Page 184 of 185
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2025 7:21 am
by Slick
Firewater wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 5:42 am
PornDog wrote: ↑Thu Mar 06, 2025 12:27 pm
Tichtheid wrote: ↑Thu Mar 06, 2025 12:20 pm
I hope the Putin propagandists are reading this;
Ukrainian opposition leaders have dismissed the idea of holding a wartime election, after a media report of contacts between them and US officials and in the wake of President Donald Trump calling his Ukrainian counterpart Volodymyr Zelenskyy a “dictator” for not holding one, Reuters reports.
Former Ukrainian president Petro Poroshenko said on Thursday his team was working with US “partners” to maintain support for Ukraine – but he added that he was opposed to a wartime election.
In a written statement published on Telegram, Poroshenko said elections should only happen after peace had been established. He added that a vote should take place no later than 180 days after the end of the war.
Yuliia Tymoshenko, another opposition leader, said her team “is talking with all our allies who can help in securing a just peace as soon as possible,” and said that elections should not take place before this had been achieved.
Politico reported on Wednesday that four senior members of Trump’s entourage had held discussions with some of Zelenskiy’s top political opponents.
The talks were held with Tymoshenko and senior members of the party of Poroshenko, who was president from 2014 to 2019, Politico reported, citing three Ukrainian lawmakers and a U.S. Republican foreign policy expert.
The discussions focused on whether Ukraine could have quick presidential elections, according to the report.
Of everything this batshit crazy White House has done over the last few weeks, this has to be the absolute worst. They're essentially trying to depose Zelensky!
The Hhite House wants an election. That is long overdue. I woudl say if a fair election is held Zelensky would have about a zero chance of winning but thats life
Im in favour of peace and the Ukrainian people having the right to vote for their leader
Why are you ignoring the fact that even the Ukrainian opposition parties don’t want an election at this time? And what are you basing the “zero chance of winning” on?
Also, what’s your plan for allowing all the regions under Russian occupation a fair and free vote, not to mention all the soldiers on the front line and all the civilians under daily bombardment?
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2025 7:27 am
by Firewater
Hugo wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 6:06 am
The Cold War actually spurred a lot of excellence in the West in every conceivable domain because people were motivated by the need to defeat Communism. It manifested itself in scientific innovation, athletic excellence, the arts etc. Societies really need these grand projects to give everyone a sense of shared purpose and to push the boundaries.
What you've seen in Europe in the past 30 years is stagnation. Having to figure out stuff without the caretaking of the US and having to meet the challenge posed by China and Russia might instill a drive and motivation not seen in Europe for a long time.
Outsourcing manufacturing overseas and defence to the US is not a viable option unless you want to be in a state of dependence. Maybe Europe is poised for a Renaissance?
""Maybe Europe is poised for a Renaissance?"
Maybe but I can't see it. Too many factors holding them back. Including net zero. Whereas China will continue to power ahead without crap holding then back.
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2025 7:29 am
by Guy Smiley
Slick, you don't have to quote him to reply mate. Please.
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2025 7:38 am
by Firewater
Slick wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 7:21 am
Firewater wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 5:42 am
PornDog wrote: ↑Thu Mar 06, 2025 12:27 pm
Of everything this batshit crazy White House has done over the last few weeks, this has to be the absolute worst. They're essentially trying to depose Zelensky!
The Hhite House wants an election. That is long overdue. I woudl say if a fair election is held Zelensky would have about a zero chance of winning but thats life
Im in favour of peace and the Ukrainian people having the right to vote for their leader
Why are you ignoring the fact that even the Ukrainian opposition parties don’t want an election at this time? And what are you basing the “zero chance of winning” on?
Also, what’s your plan for allowing all the regions under Russian occupation a fair and free vote, not to mention all the soldiers on the front line and all the civilians under daily bombardment?
Start with a ceasefire then hold an election. Zelensky will have to be pushed into this though
It would be best for him to take the money and find a safe country. But suspect he loves the limelight too much so will try to hold on
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2025 7:48 am
by Slick
Firewater wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 7:38 am
Slick wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 7:21 am
Firewater wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 5:42 am
The Hhite House wants an election. That is long overdue. I woudl say if a fair election is held Zelensky would have about a zero chance of winning but thats life
Im in favour of peace and the Ukrainian people having the right to vote for their leader
Why are you ignoring the fact that even the Ukrainian opposition parties don’t want an election at this time? And what are you basing the “zero chance of winning” on?
