The Official Scottish Rugby Thread

[Big D]

Townsend needs to release a Rassie style refereeing analysis.

The obvious non try and Itoje handstand turnover in his 22 I mean what are we even doing.

Oh dear!!! Please don't let the Scots go full Saffer
Ian Tempest says you and Townsend are wrong about the try!

Agreed. It was given. Move on.

[Lobby]

Frustrating game - Scotland superior in most aspects of the game and should have scored more tries/points, particularly in the first half. Attack with the ball was excellent but English scramble defence held firm. Agree we lack a little bit of bite in 2nd row particularly as we went with a lightweight and mobile back row. Apart from the scrum we looked fairly comfortable throughout. In all honesty I cant think of an English back I would choose ahead of one of our Scots - apart from Finn Smith's left boot?

England looked pretty uncomfortable and played an ultra conservative game which was good for us given our backs looked good below high balls and threatened on transitions a number of times. Mitchell's kicking was mediocre and Randells was just plain awful when he came on. Finn Smith is a decent 10 and worth persevering with but Marcus Smith is never a 15. Lawrence is a player I like and he was their most dangerous back, apart from him the rest were pretty mediocre.

Another day and a few tries slightly closer to the posts and we would have strolled that game!

I like Lawrence as well but, and I could be completely wrong, but it felt like he fell off a lot of tackles yesterday

You are confusing him with Slade who missed 5 from 12 attempts
Got to feel for Sleightholme who received precisiely 1 pass before being substituted, having to play to a plan that is completely alien to him compared to how Saints deply him!!!

According to the Guardian, Slade was the best performing back on the field and deserved a rating of 8/10 for, and I quote: "Some excellent covering tackles and as leader of the defence he has to take credit with the way England hung in there in the first half"



I only hope no one stole Gerard Meagher's white stick or kicked his dog on the way home.

[Big D]

Seen some odd takes about Kinghorn on SM. Needs dropped to allow a second kicker like Hastings to play

Never mind Hastings is injured but the best club side in the world were happy for Kinghorn to kick in big games the idea he isn't good enough is very odd.

[Big D]

You are confusing him with Slade who missed 5 from 12 attempts
Got to feel for Sleightholme who received precisiely 1 pass before being substituted, having to play to a plan that is completely alien to him compared to how Saints deply him!!!

Could well be. It’s quite surprising that’s Englands defence is still so awful

Because Slade leads it!!!!!

To be fair Lawrenxlce missed 3 apparently.

[Tichtheid]

Seen some odd takes about Kinghorn on SM. Needs dropped to allow a second kicker like Hastings to play

Never mind Hastings is injured but the best club side in the world were happy for Kinghorn to kick in big games the idea he isn't good enough is very odd.

It’s water off a duck’s back really, but as you say there are some weird takes out there, including the usual suspects at tol. Kinghorn isn’t good enough, too many Edinburgh players, Duhan should have scored closer to the posts - the wide angle on that shows three English defenders between him and the posts who are in the goal area, another two who are just on the field of play
What would the keyboard great players be saying if he got held up, tackled over the deadball line or lost possession?

Idiots.

[Slick]

Frustrating game - Scotland superior in most aspects of the game and should have scored more tries/points, particularly in the first half. Attack with the ball was excellent but English scramble defence held firm. Agree we lack a little bit of bite in 2nd row particularly as we went with a lightweight and mobile back row. Apart from the scrum we looked fairly comfortable throughout. In all honesty I cant think of an English back I would choose ahead of one of our Scots - apart from Finn Smith's left boot?

England looked pretty uncomfortable and played an ultra conservative game which was good for us given our backs looked good below high balls and threatened on transitions a number of times. Mitchell's kicking was mediocre and Randells was just plain awful when he came on. Finn Smith is a decent 10 and worth persevering with but Marcus Smith is never a 15. Lawrence is a player I like and he was their most dangerous back, apart from him the rest were pretty mediocre.

Another day and a few tries slightly closer to the posts and we would have strolled that game!

I like Lawrence as well but, and I could be completely wrong, but it felt like he fell off a lot of tackles yesterday

You are confusing him with Slade who missed 5 from 12 attempts
Got to feel for Sleightholme who received precisiely 1 pass before being substituted, having to play to a plan that is completely alien to him compared to how Saints deply him!!!

