NPR

Ludeen wrote: Sun Jan 17, 2021 5:04 pm Very interesting on Barker listening, having that giles Scott as full on tactician is paying dividends. Kiwis will be taking note.?

Ineos have picked up some pace but from what can see, their wins have been because of better tactics/execution.

Enzedder wrote: Sun Jan 17, 2021 6:11 pm

Battery came loose is the rumour.

Did they raise PRB ?

These things are really not designed for the sea.

Can I just say I am going to be barracking for the Americans in the Prada Cup from here on in. This Terry Hutchinson bloke I like him, a real leader. I hope they get up and running in time and can contest the Semi Finals.

So we only have 2 teams left in the round robins??

I have to admit, this has not been a great event so far.

Tech faults ruining races. Many races dropped off foils racing in a pond. Finals racing day cancelled. Mostly misbalanced races. And now a “round” robin with only 2 boats.

So we only have 2 teams left in the round robins??

I have to admit, this has not been a great event so far.


One of the very few teams competing was a ghost entry.
Tech faults ruining races. Many races dropped off foils racing in a pond. Xmas Finals racing day cancelled. Mostly misbalanced races. And now a “round” robin with only 2 boats.

Talk about a cursed event. Not great.

Ymx wrote: Tue Jan 19, 2021 8:33 am So we only have 2 teams left in the round robins??

I have to admit, this has not been a great event so far.


One of the very few teams competing was a ghost entry.
Tech faults ruining races. Many races dropped off foils racing in a pond. Xmas Finals racing day cancelled. Mostly misbalanced races. And now a “round” robin with only 2 boats.

Talk about a cursed event. Not great.

Watched a tiny bit but not really interested as there is no French involvement.

It looks like they are pushing this too far :
the budget is 100Million per syndicate if I am not mistaken. with only 4 teams competing in the end.

You could get more than 60 Imocas of latest gen for this price (Imoca's are 4.5 to 6 M € to build).
If you look at the current Vendée globe until last week only the foilers had to resign; with Sebastien Destremeau dropping off on your shores I think.
Some of the boats actually have done 4 or 5 round the world despite being racing boats.

I can't find the budget for the Maxi doing the Jules Verne (Gitana has a 3.5 million annual budget but the boat is built).

The tech is impressive however you can't really sail these boats anywhere.

If you take what's best in the current sailing performances you see some real crazy stuff
The max average speed over 24h on a maxi during Jules Verne is 37.25 knots (894,51miles) (Francis Joyon)
On the Vendée with a mono hull thomas Ruyant has a 24h max of 21.5 knots for 515.3 miles

This are crazy speed achieved in oceanic conditions.

For the Americas cup to be more entertaining I would think they need to cap budgets so as to get more boats (they can continue navigating in gulfs and protected bays to get some crowds).

The current Vendée is crazy competitive with 10 boats in under 500 miles at the equator (foilers and non foilers) and potentially 25 will finish out of 33.

Don’t get me wrong. I love the event, and the boats.

Just been some challenges with the challengers.

Feel like we’ve missed out on the round robins now.

Each stage now will be between just 2 boats now.

LR & ITUK for the final place.

Then will be semi finals between AM and loser of above. Likely LR.

Then it will be final Prada Cup likely between LR and ITUK. AM have no time to rebuild and also upgrade.

Then it will be the America’s Cup between the winner and ETNZ.

What bugs me is the stupidly high cost for boats you cannot use anywhere else.

There is 1 set of races for a few month and that's it.

The Pre crazy rules boat are still sailing I don't think any since the class America are sailing.
They were incredible but what's really the point of these if they get thrown away.

anyway going to bump the Vendée thread ;)

laurent wrote: Tue Jan 19, 2021 8:33 pm What bugs me is the stupidly high cost for boats you cannot use anywhere else.

There is 1 set of races for a few month and that's it.

The Pre crazy rules boat are still sailing I don't think any since the class America are sailing.
They were incredible but what's really the point of these if they get thrown away.

anyway going to bump the Vendée thread ;)

Well, there normally is a World Series which runs between cups.

It’s F1 of sailing, and no they’re not intended to be used anywhere. Much like F1 cars.

Ymx wrote: Tue Jan 19, 2021 8:01 am So we only have 2 teams left in the round robins??

I have to admit, this has not been a great event so far.

