NPR

tabascoboy wrote: Fri Sep 18, 2020 9:43 am

Nols wrote: Fri Sep 18, 2020 8:36 am I watched the first season before getting into the books. GOt my dad onto it and he started reading before seeing the series. He's not as taken with the show as I am. Think it's because he imagined the characters slightly differently, whereas I already had a very clear image of them from seeing the show first.
Alex Kamal should probably be chubbier. Belters taller and skinnier (although that's very difficult to do, TBF). Holden and Naomi are probably a bit too pretty, but that's just TV, which doesn't bother me.

They got Amos spot on, though, and absolutely Wes Chatham absolutely nails him, IMO, especially as the series develop and his more subtle traits come through. He's more than just a psycho meathead, as he appears at first.

Only read a few chapters so far, that's one thing about the Belters but you're right it's just not possible to populate a cast with 2m + tall stringbeans! At least we can imagine the way they speak rather than that awful cod Jamaican thing they try on screen. Amos had some good development in the show, slow but that's the way it should be and it's believable that he shows that he can do subtle and actually make friends. I only started watching the show a few months ago but I'm surprised how much of the early story I've already forgotten...even that Holden etc started with the 'Canterbury'.

How could you not "Remember the Cant"??

They tried to show the weird Belter body shape by showing Miller with his top off in one early scene and all his ribs showing, but then when everyone's got their clothes on, you wouldn't know. The show did some neat things like loads of Belters having obvious tattoo patterns to make it clear to the viewer.
The design of the patterned tattoos they have is cool. It's supposed to represent scarring that early generation Belters got from their spacesuits, it's a mark of who they are.

Nols wrote: Fri Sep 18, 2020 9:55 am How could you not "Remember the Cant"??

I'm getting old!

Won’t lie, that isn’t the first Cant I’ve seen on a forum in the last 24 hours

mat the expat wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 2:07 pm

Jeff the Bear wrote: Thu Sep 17, 2020 9:58 am

PCPhil wrote: Tue Jun 30, 2020 5:25 pm Any more been heard about Consider phlebus?

Asking the real question here...and the answer is no. Every few months I go and do a Google search, but fuck all comes back. I hope that means they are putting in the requisite effort (and money) to make it right.

Cancelled

Nooooo... How about Consider Globus then?

Enjoying Leviathan Wakes so much that I went to Dubray and bought the rest of the saga in one go.

Got out of reading for so long but delighted to get back into it.

Quite interesting so far the take of life on Ceres, especially life in low G with the effects on the human body and the food. Thought it was just a big rock but new discoveries about Ceres:

Uncle fester wrote: Sat Sep 19, 2020 9:16 am Enjoying Leviathan Wakes so much that I went to Dubray and bought the rest of the saga in one go.

Got out of reading for so long but delighted to get back into it.

Re-reading the entire Revelation Space series.

I'd forgotten a lot

mat the expat wrote: Sun Sep 20, 2020 11:14 pm Re-reading the entire Revelation Space series.

I'd forgotten a lot

Best work from Reynolds, don't think he's ever topped this trilogy, third book doesn't live up to first 2 for me

I took a break after the first two. Nearly done with the Witcher series in the meantime, then back to it to complete. Have a good few of the various short stories still to get through as well.

Hopefully not too long before Leviathan Falls is released. Might have to re-read the last few Expanse books in anticipation of it's release next year. Probably need to refresh from Nemesis Games onwards.

Leviathan Falls will be the last one? If I do read the books after LW then I should be able to get through the whole series without a hiatus to the final one then with luck.

Yeah, almost certain. I did flag a little in the middle as I read all the way through to Tiamat's Wrath in one big marathon. Well, sorta, went through periods of not making much progress as I wasn't reading much at all, but I didn't break them up with other books.
Missed some smaller details around the middle which were a bit important come the later books, so I'd benefit from a refresh. The show has even dropped a few hints in already, setting up for later seasons.


Edit, mega spoilers for some major plot points in this article, but an interesting few tidbits.
https://www.tor.com/2020/09/16/the-expa ... -sa-corey/

In addition to Leviathan Falls, they plan to have another novella that’ll come out after that final book, which will provide a “nice grace note” to some hanging threads from the series. Abraham noted that he’s been waiting to write the story for “years.”

After The Expanse, they do have some other projects in the works: A new, three-book series. They haven’t begun working on it just yet, but with The Expanse coming to a close, they’ll be devoting their attention to that shortly. “It’s a very different project [from The Expanse],” Abraham said. Where The Expanse drew its inspiration from authors like Larry Niven and Alfred Bester, “the new ones will be much more Frank Herbert.”

The novellas have been good, IMO. They do some nice work filling in the back stories of major characters or incidents that are only obliquely referred to in the main novels. I thought one of them (Strange Dogs) was just excellent as a standalone sci-fi short in its own right (absolutely do not read that until after Babylon's Ashes).

The Frank Herbert inspired comment has me intrigued.

Madness wrote: Mon Sep 21, 2020 9:01 pm

mat the expat wrote: Sun Sep 20, 2020 11:14 pm Re-reading the entire Revelation Space series.

