The Official Scottish Rugby Thread

[Slick]

In other news: if you’d told me in January that we’d have 3 starters in the first Test, I’d have been delighted. I’d also have been utterly astonished to learn that one of them would be Ali Price.

I think is safe to say Price has proven a lot of people wrong, it wasn't that long ago that many, including myself, were asking for him to move aside for Scotland. Although he bounced back in the 6N I was amazed he was in the touring party. In saying all that he absolutely deserves his spot and has been easily the best 9 on tour. Really pleased for him.

[Yr Alban]

In other news: if you’d told me in January that we’d have 3 starters in the first Test, I’d have been delighted. I’d also have been utterly astonished to learn that one of them would be Ali Price.

I think is safe to say Price has proven a lot of people wrong, it wasn't that long ago that many, including myself, were asking for him to move aside for Scotland. Although he bounced back in the 6N I was amazed he was in the touring party. In saying all that he absolutely deserves his spot and has been easily the best 9 on tour. Really pleased for him.

Yep. Agree 100%. He’s made it into the 15 on merit. But, speaking as someone else who thought he was a talented liability and thought Scotland should ditch him, I’m very surprised. Delighted for the guy, but surprised. Lions tours really can be the making of some players, and that’s why we’ve missed them so much.

If you’d asked me to say which 3 players I thought would make the team, it would have been Hogg, Mish and Sutherland (post 6N).

[Big D]

Yup fair play to Price.

[Biffer]

Slight tangent gents - without wanting to portray myself as too much of a narrow minded parochial Scot, I've done something which could be considered as rather narrow minded, very parochial and extremely Scottish. Partly because I was bored.

I've gone through the Scots in the UK Olympic team and got a list together of every individual event with a Scot taking part. If folk are interested, I can post day by day on here. Starting with

Yesterday
Women's GB football v Chile (Caroline Weir, Kim Little)

[Biffer]

In other news: if you’d told me in January that we’d have 3 starters in the first Test, I’d have been delighted. I’d also have been utterly astonished to learn that one of them would be Ali Price.

I think is safe to say Price has proven a lot of people wrong, it wasn't that long ago that many, including myself, were asking for him to move aside for Scotland. Although he bounced back in the 6N I was amazed he was in the touring party. In saying all that he absolutely deserves his spot and has been easily the best 9 on tour. Really pleased for him.

Yep. Agree 100%. He’s made it into the 15 on merit. But, speaking as someone else who thought he was a talented liability and thought Scotland should ditch him, I’m very surprised. Delighted for the guy, but surprised. Lions tours really can be the making of some players, and that’s why we’ve missed them so much.

If you’d asked me to say which 3 players I thought would make the team, it would have been Hogg, Mish and Sutherland (post 6N).

Same here. Price has come a long way since his nightmare in Cardiff.

[Biffer]

Slight tangent gents - without wanting to portray myself as too much of a narrow minded parochial Scot, I've done something which could be considered as rather narrow minded, very parochial and extremely Scottish. Partly because I was bored.

I've gone through the Scots in the UK Olympic team and got a list together of every individual event with a Scot taking part. If folk are interested, I can post day by day on here. Starting with

Yesterday
Women's GB football v Chile (Caroline Weir, Kim Little)

And then we'll have

Thursday 23rd July

Rowing - Men's Quad Sculls Heats - Angus Groom and Harry Leask are the Scots rowing alongside Tom Barras and Jack Beaumont. I think we should also claim the fella named after a Glasgow market.
Rowing - Women's Quad Sculls Heats - Lucy Glover rows alongside Hannah Scott and sisters Charlotte and Mathilda Hodgkins-Byrne. Who aren't posh in any way I presume.

[Begbie]

Wales Online aren't taking the team well at all. There was another embarrassing article about Duhan being picked over Adams. I won't link to to it, that rag doesn't deserve the hits.

Its quite funny seeing all the fans that told us to get over it and back the team on previous tours now losing their shit because a few Scots have been selected.

