NPR

What I mean is that they must have had intelligence he was planning something that day, given their armed proximity.

Ymx wrote: Fri Sep 03, 2021 1:11 pm What I mean is that they must have had intelligence he was planning something that day, given their armed proximity.

I didn't. Which implies an extraordinary resource burn watching somebody 24/7. Tough decisions by the police. Try to get him out by the courts convinced he's dangerous. Fail. What do you do then? A fair bit of navel gazing as they ponder the laws they don't let the police have an effective tool.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politi ... s-watching

Well, this is an interesting development.

Judith Collins defends not fixing law years ago...

National Party leader Judith Collins wants the Government to be able to strip citizenship or residency from those who have moved to New Zealand but then commit a violent act.

She is also defending her decision in 2013 when, as Justice Minister, she removed a review of counter-terrorism laws from the Law Commission's work programme saying "there does not appear to be any substantial or urgent concerns arising from the operation of the [Terrorism Suppression] Act".

The gap in the law has existed across successive governments and has come under scrutiny in the wake of the terror attack in Auckland yesterday, when a terrorist attacked six people in a supermarket before being shot by police who were surveiling him.

The man, who cannot be named because of court orders, had allegedly been planning a knife attack earlier this year, but he couldn't be charged with planning a terrorist attack because it wasn't an existing offence.

It is, however, an offence in the Counter Terrorism Legislation Bill, currently before select committee, which the National Party supported at first reading.

Collins told RNZ this morning that she had texted Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern last night offering National's support to pass the bill into law under urgency.

Asked about her comments in 2013 about having no substantial or urgent concerns with New Zealand's counter terrorism legislation, she said it was "really unfair" to ask her about decisions from eight years ago.

"You are asking me to reach back without notes to go back and look at eight years ago at decisions made by the Cabinet," Collins told RNZ this morning.

She said she wasn't going to second-guess Cabinet decisions - which would have been made in a particular context, and following consultation - from eight years ago...

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/ ... GN5PQJB4U/

Hmmm...

I have read a recent rumour JuCo's leadership is being challenged this weekend.

He was only under surveillance since being released from prison in July - 51 days (for up to 30 staff a day)

So new law going through (now has the nod) which now makes planning a terrorist attack an offence.

Seems that parliament can stop playing silly buggers and get things done when it is needed.

Name suppression for the Wanaka holiday couple will be lifted, unopposed, in about half an hour.

Should be punishment enough, I'd say. A monetary penalty means nothing to entitled rich people.

Gumboot wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 6:39 am Name suppression for the Wanaka holiday couple will be lifted, unopposed, in about half an hour.

Should be punishment enough, I'd say. A monetary penalty means nothing to entitled rich people.

I missed that. What’s it about? Linky?

Aha, found it. They escaped Aucklowitz

Jeez this is going to be a brutal name and shame. But kudos if they're genuinely taking their licks - hopefully it'll serve as a powerful deterrent.

Auckland still locked down.

Just read 18 new community cases.

That’s not great is it for a zero strategy. Adern recently easing lock down doesn’t seem to be well timed.

The worrying part for me is that it is still out in the community and spreading despite restrictions. I don't think we'll beat this and the Govt is giving everyone an opportunity to get a vaccine before they open the gates.

Right now we are not ready

Enzedder wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 5:46 pm The worrying part for me is that it is still out in the community and spreading despite restrictions. I don't think we'll beat this and the Govt is giving everyone an opportunity to get a vaccine before they open the gates.

Right now we are not ready

We are 82% on 2 vaccine doses, 90% on 1 dose for those over 16’s. And plenty more including those who’ve had it.

And we are getting 30,000 cases a day.

I guess that would be 2,500 cases a day you’ll likely be seeing, with your population, and 10 deaths each day.

Ymx wrote: Sat Sep 04, 2021 7:43 pm So new law going through (now has the nod) which now makes planning a terrorist attack an offence.

Count yourselves lucky that you've managed to last this long without this kind of law on the books.

Ireland has had anti-terrorism legislation since the foundation of State practically; & a Non-Jury, special criminal court; since 1972. One of the regular offenses would be "membership of a proscribed organization", or "possession of materials..."

It's an uncomfortable place to be for a Democracy; but the bottom line is that a Democracy needs to protect itself from people who would seek to destroy it; & that's what these cunts are trying to do.

Arnold Rimmer says the government has "lost control of Covid-19 and is in dangerous denial".

