NPR

EnergiseR2 wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 7:46 am

Line6 HXFX wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 7:42 am Israel since way back, knew they were the invaders, the illegal aggressors...and that the very best they could hope for in the eyes of the world, was the world to see them and the Palestinians as equally bad. This was actual policy.

There will never be a two state solution, Palestine will never have a separate state, as it will just be largely millions of angry young men, with zero water or fertile land, able to import arms , and be a massive threat on Israels border.

It is perpetual war. Perpetual f'king conflict. No solutions or peace here.

Continuous conflict is the very best outcome for Israel.

More stupid shit. The world is awash with stupid shit

What, me explaining accurately what the actual policy of various Israeli governments over the years is?

These are not my policies.

I am all for removal of sanctions, and the Palestinians having a separate state and being able to get loans, foriegn investment and using it to build dams and infrastructure and shit.
Being a bit of a player in the area, with a young vibrant, fiesty growing population.


Israel f'king ain't.

So Hezbollah attacking from the North.

All cards in on the table.

Will the US get more active now.

Muttonbird wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 8:13 am What was this "music festival for peace held near the Gaza border fence"?

Unless they had actively engaged Palestinian representatives, it just looks like Israeli settlers partying outside the doors of an open air prison.

An open air prison with 5 star hotels?

https://www.booking.com/fivestars/country/ps.en-gb.html

Line6 HXFX wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 8:42 am

EnergiseR2 wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 7:46 am

Line6 HXFX wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 7:42 am Israel since way back, knew they were the invaders, the illegal aggressors...and that the very best they could hope for in the eyes of the world, was the world to see them and the Palestinians as equally bad. This was actual policy.

There will never be a two state solution, Palestine will never have a separate state, as it will just be largely millions of angry young men, with zero water or fertile land, able to import arms , and be a massive threat on Israels border.

It is perpetual war. Perpetual f'king conflict. No solutions or peace here.

Continuous conflict is the very best outcome for Israel.

More stupid shit. The world is awash with stupid shit

What, me explaining accurately what the actual policy of various Israeli governments over the years is?

These are not my policies.

I am all for removal of sanctions, and the Palestinians having a separate state and being able to get loans, foriegn investment and using it to build dams and infrastructure and shit.
Being a bit of a player in the area, with a young vibrant, fiesty growing population.


Israel f'king ain't.

Hamas got half a billion quid from Qatar alone last year.

I've a suspicion that ISIS or AlQuaeda or whatever he loonies are called now are going to throw their hand in behind HAMAS.
This is not going to end well for anyone.

I've seen some asinine bollocks from people I know IRL like "One man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter".

Personally I don't accept any definition of freedom fighter than includes the indiscriminate slaughter, torture, rape and kidnapping of civillians.

However much one might want to cast this as an act of desperation by the oppressed against their oppressors, it can't disguise that it's pointless lashing out against soft targets. These actions do not diminish the power of Israel or its ability to keep oppressing Palestinians, they do not advance the cause of a Palestinian State or long term peace. They serve only to whip up both sides of an already decades long misery-fest with a fresh round of
"It's justified because they killed my cousin"
"Well you killed my cousin first"
"Because you killed my grandfather"
"Because you killed..." etc. etc. ad infinitum.

Fuck..

EnergiseR2 wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 9:12 am yeah Palestinians are real progressive. Palestine supporters and cognitive dissonance go hand in hand.

This is an aspect where gormless progressives irritate me. They openly give racism, misogyny and homophobia from many muslims a pass when similar behaviour from any other grouping in society would be given a kicking.

Kind of hoping the end of oil and gas will decrease the amount influence of the middle east authoritarian regimes.

I can not believe a few of our posters first reactions to the brutal mutilation of civilians has been - yeah but Israel.

Refry, Sandstorm, and Muttonbird.

Ymx wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 2:04 pm I can not believe a few of our posters first reactions to the brutal mutilation of civilians has been - yeah but Israel.

Refry, Sandstorm, and Muttonbird.

The type of University they went too, I would suggest.

