shaggy wrote: ↑Fri Aug 11, 2023 2:05 pm
Not wishing to step into your Friday pm fun but for vast majority of people the Nazi party equates to concentration camps and mass extermination. The nuances listed above just fly above most peoples heads and you lose the argument.
This can be a great place to learn and exchange views but the ability to actually step outside of your view and see how it lands on other party is completing missing from most discussions.
shaggy wrote: ↑Fri Aug 11, 2023 2:05 pm
Not wishing to step into your Friday pm fun but for vast majority of people the Nazi party equates to concentration camps and mass extermination. The nuances listed above just fly above most peoples heads and you lose the argument.
This can be a great place to learn and exchange views but the ability to actually step outside of your view and see how it lands on other party is completing missing from most discussions.
David in Gwent wrote: ↑Fri Aug 11, 2023 10:51 am
The 6.7 million crimes recorded were 11% higher compared with the year ending March 2020 (6.1 million offences). This overall increase was ...
Crime went up, migration down by ~1/2
An estimated 268,000 people came to live in the UK during 2020, compared with 592,000 people in 2019
I don’t know that the movement of refugees has hit the mega levels to hit macro trends over that time span. Though it may be for small communities where 4-500 young men are suddenly dumped there.
Additionally Sweden has over half of its sexual crimes committed by non Swedish born locals. However, we are starting to tread on a different segment with this. Ie not just asylum seekers.
Starting is an understatement due to the way such paper will have been misunderstood and spread.
The issue for our governing party is the lack of money boat migrants have. They are happy to sell passports, football clubs and accept donations from anyone regardless of attitudes towards women and other races.
Ymx wrote: ↑Fri Aug 11, 2023 7:52 pm
I blame the notorious right wing fascist millennials and zedders, and the passing of the late lefty boomers for this.
This so called swing is a small reaction of having gone too far!
With respect, there is no equivalence here and if your idea of this is a "small swing" then your credibility in this debate is severely diminished. I'd love to know where you live. Because, I'll bet, like most of the posters pontificating on both sides of this ere long debate on PR (all versions) that it's somewhere middle class + cosy. DAC is excepted from that accusation.
Tell me I'm wrong.
It is in no way further than where we were before. You’ll note my articles from the guardian. Guardian, sky and others appear to have dramatically swung left. As have the generations. I’ve not moved.
Comment about where we live are idiotic. I’m sure most posters here have settled in to better neighbourhoods as they go through life. And most posters here have lived in raw areas as well. I was in Wood Green for years in my London days.
The locations for where these asylum seekers have been placed , spans across everywhere. Affects everyone.
Ymx wrote: ↑Fri Aug 11, 2023 7:52 pm
I blame the notorious right wing fascist millennials and zedders, and the passing of the late lefty boomers for this.
This so called swing is a small reaction of having gone too far!
With respect, there is no equivalence here and if your idea of this is a "small swing" then your credibility in this debate is severely diminished. I'd love to know where you live. Because, I'll bet, like most of the posters pontificating on both sides of this ere long debate on PR (all versions) that it's somewhere middle class + cosy. DAC is excepted from that accusation.
Tell me I'm wrong.
It is in no way further than where we were before. You’ll note my articles from the guardian. Guardian, sky and others appear to have dramatically swung left. As have the generations. I’ve not moved.
Comment about where we live are idiotic. I’m sure most posters here have settled in to better neighbourhoods as they go through life. And most posters here have lived in raw areas as well. I was in Wood Green for years in my London days.
The locations for where these asylum seekers have been placed , spans across everywhere. Affects everyone.
Certain things have swung left like greater equality between sex's, races and greater acceptance of LGQBT. Other things have swung right particularly economically where inequality has continuously increased for over 40 years.
Ymx wrote: ↑Fri Aug 11, 2023 7:52 pm
I blame the notorious right wing fascist millennials and zedders, and the passing of the late lefty boomers for this.
This so called swing is a small reaction of having gone too far!