[C T]

Wales Online aren't taking the team well at all. There was another embarrassing article about Duhan being picked over Adams. I won't link to to it, that rag doesn't deserve the hits.

Its quite funny seeing all the fans that told us to get over it and back the team on previous tours now losing their shit because a few Scots have been selected.

It's the assertion that Williams/Adams are sp obviously better than Hogg/VDM.

The calls were very tight.

I want Mish as the starting 7 but totally get it was a tight call. I still think Mish will start at 7 at some point, he has played better on tour. Ultimately though I just found myself thinking "fair play Curry".

[Yr Alban]

Wales Online aren't taking the team well at all. There was another embarrassing article about Duhan being picked over Adams. I won't link to to it, that rag doesn't deserve the hits.

Its quite funny seeing all the fans that told us to get over it and back the team on previous tours now losing their shit because a few Scots have been selected.

Just came here to post the link. I’ll live with giving them the hits.

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rug ... t2I597CWOw

I mentioned the last article being full of entitled disbelief. I regret I was premature, because this one outdoes it by a mile. It’s so obvious that Gatland would have picked Adams over Duhan, that obviously it wasn’t his decision at all, and it’s all the malign influence of Townsend, who is presumably controlling Gatland’s mind in some fiendish way. Nothing to do with VdM being top try scorer in the 6N and being a massive unit who beats defenders for fun, naturally.

I’m wondering whether we can expect a hat-trick, with a third article slating Ali Price being selected over Gareth Davies, but perhaps even WOL aren’t quite that deluded.

[Blackmac]

Wales Online aren't taking the team well at all. There was another embarrassing article about Duhan being picked over Adams. I won't link to to it, that rag doesn't deserve the hits.

Its quite funny seeing all the fans that told us to get over it and back the team on previous tours now losing their shit because a few Scots have been selected.

It's the assertion that Williams/Adams are sp obviously better than Hogg/VDM.

The calls were very tight.

I want Mish as the starting 7 but totally get it was a tight call. I still think Mish will start at 7 at some point, he has played better on tour. Ultimately though I just found myself thinking "fair play Curry".

The level of scrutiny and media bias towards the Scots, both prior to the tour in an effort to see them not selected, and now on the tour has been astonishing. Every small weakness and mistake blown out of proportion. The outcry about Hariss' missed tackle on Kolbe being the most obvious. The best defensive back in the squad was now a liability. Even more galling because a few minutes later Kolbe made an even bigger tit of Itoje, leaving him flat on his arse.

I see both Dawson and Woodward had no Scots in their starting 15 but Greenwood, to his credit had 5.

[KingBlairhorn]

To be honest the entire media rhetoric in the lead up to this test has been hugely defeatist. Every debate seems to be about how best to neutralise some perceived South African advantage rather than about how best to use the weapons the Lions have.

You can see this in the debate about Hogg vs Williams where all the discussion is about Williams being better under the high ball and more defensively sound where surely we could also talk about how the South African tight five are going to struggle with Hogg's tactical kicking and incisive counter-attack. You can see it in the debate about wing places where all the discussion is about the defensive frailty of Duhan where we could talk about the fact that Duhan and Watson are immensely powerful players up against 12.5 stone 5 foot 5 winger. I clearly remember Kolbe being absolutely flattened at one point in the A game, I think by Chris Harris. You can see it in the debate about the tight five and the South African scrum, but you could equally say the Lions have potentially the best tighthead in the game in Furlong and the best lock in Itoje. There are lots of battles to be won and lost all over the pitch, and the Lions have plenty of weapons of their own to bring to the game.

Let's not pretend that the South African team isn't full of world class players sure, but let's also not forget that the Lions is too.

[Yr Alban]

Wales Online aren't taking the team well at all. There was another embarrassing article about Duhan being picked over Adams. I won't link to to it, that rag doesn't deserve the hits.

Its quite funny seeing all the fans that told us to get over it and back the team on previous tours now losing their shit because a few Scots have been selected.

It's the assertion that Williams/Adams are sp obviously better than Hogg/VDM.

The calls were very tight.

