NPR

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 8:39 pm It's the usual problem where the coaches in U20 get a limited amount of time with the players, so it's harder to get some things clicking, & you only ever get a couple of years from them.

It's showing up tonight with the lineout shambles for France.

And discipline echoing their seniors. How many pens is that now?

The french player yellow carded looks older than me and I'm in my 40s

Irish handling has been poor at times

Winnie wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 8:44 pm The french player yellow carded looks older than me and I'm in my 40s

Irish handling has been poor at times

Irish 15 is bang average.

Torquemada 1420 wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 8:43 pm

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 8:39 pm It's the usual problem where the coaches in U20 get a limited amount of time with the players, so it's harder to get some things clicking, & you only ever get a couple of years from them.

It's showing up tonight with the lineout shambles for France.

And discipline echoing their seniors. How many pens is that now?

Yeah, that's a real problem, & again we have a SH ref (although I don't have any issues with his calls)

Winnie wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 8:44 pm The french player yellow carded looks older than me and I'm in my 40s
Irish handling has been poor at times

You always get a couple of those at this level, it's often a front rower who also happens to be going very prematurely bald.

Quick tap from a replacement prop on the 22 to score! Love to see a prop rumble.

Ireland should have taken an easy 3 to go two scores up.

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 8:47 pm Quick tap from a replacement prop on the 22 to score! Love to see a prop rumble.

Very nice tap and go from the prop.

Lots of potential.

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 8:39 pm It's showing up tonight with the lineout shambles for France.

BTW, little side info: the U20 attack coach is Benoit Baby. Remember him? Headbutted BOD in a 6N game On debut

He was one of the most talented players I've ever seen but another destroyed by injuries because of the insane club system to go along with the likes of JeanJean and Castaignede.

tc27 wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 8:48 pm

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 8:47 pm Quick tap from a replacement prop on the 22 to score! Love to see a prop rumble.

Very nice tap and go from the prop.

Lots of potential.

He also turned Italy’s previous scrum dominance on its head.

Lobby wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 8:50 pm

tc27 wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 8:48 pm

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 8:47 pm Quick tap from a replacement prop on the 22 to score! Love to see a prop rumble.

Very nice tap and go from the prop.

Lots of potential.

He also turned Italy’s previous scrum dominance on its head.

Apparently he's playing a year up to be in the U20s

Italy secure a TBP and LBP with the final play. Nice little snipe from their miniature replacement scrum half.

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 8:51 pm Italy secure a TBP and LBP with the final play. Nice little snipe from their miniature replacement scrum half.

Enjoyable game that. England much improved from last week, and needed to be.

Lobby wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 8:54 pm

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 8:51 pm Italy secure a TBP and LBP with the final play. Nice little snipe from their miniature replacement scrum half.

Enjoyable game that. England much improved from last week, and needed to be.

Yup, although Italy stayed in it, it felt like we were more in control of the result this week.

Good job by squige on showing Ireland's subtle cheating.

Woohoo we finally get a win for a long time at U20

Ireland France is a real ding dong.

after the Ireland try 30-24

Still within 7

France try!!!

30-29
France need to convert to get back in lead.

And he nailed it. 30-31

Ymx wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 9:41 pm And he nailed it. 30-31

How are you watching this?

That was a cracking game.

The ref was Irish (or his grand-mammy was).

No way that throw in was straight

Grandpa wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 9:42 pm

Ymx wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 9:41 pm And he nailed it. 30-31

How are you watching this?

Bbc iPlayer then select category and sports.

All over now though.

Ymx wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 9:48 pm

Grandpa wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 9:42 pm

Ymx wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 9:41 pm And he nailed it. 30-31

How are you watching this?

Bbc iPlayer then select category and sports.

All over now though.

Bugger. At least I know for next time.

westport wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 9:21 pm Woohoo we finally get a win for a long time at U20

I'd be happy with that score tomorrow.

Some lack of composure and poor play balanced by some excellent stuff. The pack carried that through.

Enzedder wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 9:48 pm The ref was Irish (or his grand-mammy was).

No way that throw in was straight

They did get the penalty after

That's three cracking games tonight. This tournament deserves a higher profile than it gets.

Biffer wrote: ↑Sat Feb 11, 2023 12:25 am That's three cracking games tonight. This tournament deserves a higher profile than it gets.

It's growing for sure.

Frop.E wrote: ↑Sat Feb 11, 2023 12:36 am

Biffer wrote: ↑Sat Feb 11, 2023 12:25 am That's three cracking games tonight. This tournament deserves a higher profile than it gets.

It's growing for sure.

Yep and I think having all three games on a Friday and accessible via the Beeb infrastructure, albeit online services rather than on t' tellybox, will do wonders for it. Previously the U20 fixtures, much like the women's, were scattered all over the weekend around the main action which made it a lot less easy to follow. Pretty sure it used to be locked behind the Sky paywall too.