With respect, there is no equivalence here and if your idea of this is a "small swing" then your credibility in this debate is severely diminished. I'd love to know where you live. Because, I'll bet, like most of the posters pontificating on both sides of this ere long debate on PR (all versions) that it's somewhere middle class + cosy. DAC is excepted from that accusation.
Tell me I'm wrong.
It is in no way further than where we were before. You’ll note my articles from the guardian. Guardian, sky and others appear to have dramatically swung left. As have the generations. I’ve not moved.
Comment about where we live are idiotic. I’m sure most posters here have settled in to better neighbourhoods as they go through life. And most posters here have lived in raw areas as well. I was in Wood Green for years in my London days.
The locations for where these asylum seekers have been placed , spans across everywhere. Affects everyone.
'Everyone else has moved, I've stayed the same'
Listen to yourself for a second ffs.
Re: Dinghy people / asylum
Posted: Sat Aug 12, 2023 8:36 am
by David in Gwent
Guy Smiley wrote: ↑Sat Aug 12, 2023 7:46 am
Ignore, then.
This place has a decent vibe... the old PR style shitfight doesn't really fly here. Flog yourself silly... we know your routine. It's old, tired and boring, not to mention wrong on any which way you want to look at it.
I wasn't shitfighting, I was arguing a point. It was just a debate, it wasn't personal and I said my piece, others are free to argue back or ignore it.
Re: Dinghy people / asylum
Posted: Sat Aug 12, 2023 8:37 am
by David in Gwent
Seriously, if you just want this place to be an echo chamber of similar views then that's fine, just tell me.
Re: Dinghy people / asylum
Posted: Sat Aug 12, 2023 8:43 am
by Ymx
Biffer wrote: ↑Sat Aug 12, 2023 8:33 am
'Everyone else has moved, I've stayed the same'
Listen to yourself for a second ffs.
That’s not a silly comment, as the younger generations are further left, have grown older and have subsequently impacted on journalism and politics.
EDI for corporations did not exist, and has become mainstream in businesses. Even Coutts has changed !!
Re: Dinghy people / asylum
Posted: Sat Aug 12, 2023 8:52 am
by Ymx
David in Gwent wrote: ↑Sat Aug 12, 2023 8:37 am
Seriously, if you just want this place to be an echo chamber of similar views then that's fine, just tell me.
They have been in an echo chamber for a while. The UK politics thread is the F’ing Tory’s thread, and which used to be called “Tory Scum”. So it kind of set the scene.
I don’t think you’ve posted anything aggressive. They have been behaving more PR (less civil attack the poster) than you.
I’d hope you stay for the purpose of balance.
Re: Dinghy people / asylum
Posted: Sat Aug 12, 2023 8:54 am
by Line6 HXFX
For the purpose of balance?
Isn't that how we ended up with global warming?
TV producers used to put one top of their field expert vs one loud mouth shouty idiot on the tele and give them equal billing, for the purposes of Balance?
You've been in this community for two decades saying the same old shit, as you say you have stamina. You quite liked a bit of hostile environment, "Australian points based immigration system", Brexit, and all the rest of it. About 10 years back you were banging on about how the EDL weren't the bad guys and it was wrong to call them Nazis. You are the target market for Tory dog whistles, you are a piece of Farage prime rib. You were given everything you wanted. It's a total mess. People like you are directly to blame for this. You don't get to say "the Tory party is shit" whilst whistling and walking away, the Tories are trying to do all the impossible shit you demanded be done for years and years and fucking years.
Ouch
Yup, that's a bulls eye.
Re: Dinghy people / asylum
Posted: Sat Aug 12, 2023 9:17 am
by David in Gwent
Line6 HXFX wrote: ↑Sat Aug 12, 2023 8:54 am
For the purpose of balance?
Isn't that how we ended up with global warming?
TV producers used to put one top of their field expert vs one loud mouth shouty idiot on the tele and give them equal billing, for the purposes of Balance?
Guy Smiley wrote: ↑Sat Aug 12, 2023 7:46 am
Ignore, then.
This place has a decent vibe... the old PR style shitfight doesn't really fly here. Flog yourself silly... we know your routine. It's old, tired and boring, not to mention wrong on any which way you want to look at it.