Also, what’s your plan for allowing all the regions under Russian occupation a fair and free vote, not to mention all the soldiers on the front line and all the civilians under daily bombardment?
Start with a ceasefire then hold an election. Zelensky will have to be pushed into this though
It would be best for him to take the money and find a safe country. But suspect he loves the limelight too much so will try to hold on
What about the fact the opposition don’t want one? And are you suggesting that this free and fair election can still be held in occupied areas during the ceasefire? Will Putin let areas he thinks are his vote in a Ukrainian election?
And this zero chance of winning thing?
Come on man, this is your chance to shine and prove you aren’t just regurgitating stuff you saw online.
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2025 7:48 am
by Slick
Guy Smiley wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 7:29 am
Slick, you don't have to quote him to reply mate. Please.
Shit, sorry, done it again. I’ll stop
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2025 8:01 am
by laurent
Slick wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 7:48 am
Guy Smiley wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 7:29 am
Slick, you don't have to quote him to reply mate. Please.
Shit, sorry, done it again. I’ll stop
+ Stop replying it's like playing chess with a pigeon
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2025 8:20 am
by Firewater
Guy Smiley wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 7:29 am
Slick, you don't have to quote him to reply mate. Please.
scared of any sound viewpoint that opposes yours
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2025 8:35 am
by Margin__Walker
Slick wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 7:48 am
Firewater wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 7:38 am
Slick wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 7:21 am
Why are you ignoring the fact that even the Ukrainian opposition parties don’t want an election at this time? And what are you basing the “zero chance of winning” on?
Also, what’s your plan for allowing all the regions under Russian occupation a fair and free vote, not to mention all the soldiers on the front line and all the civilians under daily bombardment?
Start with a ceasefire then hold an election. Zelensky will have to be pushed into this though
It would be best for him to take the money and find a safe country. But suspect he loves the limelight too much so will try to hold on
What about the fact the opposition don’t want one? And are you suggesting that this free and fair election can still be held in occupied areas during the ceasefire? Will Putin let areas he thinks are his vote in a Ukrainian election?
And this zero chance of winning thing?
Come on man, this is your chance to shine and prove you aren’t just regurgitating stuff you saw online.
Wait until he finds out who the second most popular guy is according to the polls
Not exactly a dove in this context.
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2025 8:41 am
by Tichtheid
What are the origins of calls for elections in Ukraine? They aren’t coming from Ukrainian opposition parties, who is doing it?
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2025 8:44 am
by Guy Smiley
Tichtheid wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 8:41 am
What are the origins of calls for elections in Ukraine? They aren’t coming from Ukrainian opposition parties, who is doing it?
Vlad, via his talking sock puppet, GAGA.
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2025 10:35 am
by Slick
Firewater, you are throwing out accusations of people being "scared of any viewpoint that apposes yours" but you seem incapable of answering pretty basic questions, so do you actually have any thought out viewpoints? Or are you just spewing stuff you have read on the internet with no questioning or thinking?
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2025 10:40 am
by I like neeps
Tichtheid wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 8:41 am
What are the origins of calls for elections in Ukraine? They aren’t coming from Ukrainian opposition parties, who is doing it?
My suspicion is that part of the peace agreement the US and Russia are working on is that Zelesnsky steps down.
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2025 10:54 am
by Tichtheid
I like neeps wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 10:40 am
Tichtheid wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 8:41 am
What are the origins of calls for elections in Ukraine? They aren’t coming from Ukrainian opposition parties, who is doing it?
My suspicion is that part of the peace agreement the US and Russia are working on is that Zelesnsky steps down.
Quite possibly, but who benefits from Zelensky stepping down?
From out here it looks like he has been a very successful war time leader who has galvanised his country into standing up to seemingly impossible odds.
It appears to me that the US would benefit from a mineral rights deal and Putin would benefit from the installation of someone sympathetic to his goals of annexation of Ukraine.
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:31 pm
by Yeeb
Is Russia still recruiting afghans to attack their enemies ? Seems to have been yet another isolated incident in Germany where an armed Afghan has tried to act the bollocks & is now with his 57 virgins thanks to ze Schtuzpolizei
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:37 pm
by Biffer
Hugo wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 6:06 am
If nothing else it looks like Europe has been stirred out of its complacency over the past week.