What were Smiths stats? Think he missed a tackle for all Scotlands tries

[SaintK]

I like Lawrence as well but, and I could be completely wrong, but it felt like he fell off a lot of tackles yesterday

You are confusing him with Slade who missed 5 from 12 attempts
Got to feel for Sleightholme who received precisiely 1 pass before being substituted, having to play to a plan that is completely alien to him compared to how Saints deply him!!!

What were Smiths stats? Think he missed a tackle for all Scotlands tries

Smith M? Not ssure, he certainly missed VdM at least once. Smith F made 16 according to some reports

[Big D]

You are confusing him with Slade who missed 5 from 12 attempts
Got to feel for Sleightholme who received precisiely 1 pass before being substituted, having to play to a plan that is completely alien to him compared to how Saints deply him!!!

What were Smiths stats? Think he missed a tackle for all Scotlands tries

Smith M? Not ssure, he certainly missed VdM at least once. Smith F made 16 according to some reports

Official stats have him at 16.

[Yr Alban]

Can anyone recall another Test where one team scored three tries to one and still lost?

I think SA won the try count 2-0 when we last beat them at MF. The first game that sprang to mind was the infamous QF when Australia won the count 5-3, but of course they didn’t lose, thanks to the ref.

[Lobby]

Can anyone recall another Test where one team scored three tries to one and still lost?

I think SA won the try count 2-0 when we last beat them at MF. The first game that sprang to mind was the infamous QF when Australia won the count 5-3, but of course they didn’t lose, thanks to the ref.

In the Lions' 2nd test against SA in 1997, SA scored 3 tries but failed to convert any of them. The Lions scored no tries, but Neil Jenkins kicked 5 penalties and Jerry Guscott dropped a goal to win the match for the Lions 18 - 15.

[inactionman]

BBC really are horrendous at rugby highlights, didn’t even show the England try for some reason

Are you talking about the 5 min highlights on iplayer? They showed the try.

Is this some weird whoosh I'm not getting?

No, the highlights on the news this morning !

It's no great loss, as tries go it wasn't the most elegant!

[inactionman]

Could well be. It’s quite surprising that’s Englands defence is still so awful

Because Slade leads it!!!!!

To be fair Lawrenxlce missed 3 apparently.

He missed one on Van Der Merve for (I think) the first try. Was grasping and a bit of an arms only tackle and didn't get a full wrap.

To be honest he was in a bit of no man's land as he trying to drift onto a winger - we just haven't got the midfield defence right, no speed and all the time in the world for attackers to pick lines and exploit space. Scotland made ground pretty much every time, and it's good scramble defence but it's not good so much scramble defence is necessary.

[Chilli2]

You know that might be a game that haunts some of our players. In just a few months Farrell will be putting his squad together and he’ll look at a lot of our guys and say, when the chips are down, I don’t think I can count on him. And to be honest, he’s probably right.

Nah. We don’t have any test level second rows and it cost us. Three tries to one but gave way too many penalties because we lacked grunt. Perfectly fine everywhere else.

Need to get on the phone to Durban and see who’s granny liked big pasty ginger lads.

Pretoria, Bloemfontein, Paarl yes.


Not Durban.

[Sandstorm]

Pretoria, Bloemfontein, Paarl yes.

You go looking in Paarl for 2nd rows with grunt, you get this:

[SaintK]

Should have practised his kicking last week instead of this. Pretty impressive mind!!!!!

[Slick]

I was relatively comfortable with the game on Saturday, obviously disappointed but at least it was an exiting performance and a good day out.

But I’m finding myself getting more pissed off now. I still haven’t seen the wide angle of Duhans try which I think Biffer suggested meant he couldn’t get any closer at the end, but he looks immediately as if he knows he fucked up and even apologises to Finn. Idiotic if true.

Also seen the footage of the ref moving Finn further out towards the touchline for the kick. I’m not necessarily moaning at the ref, but why didn’t one of our many captains not question this? We always seem to be so shit at managing refs

[Sandstorm]

I’m not necessarily moaning at the ref, but why didn’t one of our many captains not question this? We always seem to be so shit at managing refs

Mate, if anyone on the pitch thought it was a valid complaint, it would be Finn. He was gobbing off at the ref throughout the match. I thought it was Sexton on the pitch at one point.