I wasn't shitfighting, I was arguing a point. It was just a debate, it wasn't personal and I said my piece, others are free to argue back or ignore it.
I have to agree with this. If you don't like what's being said either debate back or ignore. But the guy is being perfectly polite and in no way stooping to the levels of PR.
Guy Smiley wrote: ↑Sat Aug 12, 2023 7:46 am
Ignore, then.
This place has a decent vibe... the old PR style shitfight doesn't really fly here. Flog yourself silly... we know your routine. It's old, tired and boring, not to mention wrong on any which way you want to look at it.
I wasn't shitfighting, I was arguing a point. It was just a debate, it wasn't personal and I said my piece, others are free to argue back or ignore it.
I have to agree with this. If you don't like what's being said either debate back or ignore. But the guy is being perfectly polite and in no way stooping to the levels of PR.
One person has died and five others are said to be in "serious" conditions after a boat carrying migrants sank in the English Channel.
A joint rescue operation by the British and French coastguards has rescued 50 people, authorities said.
A number of people were seen being brought off a lifeboat on stretchers in Dover. The extent of the other injuries is unclear.
The RNLI said a lifeboat crew was launched just before 04:00 BST.
France's Maritime Prefecture of the Channel and the North Sea said six people were taken by helicopter to a hospital in Calais with one person later pronounced dead.
I wasn't shitfighting, I was arguing a point. It was just a debate, it wasn't personal and I said my piece, others are free to argue back or ignore it.
I have to agree with this. If you don't like what's being said either debate back or ignore. But the guy is being perfectly polite and in no way stooping to the levels of PR.
Appreciate that.
It's not for your benefit but for the benefit of the bored. People taking this "it's not PR nonsense" far too seriously. As I said just because we don't like someone's opinion doesn't mean it should get shut down.
Re: Dinghy people / asylum
Posted: Sat Aug 12, 2023 9:36 am
by Line6 HXFX
O.K. so let's see how genuine and in good faith dac is in debate. Here you go. OS rebuked all his points methodically, one by one.. and so how did dac respond..did he respond as an adult and appreciate and learn from the new information presented, say "I didn't know that, maybe my information is incorrect and I will now readjust my thinking" or did he say "that's just word salad".
David in Gwent wrote: ↑Fri Aug 11, 2023 12:51 pm
What part of what I'm saying is bollocks?
Lets see.
David in Gwent wrote: ↑Fri Aug 11, 2023 10:21 am
The Vans as pictured - We have laws in this country, are you saying the UK is wrong to enforce it's laws?
The laws around nationality in the UK are a convoluted mess. The "go home vans" were part of May's hostile environment and targeted at people legally resident in the UK who could not prove their status, years later this became the Windrush Scandal. The people in the courts trying to apply nationality/immigration law, literally refer to the law as a maze like shanty town.
""the architecture of the rules is not the grand design of Lutyens' Delhi or Haussmann's Paris, but more that of the organic growth responding to the needs of the moment that is a feature of some shanty towns." https://freemovement.org.uk/how-complex ... a-problem/
This shanty town of laws gives rise to situations where someone is born in the UK and stripped of British citizenship in their adulthood leaving them stateless, whilst their sibling retains British citizenship.
David in Gwent wrote: ↑Fri Aug 11, 2023 10:21 am
The making people stateless - It's the migrants who are making themselves stateless, not the Tory party, would you like to see videos of migrants ripping up all of their IDs?.
The type of laws that made more than a few stateless (and are now retroactively stripping people born in the UK of British citizenship), often leaving people to fight the Home Office alone for years. Have been further expanded.
David in Gwent wrote: ↑Fri Aug 11, 2023 1:03 pm
This country, for all of it's faults, is one of the most welcoming, diverse, accepting and non-racist places on the entire planet.
Most of this is subjective, some would agree others wouldn't. The level of diversity is something which can be measured though. The UK definitely isn't one of the most diverse places on the entire planet.
