NPR

sockwithaticket wrote: Mon Jan 04, 2021 9:22 pm Your government has lots of tools at its disposal. You say tax pays for a huge portion of your doctors' training, well pass legislation that anyone who graduates having had that tax payer input into their education, has to serve 5 years in SA. Give them special tax breaks for staying put, that scale up the longer they provide service.

Chrysoprase wrote: Mon Jan 04, 2021 9:53 pm

sockwithaticket wrote: Mon Jan 04, 2021 9:22 pm Your government has lots of tools at its disposal. You say tax pays for a huge portion of your doctors' training, well pass legislation that anyone who graduates having had that tax payer input into their education, has to serve 5 years in SA. Give them special tax breaks for staying put, that scale up the longer they provide service.

What a good idea! It requires some level of joined up thinking though & if this thread is anything to go by that seems to be in short supply in SA.

FalseBayFC wrote: Mon Jan 04, 2021 9:11 pm

Ted. wrote: Mon Jan 04, 2021 8:54 pm

FalseBayFC wrote: Sun Jan 03, 2021 6:37 pm I am also most worried for my parents and in-laws who are all in their eighties. Not just the risk to their physical health but self-isolating is putting a big mental strain on them. The good news is that I am confident our private sector medicine will handle distribution of the vaccine to those who can afford it quite easily. We also have good experience in rural areas in dealing with TB and HIV so I think we are better positioned to roll out than people think. Only the Pfizer vacc has the extreme cold requirement and our President has said that we can't afford that anyway.

Ever so slightly hypocritical. But as you come out as a member of the privileged few, I'll let it pass.

Ted, I am very active in the underprivileged community which is huge over here. I pay huge money which I can hardly afford for my parents health insurance. My wife has just lost her job so it just got harder. We don't have a safety net like you guys. Can you see why I may be a little strung out about this. My medical aid costs are 30 percent of my salary.

FalseBayFC wrote: Mon Jan 04, 2021 9:29 pm

Ted. wrote: Mon Jan 04, 2021 8:54 pm

FalseBayFC wrote: Sun Jan 03, 2021 6:37 pm I am also most worried for my parents and in-laws who are all in their eighties. Not just the risk to their physical health but self-isolating is putting a big mental strain on them. The good news is that I am confident our private sector medicine will handle distribution of the vaccine to those who can afford it quite easily. We also have good experience in rural areas in dealing with TB and HIV so I think we are better positioned to roll out than people think. Only the Pfizer vacc has the extreme cold requirement and our President has said that we can't afford that anyway.

Ever so slightly hypocritical. But as you have come out as a member of the privileged few, I'll let it pass.

I was referring to a distribution network, not access to the actual vaccine. Access will not be prioritized for those who can pay for it. So no not hypocritical at all.

Ted. wrote: Mon Jan 04, 2021 10:11 pm

FalseBayFC wrote: Mon Jan 04, 2021 9:11 pm

Ted. wrote: Mon Jan 04, 2021 8:54 pm

Ever so slightly hypocritical. But as you come out as a member of the privileged few, I'll let it pass.

Ted, I am very active in the underprivileged community which is huge over here. I pay huge money which I can hardly afford for my parents health insurance. My wife has just lost her job so it just got harder. We don't have a safety net like you guys. Can you see why I may be a little strung out about this. My medical aid costs are 30 percent of my salary.

I was merely pointing out that there seemed to be some hypocrisy in who you are accusing of cornering the vaccines. That is to say, you have no issue if that occurs in your own country. Apart from poking fun, I made no comment at all about your personal circumstances .

FalseBayFC wrote: Mon Jan 04, 2021 6:34 pm

Openside wrote: Mon Jan 04, 2021 6:23 pm

FalseBayFC wrote: Mon Jan 04, 2021 6:21 pm

All our universities and training hospitals are built with and funded by tax money. About 70 percent of the cost of training a doctor is born by the state.

If you are paying 70% of medics fees etc. and not getting any return on service as a condition of said funding then it is an Omnishambles.