I want Mish as the starting 7 but totally get it was a tight call. I still think Mish will start at 7 at some point, he has played better on tour. Ultimately though I just found myself thinking "fair play Curry".

The level of scrutiny and media bias towards the Scots, both prior to the tour in an effort to see them not selected, and now on the tour has been astonishing. Every small weakness and mistake blown out of proportion. The outcry about Hariss' missed tackle on Kolbe being the most obvious. The best defensive back in the squad was now a liability. Even more galling because a few minutes later Kolbe made an even bigger tit of Itoje, leaving him flat on his arse.

I see both Dawson and Woodward had no Scots in their starting 15 but Greenwood, to his credit had 5.

This is exactly how I’ve been feeling. 20 years of virtual exclusion, and now a lot of people seem to think Scottish players have no right to be there at all. Fortunately, in both the squad selection and the team for the first Test, our guys have been treated fairly this time - much to the annoyance of a lot of the same people.

Precious? Probably, but I think after the aforementioned 20 years, we’re allowed a bit of preciousness. But for the first time in forever, I’ll be giving a Lions team, all of them, my full-throated support tomorrow.

[Big D]

It's the assertion that Williams/Adams are sp obviously better than Hogg/VDM.

The calls were very tight.

I want Mish as the starting 7 but totally get it was a tight call. I still think Mish will start at 7 at some point, he has played better on tour. Ultimately though I just found myself thinking "fair play Curry".

The level of scrutiny and media bias towards the Scots, both prior to the tour in an effort to see them not selected, and now on the tour has been astonishing. Every small weakness and mistake blown out of proportion. The outcry about Hariss' missed tackle on Kolbe being the most obvious. The best defensive back in the squad was now a liability. Even more galling because a few minutes later Kolbe made an even bigger tit of Itoje, leaving him flat on his arse.

I see both Dawson and Woodward had no Scots in their starting 15 but Greenwood, to his credit had 5.

This is exactly how I’ve been feeling. 20 years of virtual exclusion, and now a lot of people seem to think Scottish players have no right to be there at all. Fortunately, in both the squad selection and the team for the first Test, our guys have been treated fairly this time - much to the annoyance of a lot of the same people.

Precious? Probably, but I think after the aforementioned 20 years, we’re allowed a bit of preciousness. But for the first time in forever, I’ll be giving a Lions team, all of them, my full-throated support tomorrow.

FWIW, and this may not go down well here. I honestly feel that Gatland has been completely honest in his selections and always taken the decision that he and his coaches feel is correct. In his tenure as Lions head coach, I don't think there are many Scots that have been hard done to. I just think this time we have a group of players that are either excelling, or in a position where there is a bit of a lack of elite quality/form.

[dkm57]

I think Dawson and Woodward can be safely ignored as a pair of irrelevant old buffers, yesterdays news......

[Begbie]

As predicted by many, Mike Blair is Edinburgh's new head coach.

https://www.edinburghrugby.org/the-club ... head-coach

[Jock42]

Happy with that. I hope he has a choice of his staff.

[westport]

Would have preferred someone with more experience.

Be interesting to see if he changes the coaching staff.

[Biffer]

Would have preferred someone with more experience.

Be interesting to see if he changes the coaching staff.

I was never really sure what his role was in the Scotland or Glasgow setups. Assistant coaches usually have some kind of area they're responsible for (attack/defence/scrum/breakdown/skills/whatever) but I've never really seen it mentioned for him.

[Big D]

As predicted by many, Mike Blair is Edinburgh's new head coach.

https://www.edinburghrugby.org/the-club ... head-coach

Promotion through the ranks.

It will be interesting to see if Dalziel breaks through to HC at some point as he'd be the first to fully come through the system from club HC to pro team head coach.

[Big D]

Would have preferred someone with more experience.

Be interesting to see if he changes the coaching staff.

I was never really sure what his role was in the Scotland or Glasgow setups. Assistant coaches usually have some kind of area they're responsible for (attack/defence/scrum/breakdown/skills/whatever) but I've never really seen it mentioned for him.