Ethnic diversity:
Linguistic diversity:
David in Gwent wrote: ↑Fri Aug 11, 2023 11:00 am
For the record, I think the Tory party are shit at everything they do and I won't be voting for them ever again but I can't let comments like that slide.
I'll take your word for it. If there's no lie, there is avoidance of taking responsibility though.
You've been in this community for two decades saying the same old shit, as you say you have stamina. You quite liked a bit of hostile environment, "Australian points based immigration system", Brexit, and all the rest of it. About 10 years back you were banging on about how the EDL weren't the bad guys and it was wrong to call them Nazis. You are the target market for Tory dog whistles, you are a piece of Farage prime rib. You were given everything you wanted. It's a total mess. People like you are directly to blame for this. You don't get to say "the Tory party is shit" whilst whistling and walking away, the Tories are trying to do all the impossible shit you demanded be done for years and years and fucking years.
What's your next move in a few years chief? Blame Labour for high immigration levels, maybe a bit of "don't call obvious bad actor a Nazi", and start the loop over again?
Re: Dinghy people / asylum
Posted: Sat Aug 12, 2023 9:38 am
by Insane_Homer
Blackmac wrote: ↑Sat Aug 12, 2023 9:18 am
I have to agree with this. If you don't like what's being said either debate back or ignore. But the guy is being perfectly polite and in no way stooping to the levels of PR.
Relentless tons of shit, how quickly this place now resembles an English river after a nights rain, even with him on ignore.
It's just a matter of time until he resorts to type, so why wait.
Biffer wrote: ↑Sat Aug 12, 2023 8:33 am
'Everyone else has moved, I've stayed the same'
Listen to yourself for a second ffs.
That’s not a silly comment, as the younger generations are further left, have grown older and have subsequently impacted on journalism and politics.
EDI for corporations did not exist, and has become mainstream in businesses. Even Coutts has changed !!
EDI is convenient for corporations, a distraction. I've found the equality, diversity and inclusion training is taken least seriously by the younger participants. Painful watching people take it seriously (usually someone will regurgitate a bit of bullshit verbatim "i know someone who...." - which if you can be bothered to question is bollocks they've read in some tabloid - I did this once as curiosity got the better of me and won't do it again as it extends the training) and prolong the training. It is irritating corporate bullshit mostly clicked through as fast as possible. The electoral calculus the Tory party makes is to make an issue out of this and other social issues positioning themselves in opposition to excite the base and get votes while the party donors get what they want which is to get ever richer and the economic inequality continues to grow as it has for 40+ years. It works.
Re: Dinghy people / asylum
Posted: Sat Aug 12, 2023 9:43 am
by David in Gwent
O.K. so let's see how genuine and in good faith dac is in debate. Here you go. OS rebuked all his points methodically, one by one.. and so how did dac respond..did he respond as an adult and appreciate and learn from the new information presented, say "I didn't know that, maybe my information is correct and I will now readjust my thinking" or did he say "that's just word salad".
Two guesses.
OS made some terrific points btw.
Care to explain what points they were? As I've tried reading that post a few times and it's hard to fathom. For example, OS seems to think Diversity only applies to the colour of someones skin.
You may think that was a bombshell post, but I honestly don't agree. Remember, my only real stance on this thread was that comparing the Tory party to the actual Nazi party was childish and silly.
Blackmac wrote: ↑Sat Aug 12, 2023 9:18 am
I have to agree with this. If you don't like what's being said either debate back or ignore. But the guy is being perfectly polite and in no way stooping to the levels of PR.
Relentless tons of shit, how quickly this place now resembles an English river after a nights rain, even with him on ignore.
It just a matter of time until he resorts to type, so why wait.
When you say "resorts to type" what you actually mean is "when he posts stuff I don't agree with"
Blackmac wrote: ↑Sat Aug 12, 2023 9:18 am
I have to agree with this. If you don't like what's being said either debate back or ignore. But the guy is being perfectly polite and in no way stooping to the levels of PR.
Relentless tons of shit, how quickly this place now resembles an English river after a nights rain, even with him on ignore.
It's just a matter of time until he resorts to type, so why wait.