The Cold War actually spurred a lot of excellence in the West in every conceivable domain because people were motivated by the need to defeat Communism. It manifested itself in scientific innovation, athletic excellence, the arts etc. Societies really need these grand projects to give everyone a sense of shared purpose and to push the boundaries.
What you've seen in Europe in the past 30 years is stagnation. Having to figure out stuff without the caretaking of the US and having to meet the challenge posed by China and Russia might instill a drive and motivation not seen in Europe for a long time.
Outsourcing manufacturing overseas and defence to the US is not a viable option unless you want to be in a state of dependence. Maybe Europe is poised for a Renaissance?
If we can take advantage of it properly. The spending on defence has been a significant part of the US taking the tech lead in business for the last fifty or sixty years. Europe could, if it wanted to, recruit all these people being laid off in the US, invest in defence, science and tech and become independently technically dominant.
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:42 pm
by tabascoboy
Tichtheid wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 10:54 am
I like neeps wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 10:40 am
Tichtheid wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 8:41 am
What are the origins of calls for elections in Ukraine? They aren’t coming from Ukrainian opposition parties, who is doing it?
My suspicion is that part of the peace agreement the US and Russia are working on is that Zelesnsky steps down.
Quite possibly, but who benefits from Zelensky stepping down?
From out here it looks like he has been a very successful war time leader who has galvanised his country into standing up to seemingly impossible odds.
It appears to me that the US would benefit from a mineral rights deal and Putin would benefit from the installation of someone sympathetic to his goals of annexation of Ukraine.
It's pretty clear that Russia sees Zelensky as an intractable obstacle to their aim of forcing what is effectively surrender terms for ceasefire and they've convinced Trump ( if he ever needed convincing) of the same. This almost certainly was the motivation for the Oval Office ambush on Zelensky, to try and weaken his position. Both Russia and the US need someone more pliable who will bend the knee and accept any terms no matter how one-sided in advantage.
Meanwhile
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:52 pm
by Hellraiser
Firewater wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 5:42 am
PornDog wrote: ↑Thu Mar 06, 2025 12:27 pm
Tichtheid wrote: ↑Thu Mar 06, 2025 12:20 pm
I hope the Putin propagandists are reading this;
Ukrainian opposition leaders have dismissed the idea of holding a wartime election, after a media report of contacts between them and US officials and in the wake of President Donald Trump calling his Ukrainian counterpart Volodymyr Zelenskyy a “dictator” for not holding one, Reuters reports.
Former Ukrainian president Petro Poroshenko said on Thursday his team was working with US “partners” to maintain support for Ukraine – but he added that he was opposed to a wartime election.
In a written statement published on Telegram, Poroshenko said elections should only happen after peace had been established. He added that a vote should take place no later than 180 days after the end of the war.
Yuliia Tymoshenko, another opposition leader, said her team “is talking with all our allies who can help in securing a just peace as soon as possible,” and said that elections should not take place before this had been achieved.
Politico reported on Wednesday that four senior members of Trump’s entourage had held discussions with some of Zelenskiy’s top political opponents.
The talks were held with Tymoshenko and senior members of the party of Poroshenko, who was president from 2014 to 2019, Politico reported, citing three Ukrainian lawmakers and a U.S. Republican foreign policy expert.
The discussions focused on whether Ukraine could have quick presidential elections, according to the report.
Of everything this batshit crazy White House has done over the last few weeks, this has to be the absolute worst. They're essentially trying to depose Zelensky!
The Hhite House wants an election. That is long overdue. I woudl say if a fair election is held Zelensky would have about a zero chance of winning but thats life
Im in favour of peace and the Ukrainian people having the right to vote for their leader
You are so full of shit.
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:53 pm
by Hellraiser
Slick wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 10:35 am
Firewater, you are throwing out accusations of people being "scared of any viewpoint that apposes yours" but you seem incapable of answering pretty basic questions, so do you actually have any thought out viewpoints? Or are you just spewing stuff you have read on the internet with no questioning or thinking?
It's DAC.
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2025 1:01 pm
by Uncle fester
Tichtheid wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 10:54 am
I like neeps wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 10:40 am
Tichtheid wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 8:41 am
What are the origins of calls for elections in Ukraine? They aren’t coming from Ukrainian opposition parties, who is doing it?
My suspicion is that part of the peace agreement the US and Russia are working on is that Zelesnsky steps down.
Quite possibly, but who benefits from Zelensky stepping down?
From out here it looks like he has been a very successful war time leader who has galvanised his country into standing up to seemingly impossible odds.