I'd forgotten a lot

Best work from Reynolds, don't think he's ever topped this trilogy, third book doesn't live up to first 2 for me

I'm happy he wrote a sequel to the Prefect - I'm holding out for a third which charts the Melding plague's origin.

Terminal World deserved another visitation but he has said he'll not write more in that universe

I found revelation space really hard work, infodump tastic and poor characterisation.

I did really enjoy pushing ice with the BDO and house of suns though.

yermum wrote: Tue Sep 22, 2020 1:52 pm I found revelation space really hard work, infodump tastic and poor characterisation.

I did really enjoy pushing ice with the BDO and house of suns though.

The second time I read it, I was more aware of the seperate time lines which helped it make more sense. Absolution Gap adds some stronger characters and a more linear plot.

I found it a bit confusing and scattered to start, until I paid attention to the dates at the start of each chapter and put together a rough timeline in my head of events as it unfolded.

Nols wrote: Tue Sep 22, 2020 7:23 pm I found it a bit confusing and scattered to start, until I paid attention to the dates at the start of each chapter and put together a rough timeline in my head of events as it unfolded.

How did you cope with Use of Weapons?

Iain is much much better at writing though. His characters shine through and the prose isn't turgid technobabble.

I can still remember the names of the characters in Use of Weapons. The pacing and exposition draw the reader through the story.

I cant remember a single name from revelation space.

(apologies to fans of RS)

yermum wrote: Wed Sep 23, 2020 8:45 am Iain is much much better at writing though. His characters shine through and the prose isn't turgid technobabble.

I can still remember the names of the characters in Use of Weapons. The pacing and exposition draw the reader through the story.

I cant remember a single name from revelation space.

(apologies to fans of RS)

With the correct spelling?

mat the expat wrote: Wed Sep 23, 2020 8:25 am

Nols wrote: Tue Sep 22, 2020 7:23 pm I found it a bit confusing and scattered to start, until I paid attention to the dates at the start of each chapter and put together a rough timeline in my head of events as it unfolded.

How did you cope with Use of Weapons?

The different chronological sequences across the chapters were much more clearcut, IMO. Plus, as said, Banks was an excellent writer and I was familiar with his style. Reynolds' writing was completely new to me, so the jumping back and forth across times and the way he builds up the overall narrative was also new.
Plus loads of technobabble, which I actually like for the most part.

I didn't find it particularly difficult, I just recall that at a certain point I started flicking back to the start of previous chapters and piecing together the timeline more clearly in my head once I was familiar with the characters and general settings. At the beginning you're jumping around Chasm City/Yellowstone, Nostalgia for Infinity, and Resurgam; with the characters related to each setting, with different chapters covering different points in time in each. Then it settles into two roughly parellel narratives of the crew on NfI and Sylveste & co. on Resurgam, before they come together in the finale.

Just took a bit of paying attention, is all.

By the time I read Chasm City, I found the jumping back and forth between the stories of Tanner and Sky much easier. Only two arcs and they were both pretty much linear within themselves. I actually found the big reveal of Chasm City to be very reminiscent of that of Use of Weapons. Was obvious from much further out, but still worked well I thought. I never saw the reveal in UoW coming and still remember the feeling like I'd been slapped when the penny dropped in the last few pages. I've never had that in another book. It's just so good, and awful. Proper Banks at his best.

Yeah, the first time reading UoW is a headfuck

I like Reynold's use of hard physics - Chasm City/Yellowstone is a great setting

mat the expat wrote: Thu Sep 24, 2020 12:46 am Yeah, the first time reading UoW is a headfuck

I like Reynold's use of hard physics - Chasm City/Yellowstone is a great setting

Reynolds is one of the minority of modern sci-fi writers who has a solid background in the sciences. I enjoy a lot of space opera but most of it is based on handwavium technology.

robmatic wrote: Thu Sep 24, 2020 6:55 am

mat the expat wrote: Thu Sep 24, 2020 12:46 am Yeah, the first time reading UoW is a headfuck

I like Reynold's use of hard physics - Chasm City/Yellowstone is a great setting

Reynolds is one of the minority of modern sci-fi writers who has a solid background in the sciences. I enjoy a lot of space opera but most of it is based on handwavium technology.

He worked as a researcher in CERN, didn't he?

Some of the stuff he comes up with is batshit crazy, but actually has a grounding in plausible physics/chemistry, even if it's completely fantastical.
The shit that the Inhibitor machines do in the Resurgam system in Absolution Gap is class. Basically just a thought exercise in mad shit you could do with celestial bodies if you have essentially no limits to engineering capabilities.

Chasm City is one of my favourite sci-fi settings. It's brilliant. Only Banks has really created environments that I like as much.

I enjoy the Expanse in a similar vein, it feels reasonably grounded. Sure, the Epstein Drive and everything about the Protomolecule is very handwavium, but the latter is a fictional alien technology. Gotta have some futuristic stuff in there, but life on-board ships and Belter colonies seems realistic. Ships feel like cramped submarines, general stuff about living in artificial spin or microgravity, etc.