And if he does, and steps over the mark, fine, get rid, but at the moment, if you think he is trolling, just ignore the guy and he will get bored
Blackmac wrote: ↑Sat Aug 12, 2023 9:18 am
I have to agree with this. If you don't like what's being said either debate back or ignore. But the guy is being perfectly polite and in no way stooping to the levels of PR.
Relentless tons of shit, how quickly this place now resembles an English river after a nights rain, even with him on ignore.
It's just a matter of time until he resorts to type, so why wait.
And if he does, and steps over the mark, fine, get rid, but at the moment, if you think he is trolling, just ignore the guy and he will get bored
What we need is for the ignore function to also hide quoted text from ignored posters. That way DAC can howl at the moon and fling faecal matter at the wall and the ones who insist on engaging can do so while everybody else gets on with it.
Re: Dinghy people / asylum
Posted: Sat Aug 12, 2023 10:03 am
by Insane_Homer
Blackmac wrote: ↑Sat Aug 12, 2023 9:54 am
And if he does, and steps over the mark, fine, get rid
If only the same tolerance for Dinghy people was shown by some on this thread...
Relentless tons of shit, how quickly this place now resembles an English river after a nights rain, even with him on ignore.
It's just a matter of time until he resorts to type, so why wait.
And if he does, and steps over the mark, fine, get rid, but at the moment, if you think he is trolling, just ignore the guy and he will get bored
What we need is for the ignore function to also hide quoted text from ignored posters. That way DAC can howl at the moon and fling faecal matter at the wall and the ones who insist on engaging can do so while everybody else gets on with it.
Biffer wrote: ↑Sat Aug 12, 2023 8:33 am
'Everyone else has moved, I've stayed the same'
Listen to yourself for a second ffs.
That’s not a silly comment, as the younger generations are further left, have grown older and have subsequently impacted on journalism and politics.
EDI for corporations did not exist, and has become mainstream in businesses. Even Coutts has changed !!
So everyone else has changed as they got older but your position has stayed the same as you've got older?
Nope, not what I said.
Old people die, or retire, young people become adults.
Re: Dinghy people / asylum
Posted: Sat Aug 12, 2023 10:11 am
by Line6 HXFX
Dac isn't a troll. He believes this stuff. I used to think dac was unique, and have since encountered hundreds of dacs.
It's unique to Wales, we have some real ignorant right wing, Brit Nat clowns I am afraid to say, and they all sound like dac.
Ironically it's like half of Englands pensioners and oddballs have moved to Wales, and stir up hatred and resentment about immigrants and about 5000 other things.., just so we ignore them using all our resources and taking all our shit.
And if he does, and steps over the mark, fine, get rid, but at the moment, if you think he is trolling, just ignore the guy and he will get bored
What we need is for the ignore function to also hide quoted text from ignored posters. That way DAC can howl at the moon and fling faecal matter at the wall and the ones who insist on engaging can do so while everybody else gets on with it.
Sensible policies for a better bored!
But we don't have that facility.
You're entitled to your opinion. What you're not entitled to is a megaphone and permission to go into people's houses to harangue them with that opinion.
Re: Dinghy people / asylum
Posted: Sat Aug 12, 2023 10:14 am
by David in Gwent
Line6 HXFX wrote: ↑Sat Aug 12, 2023 10:11 am
Dac isn't a troll. He believes this stuff. I used to think dac was unique, and have since encountered hundreds of dacs.
It's unique to Wales, we have some real ignorant right wing, Brit Nat clowns I am afraid to say, and they all sound like dac.
It's like half of Englands pensioners and oddballs have moved to Wales, and stir up hatred and resentment about immigrants, just so we ignore them using all our resources and taking all our shit.
Given the state of Wales, led by Labour, it's NHS, it's roads, it's lack of growth, it's unemployment....no wonder so many Welsh people are turning away from the Reds.
Have you got any examples of stirring up hatred or has this just happened in your head?
Edited to include the fucking state of our Education system.
What we need is for the ignore function to also hide quoted text from ignored posters. That way DAC can howl at the moon and fling faecal matter at the wall and the ones who insist on engaging can do so while everybody else gets on with it.