Skills coach wasn't it? Whatever that means.

[westport]

Would have preferred someone with more experience.

Be interesting to see if he changes the coaching staff.

I was never really sure what his role was in the Scotland or Glasgow setups. Assistant coaches usually have some kind of area they're responsible for (attack/defence/scrum/breakdown/skills/whatever) but I've never really seen it mentioned for him.

I thought I was the only one thinking that

[dpedin]

Would have preferred someone with more experience.

Be interesting to see if he changes the coaching staff.

I was never really sure what his role was in the Scotland or Glasgow setups. Assistant coaches usually have some kind of area they're responsible for (attack/defence/scrum/breakdown/skills/whatever) but I've never really seen it mentioned for him.

Skills coach wasn't it? Whatever that means.

He is an excellent appointment and has been groomed to take over a pro team for some time. Given his previous roles he will know the players well and will hit the ground running. He is a thinker and analytical and will need to have the right guys in the coaching team so as we don't lose what Cockers brought to the team, a hard and ruthless edge. However I think we will see a progression on the team and how we play the game. However he doesn't have much time to get his ideas across and embedded in our team and style of play. New stadium and new coach should hopefully help us progress.

[Yr Alban]

The level of scrutiny and media bias towards the Scots, both prior to the tour in an effort to see them not selected, and now on the tour has been astonishing. Every small weakness and mistake blown out of proportion. The outcry about Hariss' missed tackle on Kolbe being the most obvious. The best defensive back in the squad was now a liability. Even more galling because a few minutes later Kolbe made an even bigger tit of Itoje, leaving him flat on his arse.

I see both Dawson and Woodward had no Scots in their starting 15 but Greenwood, to his credit had 5.

This is exactly how I’ve been feeling. 20 years of virtual exclusion, and now a lot of people seem to think Scottish players have no right to be there at all. Fortunately, in both the squad selection and the team for the first Test, our guys have been treated fairly this time - much to the annoyance of a lot of the same people.

Precious? Probably, but I think after the aforementioned 20 years, we’re allowed a bit of preciousness. But for the first time in forever, I’ll be giving a Lions team, all of them, my full-throated support tomorrow.

FWIW, and this may not go down well here. I honestly feel that Gatland has been completely honest in his selections and always taken the decision that he and his coaches feel is correct. In his tenure as Lions head coach, I don't think there are many Scots that have been hard done to. I just think this time we have a group of players that are either excelling, or in a position where there is a bit of a lack of elite quality/form.

A few months ago I’d have laughed in your face for saying this, but the squad and team selections this time round seem to show that it’s not simply down to Gatland not rating Scottish players, as seemed to be the case before.

Having said that: I did get the abiding impression, especially in 2017, that every 50:50 decision went against the Scotland player by default. Plus there was the matter of the moving goalposts - winning games (as we did v Wales and Ireland in 2017) morphed into winning away as the criterion to be considered. Perhaps we haven’t had quite as many players hard done by as we’d like to think, but there’s no doubt in my mind that Russell and Watson would have been picked for the original squad last time out if they happened to play in red, white or green. I guess having someone on the coaching staff really does help.

[Big D]

This is exactly how I’ve been feeling. 20 years of virtual exclusion, and now a lot of people seem to think Scottish players have no right to be there at all. Fortunately, in both the squad selection and the team for the first Test, our guys have been treated fairly this time - much to the annoyance of a lot of the same people.

Precious? Probably, but I think after the aforementioned 20 years, we’re allowed a bit of preciousness. But for the first time in forever, I’ll be giving a Lions team, all of them, my full-throated support tomorrow.

FWIW, and this may not go down well here. I honestly feel that Gatland has been completely honest in his selections and always taken the decision that he and his coaches feel is correct. In his tenure as Lions head coach, I don't think there are many Scots that have been hard done to. I just think this time we have a group of players that are either excelling, or in a position where there is a bit of a lack of elite quality/form.

A few months ago I’d have laughed in your face for saying this, but the squad and team selections this time round seem to show that it’s not simply down to Gatland not rating Scottish players, as seemed to be the case before.