[topofthemoon]

I’m not necessarily moaning at the ref, but why didn’t one of our many captains not question this? We always seem to be so shit at managing refs

Mate, if anyone on the pitch thought it was a valid complaint, it would be Finn. He was gobbing off at the ref throughout the match. I thought it was Sexton on the pitch at one point.

It was nothing like Sexton (or Biggar). He was chatting to the ref more than I've heard him in other games but that's probably because Brousset was so far out of his depth and making some absolute howlers of decisions.

[SaintK]

I’m not necessarily moaning at the ref, but why didn’t one of our many captains not question this? We always seem to be so shit at managing refs

Mate, if anyone on the pitch thought it was a valid complaint, it would be Finn. He was gobbing off at the ref throughout the match. I thought it was Sexton on the pitch at one point.

It was nothing like Sexton (or Biggar). He was chatting to the ref more than I've heard him in other games but that's probably because Brousset was so far out of his depth and making some absolute howlers of decisions.

Are you S African by any chance

[Jock42]

Still very disappointed by the result. Scotland not clinical enough but losing another match in the 6N due to a horrendous reffing decision has taken the gloss off the tournament for me. I really hope the SRU raise a grievance, can't have that standard of officiating at this level. At least there's a return to the league to give me a break from this shite *checks embras fixture* .....

[charltom]

Mate, if anyone on the pitch thought it was a valid complaint, it would be Finn. He was gobbing off at the ref throughout the match. I thought it was Sexton on the pitch at one point.

It was nothing like Sexton (or Biggar). He was chatting to the ref more than I've heard him in other games but that's probably because Brousset was so far out of his depth and making some absolute howlers of decisions.

Are you S African by any chance

Don't be daft. There are three such obvious howlers, each of which ended up gifting the match to the poorer team.

Finn didn't know that would be the case as he kindly helped guide him.

[SaintK]

It was nothing like Sexton (or Biggar). He was chatting to the ref more than I've heard him in other games but that's probably because Brousset was so far out of his depth and making some absolute howlers of decisions.

Are you S African by any chance

Don't be daft. There are three such obvious howlers, each of which ended up gifting the match to the poorer team.

Finn didn't know that would be the case as he kindly helped guide him.

Three now!!
Perhaps if Scotland had converted the number of opportunities they created particularly when they entered England's 22 more than 10 times in the first half and not given away 10 penalties on the trot in the second half and Russell had kicked just one the conversions they would have won by the margin they should have.
As it was the poorer team as you say did and it was the ref's fault

[I like neeps]

Are you S African by any chance

Don't be daft. There are three such obvious howlers, each of which ended up gifting the match to the poorer team.

Finn didn't know that would be the case as he kindly helped guide him.

Three now!!
Perhaps if Scotland had converted the number of opportunities they created particularly when they entered England's 22 more than 10 times in the first half and not given away 10 penalties on the trot in the second half and Russell had kicked just one the conversions they would have won by the margin they should have.
As it was the poorer team as you say did and it was the ref's fault

England didn't convert their chances either... Their try scorer said it wasnt a try and every single angle shows it wasn't a try.

Let's be honest. The referee was a abysmal and without consistently and obviously wrong decisions Scotland win that game.

Okay don't let the referee affect the outcome but test matches are close games. Don't need the referees consistently wrong decisions making them any closer.

Brousset should be stepped down until he can show he is a competent referee. His first six nations game and he showed he's not ready for the big time.

[SaintK]

Don't be daft. There are three such obvious howlers, each of which ended up gifting the match to the poorer team.

Finn didn't know that would be the case as he kindly helped guide him.

Three now!!
Perhaps if Scotland had converted the number of opportunities they created particularly when they entered England's 22 more than 10 times in the first half and not given away 10 penalties on the trot in the second half and Russell had kicked just one the conversions they would have won by the margin they should have.
As it was the poorer team as you say did and it was the ref's fault

England didn't convert their chances either... Their try scorer said it wasnt a try and every single angle shows it wasn't a try.

Let's be honest. The referee was a abysmal and without consistently and obviously wrong decisions Scotland win that game.