Sensible policies for a better bored!
But we don't have that facility.
You're entitled to your opinion. What you're not entitled to is a megaphone and permission to go into people's houses to harangue them with that opinion.
Blackmac wrote: ↑Sat Aug 12, 2023 9:54 am
And if he does, and steps over the mark, fine, get rid
If only the same tolerance for Dinghy people was shown by some on this thread...
To be fair I actually find it quite amusing to see those preaching tolerance, frothing at the mouth at the nerve of someone that holds a different opinion.
Re: Dinghy people / asylum
Posted: Sat Aug 12, 2023 10:22 am
by David in Gwent
Dac isn't a troll. He believes this stuff.
What stuff? The only stuff I've posted on this thread is about the Nazi/Tory comparison. I stand by that, it's childish, silly and divisive.
Re: Dinghy people / asylum
Posted: Sat Aug 12, 2023 10:26 am
by Insane_Homer
Blackmac wrote: ↑Sat Aug 12, 2023 10:16 am
To be fair I actually find it quite amusing to see those preaching tolerance, frothing at the mouth at the nerve of someone that holds a different opinion.
To be fair I actually find it quite amusing that holding a different opinion is 'frothing at mouth'?
Blackmac wrote: ↑Sat Aug 12, 2023 9:54 am
And if he does, and steps over the mark, fine, get rid
If only the same tolerance for Dinghy people was shown by some on this thread...
To be fair I actually find it quite amusing to see those preaching tolerance, frothing at the mouth at the nerve of someone that holds a different opinion.
A different opinion is welcome. However when DAC “just asks questions” over and over again in a QAnon tone, we all know exactly where he’s going.
There are dozens of other places on the Interweb where he can ask those same questions and get his jollies.
I don’t want to want to see aggressive Trump/Biden/Nazis chatter on the very few Boreds I visit, thank you.
shaggy wrote: ↑Fri Aug 11, 2023 2:05 pm
Not wishing to step into your Friday pm fun but for vast majority of people the Nazi party equates to concentration camps and mass extermination. The nuances listed above just fly above most peoples heads and you lose the argument.
This can be a great place to learn and exchange views but the ability to actually step outside of your view and see how it lands on other party is completing missing from most discussions.
As you were.
This.
Your trolling has no shame.
You’ve added zero to this actual thread in discussion except thrown insults around. You should have stayed on PR.
Insane_Homer wrote: ↑Sat Aug 12, 2023 10:03 am
If only the same tolerance for Dinghy people was shown by some on this thread...
To be fair I actually find it quite amusing to see those preaching tolerance, frothing at the mouth at the nerve of someone that holds a different opinion.
A different opinion is welcome. However when DAC “just asks questions” over and over again in a QAnon tone, we all know exactly where he’s going.
There are dozens of other places on the Interweb where he can ask those same questions and get his jollies.
I don’t want to want to see aggressive Trump/Biden/Nazis chatter on the very few Boreds I visit, thank you.
What the heck is it with people here and QAnon? It's mystifying. I've vaguely heard of it but to lump everyone with a differing opinion into that bracket is just weird.
I have not been aggressive in any way shape of form, quite the opposite behaviour from yourself and your other bored pals.
One person has died and five others are said to be in "serious" conditions after a boat carrying migrants sank in the English Channel.
A joint rescue operation by the British and French coastguards has rescued 50 people, authorities said.
A number of people were seen being brought off a lifeboat on stretchers in Dover. The extent of the other injuries is unclear.
The RNLI said a lifeboat crew was launched just before 04:00 BST.
France's Maritime Prefecture of the Channel and the North Sea said six people were taken by helicopter to a hospital in Calais with one person later pronounced dead.
6 now confirmed dead. RIP.
It’s pretty horrific. No one wants this.
Boats need to stop being launched. Why are these smugglers so hard to find in France?. Tracking the supplies of boats ? Ffs ! As someone else said, the French have no desire to stop the boats. Now that lives have been lost, let’s hope that it deters others, and that the French start investigating.