EnergiseR2 wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 1:17 pm Formal war declared. I am still not sure what Hamas were at. Derail the Israeli Saudi detente? Try and spark a full war? Why would they feel now is the time for that. The Republican posturing is predictable but Christ its unfortunate for Biden the year before an election. Support for Israel is a bit more fragmented in the states than it was before but in the round they lean heavily that way: 55% to 26% support Palestine. Granted that's a high for the latter. Also that 26% is pre dead hippy girl being sat and spat on. That's so bad all the Palestinian leadership can do is pretend it wasn't them. Say it's a false flag or some Russkie type bollox. The dead granny's they can explain away but that's violently toxic. To be honest it's an image I will never have leave me. I am more nuanced than our David from.Gwent or De Santis but fuck me it's horrific

You really aren't. One of your first thoughts is "that's bad for BIden"

You know full well what you are.

EnergiseR2 wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 2:09 pm

petej wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 1:52 pm

EnergiseR2 wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 9:12 am yeah Palestinians are real progressive. Palestine supporters and cognitive dissonance go hand in hand.

This is an aspect where gormless progressives irritate me. They openly give racism, misogyny and homophobia from many muslims a pass when similar behaviour from any other grouping in society would be given a kicking.

Kind of hoping the end of oil and gas will decrease the amount influence of the middle east authoritarian regimes.

The religious rught in America and Trumpism has more in common with the socially conservative and regressive society in Palestine than they do in Israel.

Yes, I've just compared the bill or rights and the Hamas Charter - you're spot on.

David in Gwent wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 2:06 pm

Ymx wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 2:04 pm I can not believe a few of our posters first reactions to the brutal mutilation of civilians has been - yeah but Israel.

Refry, Sandstorm, and Muttonbird.

The type of University they went too, I would suggest.

Really? Go on tell us what University Refry went to.
What utter bollocks, I haven't seen anyone supporting the Islamist terrorist bastards

EnergiseR2 wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 2:47 pm

David in Gwent wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 2:11 pm

EnergiseR2 wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 2:09 pm

The religious rught in America and Trumpism has more in common with the socially conservative and regressive society in Palestine than they do in Israel.

Yes, I've just compared the bill or rights and the Hamas Charter - you're spot on.

You're a sledgehammer Dave in a world of glass

You may have fooled everyone else, you haven't fooled me. Anyway, let's play the ball, not the men.

From the Times Of Israel:

For years, Netanyahu propped up Hamas. Now it’s blown up in our faces

The premier’s policy of treating the terror group as a partner, at the expense of Abbas and Palestinian statehood, has resulted in wounds that will take Israel years to heal from

For years, the various governments led by Benjamin Netanyahu took an approach that divided power between the Gaza Strip and the West Bank — bringing Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas to his knees while making moves that propped up the Hamas terror group.

The idea was to prevent Abbas — or anyone else in the Palestinian Authority’s West Bank government — from advancing toward the establishment of a Palestinian state.

Thus, amid this bid to impair Abbas, Hamas was upgraded from a mere terror group to an organization with which Israel held indirect negotiations via Egypt, and one that was allowed to receive infusions of cash from abroad.

Hamas was also included in discussions about increasing the number of work permits Israel granted to Gazan laborers, which kept money flowing into Gaza, meaning food for families and the ability to purchase basic products.

Israeli officials said these permits, which allow Gazan laborers to earn higher salaries than they would in the enclave, were a powerful tool to help preserve calm.

https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years ... our-faces/

Bibi prefered working with terrorists, because it helped him isolate the Palestinians who wanted a negotiated settlement, but who were in the West Bank, the land that he'd promised to the, Settlers

Donald J. Trump

@realDonaldTrump

·
1h
THE HORRIBLE ATTACK ON ISRAEL, MUCH LIKE THE ATTACK ON UKRAINE, WOULD NEVER HAVE HAPPENED IF I WERE PRESIDENT - ZERO CHANCE!

So tell us how you'd accomplish that you dumb twat..

https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years ... our-faces/

That whole article is definitely worth a read.

TB63 wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 2:58 pm

Donald J. Trump

@realDonaldTrump

·
1h
THE HORRIBLE ATTACK ON ISRAEL, MUCH LIKE THE ATTACK ON UKRAINE, WOULD NEVER HAVE HAPPENED IF I WERE PRESIDENT - ZERO CHANCE!

So tell us how you'd accomplish that you dumb twat..

I hadn't thought of it that way, Biden has presided over a shit show of a geo-political world these last few years.

Ok DAC, enlighten me as to how any world leader could prevent this....