The doctors are doing a perfectly rational thing by seeking a better life. But for every doctor in the NHS who comes from a developing country there is a corresponding hole in the exporting country's health service. A massive loss of both intellectual and financial capital.
Of course I understand how the world works. But if developing countries keep rolling over they will continue to get fucked over.

Marylandolorian wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 6:18 pm Something is working

Friday, December 4, 2020, the World Health Organization (WHO) announced that 10 countries in the Caribbean and Latin America, including Haiti will receive the future vaccine against Covid-19 free of charge.

<snip> ...

Besides Haiti, the 9 other countries benefiting from a free distribution of the future vaccine against Covid-19 are: Bolivia, Dominica, El Salvador, Grenada, Guyana, Honduras, Nicaragua, Saint Lucia and Saint-Vincent and the Grenadines.

Saint wrote: Thu Jan 07, 2021 4:57 pm And it turns out that, after all of the wailing, South Africa actually have got off their arse and managed to place an order with SII. They've even managed to arrange for 1 million doses to be delivered in January.

I'm unsure why they haven't decided to put in an order for more than 1.5 million even if the delivery might be a ways off, but it would seem that the SA government are able to get there hands on vaccine as soon as they actually get the chequebook out

Chrysoprase wrote: Thu Jan 07, 2021 5:37 pm

Saint wrote: Thu Jan 07, 2021 4:57 pm And it turns out that, after all of the wailing, South Africa actually have got off their arse and managed to place an order with SII. They've even managed to arrange for 1 million doses to be delivered in January.

I'm unsure why they haven't decided to put in an order for more than 1.5 million even if the delivery might be a ways off, but it would seem that the SA government are able to get there hands on vaccine as soon as they actually get the chequebook out

But....but....but...hasn't the world's supply of vaccines already been bought up by those bastards in the UK, NZ and Aus???

Where did they find 1 million doses from? Surely no-one on this thread has been talking out their arse?

assfly wrote: Fri Jan 08, 2021 5:50 am Let's see how quick South Africa is to share their vaccines with it's poorer northern neighbours.

Tuberculosis has vaccine lessons for Covid

...

Without equitable access to Covid vaccines in the places that need them most, we run the risk of variants emerging that make the vaccines useless.

More infectious variants are already evolving in countries that aren’t using all the tools in the toolbox to stop the virus from spreading.

Yet even now, the pharmaceutical industry and many high-income countries are blocking efforts by India and South Africa to have intellectual property rights related to Covid-19 suspended, so they can begin to mass manufacture the vaccines or develop copy-cat versions.

TB taught us a valuable lesson. None of us are safe until we are all safe. We’d be fools to let this pandemic play out the same way.

Covid vaccine: WHO warns of 'catastrophic moral failure'

Shanky’s mate wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 5:04 am So after your tears and pity pleading you’re back to trolling.

FalseBayFC wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 5:19 am

Shanky’s mate wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 5:04 am So after your tears and pity pleading you’re back to trolling.

Nope just thought I'd share an article in today's Guardian about inequitable distribution of vaccines. Turns out I was right.

TheNatalShark wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 6:08 am

FalseBayFC wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 5:19 am

Shanky’s mate wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 5:04 am So after your tears and pity pleading you’re back to trolling.

Nope just thought I'd share an article in today's Guardian about inequitable distribution of vaccines. Turns out I was right.

That famously developed and wealthy country Chile.

Not that you're doing anything other than trolling, but in the event that you're not:

Question: with most vaccines having a shelf life, what do you think will happen to the vaccines order unused by developed countries? Which would have been created solely on basis they paid for additional production upfront.

FalseBayFC wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 6:57 am I see you've conveniently ignored the Canada and New Zealand cases. Do you think it's fair if the article is correct?

FalseBayFC wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 8:57 am See article above. @natalshark. One would hope they would share their bounty once they have vaccinated their own pop. Not sure what why they would need 10 doses per person. This may come a little late for us since Canada have hardly started and New Zealand too. In a fair world, which I understand this is not, they would be sent to those who need them the most.