It appears to me that the US would benefit from a mineral rights deal and Putin would benefit from the installation of someone sympathetic to his goals of annexation of Ukraine.
Well when Russia invades again in a few years time, it'll be easier if they have Zelensky out of the way and a more pliable person in charge who might even surrender straight away.
He could easily meet an unfortunate accident to make sure he doesn't get to come back to public office.
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2025 1:01 pm
by Yeeb
Hellraiser wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:53 pm
Slick wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 10:35 am
Firewater, you are throwing out accusations of people being "scared of any viewpoint that apposes yours" but you seem incapable of answering pretty basic questions, so do you actually have any thought out viewpoints? Or are you just spewing stuff you have read on the internet with no questioning or thinking?
It's DAC.
Not sure it is, I called him out and he normally never avoids a chance to insult me with some bantz .
Also seems a bit more verbose in tone than dacster, but not as badly soeltfjfjf as kertimjsnxmak desk fjsk djs d sh dens
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2025 1:02 pm
by Uncle fester
Hellraiser wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:53 pm
Slick wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 10:35 am
Firewater, you are throwing out accusations of people being "scared of any viewpoint that apposes yours" but you seem incapable of answering pretty basic questions, so do you actually have any thought out viewpoints? Or are you just spewing stuff you have read on the internet with no questioning or thinking?
It's DAC.
Had assumed it was calypso king off PR?
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2025 1:32 pm
by Tichtheid
Uncle fester wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 1:01 pm
Tichtheid wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 10:54 am
I like neeps wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 10:40 am
My suspicion is that part of the peace agreement the US and Russia are working on is that Zelesnsky steps down.
Quite possibly, but who benefits from Zelensky stepping down?
From out here it looks like he has been a very successful war time leader who has galvanised his country into standing up to seemingly impossible odds.
It appears to me that the US would benefit from a mineral rights deal and Putin would benefit from the installation of someone sympathetic to his goals of annexation of Ukraine.
Well when Russia invades again in a few years time, it'll be easier if they have Zelensky out of the way and a more pliable person in charge who might even surrender straight away.
He could easily meet an unfortunate accident to make sure he doesn't get to come back to public office.
I think that is certain to happen.
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2025 2:22 pm
by Hellraiser
Tichtheid wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 1:32 pm
Uncle fester wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 1:01 pm
Tichtheid wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 10:54 am
Quite possibly, but who benefits from Zelensky stepping down?
From out here it looks like he has been a very successful war time leader who has galvanised his country into standing up to seemingly impossible odds.
It appears to me that the US would benefit from a mineral rights deal and Putin would benefit from the installation of someone sympathetic to his goals of annexation of Ukraine.
Well when Russia invades again in a few years time, it'll be easier if they have Zelensky out of the way and a more pliable person in charge who might even surrender straight away.
He could easily meet an unfortunate accident to make sure he doesn't get to come back to public office.
I think that is certain to happen.
If it hasn't happened yet, it's not going to. He'll be heavily protected for the rest of his life.
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2025 3:22 pm
by Hellraiser
Zelenskyy's approval rating has risen to 68%. Yeah, zero chance of re-election.
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2025 4:18 pm
by Flockwitt
Trump table thumping that'll he'll increase sanctions on Russia. After he paused aid and turned off intel sharing then Russia launched a massive missile strike on Ukraine.
Despicable.
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2025 4:38 pm
by Flockwitt
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2025 11:56 pm
by Hellraiser

Ukrainian Mirage at the moment of shooting down Russian cruise missile Kh-101 during the morning missile attack.
Source.
@yigal_levin
First combat use of Mirage 2000-5s last night.
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Sat Mar 08, 2025 2:19 am
by Hellraiser
As Germany’s defence stocks go ballistic, armsmakers are tooling up
They are snapping up staff and sites from ailing firms
Defence is now by far the most dynamic sector of German industry,” says Armin Papperger, chief executive of Rheinmetall, Germany’s biggest arms producer. Until recently no one, including Mr Papperger, the firm’s boss for the past 12 years, would have believed it. But as European countries prepare for a big boost to defence spending, Rheinmetall and its peers, including Hensoldt, a maker of electronic-warfare equipment such as radars, and Renk, which manufactures military vehicles, are scaling up production as quickly as they are able.
