NPR

tabascoboy wrote: ↑Tue Nov 22, 2022 6:47 pm Well due to lower than expected wind power generation and "the world cup effect" this warning went out earlier but was later cancelled. The warning was actually aimed at the suppliers to the National Grid to ensure they met their obligations but allegedly we've been able to buy in supply from across the Channel and they expect to meet demand....

The England v Wales match next week is apparently a time of concern if too many people decide to make a cup of tea at half time.

Doesn't really bode too well for the cold and dark months ahead...

yermum wrote: ↑Thu Nov 24, 2022 1:59 pm As I could swan around with a smug holier than thou attitude and feel very pleased with myself.

yermum wrote: ↑Thu Nov 24, 2022 1:59 pm Just had a Air source heat pump quote back.

The running costs are higher than gas.

I am finding it difficult to justify the massive outlay on getting one fitted. (£10000 with the grant)

If the grants etc covered a greater amount of the outlay I would suck up the higher costs of running. As I could swan around with a smug holier than thou attitude and feel very pleased with myself.

However mother earth can go fuck herself for now as I don't have ten large sitting around just to allow myself to one up the neighbours.

GogLais wrote: ↑Thu Nov 24, 2022 2:05 pm

yermum wrote: ↑Thu Nov 24, 2022 1:59 pm As I could swan around with a smug holier than thou attitude and feel very pleased with myself.

Just give a few quid to charity every month, works for me.

yermum wrote: ↑Thu Nov 24, 2022 2:03 pm

Biffer wrote: ↑Wed Nov 23, 2022 10:22 pm If England get to the quarter final prepare for blackouts.

Anyone know how much the national grid in the uk would localise blackouts?

Ideally just in Scotland as they won't be needing half time cups of tea. (I'm here all week folks.)

yermum wrote: ↑Thu Nov 24, 2022 1:59 pm Just had a Air source heat pump quote back.

The running costs are higher than gas.

I am finding it difficult to justify the massive outlay on getting one fitted. (£10000 with the grant)

If the grants etc covered a greater amount of the outlay I would suck up the higher costs of running. As I could swan around with a smug holier than thou attitude and feel very pleased with myself.

However mother earth can go fuck herself for now as I don't have ten large sitting around just to allow myself to one up the neighbours.

Dinsdale Piranha wrote: ↑Thu Nov 24, 2022 3:54 pm

yermum wrote: ↑Thu Nov 24, 2022 1:59 pm Just had a Air source heat pump quote back.

The running costs are higher than gas.

I am finding it difficult to justify the massive outlay on getting one fitted. (£10000 with the grant)

If the grants etc covered a greater amount of the outlay I would suck up the higher costs of running. As I could swan around with a smug holier than thou attitude and feel very pleased with myself.

However mother earth can go fuck herself for now as I don't have ten large sitting around just to allow myself to one up the neighbours.

How big a unit? I'm considering one for my flat combined with under floor heating.

tabascoboy wrote: ↑Thu Nov 24, 2022 2:10 pm

yermum wrote: ↑Thu Nov 24, 2022 1:59 pm Just had a Air source heat pump quote back.

The running costs are higher than gas.

I am finding it difficult to justify the massive outlay on getting one fitted. (£10000 with the grant)

If the grants etc covered a greater amount of the outlay I would suck up the higher costs of running. As I could swan around with a smug holier than thou attitude and feel very pleased with myself.

However mother earth can go fuck herself for now as I don't have ten large sitting around just to allow myself to one up the neighbours.

Honestly can't see much appeal to convert at the moment, only reason would be if the gas supply either becomes much more expensive or there is a shortage meaning domestic supply is rationed. In either case we still rely on gas for electricity generation so neither of those reasons would go away, simply transfer to electricity supply particularly with increased demand for EV charging.

There is the environmental aspect of course, but can't see net zero being attainable while maintaining supply either without a big increase in nuclear power or the holy grail of cheap fusion power. Feel like taking for granted heating and energy supply at affordable cost is a thing of the past.

yermum wrote: ↑Thu Nov 24, 2022 1:59 pm Just had a Air source heat pump quote back.

The running costs are higher than gas.

I am finding it difficult to justify the massive outlay on getting one fitted. (£10000 with the grant)

If the grants etc covered a greater amount of the outlay I would suck up the higher costs of running. As I could swan around with a smug holier than thou attitude and feel very pleased with myself.

However mother earth can go fuck herself for now as I don't have ten large sitting around just to allow myself to one up the neighbours.

Biffer wrote: ↑Thu Nov 24, 2022 8:02 pm

yermum wrote: ↑Thu Nov 24, 2022 1:59 pm Just had a Air source heat pump quote back.

The running costs are higher than gas.

I am finding it difficult to justify the massive outlay on getting one fitted. (£10000 with the grant)

If the grants etc covered a greater amount of the outlay I would suck up the higher costs of running. As I could swan around with a smug holier than thou attitude and feel very pleased with myself.

