NPR

In a shocking turn of events, that nobody could have forseen, Tulsa experiences a surge in covid cases...

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/08/us/p ... rally.html

Raggs wrote: ↑Thu Jul 09, 2020 8:04 am In a shocking turn of events, that nobody could have forseen, Tulsa experiences a surge in covid cases...

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/08/us/p ... rally.html

Yeah, but according to Team Trump, no one is talking about it spreading at BLM marches so it doesn't count. These guys run the USA, fucking hell.

I see SCOTUS has ruled that NY state prosecutors have the right to subpoena Trump's financial records

Trump's administration have already shown they have zero fucks to give for subpoena's: see impeachment.

Slick wrote: ↑Thu Jul 09, 2020 8:12 am

Raggs wrote: ↑Thu Jul 09, 2020 8:04 am In a shocking turn of events, that nobody could have forseen, Tulsa experiences a surge in covid cases...

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/08/us/p ... rally.html

Yeah, but according to Team Trump, no one is talking about it spreading at BLM marches so it doesn't count. These guys run the USA, fucking hell.

Are they not? I must have imagine plenty attempts to delegitimise the protests along those lines when it was clear labelling them all looters wasn't doing the trick. Imagine my shock that my recollections of real life don't align with the Trumper narrative.

I really hope that this is going to be yet another virtue signaling thread. I honestly can’t see the purpose of post after post saying how terrible Trump is. I don’t know who they are trying to impress. I am sure that all the posters who can vote for the US president have got the message by now.

How do you discuss Trump and US politics without referencing the daily awfulness? It's not "virtue signalling" to point that shit out. Your mistake is assuming anyone's trying to impress anyone else.

This is a genuinely insane administration.

Not really, Fangle. The democrats have been painted as such an intolerable scourge by Faux news, etc. that Freddy Kreuger could run effectively as the GOP candidate.

Gotta own the libs.

edit: yeah, what JM2K6 said.

Have at it then. I find it tedious to repeat what is on virtually every news outlet. And who watches Fox anyway.

Fangle wrote: ↑Thu Jul 09, 2020 3:35 pm Have at it then. I find it tedious to repeat what is on virtually every news outlet. And who watches Fox anyway.

A lot of people.

There wouldn't be so much discussion of how awful Trump, his administration and many supporting republicans (McConnell, Graham) are if they stopped being so, y'know, awful on such a regular basis.

Fangle wrote: ↑Thu Jul 09, 2020 3:35 pm Have at it then. I find it tedious to repeat what is on virtually every news outlet. And who watches Fox anyway.

I'm sure you understand just how unique a situation this is. So much stuff happens with Trump and the Republicans on a near-daily basis. His lies alone reach insane numbers. It's exhausting for anyone trying to keep up with it all, which is why threads with multiple people contributing to it are so useful.

Fangle wrote: ↑Thu Jul 09, 2020 3:35 pm Have at it then. I find it tedious to repeat what is on virtually every news outlet. And who watches Fox anyway.

I do take your point. I'm hoping the recent court decision re; 45's tax documents will feed new, interesting fuel to the discussion as it is getting a little dull to just cover EVERY stupid or despicable thing he says or does.

Today's mathematical aberration struck me as being particularly inane, for example.

Ali Cadoo wrote: ↑Thu Jul 09, 2020 3:13 pm Trump's administration have already shown they have zero fucks to give for subpoena's: see impeachment.

Trump isn't the first to show up the checks and balances supposedly in place, but there are probably more abuses than before. In theory Congress could step it up and start detaining people, so could the executive if they pursued the criminal law process though one suspects when it's the executive telling people not to attend and the executive that control criminal prosecution that's unlikely, but I don't know if that would help Congress, it still might not compel the evidence they seek, and an awful lot of people would think that a big overreach by Congress

Possibly the best that can be said is looking down the line to take a cross party view on as to how the process should work, whether there's going to be time for that, whether there's any chance of a sensible non partisan approach, wouldn't be the only concerns, but maybe it could happen.

Fangle wrote: ↑Thu Jul 09, 2020 3:28 pm I really hope that this is going to be yet another virtue signaling thread. I honestly can’t see the purpose of post after post saying how terrible Trump is. I don’t know who they are trying to impress. I am sure that all the posters who can vote for the US president have got the message by now.

That’s kind of the point though. The whole Trump attitude (which Johnson is copying, albeit in the same style the British copied fast food from the US) is to keep saying outrageous things until people treat it as normal. Because then you can get away with doing outrageous things. Bannon playbook page one.

Just think the moment extremely rich people finally stop distracting, terrorising and endangering the public with outrageous idiots like Trump and Boris is the day we will finally wake up and tax them until they have to flee the country.
We didn't tax the rich 75% last week, we won't next week either.
No reason not to.
I mean wiith the sickening inequality in society, no one is selling trickle down economics anymore right, or giving any moral reason why some twat who has inherited all his wealth should keep it all..other than we are continuously distracted by this horrific right wing populist shit show.
The rich are in politics for one reason and one reason only.
To keep their wealth from you.
They don't give two shits how they do it.

