Calcutta Cup match thread

[Happyhooker]

England planning some dirty trickery for the weekend:

https://www.world.rugby/the-game/laws/c ... on/2022/2/

To be fair, I am confused by this and have seen players being penalised when I think the ball was plainly out. I also do not understand how a player on the ground having his hand on the ball can be deemed in the ruck.

I always used to check this when I played as the ref's interpretation could vary so massively. My favourite assessment as to when the ball was out was "if a bird can shit on it".

Fair, but that really fucks up the women's game

[Kawazaki]

They're saying there is no change to when the ball is out and can be played (by a player coming from an onside position) but they have clarified that Itoje can't flop onto it until it's 1m away from the ruck.

Where did they mention Itoje, must have missed that?

To troll effectively you need to leverage something that's actually true

Fair play.

However, if a 2m lock is beating wee Hamish to a loose ball on the ground then Scotland have bigger problems than referee interpretations to worry about.

[Biffer]

Where did they mention Itoje, must have missed that?

To troll effectively you need to leverage something that's actually true

Fair play.

However, if a 2m lock is beating wee Hamish to a loose ball on the ground then Scotland have bigger problems than referee interpretations to worry about.

If England are relying on their locks to attack loose ball near the breakdown, I'd be asking questions of where their back row are.

[Kawazaki]

Fair play.

However, if a 2m lock is beating wee Hamish to a loose ball on the ground then Scotland have bigger problems than referee interpretations to worry about.

If England are relying on their locks to attack loose ball near the breakdown, I'd be asking questions of where their back row are.

If a 2m lock is good enough to do the job then just admire the lock and tip your hat.

[Mahoney]

Do it the old fashioned way and drive through the middle. That's still allowed, isn't it?

Then you get done for playing the scrum-half.

(I've never got that - if it's still a ruck and you've legally driven through the middle of it, why do you tamely have to let the little scrote have the ball instead of rucking over it to win it? And if the ruck's finished, and he's got the ball, and you're onside because you were always legal in the ruck, why can't you tackle the little shit?)

[clydecloggie]

Do it the old fashioned way and drive through the middle. That's still allowed, isn't it?

Then you get done for playing the scrum-half.

(I've never got that - if it's still a ruck and you've legally driven through the middle of it, why do you tamely have to let the little scrote have the ball instead of rucking over it to win it? And if the ruck's finished, and he's got the ball, and you're onside because you were always legal in the ruck, why can't you tackle the little shit?)

It should be legal to punch scrum halves, for no other reason than on general principles.

However, I will grudgingly admit that it does help rugby as something you like to watch if the ball is allowed to be passed from a ruck.

So perhaps knocking them out cold should only be allowed in the last quarter?

[Slick]

Do it the old fashioned way and drive through the middle. That's still allowed, isn't it?

Then you get done for playing the scrum-half.

(I've never got that - if it's still a ruck and you've legally driven through the middle of it, why do you tamely have to let the little scrote have the ball instead of rucking over it to win it? And if the ruck's finished, and he's got the ball, and you're onside because you were always legal in the ruck, why can't you tackle the little shit?)

If he hasn't picked it up yet and you come through the middle are you not allowed to play on? I thought you were.

[Mahoney]

The bit I think is odd about head to heads is that there are plenty of positions on the pitch where you mostly aren't in direct competition with your opposite number.

Tight head faces off with loose head at the scrum
Hooker is up against the opposition jumpers at the lineout, not the other hooker
Scrum-half is up against guards at the ruck / flankers at the scrum
Fly-half is rarely tackled by the opposition 10, though they occasionally exchange kick tennis when they are both dropping back to cover

Half the game is about engineering mismatches so 8 is running over 10, or 13 running past 3.

I guess it can serve as a sort of proxy measure for the quality gap between the teams as a whole, but it's pretty arbitrary. You'd be better off awarding each player points out of 5 or something & then totalling the points to compare the two sides.

Good luck telling a hooker after a game that he wasn't playing against the opposition hooker

He might get it if I use fewer syllables.

[Mahoney]

And that's probably enough lazy cliches masquerading ineffectually as wit for one day.

[Mahoney]

Do it the old fashioned way and drive through the middle. That's still allowed, isn't it?

Then you get done for playing the scrum-half.

(I've never got that - if it's still a ruck and you've legally driven through the middle of it, why do you tamely have to let the little scrote have the ball instead of rucking over it to win it? And if the ruck's finished, and he's got the ball, and you're onside because you were always legal in the ruck, why can't you tackle the little shit?)

If he hasn't picked it up yet and you come through the middle are you not allowed to play on? I thought you were.

It's just an impression really, but it seems to me as if the half only has to look like they're trying to pick it up for rucking players to be penalised for touching them. Perhaps I'm wrong; or perhaps refs aren't entirely consistent about it.