However mother earth can go fuck herself for now as I don't have ten large sitting around just to allow myself to one up the neighbours.

I think it’s only worth it if you go the whole hog and get solar panels / wind turbine / battery system so that you’re not paying for much externally generated electricity. I’d probably look at the heat pump last of those options to complete the system, but have it designed as a system to be as close to self sufficient as practical.

Biffer wrote: ↑Wed Nov 23, 2022 10:22 pm If England get to the quarter final prepare for blackouts.

Anyone know how much the national grid in the uk would localise blackouts?

yermum wrote: ↑Fri Nov 25, 2022 9:10 am

Biffer wrote: ↑Thu Nov 24, 2022 8:02 pm

yermum wrote: ↑Thu Nov 24, 2022 1:59 pm Just had a Air source heat pump quote back.

The running costs are higher than gas.

I am finding it difficult to justify the massive outlay on getting one fitted. (£10000 with the grant)

If the grants etc covered a greater amount of the outlay I would suck up the higher costs of running. As I could swan around with a smug holier than thou attitude and feel very pleased with myself.

However mother earth can go fuck herself for now as I don't have ten large sitting around just to allow myself to one up the neighbours.

I think it’s only worth it if you go the whole hog and get solar panels / wind turbine / battery system so that you’re not paying for much externally generated electricity. I’d probably look at the heat pump last of those options to complete the system, but have it designed as a system to be as close to self sufficient as practical.

We have solar and battery but it still didn't quite add up.

There needs to be a change in electricity pricing to make heat pumps a viable option.

S/Lt_Phillips wrote: ↑Wed Dec 14, 2022 12:57 pm Dear citizens of NPR, some advice requested.

I live in a timber-frame house that's about 25 years old. The windows are double-glazed, but with wooden frames which have seen better days and a few of the units have blown. The heating system is a traditional non-condensing gas boiler, gravity fed with hot water tank (i.e. not a combi). The boiler is working fine, but the motorised valves sometimes pass (i.e. the radiators heat up when only the hot water is on), and also when it's on frost-protection mode (it's in the garage, so this happens quite a bit in winter) the radiators also heat up, so the diverter valve is passing.

Question: which to replace first? Windows or boiler? Which will give the best energy saving, and which is likely to give the shortest payback?

TIA.

S/Lt_Phillips wrote: ↑Wed Dec 14, 2022 2:18 pm I've replaced about half of them as I've decorated, and put TRVs in, but I have another 5 to do, which don't yet have a TRV. I'm wondering about getting programmable ones.

inactionman wrote: ↑Wed Dec 14, 2022 3:08 pm We really need to look at updating our boiler, it looks all shiny and new but the service engineer reckons it's over 20 years old.

Has boiler technology moved much in 20 years? It's a combi that heats a pressurised watertank, can't believe there's much radical change.

We will definitely being fitting a hive controller or similar, it's got some ancient and baffling Honeywell wireless thing that seems to randomly turn things on and off.

S/Lt_Phillips wrote: ↑Wed Dec 14, 2022 2:18 pm Cheers chaps, mucho appreciated. The double-glazing salesman told me the opposite of course, but I wouldn't be at all surprised to discover he's was a lying shyster.

Good shout on replacing the radiators too - hadn't appreciated that they will help with efficiency. I've replaced about half of them as I've decorated, and put TRVs in, but I have another 5 to do, which don't yet have a TRV. I'm wondering about getting programmable ones.

Blackmac wrote: ↑Wed Dec 14, 2022 4:55 pm

S/Lt_Phillips wrote: ↑Wed Dec 14, 2022 2:18 pm Cheers chaps, mucho appreciated. The double-glazing salesman told me the opposite of course, but I wouldn't be at all surprised to discover he's was a lying shyster.

Good shout on replacing the radiators too - hadn't appreciated that they will help with efficiency. I've replaced about half of them as I've decorated, and put TRVs in, but I have another 5 to do, which don't yet have a TRV. I'm wondering about getting programmable ones.

Replacing an old system boiler with a combo is not always that straight forward. Combi systems work under pressure you have to be prepared that you might experience leaks from the pipe work that was not installed to cope with that pressure.

Blackmac wrote: ↑Wed Dec 14, 2022 4:55 pm

S/Lt_Phillips wrote: ↑Wed Dec 14, 2022 2:18 pm Cheers chaps, mucho appreciated. The double-glazing salesman told me the opposite of course, but I wouldn't be at all surprised to discover he's was a lying shyster.

Good shout on replacing the radiators too - hadn't appreciated that they will help with efficiency. I've replaced about half of them as I've decorated, and put TRVs in, but I have another 5 to do, which don't yet have a TRV. I'm wondering about getting programmable ones.

Replacing an old system boiler with a combo is not always that straight forward. Combi systems work under pressure you have to be prepared that you might experience leaks from the pipe work that was not installed to cope with that pressure.

tc27 wrote: ↑Wed Dec 14, 2022 4:35 pm

inactionman wrote: ↑Wed Dec 14, 2022 3:08 pm We really need to look at updating our boiler, it looks all shiny and new but the service engineer reckons it's over 20 years old.