Okay don't let the referee affect the outcome but test matches are close games. Don't need the referees consistently wrong decisions making them any closer.

Brousset should be stepped down until he can show he is a competent referee. His first six nations game and he showed he's not ready for the big time.

Not going to argue with you on the Scotland thread.
I'll let you get on with blamimg the ref

[topofthemoon]

Mate, if anyone on the pitch thought it was a valid complaint, it would be Finn. He was gobbing off at the ref throughout the match. I thought it was Sexton on the pitch at one point.

It was nothing like Sexton (or Biggar). He was chatting to the ref more than I've heard him in other games but that's probably because Brousset was so far out of his depth and making some absolute howlers of decisions.

Are you S African by any chance

You take that back!

Scotland lost that game in multiple ways. By not taking their try scoring chances; not kicking points available; and poor discipline - particularly between half-time and the 70th minute.

I don't think that should preclude discussing the performance of the ref. In every game I have seen him in there have been points where he has seemed overwhelmed. Unsurprisingly that came much more frequently in a match played at this intensity.

He should not have been put in that position by World Rugby this early in his Test career - and nor should his TMO who was equally poor.

Both should be given opportunities to build themselves up to this level but they shouldn't be getting appointments like this again until they are 100% ready for it.

[Chilli2]

Pretoria, Bloemfontein, Paarl yes.

You go looking in Paarl for 2nd rows with grunt, you get this:

They can fukken have him.

[SaintK]

It was nothing like Sexton (or Biggar). He was chatting to the ref more than I've heard him in other games but that's probably because Brousset was so far out of his depth and making some absolute howlers of decisions.

Are you S African by any chance

You take that back!

Scotland lost that game in multiple ways. By not taking their try scoring chances; not kicking points available; and poor discipline - particularly between half-time and the 70th minute.

I don't think that should preclude discussing the performance of the ref. In every game I have seen him in there have been points where he has seemed overwhelmed. Unsurprisingly that came much more frequently in a match played at this intensity.

He should not have been put in that position by World Rugby this early in his Test career - and nor should his TMO who was equally poor.

Both should be given opportunities to build themselves up to this level but they shouldn't be getting appointments like this again until they are 100% ready for it.

Yes, bit harsh calling you a Saffer in hindsight!
World Rugby obviously think he's ready based on their studying of his matches and feedback from the teams he refs. Scotland and England will obviously be both providing feedback from Saturday.
AS for the TMO. Ian Tempest is a very experienced referee having previously reffed at the highest level in European comps and internationals since 2015. He stood down fromk reffing for a while to become a TMO after receiving some pretty horrible abuse.

[topofthemoon]

Are you S African by any chance

You take that back!

Scotland lost that game in multiple ways. By not taking their try scoring chances; not kicking points available; and poor discipline - particularly between half-time and the 70th minute.

I don't think that should preclude discussing the performance of the ref. In every game I have seen him in there have been points where he has seemed overwhelmed. Unsurprisingly that came much more frequently in a match played at this intensity.

He should not have been put in that position by World Rugby this early in his Test career - and nor should his TMO who was equally poor.

Both should be given opportunities to build themselves up to this level but they shouldn't be getting appointments like this again until they are 100% ready for it.

Yes, bit harsh calling you a Saffer in hindsight!
World Rugby obviously think he's ready based on their studying of his matches and feedback from the teams he refs. Scotland and England will obviously be both providing feedback from Saturday.
AS for the TMO. Ian Tempest is a very experienced referee having previously reffed at the highest level in European comps and internationals since 2015. He stood down fromk reffing for a while to become a TMO after receiving some pretty horrible abuse.

There is a definite push to bring on a new generation of refs, including sidelining more experienced officials to get the new blood time in the middle. In Scotland's last 11 Tests they have have a ref who is new to them on 9 occasions.

There is particular pressure to find a French official to replace some veterans who have retired in recent years.

I don't think any ref should be getting their first Six Nations outing in a game like that, with only - as far as I can see - either three or four other all Tier 1 Tests behind them.

Tempest I wouldn't have minded, he's very experienced. The TMO on Saturday was Tual Trainini who is nowhere near as experienced and it showed.

[SaintK]

You take that back!

