NPR

I didn't watch the Bok game... that you tube clip is damning. WR need to sort the inconsistency issue in refereeing out urgently... you can't have a ref ignore a hit like that. It has to be reviewed at the very least. I'm gobsmacked it wasn't.

Ymx wrote: ↑Sat Jul 29, 2023 8:37 pm Oh Jesus. Are we about to see a ref with death threats again?

No man, I explicitly asked for a mature discussion about that incident above. You capable of that? Have a look at the video and feel free to join in.

Guy Smiley wrote: ↑Sat Jul 29, 2023 8:58 pm I didn't watch the Bok game... that you tube clip is damning. WR need to sort the inconsistency issue in refereeing out urgently... you can't have a ref ignore a hit like that. It has to be reviewed at the very least. I'm gobsmacked it wasn't.

Spot on!

I guess the mitigation is he got the ball first... unlike Stander. But was surprised it wasn't at least yellow carded and left for the TMO to adjudicate.

As for the Boks in general. Are South African fans disappointed in the style of the Boks? I thought they had turned a corner last autumn on the EOYT... with a more expansive style. Has that been abandoned now and gonna rely on the old style they know so well?

Brace was.... let's say indifferent, to be polite. He could do with some education or training. Is he on the roster for the RWC?

I was really impressed with NZ today. I thought the best performance under Foster. A real 80 minute effort. Loved the first half absorbing pressure. Playing the blindside, really controlled possession and territory. I didn't think we were capable of playing a game like that. Plus I thought Australia in the first half especially were the toughest opponent we have faced since Ireland. So very satisfying to blunt their attack... and then we were quite ruthless second half.

I thought Richie Mounga, Scott and Jordie Barrett were outstanding... and if Razor trusts Scott Barrett as captain, then so do I. Would prefer him to Ardie Savea. Plus I hope Cane stays injured so we can have the energiser bunny continuing at seven. He topped the tackle count today and was everywhere. He's like having two Canes on the pitch. Plus he goes for 80 minutes... I also enjoyed Roigard's little cameo.

Grandpa wrote: ↑Sat Jul 29, 2023 9:43 pm I guess the mitigation is he got the ball first... unlike Stander. But was surprised it wasn't at least yellow carded and left for the TMO to adjudicate.

As for the Boks in general. Are South African fans disappointed in the style of the Boks? I thought they had turned a corner last autumn on the EOYT... with a more expansive style. Has that been abandoned now and gonna rely on the old style they know so well?

Faf dragged us back to 2019. The other 9s in the squad don’t Boxkick everything 24/7. They try to use the backs as more than kick chasers.

Guy Smiley wrote: ↑Sat Jul 29, 2023 9:47 pm He could do with some education or training.

He's on the Bok fan radar now, if he keeps this up he'll end up getting some education alright.

Guy Smiley wrote: ↑Sat Jul 29, 2023 9:47 pm Brace was.... let's say indifferent, to be polite. He could do with some education or training. Is he on the roster for the RWC?

Fuck me, that's a shocker. And not even a yellow?? GTFO

Grandpa wrote: ↑Sat Jul 29, 2023 9:43 pm I guess the mitigation is he got the ball first... unlike Stander. But was surprised it wasn't at least yellow carded and left for the TMO to adjudicate.

As for the Boks in general. Are South African fans disappointed in the style of the Boks? I thought they had turned a corner last autumn on the EOYT... with a more expansive style. Has that been abandoned now and gonna rely on the old style they know so well?