A surge of demand caused by the war in Ukraine has made defence firms stars among Germany’s listed companies. Their share prices have leapt. Announcements on March 4th by Friedrich Merz, set to become Germany’s next chancellor, made them shine more brightly still (see chart). His aim is to exempt defence spending above 1% of gdp from the country’s fiscal rules, and set up a €500bn ($535bn) infrastructure fund. Germany’s stockmarket soared, led by the construction and defence firms that will benefit the most.
The fortunes of a once maligned industry have reversed rapidly. Until Russia’s full-scale invasion of Ukraine in 2022 defence companies were considered the Schmuddelkinder (grubby urchins) of German industry. Rheinmetall was not even among the 40 members of the DAX, the German stockmarket’s blue-chip index. European funds using environmental, social and governance (esg) criteria shunned the shares of defence companies. Successive governments kept cutting expenditure on military equipment as a share of gdp. Tepid demand at home forced Rheinmetall to look abroad. It set up shop in Australia, Britain and Hungary.
The urchins are now looking far better turned out. Rheinmetall is Germany’s tenth-largest company by value. Some esg investors are overcoming their misgivings. But to become true industrial aristocrats Germany’s defence firms have to take advantage of the splurge of defence spending. That would give them the opportunity to become the saviours of well-paid industrial jobs that are threatened by another conflict. Donald Trump is threatening heavy tariffs on European goods imported to America—the most important destination for German exports.
Defence firms have to add capacity swiftly to supply a growing demand for new kit. Although governments generally favour domestic firms, America’s giant defence companies will happily fill any gaps. Ironically, the travails of other German manufacturers, struggling with a stagnant economy at home and faltering exports, may help. Rheinmetall, Hensoldt, Renk and knds, a Franco-German company, are negotiating to take over factories from beleaguered firms in other industries, as well as offering to hire the workers they are about to let go.
In February KNDS took over an entire plant in Saxony from Alstom, a French trainmaker, to build tanks. Production will switch from double-decker train carriages and trams to Leopard 2 tanks and Boxer armoured vehicles later this year, with the entire retooling of the site due to be completed in 2027. Around 580 of the 700 employees will get a job at KNDS or move to another Alstom site.
Hensoldt is in talks with two huge suppliers of car parts, Bosch and Continental, to take on some of their staff. Both are cutting jobs and closing factories because production of vehicles in Europe has failed to regain its pre-pandemic levels. At the end of this year Conti will end production at Wetzlar, in Hesse, and cut 370 jobs. Luckily, Hensoldt has a factory close by. “Last week 150 Conti employees came to our open house in Wetzlar,” says Joachim Schranzhofer, a spokesman for the firm. Hensoldt is also keen to hire entire teams of software engineers from carmakers and their suppliers.
Rheinmetall also struck an agreement with Conti to offer jobs at its new ammunition factory in Unterlüss, in Lower Saxony, to some of the 900 workers who will be laid off from a plant in Gifhorn, 55km to the south. It is planning to retool sites in Berlin and Neuss that made parts for car companies and energy firms to make weapons and ammunition instead.
Germany’s defence firms have ambitious targets. Hensoldt is aiming to double its revenues from €2.2bn ($2.4bn) last year to €5bn by 2030. Rheinmetall says it wants its sales to grow from €10bn in 2024 to €20bn in 2027 and eventually to €30bn. It aspires to a market capitalisation that will stand comparison with those of America’s defence giants. Such heights are still far away. Even so, the Schmuddelkinder are moving up in the world. ■
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Sat Mar 08, 2025 8:31 am
by Sandstorm
Hellraiser wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 2:19 am
As Germany’s defence stocks go ballistic, armsmakers are tooling up
They are snapping up staff and sites from ailing firms
Defence is now by far the most dynamic sector of German industry,” says Armin Papperger, chief executive of Rheinmetall, Germany’s biggest arms producer. Until recently no one, including Mr Papperger, the firm’s boss for the past 12 years, would have believed it. But as European countries prepare for a big boost to defence spending, Rheinmetall and its peers, including Hensoldt, a maker of electronic-warfare equipment such as radars, and Renk, which manufactures military vehicles, are scaling up production as quickly as they are able.
A surge of demand caused by the war in Ukraine has made defence firms stars among Germany’s listed companies. Their share prices have leapt. Announcements on March 4th by Friedrich Merz, set to become Germany’s next chancellor, made them shine more brightly still (see chart). His aim is to exempt defence spending above 1% of gdp from the country’s fiscal rules, and set up a €500bn ($535bn) infrastructure fund. Germany’s stockmarket soared, led by the construction and defence firms that will benefit the most.