Scotland lost that game in multiple ways. By not taking their try scoring chances; not kicking points available; and poor discipline - particularly between half-time and the 70th minute.

I don't think that should preclude discussing the performance of the ref. In every game I have seen him in there have been points where he has seemed overwhelmed. Unsurprisingly that came much more frequently in a match played at this intensity.

He should not have been put in that position by World Rugby this early in his Test career - and nor should his TMO who was equally poor.

Both should be given opportunities to build themselves up to this level but they shouldn't be getting appointments like this again until they are 100% ready for it.

Yes, bit harsh calling you a Saffer in hindsight!
World Rugby obviously think he's ready based on their studying of his matches and feedback from the teams he refs. Scotland and England will obviously be both providing feedback from Saturday.
AS for the TMO. Ian Tempest is a very experienced referee having previously reffed at the highest level in European comps and internationals since 2015. He stood down fromk reffing for a while to become a TMO after receiving some pretty horrible abuse.

There is a definite push to bring on a new generation of refs, including sidelining more experienced officials to get the new blood time in the middle. In Scotland's last 11 Tests they have have a ref who is new to them on 9 occasions.

There is particular pressure to find a French official to replace some veterans who have retired in recent years.

I don't think any ref should be getting their first Six Nations outing in a game like that, with only - as far as I can see - either three or four other all Tier 1 Tests behind them.

Tempest I wouldn't have minded, he's very experienced. The TMO on Saturday was Tual Trainini who is nowhere near as experienced and it showed.

Fair call
Apologies about Tempest I was getting my matches confused he was of course Wales v Ireland TMO

[Tichtheid]

Edinburgh Rugby will face Gallagher Premiership giants Saracens in a mid-season friendly match at Hive Stadium next month (Friday 14 March, 7.35pm).

The match has been scheduled to create more competitive action for the senior side in preparation for the vital end-of-season run-in to the BKT URC and EPCR Challenge Cup – including Edinburgh’s knockout Round of 16 encounter with Emirates Lions in April.

https://edinburghrugby.org/news-and-fea ... -friendly/

[Biffer]

Edinburgh Rugby will face Gallagher Premiership giants Saracens in a mid-season friendly match at Hive Stadium next month (Friday 14 March, 7.35pm).

The match has been scheduled to create more competitive action for the senior side in preparation for the vital end-of-season run-in to the BKT URC and EPCR Challenge Cup – including Edinburgh’s knockout Round of 16 encounter with Emirates Lions in April.

https://edinburghrugby.org/news-and-fea ... -friendly/

Pretty sure this'll be an A team fixture in all but name, but that's a good thing, need playing time for the young lads in particular.

[I like neeps]

https://x.com/jfordrob/status/1894338515669762169

Very funny to be fair. Dearie me what a joke Brousset is.

[charltom]

Are you S African by any chance

Don't be daft. There are three such obvious howlers, each of which ended up gifting the match to the poorer team.

Finn didn't know that would be the case as he kindly helped guide him.

Three now!!

Apologies, you are right. There were four particularly heinous ones.

[Yr Alban]

Just seen a PR post on my FB feed (didn’t click on it) where part of the tagline says that ‘Scotland stars loosen their grip on Lions shirts’.

Hold on a sec. So Scotland went to Twickenham looking for a third win there on the trot, and a fifth straight win v England. They were agreed to be the better team, scored three tries to one, and lost by a point because Russell missed all of his conversions (including one the ref insisted he take from the wrong place). But sure, whatever you say.

[Slick]

Just seen a PR post on my FB feed (didn’t click on it) where part of the tagline says that ‘Scotland stars loosen their grip on Lions shirts’.

Hold on a sec. So Scotland went to Twickenham looking for a third win there on the trot, and a fifth straight win v England. They were agreed to be the better team, scored three tries to one, and lost by a point because Russell missed all of his conversions (including one the ref insisted he take from the wrong place). But sure, whatever you say.

I saw their round up of media takes on this and they had Finn as a huge loser in the Lions race with scores of 4/10, 5/10.

Finn missed his kicks, but I thought apart from that it was a masterclass from him and certainly made Smith to look like the new boy he is.

It's embarrassing that any rugby correspondent can watch that game and think Finn was a 4/5 of of 10.

