NPR

Posted: **Sun Feb 12, 2023 9:53 pm**

C69 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 4:06 pm
CM11 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 1:46 pm
C69 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 1:42 pm Still amazing how the try was given even at the time it looked obviously in touch.

You need to look at in motion to understand the doubt. If his foot didn't touch the ground, it brushed it millimeters above it but it's a question for the TMO, who has access to more technology to determine certainty.

No one would have batted an eyelid if it was disallowed. And would have been if Barnes asked try or not.
I looked at it in motion live and thought it was an outrageously bad call.
As a neutral Barnes ruined the match

At least it was only Barnes ruined it
As a neutral for the next game the XV clowns in red ruined it for me

Posted: **Sun Feb 12, 2023 9:54 pm**

EnergiseR2 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 5:13 pm Yeah great. How's life oop norf?

All good sir
Still fighting the good fight
Glad you are keeping well

Posted: **Sun Feb 12, 2023 9:55 pm**

EnergiseR2 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 5:13 pm Yeah great. How's life oop norf?

All good sir
Still fighting the good fight
Glad you are keeping well

Posted: **Sun Feb 12, 2023 9:56 pm**

Winnie wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 9:55 pm
EnergiseR2 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 5:13 pm Yeah great. How's life oop norf?
Double post
This place is nearly as bad as PR

Posted: **Sun Feb 12, 2023 11:11 pm**

CM11 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 4:11 pm Barnes wasn't the TMO and he got the grounding right.

Ffs even you can concede it should have been scrubbed off ffs

Posted: **Sun Feb 12, 2023 11:14 pm**

Dry yer eyes, C69.

Posted: **Sun Feb 12, 2023 11:19 pm**

Nols wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 11:14 pmDry yer eyes, C69.

Why?

Posted: **Sun Feb 12, 2023 11:25 pm**

C69 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 11:11 pm
CM11 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 4:11 pm Barnes wasn't the TMO and he got the grounding right.
Ffs even you can concede it should have been scrubbed off ffs

You'll see my views above.

I'm still not sure why you're blaming Barnes though.

Posted: **Sun Feb 12, 2023 11:35 pm**

EnergiseR2 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 11:17 pm
Winnie wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 9:55 pm
EnergiseR2 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 5:13 pm Yeah great. How's life oop norf?
All good sir
Still fighting the good fight
Glad you are keeping well
Going up there to run the marathon in a few months so will get to see the sights

Posted: **Sun Feb 12, 2023 11:42 pm**

CM11 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 11:25 pm
C69 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 11:11 pm
CM11 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 4:11 pm Barnes wasn't the TMO and he got the grounding right.
Ffs even you can concede it should have been scrubbed off ffs
You'll see my views above.

I'm still not sure why you're blaming Barnes though.

What? Barnes was awful, his appalling overall officiating and his bottling of the red card were a disgrace tbh.
He missed so many forward passes and the breakdown was a shambles.

Posted: **Sun Feb 12, 2023 11:48 pm**

If you say so.

The rest of us will just move on having watched a great test match.

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 1:02 am**

Mr Bungle wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 10:38 am
Jim Lahey wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 10:33 am Its one of those tries that if its for your team you'll try and find numerous reasons for its justification. If its against your team then you'd be furious.
I see it as Cammy above saw it.

But going by Lowe’s reaction after, I think he knew he’d scraped the deck.

It wasn't assessed in real time though, was it. The TMO had more or less the same opportunity to view it as we have had and those images say it is clear and obvious that his foot was down.

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 1:56 am**

Just getting around to reading this thread now and I'm a bit embarrassed. I didn't realize it was such a bad game totally ruined by Barnes. I had actually thought it was quite good. Silly me

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 11:18 am**

All the photos's are appearing now. One taken by Lowe's mum...

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 11:31 am**

All these photos are just stills of footage the TMO had.

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 11:39 am**

CM11 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 11:31 am All these photos are just stills of footage the TMO had.

High resolution for a video still?

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 11:56 am**

Yeah that's very obviously a photograph, not least because of the focus effect, the post-processing, the detail, etc.

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 11:57 am**

CM11 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 11:48 pm If you say so.

The rest of us will just move on having watched a great test match.

Yes, it's the Irish way.

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 11:57 am**

CM11 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 1:53 pm
TheFrog wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 1:51 pm
C69 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 1:42 pm Still amazing how the try was given even at the time it looked obviously in touch.
[/img]
That image wasn't shown to the ref or the TMO. End of.
Doesn't change the outcome of the game. France saved another 3 tries in their in goal area. We were going backward with every green wave thrown at us.
I don't know what you mean by 'it wasn't shown to the TMO'. I've already pointed out yesterday that it's confirmed that the TMO has access to all angles and it's up to him to chose which ones he looks at.

Even that angle isn't conclusive when you look at it in motion and compare it to the others.

But it's very much a TMO error if it's an error. Nothing to do with 'what he was shown'.

The angle from behind was not shown to Barnes on the pitch. It’s the conclusive one. Neither was it shown on television until after the conversion had been taken. Either the TMO chose not to show it or the tv didn’t make it available.