The fortunes of a once maligned industry have reversed rapidly. Until Russia’s full-scale invasion of Ukraine in 2022 defence companies were considered the Schmuddelkinder (grubby urchins) of German industry. Rheinmetall was not even among the 40 members of the DAX, the German stockmarket’s blue-chip index. European funds using environmental, social and governance (esg) criteria shunned the shares of defence companies. Successive governments kept cutting expenditure on military equipment as a share of gdp. Tepid demand at home forced Rheinmetall to look abroad. It set up shop in Australia, Britain and Hungary.
The urchins are now looking far better turned out. Rheinmetall is Germany’s tenth-largest company by value. Some esg investors are overcoming their misgivings. But to become true industrial aristocrats Germany’s defence firms have to take advantage of the splurge of defence spending. That would give them the opportunity to become the saviours of well-paid industrial jobs that are threatened by another conflict. Donald Trump is threatening heavy tariffs on European goods imported to America—the most important destination for German exports.
Defence firms have to add capacity swiftly to supply a growing demand for new kit. Although governments generally favour domestic firms, America’s giant defence companies will happily fill any gaps. Ironically, the travails of other German manufacturers, struggling with a stagnant economy at home and faltering exports, may help. Rheinmetall, Hensoldt, Renk and knds, a Franco-German company, are negotiating to take over factories from beleaguered firms in other industries, as well as offering to hire the workers they are about to let go.
In February KNDS took over an entire plant in Saxony from Alstom, a French trainmaker, to build tanks. Production will switch from double-decker train carriages and trams to Leopard 2 tanks and Boxer armoured vehicles later this year, with the entire retooling of the site due to be completed in 2027. Around 580 of the 700 employees will get a job at KNDS or move to another Alstom site.
Hensoldt is in talks with two huge suppliers of car parts, Bosch and Continental, to take on some of their staff. Both are cutting jobs and closing factories because production of vehicles in Europe has failed to regain its pre-pandemic levels. At the end of this year Conti will end production at Wetzlar, in Hesse, and cut 370 jobs. Luckily, Hensoldt has a factory close by. “Last week 150 Conti employees came to our open house in Wetzlar,” says Joachim Schranzhofer, a spokesman for the firm. Hensoldt is also keen to hire entire teams of software engineers from carmakers and their suppliers.
Rheinmetall also struck an agreement with Conti to offer jobs at its new ammunition factory in Unterlüss, in Lower Saxony, to some of the 900 workers who will be laid off from a plant in Gifhorn, 55km to the south. It is planning to retool sites in Berlin and Neuss that made parts for car companies and energy firms to make weapons and ammunition instead.
Germany’s defence firms have ambitious targets. Hensoldt is aiming to double its revenues from €2.2bn ($2.4bn) last year to €5bn by 2030. Rheinmetall says it wants its sales to grow from €10bn in 2024 to €20bn in 2027 and eventually to €30bn. It aspires to a market capitalisation that will stand comparison with those of America’s defence giants. Such heights are still far away. Even so, the Schmuddelkinder are moving up in the world. ■
Called it

Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Sat Mar 08, 2025 9:45 am
by tabascoboy
Flockwitt wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 4:18 pm
Trump table thumping that'll he'll increase sanctions on Russia. After he paused aid and turned off intel sharing then Russia launched a massive missile strike on Ukraine.
Despicable.
Infantile moron discovers that being a subservient tool for Vlad bears real consequences shock...
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Sat Mar 08, 2025 11:08 am
by Hellraiser
Poland is introducing mandatory military service for all men, raising the armed forces plus active reserve to 500,000, and looking at following Lithuania in withdrawing from the convention on cluster munitions.
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Sat Mar 08, 2025 11:46 am
by Rhubarb & Custard
I thought Poland was going non mandatory but with incentives.
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Sat Mar 08, 2025 6:13 pm
by Yeeb
Rhubarb & Custard wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 11:46 am
I thought Poland was going non mandatory but with incentives.