Welcome back Refry

Line6 HXFX wrote: ↑Thu Jul 09, 2020 5:36 pm Just think the moment extremely rich people finally stop distracting, terrorising and endangering the public with outrageous idiots like Trump and Boris is the day we will finally wake up and tax them until they have to flee the country.
We didn't tax the rich 75% last week, we won't next week either.
No reason not to.
I mean wiith the sickening inequality in society, no one is selling trickle down economic anymore right, or giving any moral reason why some twat who has inherited all his wealth should keep it all..other than we are continuously distracted by this horrific right wing populist shit show.
The rich are in politics for one reason and one reason only.
To keep their wealth from you.
They don't give two shits how they do it.

I like the cut of your jib.
We should start shooting the cunts on sight.

Bokkom wrote: ↑Thu Jul 09, 2020 6:14 pm

Line6 HXFX wrote: ↑Thu Jul 09, 2020 5:36 pm Just think the moment extremely rich people finally stop distracting, terrorising and endangering the public with outrageous idiots like Trump and Boris is the day we will finally wake up and tax them until they have to flee the country.
We didn't tax the rich 75% last week, we won't next week either.
No reason not to.
I mean wiith the sickening inequality in society, no one is selling trickle down economic anymore right, or giving any moral reason why some twat who has inherited all his wealth should keep it all..other than we are continuously distracted by this horrific right wing populist shit show.
The rich are in politics for one reason and one reason only.
To keep their wealth from you.
They don't give two shits how they do it.

I like the cut of your jib.
We should start shooting the cunts on sight.

Nah! They should close down all their businesses, stop making all that money, and just live on their savings. The amount they earn is iniquitous.

JM2K6 wrote: ↑Thu Jul 09, 2020 3:30 pm How do you discuss Trump and US politics without referencing the daily awfulness? It's not "virtue signalling" to point that shit out. Your mistake is assuming anyone's trying to impress anyone else.

This is a genuinely insane administration.

Have a sense of perspective?

Fonz wrote: ↑Fri Jul 10, 2020 2:16 am

JM2K6 wrote: ↑Thu Jul 09, 2020 3:30 pm How do you discuss Trump and US politics without referencing the daily awfulness? It's not "virtue signalling" to point that shit out. Your mistake is assuming anyone's trying to impress anyone else.

This is a genuinely insane administration.

Have a sense of perspective?

It is a big place, with a lot going on, most states have enough political intrigue of their own to warrant debate and discussion but I don't think anyone outside of the US cares about state-level stuff - in the UK it would be a bit like caring about local council matters. The orange shitgibbon is the only game in town for most non-seppos.

JM2K6 wrote: ↑Thu Jul 09, 2020 3:30 pm How do you discuss Trump and US politics without referencing the daily awfulness? It's not "virtue signalling" to point that shit out. Your mistake is assuming anyone's trying to impress anyone else.

This is a genuinely insane administration.

You could just make false equivalences like "all politicians lie" and "every government is corrupt" stick your stupid head in the sand and just accept your country is on it's way to being a gangster state.

Have a bit of perspective there JM.

The perspective is that this is all incredibly abnormal for a previously stable western democracy, basically!

JM2K6 wrote: ↑Fri Jul 10, 2020 8:35 am The perspective is that this is all incredibly abnormal for a previously stable western democracy, basically!

Quite. Anyone who thinks this is normal has been welcomed in to his gentle embrace. It is fucking crazy.

When we did tax people at 60-70%, we had higher growth, more social mobility and low unemployment. I think people forget that.

Biffer wrote: ↑Fri Jul 10, 2020 9:07 am When we did tax people at 60-70%, we had higher growth, more social mobility and low unemployment. I think people forget that.

You can fuck right off if you think I’m going grind myself into the ground working 70+ hour weeks for a 70% tax rate.

ScarfaceClaw wrote: ↑Fri Jul 10, 2020 11:48 am

Biffer wrote: ↑Fri Jul 10, 2020 9:07 am When we did tax people at 60-70%, we had higher growth, more social mobility and low unemployment. I think people forget that.

You can fuck right off if you think I’m going grind myself into the ground working 70+ hour weeks for a 70% tax rate.

I'm not proposing it. I'm just pointing out that the people who say that high rates of tax mean low growth and high unemployment are factually wrong.

Would have thought such high rates would only hit the ultra high earners? Multi-million pound bonuses types no? Though I guess you may be one of those.

Time better spent closing some of those loopholes and working out systems to prevent some of the super rich and their corporations seemingly paying virtually f* all tax at all.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/14/us/p ... virus.html

This looks a bit shifty

Nah, nothing to see here. Biggest issue for Trumps re-election, reporting of which is now completely under control of Trumps administration, and some key figures no longer getting released...