Has boiler technology moved much in 20 years? It's a combi that heats a pressurised watertank, can't believe there's much radical change.

We will definitely being fitting a hive controller or similar, it's got some ancient and baffling Honeywell wireless thing that seems to randomly turn things on and off.

Modern ones extract heat from the exhaust gas to and are upper 90th percentile efficient.

petej wrote: ↑Wed Dec 14, 2022 6:18 pm

Blackmac wrote: ↑Wed Dec 14, 2022 4:55 pm

S/Lt_Phillips wrote: ↑Wed Dec 14, 2022 2:18 pm Cheers chaps, mucho appreciated. The double-glazing salesman told me the opposite of course, but I wouldn't be at all surprised to discover he's was a lying shyster.

Good shout on replacing the radiators too - hadn't appreciated that they will help with efficiency. I've replaced about half of them as I've decorated, and put TRVs in, but I have another 5 to do, which don't yet have a TRV. I'm wondering about getting programmable ones.

Replacing an old system boiler with a combo is not always that straight forward. Combi systems work under pressure you have to be prepared that you might experience leaks from the pipe work that was not installed to cope with that pressure.

Not sure you would want to take out the tank if we are eventually moving to heat pumps.

tabascoboy wrote: ↑Wed Dec 14, 2022 6:24 pm

Blackmac wrote: ↑Wed Dec 14, 2022 4:55 pm

S/Lt_Phillips wrote: ↑Wed Dec 14, 2022 2:18 pm Cheers chaps, mucho appreciated. The double-glazing salesman told me the opposite of course, but I wouldn't be at all surprised to discover he's was a lying shyster.

Good shout on replacing the radiators too - hadn't appreciated that they will help with efficiency. I've replaced about half of them as I've decorated, and put TRVs in, but I have another 5 to do, which don't yet have a TRV. I'm wondering about getting programmable ones.

Replacing an old system boiler with a combo is not always that straight forward. Combi systems work under pressure you have to be prepared that you might experience leaks from the pipe work that was not installed to cope with that pressure.

That's why I went for a regular condenser boiler 4 years ago, the old pipes would've probably blown to pieces...


There is a thing called pressure testing..Just sayin....


Set my radiator flow to 60 °C as they advise now, it is more economical and although not one room will rise above 18 °C after several hours (some barely manage 15 °C) , it's better than using it for less time with higher heat IMO. HW is on a timer for when it's needed, I don't use the thermostat, only use the CH when I'm at home and switch it on/off manually as required - no more than 6 hours a day to keep to a budget.

weegie01 wrote: ↑Wed Dec 14, 2022 3:01 pm We get two loads of wood pellets a year for our 6 ton hopper, usually circa 5 tons at a time.

Typically one load goes in early December, the other late January / early February, so we have not bought a load since then. We paid circa £1,200 for a 5 ton load.

I have just been quoted £480 per ton for delivery before Christmas.

Ouch

Edit.
To add insult to injury, we had to put in wall air vents in the three rooms in which we have woodburners. It is -8 outside today. You can feel the cold draft coming in from the other side of the room.

TB63 wrote: ↑Wed Dec 14, 2022 7:58 pmWhat's the rating of the wood burners? 5kw or below doesn't need air vents.. Alternatively, look at installing direct ducted air to the stove.. What types have you got, might be able to help..

Ovals wrote: ↑Thu Dec 15, 2022 1:00 pm My energy supplier has just put up my monthly DD from £156 to £353. So about £4K per year.

I suspect we'll come in some way below that as we now have a 5KW log burning stove. We get half loads of Logs at £60 per go and they'll last about 6-8weeks.

Ovals wrote: ↑Thu Dec 15, 2022 1:00 pm My energy supplier has just put up my monthly DD from £156 to £353. So about £4K per year.

I suspect we'll come in some way below that as we now have a 5KW log burning stove. We get half loads of Logs at £60 per go and they'll last about 6-8weeks.

Blackmac wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 10:33 am Currently spending £9 a day on gas alone. This time last year it was £2.40.

tabascoboy wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 11:29 am

Blackmac wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 10:33 am Currently spending £9 a day on gas alone. This time last year it was £2.40.

Kept it to under £7 per day ( last year £2.10). Some very cold nights here but not as low as some parts of England like Oxfordshire and nothing like Scotland's deep freeze

weegie01 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 3:20 pm My younger son had turned down the heating in his flat substantially to economise. He is in London and had a call from his flatmate to say the boiler was leaking. Apparently rain has blown in through the pipe in the wall and frozen, blowing the boiler. I have no idea how that happens, but given the standard of work the cowboys who did the conversion from a hotel to flats, it does not surprise me.

Apparently he may have got away with it if the boiler had not been off so much.

So time for a new boiler.