He provides another five points of mumbling airy-fairy shite as a solution. Point 4:

Move from a 'government knows best' approach to an approach of openness, and host all in 'sprints'. In each sprint, the business community and all of society are invited to help reach clearly identified goals of lower transmission rates, hospitalisations and deaths, in time for reopening.

What the actual fudge? What is a "sprint" and how does it apply to the real world? Points 1, 2, 3, and 5 are not much better. "Harm minimisation", "Lock up the vulnerable only", "Vote on when vaccination is complete", It's the "tone" of the thing.

Seymour is a dangerous, student politician, clown masquerading as a serious leader. He's well out of his depth.

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics ... ikato.html

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/covid-19- ... C5G3IM6YA/

Cases South of Auckland now.

Enzedder wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 5:46 pm The worrying part for me is that it is still out in the community and spreading despite restrictions. I don't think we'll beat this and the Govt is giving everyone an opportunity to get a vaccine before they open the gates.

Right now we are not ready

When are they planning to open the gates?

Calculon wrote: Sun Oct 03, 2021 4:48 pm

Enzedder wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 5:46 pm The worrying part for me is that it is still out in the community and spreading despite restrictions. I don't think we'll beat this and the Govt is giving everyone an opportunity to get a vaccine before they open the gates.

Right now we are not ready

When are they planning to open the gates?

I think they were looking to build a wall around Auckland. But it looks like it’s breached the wall and at castle gate (Enz’s parts).

But in seriousness I understand there is no confidence they are going to eradicate it.

I still have no idea why Auckland was shifted from tier 4 to tier 3 when it wasn’t removed from the community.

I don't exactly follow NZ politics but it's interesting to see how countries that have/had a zero covid policy, like China, NZ, Australia, Singapore, Taiwan etc move forward and adapt in the face of new realities. Or not in the case of China.

Restrictions easing while still trying to convince people to get vaxxed.

Looks like the hammer blows alert levels are gone for now.

Seriously wouldn't care if we had to pay the hold outs to get them jabbed

Petition for the Bogus Bishop to be charged over Saturday's anti-lockdown protest rally:

https://www.change.org/p/nz-police-comm ... rect=false

Up to almost 85,000 signatures now. When I signed a few hours ago it was 55,000.

I would sign but then I would hate getting blitzed to sign every other cause known to mankind - bloody algorithms

Ymx wrote: Sun Oct 03, 2021 5:26 pm ... I still have no idea why Auckland was shifted from tier 4 to tier 3 when it wasn’t removed from the community.

The official explanation given last week was that containment/elimination could be done just as well at Level 3 as at level 4.

Which of course begs the question so why was NZ in Level 4 for so long last year and Auckland for so long this year?

100k signatures and counting. Hang the witch!

https://www.change.org/p/nz-police-comm ... rect=false

The purpose of a vaccine is to prevent infection and transmission.
In that regard these vaccines fail because the vaccinated can not only become infected but they can also spread it.
So the entire concept of "protecting the vaccinated" is a con. To summarize Ardern and Joke, “We must protect the protected by forcing the same protection on the unprotected that did not protect the protected.”

Yes, the vaccine appears to lessen symptoms but for how long? Maybe just 6 months. So do we not only police vaccination cards but also their expiry date?

In contrast, those umpteen millions known to have been infected and to have recovered, and those maybe uncountable umpteen millions more infected without even realizing it appear to have ongoing immunity ... and that last part raises the question of why force injections to protect against a pox so deadly that the great bulk of the infected need to be tested to determine whether or not they even have or have had it?

Calculon wrote: Sun Oct 03, 2021 4:48 pm

Enzedder wrote: Sun Sep 26, 2021 5:46 pm The worrying part for me is that it is still out in the community and spreading despite restrictions. I don't think we'll beat this and the Govt is giving everyone an opportunity to get a vaccine before they open the gates.

Right now we are not ready

When are they planning to open the gates?

The deemed satisfactory vaccination rate can be moved at whim to maintain control of the populace.

For example, the other day on the TV I watched Biden get his booster, and as he rolled his sleeve back down he mumbled "We need to get to 98 per cent".
That of course is impossible, but then his mutter had nothing to do with the health of the American people and everything to do with keeping the nonsense going through to the US mid-term elections next year so the Dems can pull off another mail-in ballot swindle and take the Senate while retaining the House.
They could then enforce the necessary changes that will not only keep them in power forever but will revert that country to Year Zero to be totally remodelled.