Killing Russians is a pretty good incentive
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Sat Mar 08, 2025 8:37 pm
by Enzedder
Sandstorm wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 8:31 am
Hellraiser wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 2:19 am
As Germany’s defence stocks go ballistic, armsmakers are tooling up
They are snapping up staff and sites from ailing firms
Defence is now by far the most dynamic sector of German industry,” says Armin Papperger, chief executive of Rheinmetall, Germany’s biggest arms producer. Until recently no one, including Mr Papperger, the firm’s boss for the past 12 years, would have believed it. But as European countries prepare for a big boost to defence spending, Rheinmetall and its peers, including Hensoldt, a maker of electronic-warfare equipment such as radars, and Renk, which manufactures military vehicles, are scaling up production as quickly as they are able.
A surge of demand caused by the war in Ukraine has made defence firms stars among Germany’s listed companies. Their share prices have leapt. Announcements on March 4th by Friedrich Merz, set to become Germany’s next chancellor, made them shine more brightly still (see chart). His aim is to exempt defence spending above 1% of gdp from the country’s fiscal rules, and set up a €500bn ($535bn) infrastructure fund. Germany’s stockmarket soared, led by the construction and defence firms that will benefit the most.
The fortunes of a once maligned industry have reversed rapidly. Until Russia’s full-scale invasion of Ukraine in 2022 defence companies were considered the Schmuddelkinder (grubby urchins) of German industry. Rheinmetall was not even among the 40 members of the DAX, the German stockmarket’s blue-chip index. European funds using environmental, social and governance (esg) criteria shunned the shares of defence companies. Successive governments kept cutting expenditure on military equipment as a share of gdp. Tepid demand at home forced Rheinmetall to look abroad. It set up shop in Australia, Britain and Hungary.
The urchins are now looking far better turned out. Rheinmetall is Germany’s tenth-largest company by value. Some esg investors are overcoming their misgivings. But to become true industrial aristocrats Germany’s defence firms have to take advantage of the splurge of defence spending. That would give them the opportunity to become the saviours of well-paid industrial jobs that are threatened by another conflict. Donald Trump is threatening heavy tariffs on European goods imported to America—the most important destination for German exports.
Defence firms have to add capacity swiftly to supply a growing demand for new kit. Although governments generally favour domestic firms, America’s giant defence companies will happily fill any gaps. Ironically, the travails of other German manufacturers, struggling with a stagnant economy at home and faltering exports, may help. Rheinmetall, Hensoldt, Renk and knds, a Franco-German company, are negotiating to take over factories from beleaguered firms in other industries, as well as offering to hire the workers they are about to let go.
In February KNDS took over an entire plant in Saxony from Alstom, a French trainmaker, to build tanks. Production will switch from double-decker train carriages and trams to Leopard 2 tanks and Boxer armoured vehicles later this year, with the entire retooling of the site due to be completed in 2027. Around 580 of the 700 employees will get a job at KNDS or move to another Alstom site.
Hensoldt is in talks with two huge suppliers of car parts, Bosch and Continental, to take on some of their staff. Both are cutting jobs and closing factories because production of vehicles in Europe has failed to regain its pre-pandemic levels. At the end of this year Conti will end production at Wetzlar, in Hesse, and cut 370 jobs. Luckily, Hensoldt has a factory close by. “Last week 150 Conti employees came to our open house in Wetzlar,” says Joachim Schranzhofer, a spokesman for the firm. Hensoldt is also keen to hire entire teams of software engineers from carmakers and their suppliers.
Rheinmetall also struck an agreement with Conti to offer jobs at its new ammunition factory in Unterlüss, in Lower Saxony, to some of the 900 workers who will be laid off from a plant in Gifhorn, 55km to the south. It is planning to retool sites in Berlin and Neuss that made parts for car companies and energy firms to make weapons and ammunition instead.
Germany’s defence firms have ambitious targets. Hensoldt is aiming to double its revenues from €2.2bn ($2.4bn) last year to €5bn by 2030. Rheinmetall says it wants its sales to grow from €10bn in 2024 to €20bn in 2027 and eventually to €30bn. It aspires to a market capitalisation that will stand comparison with those of America’s defence giants. Such heights are still far away. Even so, the Schmuddelkinder are moving up in the world. ■
Called it
They are three years too late. In this, I agree with trump
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Sat Mar 08, 2025 10:14 pm
by Flockwitt
For those unsure of the trajectory of the conflict the latest RfU drop is a good encapsulation of that. More directly relevant though is to just listen to Trump. How does disinformation work? You start off with the biggest lie - an unwinnable war!!!