Tech faults ruining races. Many races dropped off foils racing in a pond. Finals racing day cancelled. Mostly misbalanced races. And now a “round” robin with only 2 boats.

Even the "balanced" races haven't really been that close.

To me, the america's cup is elite level match-racing. That's proper understanding of weather, wave and tide patterns plus boat-to-boat racing: Lee-bows, taking deuls, covering downwind and sending your opponent to the wrong side of the racetrack.

These boats are so dependent on foiling and the different between foiling speed and maneuvers means that both boats just bang corners at full blast.

After the youtube coverage of Sundays races finished it autoplayed some of the 2003 races. That was the last match-racing cup....it's been more like drag races since then.

Ymx wrote: Tue Jan 19, 2021 8:53 pm

laurent wrote: Tue Jan 19, 2021 8:33 pm What bugs me is the stupidly high cost for boats you cannot use anywhere else.

There is 1 set of races for a few month and that's it.

The Pre crazy rules boat are still sailing I don't think any since the class America are sailing.
They were incredible but what's really the point of these if they get thrown away.

anyway going to bump the Vendée thread ;)

Well, there normally is a World Series which runs between cups.

It’s F1 of sailing, and no they’re not intended to be used anywhere. Much like F1 cars.

The difference being really that a casual viewer can at least somewhat related to F1. Steering Wheel + 4 tyres at least relates to most people's understanding of a car. But the whole foils thing doesn't relate to most people's understanding of sailing.

I watch some of it because the engineering and science is seriously impressive, but even I find it hard to relate

It’s becoming much more common place



But in any case, I don’t watch it because I only watch things I’ve experienced. For me it’s magic of combining the elements it does. Sea, wind, aerodynamics, hydrodynamics, electronics, and humans racing.

Not to mention, my summer fun . . . .

Its been dull and boring so far.

So no racing Friday, and is it only one race on each of sat and Sunday.

That's the way I read it too. A shame. Only ever 1 race a day now, unless during the finals (both Prada and Americas) they have 2 races a day. Haven't looked into the schedule that far in advance

Saint wrote: Tue Jan 19, 2021 9:28 pm

Ymx wrote: Tue Jan 19, 2021 8:53 pm

laurent wrote: Tue Jan 19, 2021 8:33 pm What bugs me is the stupidly high cost for boats you cannot use anywhere else.

There is 1 set of races for a few month and that's it.

The Pre crazy rules boat are still sailing I don't think any since the class America are sailing.
They were incredible but what's really the point of these if they get thrown away.

anyway going to bump the Vendée thread ;)

Well, there normally is a World Series which runs between cups.

It’s F1 of sailing, and no they’re not intended to be used anywhere. Much like F1 cars.

The difference being really that a casual viewer can at least somewhat related to F1. Steering Wheel + 4 tyres at least relates to most people's understanding of a car. [i]But the whole foils thing doesn't relate to most people's understanding of sailing.[/i]

I watch some of it because the engineering and science is seriously impressive, but even I find it hard to relate

A sail boat speed is limited mainly by the keel and the shape / size of the hull ( also weight and sails etc.) or the wave that makes the hull.
The Catamarans and Trimarans changed that but now even them have foils
Foils seem to be the future

Ymx is corrected to compare F1 and AC, most of the tech innovations in sailing came from the AC

Marylandolorian wrote: Thu Jan 21, 2021 9:43 pm

Saint wrote: Tue Jan 19, 2021 9:28 pm

Ymx wrote: Tue Jan 19, 2021 8:53 pm

Well, there normally is a World Series which runs between cups.

It’s F1 of sailing, and no they’re not intended to be used anywhere. Much like F1 cars.

The difference being really that a casual viewer can at least somewhat related to F1. Steering Wheel + 4 tyres at least relates to most people's understanding of a car. [i]But the whole foils thing doesn't relate to most people's understanding of sailing.[/i]

I watch some of it because the engineering and science is seriously impressive, but even I find it hard to relate

A sail boat speed is limited mainly by the keel and the shape / size of the hull ( also weight and sails etc.) or the wave that makes the hull.
The Catamarans and Trimarans changed that but now even them have foils
Foils seem to be the future

Ymx is corrected to compare F1 and AC, most of the tech innovations in sailing came from the AC

I understand all of that. But sailing in general is fairly far removed from a lot of people's experience anyway add the foils in and people don't really understand what's going on. For F1 most people don't really understand eiter, but there's4 wheels, a steering wheel, and even thing like Regen braking are becoming part of people's data to day experience

With only 2 teams, or even 3 when the Septics come back, the whole event is a farce. Pricing the competition out of reach doesn't make for a good event. If there were 5 or 6 teams it would be much better.