^ Who is this clown?

Gumboot wrote: Mon Oct 04, 2021 6:20 am 100k signatures and counting. Hang the witch!

https://www.change.org/p/nz-police-comm ... rect=false

105k now.

Change.org is supposed to be about lobbying for change.

What’s the deal with needing a change.org in
order to arrest someone for breaking a law?

I mean you guys made such a big deal of an Auckland couple escaping.

This is quite literally 1000 times worse for COVID.

Ymx wrote: Mon Oct 04, 2021 7:09 am I mean you guys made such a big deal of an Auckland couple escaping.

This is quite literally 1000 times worse for COVID.

They're facing charges, he isn't...yet.

Gumboot wrote: Mon Oct 04, 2021 7:47 am

Ymx wrote: Mon Oct 04, 2021 7:09 am I mean you guys made such a big deal of an Auckland couple escaping.

This is quite literally 1000 times worse for COVID.

They're facing charges, he isn't...yet.

So nothing needs to change as they’ve not dismissed it. It’s just a venting mechanism

Muttonbird wrote: Mon Oct 04, 2021 6:30 am ^ Who is this clown?

How about attempting to counter my logic with your own logic to show that I am in fact a clown.

Consider the Trump-Putin Collusion farce.

There was never the slightest hint of such.
It was nothing more than concocted crap that was deliberately dragged out over years in order to maintain a public distrust of Trump through to the mid-term 2018 elections.
With huge help from the complicit Mainstream Media, this tactic succeeded in turning the House from the Republicans to the Democrats.
Under Pelosi's leadership the Democrat-controlled House was then able to conjure up a couple of farcical impeachments of Trump to try to undermine him for the 2020 Presidential elections.

I am not diverting from the NZ politics thread by mentioning this.
Anyone paying the slightest bit of attention will have noticed how progressive elements within NZ have in recent weeks begun mimicking the extremist calls of those US progressives who now hold sway over the once-moderate US Democrat Party.

Planet Rugby is calling out for some like yourself and a strong belief in justice. I just don’t think we’re worthy of someone with that depth of understanding and information.

Ymx wrote: Mon Oct 04, 2021 3:52 pm

Gumboot wrote: Mon Oct 04, 2021 7:47 am

Ymx wrote: Mon Oct 04, 2021 7:09 am I mean you guys made such a big deal of an Auckland couple escaping.

This is quite literally 1000 times worse for COVID.

They're facing charges, he isn't...yet.

So nothing needs to change as they’ve not dismissed it. It’s just a venting mechanism

Indeed.

There's a widespread perception that the cops are going easy on the charlatan and his cronies, while still charging others for breach offences, ie double standards. Especially after this stunt they pulled earlier in the year: https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/437 ... 3-lockdown

Hence the venting.

130,000+ signatures now...

I see the counter petition, Stand-by Tamaki, is now up to 3000.

The police have finally charged the cunt.

Police have confirmed a 63-year-old man has been summonsed to court for organising a mass gathering event at Auckland Domain over the weekend.

Superintendent Shanan Gray, the acting Auckland City District Commander, says the man has been summonsed to appear next Tuesday in the Auckland District Court.

"The man will be appearing on charges which relate to Breaching the COVID-19 Public Health Response Act 2020 and Alert Level 3 Order," Gray says.

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zeal ... ation.html

Gumboot wrote: Tue Oct 05, 2021 3:56 am The police have finally charged the cunt.

Police have confirmed a 63-year-old man has been summonsed to court for organising a mass gathering event at Auckland Domain over the weekend.

Superintendent Shanan Gray, the acting Auckland City District Commander, says the man has been summonsed to appear next Tuesday in the Auckland District Court.

"The man will be appearing on charges which relate to Breaching the COVID-19 Public Health Response Act 2020 and Alert Level 3 Order," Gray says.

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zeal ... ation.html

But you’ve only got to 147,000

ScarfaceClaw wrote: Mon Oct 04, 2021 7:45 pm ... I just don’t think we’re worthy of someone with that depth of understanding and information.

Wasn't going to bother, but ...
You lot could at least make yourselves more worthy by offering counter-arguments rather than just tossing sarcasm or Muttonbird's dismissive "Who is this clown?", as if those on their own suffice to debunk my points.

I turned 73 on Tuesday so yes, by age alone I would have seen and experienced a lot more than most on here.
As such, I am fully aware that the progressive extremists whether in the US or NZ have not just suddenly popped up out of nowhere.
This has all been many decades in the making.