FalseBayFC wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 10:06 am "Chile and New Zealand, which have also made controversial side deals to secure their own vaccine supplies, will also receive above-average numbers of doses, according to the interim allocation schedule released by Covax on Wednesday."


Given that the stated aim of Covax on their website is:" All participating countries, regardless of income levels, will have equal access to these vaccines once they are developed. "

Just wondering about how equal access actually is.

Raggs wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 10:09 am

FalseBayFC wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 10:06 am "Chile and New Zealand, which have also made controversial side deals to secure their own vaccine supplies, will also receive above-average numbers of doses, according to the interim allocation schedule released by Covax on Wednesday."


Given that the stated aim of Covax on their website is:" All participating countries, regardless of income levels, will have equal access to these vaccines once they are developed. "

Just wondering about how equal access actually is.

$345m for 2m AZ doses doesn't sound very equal for Canada to me, sounds like they've massively overpaid... or maybe they're not being arseholes at all.

FalseBayFC wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 10:22 am

Raggs wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 10:09 am

FalseBayFC wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 10:06 am "Chile and New Zealand, which have also made controversial side deals to secure their own vaccine supplies, will also receive above-average numbers of doses, according to the interim allocation schedule released by Covax on Wednesday."


Given that the stated aim of Covax on their website is:" All participating countries, regardless of income levels, will have equal access to these vaccines once they are developed. "

Just wondering about how equal access actually is.

$345m for 2m AZ doses doesn't sound very equal for Canada to me, sounds like they've massively overpaid... or maybe they're not being arseholes at all.

Covax is intended to give access equally. Canada has used its developed world financial advantage to sign bilateral supply agreements. Covax intention was to give less strong countries a foot up

Raggs wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 10:41 am

FalseBayFC wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 10:22 am

Raggs wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 10:09 am

$345m for 2m AZ doses doesn't sound very equal for Canada to me, sounds like they've massively overpaid... or maybe they're not being arseholes at all.

Covax is intended to give access equally. Canada has used its developed world financial advantage to sign bilateral supply agreements. Covax intention was to give less strong countries a foot up

Towards which Canada has donated $345m... and because they struggle to get early doses as well, they've taken up an option to get 2m doses from AZ when the first wave of doses becomes available. I'm sorry, but trying to paint them as the bad guys here is going to be a problem for me. Would you prefer that they simply not bother with COVAX at all? I'm sure there are many nations out there that have donated bugger all.

FalseBayFC wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 10:47 am

Raggs wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 10:41 am

FalseBayFC wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 10:22 am
Covax is intended to give access equally. Canada has used its developed world financial advantage to sign bilateral supply agreements. Covax intention was to give less strong countries a foot up

Towards which Canada has donated $345m... and because they struggle to get early doses as well, they've taken up an option to get 2m doses from AZ when the first wave of doses becomes available. I'm sorry, but trying to paint them as the bad guys here is going to be a problem for me. Would you prefer that they simply not bother with COVAX at all? I'm sure there are many nations out there that have donated bugger all.

SA donated $33m as a down payment, admittedly little compared to the richer countries. SA can pay for a vaccine but is towards the back of the queue with regards to access.

Raggs wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 11:00 am

FalseBayFC wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 10:47 am

Raggs wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 10:41 am

Towards which Canada has donated $345m... and because they struggle to get early doses as well, they've taken up an option to get 2m doses from AZ when the first wave of doses becomes available. I'm sorry, but trying to paint them as the bad guys here is going to be a problem for me. Would you prefer that they simply not bother with COVAX at all? I'm sure there are many nations out there that have donated bugger all.

SA donated $33m as a down payment, admittedly little compared to the richer countries. SA can pay for a vaccine but is towards the back of the queue with regards to access.

When did it make that donation? Was it after everyone else?

FalseBayFC wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 10:06 am "Chile and New Zealand, which have also made controversial side deals to secure their own vaccine supplies, will also receive above-average numbers of doses, according to the interim allocation schedule released by Covax on Wednesday."


Given that the stated aim of Covax on their website is:" All participating countries, regardless of income levels, will have equal access to these vaccines once they are developed. "

Just wondering about how equal access actually is.