[Happyhooker]

And that's probably enough lazy cliches masquerading ineffectually as wit for one day.

Especially as crash made the same gag 12 hours ago

[Lobby]

Do it the old fashioned way and drive through the middle. That's still allowed, isn't it?

Then you get done for playing the scrum-half.

(I've never got that - if it's still a ruck and you've legally driven through the middle of it, why do you tamely have to let the little scrote have the ball instead of rucking over it to win it? And if the ruck's finished, and he's got the ball, and you're onside because you were always legal in the ruck, why can't you tackle the little shit?)

It should be legal to punch scrum halves, for no other reason than on general principles.

However, I will grudgingly admit that it does help rugby as something you like to watch if the ball is allowed to be passed from a ruck.

So perhaps knocking them out cold should only be allowed in the last quarter?

I always thought Troncon's red card for smacking Peter Stringer in the chops was dreadfully unfair. He should have got a medal.

[Kawazaki]

So perhaps knocking them out cold should only be allowed in the last quarter?

Or just after they've passed it like in the old days.

[Mahoney]

And that's probably enough lazy cliches masquerading ineffectually as wit for one day.

Especially as crash made the same gag 12 hours ago

Bollocks, so he did.

[Crash669]

And that's probably enough lazy cliches masquerading ineffectually as wit for one day.

Especially as crash made the same gag 12 hours ago

Bollocks, so he did.

Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.

You cunt...

[Slick]

Then you get done for playing the scrum-half.

(I've never got that - if it's still a ruck and you've legally driven through the middle of it, why do you tamely have to let the little scrote have the ball instead of rucking over it to win it? And if the ruck's finished, and he's got the ball, and you're onside because you were always legal in the ruck, why can't you tackle the little shit?)

If he hasn't picked it up yet and you come through the middle are you not allowed to play on? I thought you were.

It's just an impression really, but it seems to me as if the half only has to look like they're trying to pick it up for rucking players to be penalised for touching them. Perhaps I'm wrong; or perhaps refs aren't entirely consistent about it.

I’ve no idea either. What a sport

[Mahoney]

Blog on the subject here:
http://newrugbyref.me/blog-posts/playin ... he%20other.

TLDR - Slick's right. There's no specific law that protects the 9, it's just the normal one about not being allowed to tackle someone off the ball, plus someone near the ruck but not in it cannot be pulled into it by the opposition.

The scrum-half specific interpretation is that they aren't in possession when they have hands on the ball. I think this is where I get a bit outraged - so they are not in possession, but they aren't in the ruck either, but it's basically impossible to get at the ball without touching them.

I reckon if you manage to make contact with them from a legal position when they have hands on the ball you should be able to treat them as being in the ruck - you are now in contact with them, both on your feet, over the ball.

[Margin__Walker]

It's always been an annoyance for me as well. You often see situations where the 9 is actually leant in trying to protect the ball (i.e part of the ruck), but the defending team aren't able to drive through and get him out of the way as they 'played the 9'

[Happyhooker]

I'd go further. You should be able to fuck over the scrum half at any point in the game, wherever you are on the pitch.

*including your own

[duke]

I'd go further. You should be able to fuck over the scrum half at any point in the game, wherever you are on the pitch.

*including your own

Particularly your own

[Un Pilier]

I'd go further. You should be able to fuck over the scrum half at any point in the game, wherever you are on the pitch.

*including your own

Particularly your own

I was going to suggest that a point or two might be awarded but ending your own side’s scrum half might complicate that.

[Biffer]

I'd go further. You should be able to fuck over the scrum half at any point in the game, wherever you are on the pitch.

*including your own

Taking your studs off before and wearing them like a boxing glove should also be permitted.

[HKCJ]

I'd go further. You should be able to fuck over the scrum half at any point in the game, wherever you are on the pitch.

*including your own

Careful.. with your physique you might be putting yourself in for a shoeing with that kind of talk.

[Happyhooker]

I'd go further. You should be able to fuck over the scrum half at any point in the game, wherever you are on the pitch.

*including your own

Careful.. with your physique you might be putting yourself in for a shoeing with that kind of talk.

Oi.

I'm not sure if you'd remember him, think he's slightly younger than you, but a lad called john brown was often my scrum half for OO's.

And I rest my case

[OomStruisbaai]

Come on Skotte!

[Slick]

Really not a nice day in Edinburgh. Cold, wet and windy and due to go on all afternoon.

A decent number of Englanders up and a good atmosphere in parts of town last night.

Off for lunch soon then get to the stadium early..

God I love and have missed this!

[Lobby]

That famous Scottish optimism in evidence outside Murrayfield yesterday

[Punter15]

Really not a nice day in Edinburgh. Cold, wet and windy and due to go on all afternoon.