I don't think Argentina is getting enough credit. They were very good in the beginning. Great defensive lines and speed. They seem to well coached. Manie had no time to think being so flat. The kicking from hand by both sides waa good. Very contestable. Even Faf. Argentina were stronger under the high kick. That hasn't been a strength for us in a few games already. Last week against the ABs was dreadful. The little chip kicks from Manie and Willie were a positive. Also, Manie and Willies line kicking and clearing was great. That's the only real positive in this match for me. Flyhalf and fullback are a major issue for us. We have a player Willemse who the coaches want to play in these 2 positions and it leads to a lot of media criticism of Manie and Willie. Manie for me really didn't get to show his attacking flair after Williams went off. I think these 2 will really click.
Faf I feel had a very big game. He gets criticism for being slow but you need to watch a replay to understand that it's more a perception than a fact...just blame Faf for being slow. It will stick...his up and unders were very contestable. His tackling like a demon. Most of his passes went to the forwards. I think they decided that this is where they wanted to attack Argentina. Let's be honest. You put De Allende at 12 you are not planning on playing running rugby. Our defense across the park was impressive. We made a lot of tackles. Missing only 22. So Argentina did most of the work on attack.
Our wings......ja. ....2 small wings.......doesn't work.
Either Mapimpi or Canaan must play. Who do you drop. Kolbe for me. Arendse is a very exciting player who deserves an extended go.

Look. We can blame individuals all day buy we need to take a good look at the process Rassnabber have taken us through till this point. They really have not given emerging players a chance. So we know exactly which players will be playing in the RWC. And there will be very few changes from the last RWC. So its the same game plan and same components. Other nations have evolved. Can't see us going too far in the RWC. We seem to overrate our worth more than most

Sandstorm wrote: ↑Sat Jul 29, 2023 9:54 pm

Grandpa wrote: ↑Sat Jul 29, 2023 9:43 pm I guess the mitigation is he got the ball first... unlike Stander. But was surprised it wasn't at least yellow carded and left for the TMO to adjudicate.

As for the Boks in general. Are South African fans disappointed in the style of the Boks? I thought they had turned a corner last autumn on the EOYT... with a more expansive style. Has that been abandoned now and gonna rely on the old style they know so well?

Faf dragged us back to 2019. The other 9s in the squad don’t Boxkick everything 24/7. They try to use the backs as more than kick chasers.

Go watch a replay. You are just mouthing popular stereotypes.

Grandpa wrote: ↑Sat Jul 29, 2023 9:49 pm I was really impressed with NZ today. I thought the best performance under Foster. A real 80 minute effort. Loved the first half absorbing pressure. Playing the blindside, really controlled possession and territory. I didn't think we were capable of playing a game like that. Plus I thought Australia in the first half especially were the toughest opponent we have faced since Ireland. So very satisfying to blunt their attack... and then we were quite ruthless second half.

I thought Richie Mounga, Scott and Jordie Barrett were outstanding... and if Razor trusts Scott Barrett as captain, then so do I. Would prefer him to Ardie Savea. Plus I hope Cane stays injured so we can have the energiser bunny continuing at seven. He topped the tackle count today and was everywhere. He's like having two Canes on the pitch. Plus he goes for 80 minutes... I also enjoyed Roigard's little cameo.

We saw game a bit different Grandpa, thought we missed Cane a fair bit last night. We were getting bullied at times in ruck, and think he's better defensively in and around breakdown. But we all see things differently I guess.
But definetly agree about RMo, and 2 Barretts, as well as Telea I thought was great. Interesting to see we have had 3 teats and a different winger looing a star in each test!

Dan54 wrote: ↑Sun Jul 30, 2023 4:19 amWe saw game a bit different Grandpa, thought we missed Cane a fair bit last night. We were getting bullied at times in ruck, and think he's better defensively in and around breakdown. But we all see things differently I guess.
But definetly agree about RMo, and 2 Barretts, as well as Telea I thought was great. Interesting to see we have had 3 teats and a different winger looing a star in each test!

Not sure Clarke's looked a star at any stage, tbh. In fact, with Jordan, Telea and Narawa in such good form, and Leicester yet to make an appearance, Caleb's well and truly surplus to requirements, imho.

Agree with you about Cane. Papali'i was very good defensively, but the Wallabies were doing a fair bit of damage at the breakdown, especially in the first half.

