RWC so far.

The 1/4 final against France is going to be a nightmare for us.

Sandstorm wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 10:51 am

_Os_ wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 10:41 am

assfly wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 8:44 am I don't mind the decision about Mapimpi, there was no reckless intent.

However, the ref clearly said it was a low level of danger. His world cup is over, how is that a low level of danger?

And if that sort of incident is going to be seen as a penalty only, they need to start applying that same level of reasoning to many of the other cards we're seeing.

The intent is irrelevant, that's never been how it is reffed.

Agree with the last sentence, I'm fine with it being reffed this way. The Boks should be allowed to do it too though, rather than the Boks not being allowed to do it and it not being called when it's done to Bok players.

Os, you know every ref and neutral is trying to get the "filthy Boks" carded every chance they get, despite us being probably the cleanest we've ever been! And have fuck-all cards this RWC so far.

The 1/4 final against France is going to be a nightmare for us.

Could you please be so kind as to not...

Sandstorm wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 10:51 am

_Os_ wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 10:41 am

assfly wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 8:44 am I don't mind the decision about Mapimpi, there was no reckless intent.

However, the ref clearly said it was a low level of danger. His world cup is over, how is that a low level of danger?

And if that sort of incident is going to be seen as a penalty only, they need to start applying that same level of reasoning to many of the other cards we're seeing.

The intent is irrelevant, that's never been how it is reffed.

Agree with the last sentence, I'm fine with it being reffed this way. The Boks should be allowed to do it too though, rather than the Boks not being allowed to do it and it not being called when it's done to Bok players.

Os, you know every ref and neutral is trying to get the "filthy Boks" carded every chance they get, despite us being probably the cleanest we've ever been! And have fuck-all cards this RWC so far.

The 1/4 final against France is going to be a nightmare for us.

The Boks are in the running for the cleanest side at the RWC. Four matches, three of them tough, no cards. Some effort given how they play.

I'm already mentally preparing myself for the ref going totally Homer in the France match, then everyone saying how good they were post-match. On social media there's actually people saying Pearce got the Mapimpi call correct and it should always be reffed like that rather than how it has been, they admit Pearce just invented a new reffing standard at odds with how this tournament has been reffed and say that like it's a good thing, the same people would have a heart attack if the Boks played to that standard.

LoveOfTheGame wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 11:11 am Could you please be so kind as to not...

Ag man, haven't you worked out yet we'll never be liked. Stop trying to impress them they're not interested.

_Os_ wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 11:15 am

LoveOfTheGame wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 11:11 am Could you please be so kind as to not...

Ag man, haven't you worked out yet we'll never be liked. Stop trying to impress them they're not interested.

The mocker gods? They are always listening.

LoveOfTheGame wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 11:29 am

_Os_ wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 11:15 am

LoveOfTheGame wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 11:11 am Could you please be so kind as to not...

Ag man, haven't you worked out yet we'll never be liked. Stop trying to impress them they're not interested.

The mocker gods? They are always listening.

They can go fuck themselves too.

_Os_ wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 11:40 am

LoveOfTheGame wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 11:29 am

_Os_ wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 11:15 am
Ag man, haven't you worked out yet we'll never be liked. Stop trying to impress them they're not interested.

The mocker gods? They are always listening.

They can go fuck themselves too.

I like the confidence Ox, but is it really necessary for the potty mouth?

I fucking hate swearing.

LoveOfTheGame wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 11:49 am

_Os_ wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 11:40 am

LoveOfTheGame wrote: Mon Oct 02, 2023 11:29 am
The mocker gods? They are always listening.

They can go fuck themselves too.

I like the confidence Ox, but is it really necessary for the potty mouth?

Use vok Os. It's not as bad