TB63 wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 3:18 pm Ok DAC, enlighten me as to how any world leader could prevent this....

Whilst your at it tell us about what bad Unviversity indoctrinated Refry.
Apart from the Univeristy of Life, and oh doesDAC support TRUMP
The Epstein loving Billionnaire scatologist

TB63 wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 3:18 pm Ok DAC, enlighten me as to how any world leader could prevent this....

Dude, I was just stating a fact, it's been a shit show.

Not entirely convinced that Putin would have invaded Ukraine with a US Republican government though but that's just a feeling and not based in anything else.

EnergiseR2 wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 3:30 pm

David in Gwent wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 3:25 pm

TB63 wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 3:18 pm Ok DAC, enlighten me as to how any world leader could prevent this....

Dude, I was just stating a fact, it's been a shit show.

Not entirely convinced that Putin would have invaded Ukraine with a US Republican government though but that's just a feeling and not based in anything else.

You really are a derpy mofo

I'm really not, however, it's without a doubt that the world looks on at Biden as a weak, sad president and a perfect example of the fall of Western Civilisation, maybe we should keep you guy's weird hard on for American Liberal politics to the Biden thread.

David in Gwent wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 9:30 am

Line6 HXFX wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 8:42 am

EnergiseR2 wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 7:46 am

More stupid shit. The world is awash with stupid shit

What, me explaining accurately what the actual policy of various Israeli governments over the years is?

These are not my policies.

I am all for removal of sanctions, and the Palestinians having a separate state and being able to get loans, foriegn investment and using it to build dams and infrastructure and shit.
Being a bit of a player in the area, with a young vibrant, fiesty growing population.


Israel f'king ain't.

Hamas got half a billion quid from Qatar alone last year.

I guess if you fund a premiership football team it is acceptable.
One of many reasons why I find Manchester City, Newcastle United and Chelsea under abramovich repulsive.

petej wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 3:41 pm

David in Gwent wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 9:30 am

Line6 HXFX wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 8:42 am

What, me explaining accurately what the actual policy of various Israeli governments over the years is?

These are not my policies.

I am all for removal of sanctions, and the Palestinians having a separate state and being able to get loans, foriegn investment and using it to build dams and infrastructure and shit.
Being a bit of a player in the area, with a young vibrant, fiesty growing population.


Israel f'king ain't.

Hamas got half a billion quid from Qatar alone last year.

I guess if you fund a premiership football team it is acceptable.
One of many reasons why I find Manchester City, Newcastle United and Chelsea under abramovich repulsive.

Our Arab friends are definitely playing the long game and know exactly what they're doing, the Saudi Pro League is very clever work by them. On the flip side of that, our leaders can't even define what a woman is.

David in Gwent wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 3:35 pm

EnergiseR2 wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 3:30 pm

David in Gwent wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 3:25 pm

Dude, I was just stating a fact, it's been a shit show.

Not entirely convinced that Putin would have invaded Ukraine with a US Republican government though but that's just a feeling and not based in anything else.

You really are a derpy mofo

I'm really not, however, it's without a doubt that the world looks on at Biden as a weak, sad president and a perfect example of the fall of Western Civilisation, maybe we should keep you guy's weird hard on for American Liberal politics to the Biden thread.

Whilst the rest of the world sees Drump as what he really is, a dumb fucking buffoon to be laughed at.. Seriously, how the fuck does he think he could've prevented the ongoing atrocities that's happening now?..

TB63 wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 3:48 pm

David in Gwent wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 3:35 pm

EnergiseR2 wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 3:30 pm

You really are a derpy mofo

I'm really not, however, it's without a doubt that the world looks on at Biden as a weak, sad president and a perfect example of the fall of Western Civilisation, maybe we should keep you guy's weird hard on for American Liberal politics to the Biden thread.

Whilst the rest of the world sees Drump as what he really is, a dumb fucking buffoon to be laughed at.. Seriously, how the fuck does he think he could've prevented the ongoing atrocities that's happening now?..

You'll have to ask him yourself, I didn't actually agree with him, did I?

Ymx wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 2:04 pm I can not believe a few of our posters first reactions to the brutal mutilation of civilians has been - yeah but Israel.

Refry, Sandstorm, and Muttonbird.

Probably wouldn’t be a good idea to tot up a score of dead civilians in the last few decades thought.

Is thinking they are both cunts OK?