Guy Smiley wrote: ↑Sat Jul 29, 2023 9:47 pm Brace was.... let's say indifferent, to be polite. He could do with some education or training. Is he on the roster for the RWC?

You see shit like this and Eddie leaving Tupou on when he was clearly badly injured makes you wonder about how seriously WR and some coaches take the "player welfare" everyone loves to talk about.

Ymx wrote: ↑Sat Jul 29, 2023 8:37 pm Oh Jesus. Are we about to see a ref with death threats again?

Like what happened to O 'Keeffe after the Super Rugby final this year?

bogbunny wrote: ↑Sat Jul 29, 2023 8:35 pm

Sandstorm wrote: ↑Sat Jul 29, 2023 8:04 pm

boere wors wrote: ↑Sat Jul 29, 2023 7:38 pm Wanted to bring up the Matera incident again. No ref whinging intended at all. Honestly, how can that not be a red card?? Someone mentioned it before, that is exactly how CJ Stander ended Lambies career. Nowadays this surely has to be a red card. Any other views on this?

Farcical. At the least it’s a yellow card, then the TMO reviews it over the next 10.

You can’t jump with your hip into a kicker’s head any more. Ref team today fucked up.

One was a successful charge down, the other no where near??

Same as for jumping in the air. Realistic position to catch.

The Irish whinged incessantly about Stander getting carded for that and the ref yesterday was Irish...

Nah, I've seen Brace make enough terrible calls across his career to not think bias played any part in the decision (or lack thereof). He's just not a good ref.

Ymx wrote: ↑Sun Jul 30, 2023 10:31 am

bogbunny wrote: ↑Sat Jul 29, 2023 8:35 pm

Sandstorm wrote: ↑Sat Jul 29, 2023 8:04 pm

Farcical. At the least it’s a yellow card, then the TMO reviews it over the next 10.

You can’t jump with your hip into a kicker’s head any more. Ref team today fucked up.

One was a successful charge down, the other no where near??

Same as for jumping in the air. Realistic position to catch.

Both reckless, both reds.

I’ve not listened to it, so not sure if he gets wound up.

I hope so.

Ymx wrote: ↑Sun Jul 30, 2023 11:56 am I’ve not listened to it, so not sure if he gets wound up.

I hope so.

It’s dull.

He was pretending to put his hand up for the loss. Usual garbage. Then constantly picking away at the players. I can’t imagine it being hugely motivational for them listening to it.

Dan54 wrote: ↑Sun Jul 30, 2023 4:19 am

Grandpa wrote: ↑Sat Jul 29, 2023 9:49 pm I was really impressed with NZ today. I thought the best performance under Foster. A real 80 minute effort. Loved the first half absorbing pressure. Playing the blindside, really controlled possession and territory. I didn't think we were capable of playing a game like that. Plus I thought Australia in the first half especially were the toughest opponent we have faced since Ireland. So very satisfying to blunt their attack... and then we were quite ruthless second half.

I thought Richie Mounga, Scott and Jordie Barrett were outstanding... and if Razor trusts Scott Barrett as captain, then so do I. Would prefer him to Ardie Savea. Plus I hope Cane stays injured so we can have the energiser bunny continuing at seven. He topped the tackle count today and was everywhere. He's like having two Canes on the pitch. Plus he goes for 80 minutes... I also enjoyed Roigard's little cameo.

We saw game a bit different Grandpa, thought we missed Cane a fair bit last night. We were getting bullied at times in ruck, and think he's better defensively in and around breakdown. But we all see things differently I guess.
But definetly agree about RMo, and 2 Barretts, as well as Telea I thought was great. Interesting to see we have had 3 teats and a different winger looing a star in each test!

Yeah.. I don't like Cane full stop... not since his injury (in 2018?) he's not been the same. Not sure why you think he'd make a difference at the breakdown, he's so slow he barely gets to many... he really does look like a 50 year old playing to me... and I can't remember one All Black game since 2018 where I thought he was ok... I'd honestly prefer Blackadder or Harmon to play seven before going back to Cane.