Nols wrote: Thu Sep 24, 2020 10:28 am
I enjoy the Expanse in a similar vein, it feels reasonably grounded. Sure, the Epstein Drive and everything about the Protomolecule is very handwavium, but the latter is a fictional alien technology. Gotta have some futuristic stuff in there, but life on-board ships and Belter colonies seems realistic. Ships feel like cramped submarines, general stuff about living in artificial spin or microgravity, etc.

That's an advantage of reading the books, there's time to explain some of the effects and problems of life in low G environments etc that you just can't put into a TV adaptation without clunky exposition.

What I like about Reynolds is he doesn't saturate his books with description. It's mostly inferred.

Considering the size of parking swarms, the number of systems Ultras visit bust be in the hundreds at least

I remember the first time I read something properly sciency that worked well in a book.

In Consider Phlebas they have magic anti-grav suits (Banks was very happy to have magic space stuff) which work against gravity due to massive bodies, but they're on a ring orbital. One character goes to float off a high ledge and falls to his death because it doesn't work in artifical spin gravity.
I really enjoy little touches like that. While the technology is completely fantastical, it's clearly been thought about by the author.

Definitely.

The Expanse:

So, the showrunners decided not to go with "Vomit Zombies" and give us neon fluorescent blue goo rather than brown goo. I think that sequence though worked better in the show, or it would have looked too much like meaningless slaughter. Probably a wise move to avoid looking like another zombie apocalypse trope.

I noticed those guys that fucked up GOT on tv are about to massacre one of my favourite Sci-fi books "the three body problem".

To be fair, the three body problem is a set of great scientific ideas with some of the most paper thin and one-dimensional characters (and dialogue) you could hope to find.

It's not hard sci fi in any way, shape or form, but I have been enjoying rereading the Ciaphas Cain novels, a.k.a. Flashman in Spaaaaace (only the racism is fantastical and the women are rather more than one dimensional rape targets).

JM2K6 wrote: Thu Oct 08, 2020 2:57 pm To be fair, the three body problem is a set of great scientific ideas with some of the most paper thin and one-dimensional characters (and dialogue) you could hope to find.

yep I always hoped that it lost something in translation.

JM2K6 wrote: Thu Oct 08, 2020 2:57 pm To be fair, the three body problem is a set of great scientific ideas with some of the most paper thin and one-dimensional characters (and dialogue) you could hope to find.

It's definitely a marmite kind of book because I hated it.

robmatic wrote: Thu Oct 08, 2020 8:01 pm

JM2K6 wrote: Thu Oct 08, 2020 2:57 pm To be fair, the three body problem is a set of great scientific ideas with some of the most paper thin and one-dimensional characters (and dialogue) you could hope to find.

It's definitely a marmite kind of book because I hated it.

I gave up about 200 pages in. Will re-read it at some point

Hal Jordan wrote: Thu Oct 08, 2020 5:58 pm It's not hard sci fi in any way, shape or form, but I have been enjoying rereading the Ciaphas Cain novels, a.k.a. Flashman in Spaaaaace (only the racism is fantastical and the women are rather more than one dimensional rape targets).

They are excellent if extremely formulaic!

mat the expat wrote: Fri Oct 09, 2020 1:04 am

robmatic wrote: Thu Oct 08, 2020 8:01 pm

JM2K6 wrote: Thu Oct 08, 2020 2:57 pm To be fair, the three body problem is a set of great scientific ideas with some of the most paper thin and one-dimensional characters (and dialogue) you could hope to find.

It's definitely a marmite kind of book because I hated it.

I gave up about 200 pages in. Will re-read it at some point

I actually enjoyed the series although "The Dark Forest" was a bit of a plod.

JM2K6 wrote: Fri Oct 09, 2020 9:29 am

Hal Jordan wrote: Thu Oct 08, 2020 5:58 pm It's not hard sci fi in any way, shape or form, but I have been enjoying rereading the Ciaphas Cain novels, a.k.a. Flashman in Spaaaaace (only the racism is fantastical and the women are rather more than one dimensional rape targets).

They are excellent if extremely formulaic!

Deus ex Jurgen.

Reading the third in the Galactic Commons series written by Becky Chambers. Quite enjoying them tbh. Very human sci fi.

Also, for TV stuff, has anyone watched Tales from the Loop on Amazon? I loved it. very slow moving, the sci fi elements of the odd little town are kind of a background to character stories. Soundtrack by the legend that is Philip Glass as well.

I enjoyed tales from the loop.

Nols wrote: Thu Sep 24, 2020 12:24 pm I remember the first time I read something properly sciency that worked well in a book.

In Consider Phlebas they have magic anti-grav suits (Banks was very happy to have magic space stuff) which work against gravity due to massive bodies, but they're on a ring orbital. One character goes to float off a high ledge and falls to his death because it doesn't work in artifical spin gravity.
I really enjoy little touches like that. While the technology is completely fantastical, it's clearly been thought about by the author.

There's a long internet discussion somewhere about whether Lenibopra's jump would actually have been fatal or not. Confused the hell out of me.