Having said that: I did get the abiding impression, especially in 2017, that every 50:50 decision went against the Scotland player by default. Plus there was the matter of the moving goalposts - winning games (as we did v Wales and Ireland in 2017) morphed into winning away as the criterion to be considered. Perhaps we haven’t had quite as many players hard done by as we’d like to think, but there’s no doubt in my mind that Russell and Watson would have been picked for the original squad last time out if they happened to play in red, white or green. I guess having someone on the coaching staff really does help.

It would have been hard for any coach to reject the images of the Scotland team bending themselves over in the England game to be fair. East to forget as well that Nel and Jones probably would have toured but for a neck injury and a destroyed hamstring.

We saw in the 2013 tour that Gatland wanted to call up Grant but Rowntree was adamant (and correct) in wanting Corbisiero in the squad. In his book Gatland wrote about the decision to drop BOD. It was him who put it out there but there was agreement from a majority of coaches IIRC. He and people who have coached with him have said he isn't a dictator at all when it comes to selection.

I think for sure the fact there has been no representation in the staff for the last two tours has hurt discussions but that isn't Gatlands fault that Townsend and O'Halloran told him to bolt. Watson was against 2 excellent 7's and Finn possibly could have went ahead of Biggar but Farrell was European player of the year on merit to be fair and Sexton was pretty much close to his peak.

[SomersetJock]

Hey, Somerset - have you made it up here yet?

Hi Yr Alban, sure have. Have had a few issues with my login for this page.

Now a resident of Colwyn Bay

Croeso i Gymru!

I was going to just buy a Now TV pass for Saturday (cancelled Sky Sports a while ago) but do you want to revive the pub idea?

Diolch Yn Fawr

Am booked up for tomorrow unfortunately, definitely up for it with the next two tests though. Was looking out for pubs which are showing the tests, can’t find any in the Bay which is a bit of a surprise, any suggestions ?

[Yr Alban]

Hi Yr Alban, sure have. Have had a few issues with my login for this page.

Now a resident of Colwyn Bay

Croeso i Gymru!

I was going to just buy a Now TV pass for Saturday (cancelled Sky Sports a while ago) but do you want to revive the pub idea?

Diolch Yn Fawr

Am booked up for tomorrow unfortunately, definitely up for it with the next two tests though. Was looking out for pubs which are showing the tests, can’t find any in the Bay which is a bit of a surprise, any suggestions ?

TBH I have got completely out of the habit of going to the pub. Kids just reaching the age when this might be a reasonable option! I’ll see what I can find out.

[Yr Alban]

Croeso i Gymru!

I was going to just buy a Now TV pass for Saturday (cancelled Sky Sports a while ago) but do you want to revive the pub idea?

Diolch Yn Fawr

Am booked up for tomorrow unfortunately, definitely up for it with the next two tests though. Was looking out for pubs which are showing the tests, can’t find any in the Bay which is a bit of a surprise, any suggestions ?

TBH I have got completely out of the habit of going to the pub. Kids just reaching the age when this might be a reasonable option! I’ll see what I can find out.

I’ve asked people on the Nextdoor app. Google seems to think that there’s a couple of decent options in Conwy, which would be about half way between me and you (and you can probably get a train home).

It’s just dawned on me I’m on duty on the day of the 3rd test. FFS.

[Begbie]

Can't be arsed scanning back, so apologies if already posted, but Jake Kerr has signed a permanent deal with Bristol.

[robmatic]

I was never really sure what his role was in the Scotland or Glasgow setups. Assistant coaches usually have some kind of area they're responsible for (attack/defence/scrum/breakdown/skills/whatever) but I've never really seen it mentioned for him.

Skills coach wasn't it? Whatever that means.

He is an excellent appointment and has been groomed to take over a pro team for some time. Given his previous roles he will know the players well and will hit the ground running. He is a thinker and analytical and will need to have the right guys in the coaching team so as we don't lose what Cockers brought to the team, a hard and ruthless edge. However I think we will see a progression on the team and how we play the game. However he doesn't have much time to get his ideas across and embedded in our team and style of play. New stadium and new coach should hopefully help us progress.