A decent number of Englanders up and a good atmosphere in parts of town last night.

Off for lunch soon then get to the stadium early..

God I love and have missed this!

Have a blinder. Stovies at Teuchters then a wander up?

[Slick]

Really not a nice day in Edinburgh. Cold, wet and windy and due to go on all afternoon.

A decent number of Englanders up and a good atmosphere in parts of town last night.

Off for lunch soon then get to the stadium early..

God I love and have missed this!

Have a blinder. Stovies at Teuchters then a wander up?

Fuck off. Seafood platter then a private hire to the door.

(Reality is somewhere in between, but always with the wander up!)

[Crash669]

Really not a nice day in Edinburgh. Cold, wet and windy and due to go on all afternoon.

A decent number of Englanders up and a good atmosphere in parts of town last night.

Off for lunch soon then get to the stadium early..

God I love and have missed this!

The weather is really making me glad I turned down that ticket. I still have flashbacks to the 2020 game, they help me get to sleep.

[Tichtheid]

Really not a nice day in Edinburgh. Cold, wet and windy and due to go on all afternoon.

A decent number of Englanders up and a good atmosphere in parts of town last night.

Off for lunch soon then get to the stadium early..

God I love and have missed this!

The weather is really making me glad I turned down that ticket. I still have flashbacks to the 2020 game, they help me get to sleep.

I had to look up the year as I never remember these things, but 2008 was grim, very cold very wet very windy, five penalties to three

Watching Olympic curling seems like a good option sometimes

[Crash669]

Really not a nice day in Edinburgh. Cold, wet and windy and due to go on all afternoon.

A decent number of Englanders up and a good atmosphere in parts of town last night.

Off for lunch soon then get to the stadium early..

God I love and have missed this!

The weather is really making me glad I turned down that ticket. I still have flashbacks to the 2020 game, they help me get to sleep.

I had to look up the year as I never remember these things, but 2008 was grim, very cold very wet very windy, five penalties to three

Watching Olympic curling seems like a good option sometimes

I remember watching that in the TV room at uni. I felt cold just watching it.

[Big D]

The weather is really making me glad I turned down that ticket. I still have flashbacks to the 2020 game, they help me get to sleep.

I had to look up the year as I never remember these things, but 2008 was grim, very cold very wet very windy, five penalties to three

Watching Olympic curling seems like a good option sometimes

I remember watching that in the TV room at uni. I felt cold just watching it.

That was the Jason White on Paul Sackey game. Was on my stag in Newcastle. Ah, 23 without a care in the world, where does the time go.

[Big D]

I worry the deciding factor will be the advantages England have in Dombrandt, Ford and Nowell over the Scotish alternative. Bradbury has been better this year but Dombrandt is better.

I'm leaning towards England by 5 or 6. May just be pre match pessimism though.

[Tichtheid]

I worry the deciding factor will be the advantages England have in Dombrandt, Ford and Nowell over the Scotish alternative. Bradbury has been better this year but Dombrandt is better.

I'm leaning towards England by 5 or 6. May just be pre match pessimism though.

The weather forecast is gusty winds and heavy rain, I think that will be a deciding factor. It favours a good lineout and scrum, I think England will have the edge there

However, I still can’t bring myself to think that it’s going to be anything but a Scottish win

[Crash669]

I worry the deciding factor will be the advantages England have in Dombrandt, Ford and Nowell over the Scotish alternative. Bradbury has been better this year but Dombrandt is better.

I'm leaning towards England by 5 or 6. May just be pre match pessimism though.

The weather forecast is gusty winds and heavy rain, I think that will be a deciding factor. It favours a good lineout and scrum, I think England will have the edge there

However, I still can’t bring myself to think that it’s going to be anything but a Scottish win

It's a hard one to call. If England put it together and play some rugby they could put on a score, but Eddie Jones. If Scotland play to the sum of their parts they could take England to pieces, but Scotland.

I think it'll be a low scoring Scotland win but this is why I don't gamble.

[ScarfaceClaw]

As much as it pains me, I can’t see anything other than an ugly ground out uninspiring English win.

Wanders off singing Flower of Scotland in hope.

[JM2K6]

As much as it pains me, I can’t see anything other than an ugly ground out uninspiring English win.

Wanders off singing Flower of Scotland in hope.

We've not picked a team for that.

[Blackmac]

Really not a nice day in Edinburgh. Cold, wet and windy and due to go on all afternoon.

A decent number of Englanders up and a good atmosphere in parts of town last night.

Off for lunch soon then get to the stadium early..

God I love and have missed this!

TBF the English travelling support are always good lads.

[GogLais]

Genge coming over well.