But as you say we all have our own thoughts... funny though that last year when Dalton was on fire in the EOYT no one seemed to want Cane back then... I think Dalton needs to bleach his hair again though so people appreciate him again... how the hell he was still running like a spring bunny in the 80th minute I don't know... and for me NZ dominated the breakdown from start to finish... that was what was so impressive, despite Australia putting more pressure on there than any side since Ireland a year ago... and the breakdown has little to do with the seven.. it's a team thing... a mentality... you win and lose that together...

But then I do see rugby different to most

EnergiseR2 wrote: ↑Sun Jul 30, 2023 1:46 pm

Guy Smiley wrote: ↑Sat Jul 29, 2023 9:47 pm Brace was.... let's say indifferent, to be polite. He could do with some education or training. Is he on the roster for the RWC?

Nothing in that

Are you sure about it? I am going to mark this one.

Don’t bite on the Irishman’s bait.

Sandstorm wrote: ↑Sun Jul 30, 2023 2:22 pm Don’t bite on the Irishman’s bait.

It's going to come back to bite his arse. They complain about their own refs specially with their own Derbies.

EnergiseR2 wrote: ↑Sun Jul 30, 2023 3:06 pm

OomStruisbaai wrote: ↑Sun Jul 30, 2023 2:27 pm

Sandstorm wrote: ↑Sun Jul 30, 2023 2:22 pm Don’t bite on the Irishman’s bait.

It's going to come back to bite his arse. They complain about their own refs specially with their own Derbies.

Are you talking about *spit Murphy. Don't mention that swarthy cunt in my presence again

There u go.

I see Jaco Erasmus just posted that the boks played against 16 men. Here we go again

Sards wrote: ↑Sun Jul 30, 2023 6:04 pm I see Jaco Erasmus just posted that the boks played against 16 men. Here we go again

It was inevitable

Ymx wrote: ↑Sun Jul 30, 2023 6:11 pm

Sards wrote: ↑Sun Jul 30, 2023 6:04 pm I see Jaco Erasmus just posted that the boks played against 16 men. Here we go again

It was inevitable

One of the Saffa lads has already pointed out the outcry after the Super Rugby final. Bear that in mind as you raise your trembling, hysterical finger.

Are you drunk? I am certainly not the one trembling over it.

Even Sards is distancing himself over it.

Sards wrote: ↑Sun Jul 30, 2023 3:50 am

Grandpa wrote: ↑Sat Jul 29, 2023 9:43 pm I guess the mitigation is he got the ball first... unlike Stander. But was surprised it wasn't at least yellow carded and left for the TMO to adjudicate.

As for the Boks in general. Are South African fans disappointed in the style of the Boks? I thought they had turned a corner last autumn on the EOYT... with a more expansive style. Has that been abandoned now and gonna rely on the old style they know so well?

I don't think Argentina is getting enough credit. They were very good in the beginning. Great defensive lines and speed. They seem to well coached. Manie had no time to think being so flat. The kicking from hand by both sides waa good. Very contestable. Even Faf. Argentina were stronger under the high kick. That hasn't been a strength for us in a few games already. Last week against the ABs was dreadful. The little chip kicks from Manie and Willie were a positive. Also, Manie and Willies line kicking and clearing was great. That's the only real positive in this match for me. Flyhalf and fullback are a major issue for us. We have a player Willemse who the coaches want to play in these 2 positions and it leads to a lot of media criticism of Manie and Willie. Manie for me really didn't get to show his attacking flair after Williams went off. I think these 2 will really click.
Faf I feel had a very big game. He gets criticism for being slow but you need to watch a replay to understand that it's more a perception than a fact...just blame Faf for being slow. It will stick...his up and unders were very contestable. His tackling like a demon. Most of his passes went to the forwards. I think they decided that this is where they wanted to attack Argentina. Let's be honest. You put De Allende at 12 you are not planning on playing running rugby. Our defense across the park was impressive. We made a lot of tackles. Missing only 22. So Argentina did most of the work on attack.
Our wings......ja. ....2 small wings.......doesn't work.
Either Mapimpi or Canaan must play. Who do you drop. Kolbe for me. Arendse is a very exciting player who deserves an extended go.