He's got two months until the start of the URC season which will hopefully be enough time to explain to the scrum halves that he wants them to occasionally pass to the backs.

I reckon there must be more changes coming to the coaching team, because I doubt that there is a role for Hodge with Blair there as head coach, and we probably need an additional coach to work with the forwards to cover what we will lose with Cockers not there.

[Jock42]

How long has hodge been there now?

[robmatic]

How long has hodge been there now?

Since 2015.

[KingBlairhorn]

I’m not sure Hodge would take the gig, but the U20s looked badly in need of a backs coach. Surely he would do a good job at that level.

[KingBlairhorn]

Wyn-Jones injured, Suzz starts.

4 motherfucken test lions.

[Yr Alban]

Wyn-Jones injured, Suzz starts.

4 motherfucken test lions.

It’ll be 5 by close of play - can’t see Watson not getting on!

Not bad at all from a total of 8 picks, with one out injured.

I could see Harris getting some game time in tests 2 & 3, perhaps even Finn if he recovers in time.

[Big D]

I’m not sure Hodge would take the gig, but the U20s looked badly in need of a backs coach. Surely he would do a good job at that level.

Because his time with Scotland and Edinburgh were successful?

[Big D]

Skills coach wasn't it? Whatever that means.

He is an excellent appointment and has been groomed to take over a pro team for some time. Given his previous roles he will know the players well and will hit the ground running. He is a thinker and analytical and will need to have the right guys in the coaching team so as we don't lose what Cockers brought to the team, a hard and ruthless edge. However I think we will see a progression on the team and how we play the game. However he doesn't have much time to get his ideas across and embedded in our team and style of play. New stadium and new coach should hopefully help us progress.

He's got two months until the start of the URC season which will hopefully be enough time to explain to the scrum halves that he wants them to occasionally pass to the backs.

I reckon there must be more changes coming to the coaching team, because I doubt that there is a role for Hodge with Blair there as head coach, and we probably need an additional coach to work with the forwards to cover what we will lose with Cockers not there.

The fact Hodge wasn't name checked in the release regarding Cockerill going when the S+C coach and MacCrae were probably isn't good news for him.

[Jock42]

How long has hodge been there now?

Since 2015.

I think that's probably long enough then.

[Biffer]

He is an excellent appointment and has been groomed to take over a pro team for some time. Given his previous roles he will know the players well and will hit the ground running. He is a thinker and analytical and will need to have the right guys in the coaching team so as we don't lose what Cockers brought to the team, a hard and ruthless edge. However I think we will see a progression on the team and how we play the game. However he doesn't have much time to get his ideas across and embedded in our team and style of play. New stadium and new coach should hopefully help us progress.

He's got two months until the start of the URC season which will hopefully be enough time to explain to the scrum halves that he wants them to occasionally pass to the backs.

I reckon there must be more changes coming to the coaching team, because I doubt that there is a role for Hodge with Blair there as head coach, and we probably need an additional coach to work with the forwards to cover what we will lose with Cockers not there.

The fact Hodge wasn't name checked in the release regarding Cockerill going when the S+C coach and MacCrae were probably isn't good news for him.

Definitely need someone for scrum, lineout and breakdown.

[Big D]

Price and Duhan had good games. Hogg decent bar one shitting of the bed after the Kolbe knock on.

Watson lucky not to be binned and the Curry debate settled for this tour in terms of who starts.

[Yr Alban]

Price and Duhan had good games. Hogg decent bar one shitting of the bed after the Kolbe knock on.

Watson lucky not to be binned and the Curry debate settled for this tour in terms of who starts.

Agree. Curry put in a mixed performance, but Mish could have been sent off there and if that leads to Curry starting, so be it.

Edit: and after the penalties Curry gave away, Mish could easily have got the nod next time, so he only has himself to blame.

Good shift by all of our lads. Nobody let us down otherwise.