And most races so far have either been mismatches or non events.

Bring back the proper sail boats with crew work and tactics determining how teams perform.

Its basically like T20 cricket or 7s rugby. A bastardised version of the real thing. Dumbed down to short timed races for people with the attention span of an ADHD kid.

Russell Coutts has a lot to answer for, the wanker.

It’s a strange phenomenon with such low numbers in the first place.

Dropping from 3 to 2 competitors reduces the races from 6 down to just 2. (2 rounds worth)

5 competitors = 20 races
4 = 12 races
3 = 6 races
2 = 2 races

And to think AM is most likely to lose. So might just have only 4 races left. Only about 100 more minutes of sailing left for them.

So perhaps 200 in total. For $130m, every 1.5 mins of racing that’s $1m burned.

Ouch, that’s a tough price for the sponsors of a not heavily watched sport.

That was a good race, finally!!

Thought that LR could have easily won that. Great sailing though.

But that means it’s over. Shame it’s the only one out of the six which were planned. The only other actual race this weekend is now a dead rubber.

Still, it’s going to be good starting next weekend.

Great race , fair play to Ineos having to sail powered up with the Cunningham jammed,( hydraulic?),
Think Prada are losing out with bruno and Jimmy sharing the helm. Still it came down to better boat handling in
The end. (Inho). Would like to see Ineos as the challenger unless Prada can up there game.

Luna Rossa will have to up their game quite a bit.

Ineos just won that race with their arm in a cast.

Oops meant LR, would love to see AM make a comeback . Unlikey though.

Ludeen wrote: Sat Jan 23, 2021 12:27 pm Oops meant LR, would love to see AM make a comeback . Unlikey though.

No, you were right. They are Luna Rossa Prada Pirelli team.

Prada also being the main event sponsor as the CoR.

Ludeen wrote: Sat Jan 23, 2021 12:27 pm Oops meant LR, would love to see AM make a comeback . Unlikey though.

AM were looking pretty fast before they stacked it. If they can get back in the water, don't count them out.

Dinsdale Piranha wrote: Sat Jan 23, 2021 3:03 pm

Ludeen wrote: Sat Jan 23, 2021 12:27 pm Oops meant LR, would love to see AM make a comeback . Unlikey though.

AM were looking pretty fast before they stacked it. If they can get back in the water, don't count them out.

They’ll be back. Guess it’s hard to focus on upgrades for them over and above re assembling it. Then again while opening her up you might as well put the new kit in and roll the dice.

Given the wind limits for racing (6.5 knots ?) is there any chance of any boat using the code 0
during a race , dont think there allowed sail changes ,and not practical with the speeds there
achieving.

No chance of a code 0 from what I heard the experts saying a few weeks back.

Something about the boatspeed generated even from minimal condition wind being too much for that setting

Woke up this morning. Couldn’t find the race day.

I hadn’t watched the previous post match video where Ben decided not to race on the only other race, because they don’t need to and it’s a bit windy. That’s pretty shit considering. Think the LR team said they’d probably be out.

Also noted yet another non conformant challenge to the Ineos boat. This could be race losing. Ben complaining that they weren’t performance enhancing, but as I understand it that’s why there are 2 strikes in such casss.

Ludeen wrote: Sun Jan 24, 2021 6:34 am Given the wind limits for racing (6.5 knots ?) is there any chance of any boat using the code 0
during a race , dont think there allowed sail changes ,and not practical with the speeds there
achieving.

Changing sails was one of the exciting parts of the old Americas Cup. Seeing the spinnaker race up the mast and then puff out to full plume was a thing of beauty.

Shit, I’m starting to sound like globus!

But you have a point there, I love these boats and the amazing speed. But definitely miss the crew work and sail changes .
Also hard to get my head around a boat doing 40knts in 8 to 10 knots of breeze .

Classy stuff from American Magic

This is great

Brilliant. Lucky bastards. PB having some fun with spectators it would seem.

Using them as a target.

About 4 hours til knockouts start ...