[Tichtheid]

Just seen a PR post on my FB feed (didn’t click on it) where part of the tagline says that ‘Scotland stars loosen their grip on Lions shirts’.

Hold on a sec. So Scotland went to Twickenham looking for a third win there on the trot, and a fifth straight win v England. They were agreed to be the better team, scored three tries to one, and lost by a point because Russell missed all of his conversions (including one the ref insisted he take from the wrong place). But sure, whatever you say.

I saw their round up of media takes on this and they had Finn as a huge loser in the Lions race with scores of 4/10, 5/10.

Finn missed his kicks, but I thought apart from that it was a masterclass from him and certainly made Smith to look like the new boy he is.

Russell's width and pace of passing was why we were able to get around the outside of England so easily.

TOTM put up a stat on the Glasgow bored, "Despite Scotland having 45 rucks, three lineouts, two mauls and one scrum in the English red zone, the hosts did not concede a single penalty inside their own 22."

That lack of execution was a big part of why we didn't win - we need bigger and more dynamic players in the pack to force the opposition into making defensive errors and cough up penalties or for us to execute the pick and go.

Mind you, with Curry and Itoje making inexplicable turnovers with hands on the ground and feet in the air, fuck knows how it would have panned out even if we did have the heavy timber.

[Slick]

Just seen a PR post on my FB feed (didn’t click on it) where part of the tagline says that ‘Scotland stars loosen their grip on Lions shirts’.

Hold on a sec. So Scotland went to Twickenham looking for a third win there on the trot, and a fifth straight win v England. They were agreed to be the better team, scored three tries to one, and lost by a point because Russell missed all of his conversions (including one the ref insisted he take from the wrong place). But sure, whatever you say.

I saw their round up of media takes on this and they had Finn as a huge loser in the Lions race with scores of 4/10, 5/10.

Finn missed his kicks, but I thought apart from that it was a masterclass from him and certainly made Smith to look like the new boy he is.

Russell's width and pace of passing was why we were able to get around the outside of England so easily.

Exactly this, I watched him most of the game and they just couldn't handle his range of passing and he was actually much more involved than normal.

[Tichtheid]

Coming back to domestic action this weekend, I've reached the point, as I did last year, where I can't bring myself to watch Edinburgh and only watch a re-run if the score looks enticing. I only have ten fingers and that's not enough to block out the horror that is Edinburgh Rugby at the moment.

Away to Munster has seldom been anything other than a right doing and I can't see that change on Friday. I'm away all day Saturday to support my local club, so I would have preferred the entertainment of watching Glasgow on a Friday night

[C T]

I saw their round up of media takes on this and they had Finn as a huge loser in the Lions race with scores of 4/10, 5/10.

Finn missed his kicks, but I thought apart from that it was a masterclass from him and certainly made Smith to look like the new boy he is.

Russell's width and pace of passing was why we were able to get around the outside of England so easily.

Exactly this, I watched him most of the game and they just couldn't handle his range of passing and he was actually much more involved than normal.

In the last couple of minutes after IrnDhu's try, Finn was looking so comfortable I thought for sure we were going to get another try and win.

We got held up and bundled into touch of course, but there you go.

He was, by far, the better flyhalf on the pitch. Just not off the tee.

Some outlets just have an agenda here. It's between Finn and Prendergast. I can see a case for either.

Farrell has an opportunity to give Prendergast a boost, a player who will be crucial to Ireland for years to come. First test Prendergast to start with Finn on the bench I reckon.

[SaintK]

Russell's width and pace of passing was why we were able to get around the outside of England so easily.

Exactly this, I watched him most of the game and they just couldn't handle his range of passing and he was actually much more involved than normal.

In the last couple of minutes after IrnDhu's try, Finn was looking so comfortable I thought for sure we were going to get another try and win.

We got held up and bundled into touch of course, but there you go.

He was, by far, the better flyhalf on the pitch. Just not off the tee.

Some outlets just have an agenda here. It's between Finn and Prendergast. I can see a case for either.

Farrell has an opportunity to give Prendergast a boost, a player who will be crucial to Ireland for years to come. First test Prendergast to start with Finn on the bench I reckon.

Thankyou Mystic Meg. You got the lottery numbers for next week?