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 12:03 pm**

Poor day at the office for Barnes to be fair. But what cracking first half of rugby that was, lived up to the hype. Ireland's just on another level at the moment, can they sustain this momentum for the rest of the year? Let's face it, they look pretty ominous to the Boks and Scots in their pool. Will this be Ireland's year, can they go all the way?

Probably not. But hell, they'll deserve it if they do.

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 12:12 pm**

Grandpa wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 11:39 am
CM11 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 11:31 am All these photos are just stills of footage the TMO had.
High resolution for a video still?

Sorry, I mean that they're a still reproduction of what the TMO had at his disposal. He has his reasons for not being sure. I don't think there's anything more to say on the matter. The images we all saw suggested he did touch the ground, before you even get to stills or other angles, but the TMO said he couldn't be certain. It's either a straight up mistake or he zoomed in on his footage and deemed no direct contact. I don't know but it's a pointless discussion at this stage.

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 12:15 pm**

Biffer wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 11:57 am
CM11 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 1:53 pm
TheFrog wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 1:51 pm

That image wasn't shown to the ref or the TMO. End of.
Doesn't change the outcome of the game. France saved another 3 tries in their in goal area. We were going backward with every green wave thrown at us.
I don't know what you mean by 'it wasn't shown to the TMO'. I've already pointed out yesterday that it's confirmed that the TMO has access to all angles and it's up to him to chose which ones he looks at.

Even that angle isn't conclusive when you look at it in motion and compare it to the others.

But it's very much a TMO error if it's an error. Nothing to do with 'what he was shown'.
The angle from behind was not shown to Barnes on the pitch. It’s the conclusive one. Neither was it shown on television until after the conversion had been taken. Either the TMO chose not to show it or the tv didn’t make it available.

Barnes didn't make the call. The TMO did.

And for the third or fourth time, the TV is provided by a Six Nations production team and the TMO had access to any angles he wanted.

The point made on one of our stations was that they've been asked to hurry up and not spend ages looking at every conceivable angle before making a decision. I also don't see how the reverse angle adds anything as it looked like he touched ground in the angles we saw but the TMO decided otherwise.

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 12:16 pm**

Slick wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 11:57 am
CM11 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 11:48 pm If you say so.

The rest of us will just move on having watched a great test match.
Yes, it's the Irish way.

Wut?

Everyone else thought it was a very good game. Are you joining C69 in declaring it was crap and ruined by Barnes?

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 12:23 pm**

It looked like a try to me. Good one to.

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 12:27 pm**

Was a good test match. With all due respect I think the Boks rush defense if on song can beat them. The All Blacks running game also.

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 12:38 pm**

CM11 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 12:16 pm
Slick wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 11:57 am
CM11 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 11:48 pm If you say so.

The rest of us will just move on having watched a great test match.
Yes, it's the Irish way.
Wut?

Everyone else thought it was a very good game. Are you joining C69 in declaring it was crap and ruined by Barnes?

It was an absolutely brilliant game

The idea that the Irish gently move on from even the mildest decision that doesn’t go their way is what’s making me laugh

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 12:42 pm**

Everyone's so wound up about the try. I was surprised it was given.

It wasn't the winning of the match, though.

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 12:58 pm**

Slick wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 12:38 pm
CM11 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 12:16 pm
Slick wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 11:57 am

Yes, it's the Irish way.
Wut?

Everyone else thought it was a very good game. Are you joining C69 in declaring it was crap and ruined by Barnes?
It was an absolutely brilliant game

The idea that the Irish gently move on from even the mildest decision that doesn’t go their way is what’s making me laugh

If you say so.

The post I was replying to was where C69 said it was a shit game ruined by Barnes.

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 1:11 pm**

Nols wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 12:42 pm Everyone's so wound up about the try. I was surprised it was given.

It wasn't the winning of the match, though.

FFS, might we all put this to bed now? Bernol right on the mark on this one:
https://www.rugbyrama.fr/2023/02/12/6-n ... 994085.php

Basically blaming Barnes for the defeat is the worst of excuses.

On a plus note, Lard Arse has been cited and with luck will be banned from stinking up the rest of the comp:
https://www.rugbyrama.fr/2023/02/13/6-n ... 995781.php

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 1:17 pm**

CM11 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 12:58 pm
Slick wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 12:38 pm
CM11 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 12:16 pm

Wut?

Everyone else thought it was a very good game. Are you joining C69 in declaring it was crap and ruined by Barnes?
It was an absolutely brilliant game

The idea that the Irish gently move on from even the mildest decision that doesn’t go their way is what’s making me laugh
If you say so.

The post I was replying to was where C69 said it was a shit game ruined by Barnes.

Well, I can tell you your first mistake...

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 1:30 pm**

Is it possible to believe that it was a great game and the referee made a couple of mistakes or does that call for impossible mental gymnastics?

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 1:35 pm**

JM2K6 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 1:17 pm
CM11 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 12:58 pm
Slick wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 12:38 pm

It was an absolutely brilliant game

The idea that the Irish gently move on from even the mildest decision that doesn’t go their way is what’s making me laugh
If you say so.