Take just one personal close acquaintance.
My best mate at Intermediate school became extremely prominent in HART and was instrumental in getting the black nations to boycott the Montreal Olympics because of the 1976 All Black tour to South Africa.
His public persona was that of someone deeply concerned for the welfare of the downtrodden black masses, but he didn't give a stuff about them. His hoped-for end game was a Red South Africa, just as he wished for with the wars in Angola and Mozambique.
And he lauded Beijing's total subjugation of the Tibetan people and their culture, a direct contrast to his sham posture re. Africa of "liberation for the oppressed".

Throughout his high school years he was a member of the local branch of NZ's Progressive Youth Movement (Communist Cubs).
As a university student he was a leading figure in NZ's Anti-Vietnam War movement, again his goal being not that of his stated "liberation and reunification for the Vietnamese people" but for a Red Vietnam and a consequent Red South-East Asia.
In the early 1970s he pilgrimaged to China, his invite to Beijing owing to the Soviet-Sino split which saw the NZ Communist Party be the sole Western communist party to side with the Chinese.

Becoming very prominent in the NZ-China Friendship Association, he adored and supported Beijing's Cambodian Khmer Rouge protégées.
When told directly and firmly that the Khmer Rouge takeover of Cambodia would result in calamity for that population, then just as how in our youth I had several times heard him gloat out the Red mantra of "You can't make an omelette without breaking some eggs", he sneered "All the capitalists there deserve to die." Reality was that, as a nation of peasants, the great bulk of those Cambodians who would perish under their Red regime were ordinary farmers and their families.

And so, yep, today we have front man Joe Biden, the Great Healer, and there's Jacinda "Be Kind", and all has become so rosy and safe and comforting without The Orange One, and let's all thank god that there are now adults not just in the room but lurking in the shadows.

--------------- ---------------
(cue a "Reds Under The Bed" snort)

You should meet up with Globus. I hear he did the mortgage application for Nelson Mandela and and helped Stalin out with that summer dacha in the Black Forest.

convoluted wrote: Mon Oct 04, 2021 7:21 pm

Muttonbird wrote: Mon Oct 04, 2021 6:30 am ^ Who is this clown?

How about attempting to counter my logic with your own logic to show that I am in fact a clown.

Consider the Trump-Putin Collusion farce.

There was never the slightest hint of such.
It was nothing more than concocted crap that was deliberately dragged out over years in order to maintain a public distrust of Trump through to the mid-term 2018 elections.
With huge help from the complicit Mainstream Media, this tactic succeeded in turning the House from the Republicans to the Democrats.
Under Pelosi's leadership the Democrat-controlled House was then able to conjure up a couple of farcical impeachments of Trump to try to undermine him for the 2020 Presidential elections.

I am not diverting from the NZ politics thread by mentioning this.
Anyone paying the slightest bit of attention will have noticed how progressive elements within NZ have in recent weeks begun mimicking the extremist calls of those US progressives who now hold sway over the once-moderate US Democrat Party.

Ok, mate. I just thought your post fell into that anti-science, conspiracy theory, hyper individualist, anarchy camp where the rednecks who rioted at the Capitol live. I reference the Capitol riots because from your comments it looks like that is the political arena you are most obsessed with.

vaccine

noun
a substance used to stimulate the production of antibodies and provide immunity against one or several diseases, prepared from the causative agent of a disease, its products, or a synthetic substitute, treated to act as an antigen without inducing the disease.

immunity

noun
1. the ability of an organism to resist a particular infection or toxin by the action of specific antibodies or sensitised white blood cells.

The dictionary definitions simply don't support what you are saying about vaccines. In real life vaccines do not work in black and white. Neither is immunity black and white. You appear to be taking a position on vaccines by drawing from statements which you believe to be guaranteeing a particular non-real world outcome.

The concept vaccines protect the vaccinated is not a con, it is a fact. It's not perfect like in your mind some filthy progressive promised you, but it will most likely stop you dying from Covid-19 and also stop you from unnecessarily clogging up the health system. So what if a booster shot is required after six months? That updates your digital vaccination certificate which are being designed with exactly that in mind. I get why anti-vaxxers are so scared, they actually have to participate in society for the first time rather than reject their fellow citizens.

You claim governments are using vaccination to maintain control of the populous. Well, that is true if by 'control' you mean 'safety'. Your post, like all anti-vax arguments, made no sense to me so I replied with brevity.