Look. We can blame individuals all day buy we need to take a good look at the process Rassnabber have taken us through till this point. They really have not given emerging players a chance. So we know exactly which players will be playing in the RWC. And there will be very few changes from the last RWC. So its the same game plan and same components. Other nations have evolved. Can't see us going too far in the RWC. We seem to overrate our worth more than most

A comprehensive answer.. thanks! Pretty much my thoughts...

Sandstorm wrote: ↑Sat Jul 29, 2023 9:54 pm

Grandpa wrote: ↑Sat Jul 29, 2023 9:43 pm I guess the mitigation is he got the ball first... unlike Stander. But was surprised it wasn't at least yellow carded and left for the TMO to adjudicate.

As for the Boks in general. Are South African fans disappointed in the style of the Boks? I thought they had turned a corner last autumn on the EOYT... with a more expansive style. Has that been abandoned now and gonna rely on the old style they know so well?

Faf dragged us back to 2019. The other 9s in the squad don’t Boxkick everything 24/7. They try to use the backs as more than kick chasers.

How is Williams now? Is there any news of his condition? The more I see it, the more I wince...

Grandpa wrote: ↑Sun Jul 30, 2023 12:34 pm

We saw game a bit different Grandpa, thought we missed Cane a fair bit last night. We were getting bullied at times in ruck, and think he's better defensively in and around breakdown. But we all see things differently I guess.
But definetly agree about RMo, and 2 Barretts, as well as Telea I thought was great. Interesting to see we have had 3 teats and a different winger looing a star in each test!
[/quote]

Yeah.. I don't like Cane full stop... not since his injury (in 2018?) he's not been the same. Not sure why you think he'd make a difference at the breakdown, he's so slow he barely gets to many... he really does look like a 50 year old playing to me... and I can't remember one All Black game since 2018 where I thought he was ok... I'd honestly prefer Blackadder or Harmon to play seven before going back to Cane.

But as you say we all have our own thoughts... funny though that last year when Dalton was on fire in the EOYT no one seemed to want Cane back then... I think Dalton needs to bleach his hair again though so people appreciate him again... how the hell he was still running like a spring bunny in the 80th minute I don't know... and for me NZ dominated the breakdown from start to finish... that was what was so impressive, despite Australia putting more pressure on there than any side since Ireland a year ago... and the breakdown has little to do with the seven.. it's a team thing... a mentality... you win and lose that together...

But then I do see rugby different to most
[/quote]

Well I was never calling for Dalton to be starting, I think he a bloody good player, but I not sure he is suited to test level as much as Cane. I actually thought Tom Hooper from Wallabies probably outplayed him on weekend. I must admit though as I said we see things diferently on 7's role, and I a huge fan of judging them by workrate, and Cane is someone who is hard on tackle and back on feet again to be part of play very quickly, and that was something I noticed a bit about Hooper for Wallabies. I also a bit different to you, not a case of me liking or disliking Cane or Papalii, just how I think they should play at test level.

Grandpa wrote: ↑Sun Jul 30, 2023 10:48 pm

Sandstorm wrote: ↑Sat Jul 29, 2023 9:54 pm

Grandpa wrote: ↑Sat Jul 29, 2023 9:43 pm I guess the mitigation is he got the ball first... unlike Stander. But was surprised it wasn't at least yellow carded and left for the TMO to adjudicate.

As for the Boks in general. Are South African fans disappointed in the style of the Boks? I thought they had turned a corner last autumn on the EOYT... with a more expansive style. Has that been abandoned now and gonna rely on the old style they know so well?

Faf dragged us back to 2019. The other 9s in the squad don’t Boxkick everything 24/7. They try to use the backs as more than kick chasers.