But we know your love of the orange shitgibbon, and your dislike of Biden..

So tell me how their policies and world class management would differ?..

Can we please not use this thread to post picture of either side of gore and death.

EnergiseR2 wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 4:27 pm

C69 wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 4:24 pm Can we please not use this thread to post picture of either side of gore and death.

It's actually imperative that people like you and me see what was done to that girl. Full HD video. I'm a centrist and you are a lefty and the men who did that rely on us thinking they are freedom fighting ledgeballs

It would be a difficult wank tbh.

Was reading from someone reputable that yesterday was the bloodiest day in the history of the State of Israel. This will change Israeli society in a way that is unlikely to benefit the people Hamas purport to fight for

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 4:42 pm Was reading from someone reputable that yesterday was the bloodiest day in the history of the State of Israel. This will change Israeli society in a way that is unlikely to benefit the people Hamas purport to fight for

If you mean what I think you mean, it'll just lengthen their recruitment line.

EnergiseR2 wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 4:51 pm

Uncle fester wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 4:46 pm

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 4:42 pm Was reading from someone reputable that yesterday was the bloodiest day in the history of the State of Israel. This will change Israeli society in a way that is unlikely to benefit the people Hamas purport to fight for

If you mean what I think you mean, it'll just lengthen their recruitment line.

Israel will take Era defining decisions here Fester. That's a given

In one direction, they could go full Xinjiang on Gaza and just take the rest of the West Bank I suppose.

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 4:42 pm Was reading from someone reputable that yesterday was the bloodiest day in the history of the State of Israel. This will change Israeli society in a way that is unlikely to benefit the people Hamas purport to fight for

Do Hamas really fight for them or is it full of troublemakers itching to kill people from the autocratic regimes of the middle east?

Uncle fester wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 4:46 pm

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 4:42 pm Was reading from someone reputable that yesterday was the bloodiest day in the history of the State of Israel. This will change Israeli society in a way that is unlikely to benefit the people Hamas purport to fight for

If you mean what I think you mean, it'll just lengthen their recruitment line.

Which alongside large parts of Gaza being flattened and Israeli public opinion hardening is very unlikely to benefit their people. Not that they care, as petej suggests.

EnergiseR2 wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 4:36 pm

C69 wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 4:31 pm

EnergiseR2 wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 4:27 pm

It's actually imperative that people like you and me see what was done to that girl. Full HD video. I'm a centrist and you are a lefty and the men who did that rely on us thinking they are freedom fighting ledgeballs

It would be a difficult wank tbh.

You wouldn't joke if you saw it. It's the very definition of horrific male violence. I have never seen anything as bad with a sexual element. It's frightening and any cunt who tries to Palestine me this week is getting a punch in the throat

Is there more than the 20 second clip I’ve seen in the back of the pickup? Can’t get it out of my head but the suggestion seems to be there is more and worse

I mean the solution (2 state) has been doing the rounds since the seventies (through the UN etc) and Israel, again, and again has stepped in to stop it.
Israel doesn't want a Palestinian state, for the reasons outlined. Essentially lots of young angry men, on Israels border, with practically zero resources (water) able to import all sorts of nasty shit to "protect" themselves, ., and so they (Israelies) think of that (two state solution...or the only solution) as a massive threat to their security.
So nothing is going to change..

I honestly thought everyone knew this? Guys if you don't even know this you should just you know, go away and sneer at the bins etc.

This is also why the English don't want the Welsh to do this (borrow to invest and be able fly the nest). Isreal can embargo, control, and imprision Palestine through poverty and penury...again loke the English do to the welsh.

This is hardly news.

As an aside...Wales wanted to borrow and invest to avoid austerity, not in guns and arms. but in things like the NHS, invest in clean energy, rail infrastructure.. when borrowing was so cheap they were giving cash away.. David Cameron and George Osborne (our tory oppressors) wanted Wales to suffer terribly as Wales doing well and England doing Austerity would be a tory nightmare.

Again.. actually happenned.
Sneer at the bins. Not me.

Wasn't that impressed with your song lyrics earlier which you quickly deleted.

PCPhil wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 5:53 pm Wasn't that impressed with your song lyrics earlier which you quickly deleted.

Frank Zappa.
Not mine.

Didn't think they would go down well, in 2023, and during Israeli Hamas conflict in the end.