You can only drain a swamp so quickly

Rhubarb & Custard wrote: ↑Wed Jul 15, 2020 10:36 am You can only drain a swamp so quickly

Although it takes longer if you refill it with Hungarian Nazi supporters.

Just seeing snippets of that deranged rambling from the White House last night. Even at my drunkest I would back myself to make more sense than that.

The Lincoln Project knock another one out of the park !



It's good to see some responsible Republicans want to reclaim their Party from the scum currently calling the shots. I wish them every success !

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Wed Jul 15, 2020 9:32 pm
It's good to see some responsible Republicans want to reclaim their Party from the scum currently calling the shots. I wish them every success !

This is a very dangerous line of thinking in my opinion.

It enables Republicans to avoid responsibility for Trump and suggests that Trumpism is a departure from Republican ideals rather than a continuation of them.

They are and have been the party of illegal war, climate change denial, dog whistle racism, fiscal irresponsibility, mass incarceration, obstructionism and the NRA.

Campaign manager number 5 come in down.

Biffer wrote: ↑Fri Jul 10, 2020 9:07 am When we did tax people at 60-70%, we had higher growth, more social mobility and low unemployment. I think people forget that.

Correlation, causation and all that.

Several things explain the substantially higher growth rates and mobility of that time: the education systems were better (relative to the rest of the world), technology had a much wider and balanced effect on productivity, the labour force was growing and the population was rising, the central bank functioned normally, unemployment was not a feasible life choice, governments proactively neutered oligopolies, women were entering the workforce, there was a greater variety of jobs (though highly skilled) that did not require to be part of the knowledge economy, companies didn't decamp due to wages and or domestic costs in anything like the manner they do now and global supply chains and job outsourcing were in their infancy.

Caley_Red wrote: ↑Thu Jul 16, 2020 4:48 am

Biffer wrote: ↑Fri Jul 10, 2020 9:07 am When we did tax people at 60-70%, we had higher growth, more social mobility and low unemployment. I think people forget that.

Correlation, causation and all that.

Several things explain the substantially higher growth rates and mobility of that time: the education systems were better (relative to the rest of the world), technology had a much wider and balanced effect on productivity, the labour force was growing and the population was rising, the central bank functioned normally, unemployment was not a feasible life choice, governments proactively neutered oligopolies, women were entering the workforce, there was a greater variety of jobs (though highly skilled) that did not require to be part of the knowledge economy, companies didn't decamp due to wages and or domestic costs in anything like the manner they do now and global supply chains and job outsourcing were in their infancy.

Yeah, that’s kind of the point I’m making, in a blunt instrument way. There’s now this idea that high tax discourages growth. It’s fundamentally untrue. I’m not saying it causes growth, I’m saying it doesn’t prevent it in the way that the current economic paradigm presents it.

Hugo wrote: ↑Wed Jul 15, 2020 10:04 pm

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Wed Jul 15, 2020 9:32 pm
It's good to see some responsible Republicans want to reclaim their Party from the scum currently calling the shots. I wish them every success !

This is a very dangerous line of thinking in my opinion.

It enables Republicans to avoid responsibility for Trump and suggests that Trumpism is a departure from Republican ideals rather than a continuation of them.

They are and have been the party of illegal war, climate change denial, dog whistle racism, fiscal irresponsibility, mass incarceration, obstructionism and the NRA.

I don't see that it does ?

A significant number of Republicans have been ostracized, initially by the Tea Party loons, & now by the Trumpist fluffers. Even gimps like Frum; who I've little time for his policies;, was more or less kicked out of GOP.

A functional GOP is necessary as a balance against a DNC, that is just as capable of lurching to it's own extremes.

In a functional democracy, when one Party lurches to an ideological extreme; it's middle & the swing voters can at least shift their vote; but if the GOP has the Shitgibbon, & the DNC has AOC; then there are a lot of voters who don't seen any option they can vote for.

If instead of 100% AOC, they get a 90% Joe, & 10% AOC, at least the progressive wing gets an input; they mightn't get a US NHS, but the can get an enhanced Obamacare; & the swing voters aren't shitting themselves over the taxes to pay for it all*.


* and yes, I know the, "tax & spend", dems is a myth

Anyhow, Trump is obviously getting slightly worried by the polling, having just sacked his campaign manager

Of course, strictly speaking he didn't sack him. He got son-in-law to do the job for him, as is his way

Saint wrote: ↑Thu Jul 16, 2020 6:02 pm Anyhow, Trump is obviously getting slightly worried by the polling, having just sacked his campaign manager

Of course, strictly speaking he didn't sack him. He got son-in-law to do the job for him, as is his way

So he should be; the Polls show that Texas is in play for Biden; that's like hearing that Corbyn was leading in Kensington