How is Williams now? Is there any news of his condition? The more I see it, the more I wince...

He is alright....2 week concussion protocol

So basically the guys going to Argentina , bar a few that have gone over for cover , are the on call...have your bag packed in case of an injury....crew

Dan54 wrote: ↑Sun Jul 30, 2023 11:18 pm
Well I was never calling for Dalton to be starting, I think he a bloody good player, but I not sure he is suited to test level as much as Cane. I actually thought Tom Hooper from Wallabies probably outplayed him on weekend. I must admit though as I said we see things diferently on 7's role, and I a huge fan of judging them by workrate, and Cane is someone who is hard on tackle and back on feet again to be part of play very quickly, and that was something I noticed a bit about Hooper for Wallabies. I also a bit different to you, not a case of me liking or disliking Cane or Papalii, just how I think they should play at test level.

Be interesting to see who Razor picks next year... could be neither... he might put Savea back there

Sards wrote: ↑Mon Jul 31, 2023 7:04 am

Grandpa wrote: ↑Sun Jul 30, 2023 10:48 pm

Sandstorm wrote: ↑Sat Jul 29, 2023 9:54 pm

Faf dragged us back to 2019. The other 9s in the squad don’t Boxkick everything 24/7. They try to use the backs as more than kick chasers.

How is Williams now? Is there any news of his condition? The more I see it, the more I wince...

He is alright....2 week concussion protocol

hopefully no long term effects like Lambie.

OomStruisbaai wrote: ↑Sun Jul 30, 2023 2:18 pm

EnergiseR2 wrote: ↑Sun Jul 30, 2023 1:46 pm

Guy Smiley wrote: ↑Sat Jul 29, 2023 9:47 pm Brace was.... let's say indifferent, to be polite. He could do with some education or training. Is he on the roster for the RWC?

Nothing in that

Are you sure about it? I am going to mark this one.

Argentina full-back Juan Cruz Mallia has been cited for alleged foul play during his side's 22-21 defeat to South Africa in the Rugby Championship at the weekend.
Cruz Mallia is alleged to have contravened Law 9.11, whereby players must not do anything that is reckless or dangerous to others.
From the opening kick-off, the ball was collected by Springbok scrumhalf Grant Williams – who attempted a clearance. Cruz Mallia jumped to charge down the clearance and his hip collided with the head of Williams – appearing to knock the 'Bok No. 9 out cold.

As a neutral I think the Bok problems stem from Willie not letting the 10 develop. It's OK for him to direct play now and then but the guy takes over at 10 without the responsibility of a 10. If the 10 is useless then drop him but at least play them at 10 and let them sink or swim or put Willie at 10. The other thing is how much Kolisi has been missed, And that's not just his leadership but his dominant tackling. The other real worry for the Boks is decline of AM, looks a shadow of the player before the injury. The bish Bosh merchants in De Allende and Esterhuizen can't make up for a BOK team lacking fully fit AM in tight games.

SaintK wrote: ↑Mon Jul 31, 2023 11:58 am

OomStruisbaai wrote: ↑Sun Jul 30, 2023 2:18 pm

EnergiseR2 wrote: ↑Sun Jul 30, 2023 1:46 pm

Nothing in that

Are you sure about it? I am going to mark this one.

Argentina full-back Juan Cruz Mallia has been cited for alleged foul play during his side's 22-21 defeat to South Africa in the Rugby Championship at the weekend.
Cruz Mallia is alleged to have contravened Law 9.11, whereby players must not do anything that is reckless or dangerous to others.
From the opening kick-off, the ball was collected by Springbok scrumhalf Grant Williams – who attempted a clearance. Cruz Mallia jumped to charge down the clearance and his hip collided with the head of Williams – appearing to knock the 'Bok No. 9 out cold.

Andrew Brace is usually very strict. He got this one wrong. The sad part is that it was a very important test for Grant Williams.