To go back to the example of just what the future will look like in the Ukraine conflict as it heads into 2026, the Ukrainian are sped up to the contact line in state-of-the-art French armoured vehicles. They created local fire superiority which the Russians then need to reinforce. Unfortunately for the Russians (sic) Ukraine also has artillery and drone dominance over the Russia supply lines. On the battlefield scale it seems insignificant. Ukraine only retook a few blocks of houses, it was a skirmish. However in the process they eliminated half a dozen pieces of Russian equipment and about a platoon of troops as reinforcements were being brought up for effectively zero losses. The Russians were being reinforced via BMP2s note that would have been cut to pieces even if they had got to the front line.
With continued support this is the outcome of the war. Ukrainians while not getting overwhelming firepower are getting this qualitative edge that will turn the tide.
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Sun Mar 09, 2025 11:21 am
by Flockwitt
The US has vetoed the Canadian G7 proposal to set up a task force to monitor the shadow oil fleet.
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Sun Mar 09, 2025 11:23 am
by dpedin
Flockwitt wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 10:14 pm
For those unsure of the trajectory of the conflict the latest RfU drop is a good encapsulation of that. More directly relevant though is to just listen to Trump. How does disinformation work? You start off with the biggest lie - an unwinnable war!!!
To go back to the example of just what the future will look like in the Ukraine conflict as it heads into 2026, the Ukrainian are sped up to the contact line in state-of-the-art French armoured vehicles. They created local fire superiority which the Russians then need to reinforce. Unfortunately for the Russians (sic) Ukraine also has artillery and drone dominance over the Russia supply lines. On the battlefield scale it seems insignificant. Ukraine only retook a few blocks of houses, it was a skirmish. However in the process they eliminated half a dozen pieces of Russian equipment and about a platoon of troops as reinforcements were being brought up for effectively zero losses. The Russians were being reinforced via BMP2s note that would have been cut to pieces even if they had got to the front line.
With continued support this is the outcome of the war. Ukrainians while not getting overwhelming firepower are getting this qualitative edge that will turn the tide.
Putin is desperate for a settlement so he can refresh his forces. As said above he is losing men and equipment at a horrendous rate and cant continue. Even Kim Yung Un and the NK will not sustain these losses forever. The sanctions have had a big impact on his ability to rearm quickly and his economy and currency is tanking. His main weapon is long range drone and missile strikes aimed at civilians and Ukraine infrastructures - a war of terror! Trump, who I am convinced is Krasnov, has agreed with Putin he will both disable Ukraine's US capabilities and push for a cease fire on Putins terms to allow him to regroup and rearm. In return Trump/Krasnov will get his 'share' of Ukraines resources once the country falls. There is no other explanation for Trumps decisions.
However all Ukrainians know they are faced with an impossible decision - continue fighting to the end or else surrender and end up in a Gulag for life, fall out of a 12th floor window, murdered in a prison, raped and enslaved and their children sent to Russia for brainwashing. It isn't really a decision to be honest, I am not sure the US Tango Twat and his bunch of sycophants appreciate this? They seem to think the Ukrainians will just roll over and give up once their dodgy deal with Putin is struck? It will get very very messy and if it does end up as the worst case scenario I cant see Trump and US surviving their treacherous behaviors intact.
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Sun Mar 09, 2025 11:32 am
by Hellraiser
OSINT researcher Richard Vereker continues to note a trend of significant reduction in losses of Russian T-72 and T-62 tanks. The most striking decline is in the T-72 category. The researcher notes that the ratio of Russian losses still includes very few of the oldest versions of the T-72 - the T-72 Ural, T-72A and T-72AV - although these tanks remain in the largest number in storage bases. Vereker believes that the reason is the difficulty in reactivating these tanks, which the Russians are unable to organize.
@yigal_levin
The bottom of the barrel has been reached for T-72s and T-62s.
Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Posted: Sun Mar 09, 2025 12:34 pm
by tabascoboy
Sounds like things not going so well for UA for their Kursk operation with ground being lost steadily, which would be unfortunate from the POV of tit-for-tat land occupation leverage but have to wonder if these forces would be better redeployed along the main front lines in areas where UA forces have been more successful lately for counterattacks around Pokrovsk and Toretsk?
Even so, Russia continues to waste human lives to little effect
"This unit also stated that they had prepared everything: ventilation, settling tanks, water and provisions, communications, etc. But it turned out that they had been screwed and had not prepared. Everyone on the ground knows the result. The question is - will there be a charge for those who suffocated?," Russian milblogger Romanov reports.