The post I was replying to was where C69 said it was a shit game ruined by Barnes.
Well, I can tell you your first mistake...

Fair point.

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 1:36 pm**

GogLais wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 1:30 pm Is it possible to believe that it was a great game and the referee made a couple of mistakes or does that call for impossible mental gymnastics?

LOL, no.

To repeat
- Lowe's was not a try. It was not Barnes' fault that for whatever reason, he was not shown the correct footage (ironic given how the French are often accused of doing the same!). It was Barnes' fault for saying "on field decision try" when he could have no f**king idea whether it was or not.
- For me, Lard Arse was red but there has been enough argument about this elsewhere to suggest there was enough doubt to give Barnes the leeway in real time. I suspect the citing commissioner is going to go with red too.
- Barnes rode France for most of the 2nd half.
- None of this altered the result which really should have been wider.

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 1:37 pm**

GogLais wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 1:30 pm Is it possible to believe that it was a great game and the referee made a couple of mistakes or does that call for impossible mental gymnastics?

Find me a game where a ref hasn't made a mistake. The argument was whether he'd ruined it.

Of the two biggest talking points, one wasn't his call and the other did the opposite of ruining the game.

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 1:41 pm**

Torquemada 1420 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 1:36 pm
GogLais wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 1:30 pm Is it possible to believe that it was a great game and the referee made a couple of mistakes or does that call for impossible mental gymnastics?
LOL, no.

To repeat
- Lowe's was not a try. It was not Barnes' fault that for whatever reason, he was not shown the correct footage (ironic given how the French are often accused of doing the same!). It was Barnes' fault for saying "on field decision try" when he could have no f**king idea whether it was or not.
- For me, Lard Arse was red but there has been enough argument about this elsewhere to suggest there was enough doubt to give Barnes the leeway in real time. I suspect the citing commissioner is going to go with red too.
- Barnes rode France for most of the 2nd half.
- None of this altered the result which really should have been wider.

On reflection, Barnes and AR did not feel Lowe was out and were happy with grounding. That's the application of how they're meant to ref. Barnes is not at fault with regards touch as that's his AR's job and was correct on grounding.

At no stage of the process were any of the (assumed) incorrect decisions made by Barnes.

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 1:58 pm**

CM11 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 1:41 pm
Torquemada 1420 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 1:36 pm
GogLais wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 1:30 pm Is it possible to believe that it was a great game and the referee made a couple of mistakes or does that call for impossible mental gymnastics?
LOL, no.

To repeat
- Lowe's was not a try. It was not Barnes' fault that for whatever reason, he was not shown the correct footage (ironic given how the French are often accused of doing the same!). It was Barnes' fault for saying "on field decision try" when he could have no f**king idea whether it was or not.
- For me, Lard Arse was red but there has been enough argument about this elsewhere to suggest there was enough doubt to give Barnes the leeway in real time. I suspect the citing commissioner is going to go with red too.
- Barnes rode France for most of the 2nd half.
- None of this altered the result which really should have been wider.
On reflection, Barnes and AR did not feel Lowe was out and were happy with grounding. That's the application of how they're meant to ref. Barnes is not at fault with regards touch as that's his AR's job and was correct on grounding.

At no stage of the process were any of the (assumed) incorrect decisions made by Barnes.

Also, as a french fan you would want the try awarded as otherwise it is probably a PT and a YC. I've seen Ulster games where I've wanted the try to be awarded for that precise reason..... I can't remember a specific example but there are instances where the try was awarded and the culprit carded anyway.

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 2:08 pm**

MrJonno wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 1:58 pm Also, as a french fan you would want the try awarded as otherwise it is probably a PT and a YC.

No. See the law discussion earlier (incl Jim Lahey) which I am too lazy to repost.

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 2:16 pm**

Torquemada 1420 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 2:08 pm
MrJonno wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 1:58 pm Also, as a french fan you would want the try awarded as otherwise it is probably a PT and a YC.
No. See the law discussion earlier (incl Jim Lahey) which I am too lazy to repost.

I saw something that proves me righter and I won't post it. I win, RC all day long

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 2:28 pm**

MrJonno wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 2:16 pm
Torquemada 1420 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 2:08 pm
MrJonno wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 1:58 pm Also, as a french fan you would want the try awarded as otherwise it is probably a PT and a YC.
No. See the law discussion earlier (incl Jim Lahey) which I am too lazy to repost.
I saw something that proves me righter and I won't post it. I win, RC all day long

I didn't see anything. I posted it!!!!

{EDIT} Here, you lazy b*st*rd. Learn to use the search feature

https://notplanetrugby.com/viewtopic.ph ... 38#p263538

Posted: **Mon Feb 13, 2023 2:41 pm**

MrJonno wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 1:58 pm Also, as a french fan you would want the try awarded as otherwise it is probably a PT and a YC.

https://www.world.rugby/the-game/laws/c ... on/2022/3/

So the more likely position is pen against Lowe for jumping into the tackle.

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