OK, off to bed now in the hope of being alarmed enough to wake up and watch France v Ireland at 3am.

Very much looking forward today, something nice about a 6N Saturday morning without horrific nerves taking over. Baguette and kilt at the ready

Match thread created by one of the guests.

Ireland v France

viewtopic.php?t=2411

Frop.E wrote: ↑Sat Feb 11, 2023 12:36 am

Biffer wrote: ↑Sat Feb 11, 2023 12:25 am That's three cracking games tonight. This tournament deserves a higher profile than it gets.

It's growing for sure.

I've been watching every year since I can remember. Calder and Jeffrey were my heroes because they were farmers and loose forwards like me. Its followed very closely here in SA. The story about Jeffrey and Dean Richards kicking the Calcutta cup down Princes Street is probably my favourite bit of rugby lore.

My prediction for the weekend is Ireland by 10 points, Wales by 6 (because Scotland delight in frustrating us) and England by 15.

My summary after two rounds, in strength order imo:

Ireland - Stand out best team so far, look really complete, every aspect is impressive. Was surprised by how easily they beat France, the Lowe try wasn't a try but even without that they were still comfortable winners. They could be favourites for the RWC before it starts.
France - Have gone a bit down in my estimation. Have some exciting attacking players in the backline, and some large units in the pack, but they seem a bit weaker than the sum of their parts (compared to really top teams through history). Also wondering if they have a fitness issue, especially after the Italy match, falling off at the end of matches is a huge weakness. They're a bit frustrating, watching them I think "they're doing well, but should be doing much better, but they're not".
Scotland - Best Scottish side in decades? Very strong in attack with a lot of exciting attacking players in the backline. Unlike France play more as a team and they're more than their parts, they play to their maximum potential. Still wonder if a heavy weight pack can cause them huge issues, will be interesting to see how they go against France. If France play like they have and beat Scotland with room to spare, I rest a bit easier thinking about the RWC pool.

The other three sides I see as a level below those three.

England - Not sure what to make of them? They have some forwards that are good, their backs look a bit average (compared to Ireland/France/Scotland, they're not as good). Still, they seem to be improving again. Chance they can put together a monster pack, and backs who can at least tackle and carry at 10/12 (if not starting Smith continues), then get all that working at maximum potential. There's ways they could offer something at the RWC.
Italy - Best ever Italy side surely. They've normally had some decent players in the pack and a good place kicker, but have some attacking backline players that look like they belong at this level now. That's the main difference with them now, they can actually use possession and generate some momentum.
Wales - Worst Wales side since the 90s? They're playing really badly. About all you can say is they keep going hard and don't quit at all, look to have nothing at all in attack, but they don't give up. I have no clue how they improve, they need to select new players (any backline players with some speed/inventiveness and any large forwards with some skill), but time has nearly run out for the RWC, unless they sacrifice tests to cap players and see what they've got. The Italy match will be huge, if they lose to Italy I'll start wondering if Fiji/Georgia can beat them at the RWC.

I think that's a fair assessment.

My only worry with Scotland is how they might get on with an injury to Finn Russel. At least Ireland have proved that they have some depth behind Sexton.

Italy look the best they ever have, but I still can't get by head around how they sometimes get the basics so wrong. Like their exit play, it's atrocious for an international team. I think a bit of tightening up here and there and they'll be picking up many more wins.

assfly wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 9:11 am I think that's a fair assessment.

My only worry with Scotland is how they might get on with an injury to Finn Russel. At least Ireland have proved that they have some depth behind Sexton.

Italy look the best they ever have, but I still can't get by head around how they sometimes get the basics so wrong. Like their exit play, it's atrocious for an international team. I think a bit of tightening up here and there and they'll be picking up many more wins.

To be honest, as well as Irelands replacement 10 did on Saturday, I actually think we have more depth there than Ireland - although that does drop a fair bit with Hastings being injured

assfly wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 9:11 am I think that's a fair assessment.

My only worry with Scotland is how they might get on with an injury to Finn Russel. At least Ireland have proved that they have some depth behind Sexton.

Italy look the best they ever have, but I still can't get by head around how they sometimes get the basics so wrong. Like their exit play, it's atrocious for an international team. I think a bit of tightening up here and there and they'll be picking up many more wins.

Italy are interesting right now.

I think Italy's first try for example they would have scored against anyone - it was just a brilliant attacking set. So not relying on individual brilliance or a lucky bounce/mistake to get a try is definitely the sign of a top class side.

On the other hand as you say they fluffed their exits multiple times.

_Os_ wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2023 5:59 pm
France - Have gone a bit down in my estimation. Have some exciting attacking players in the backline, and some large units in the pack, but they seem a bit weaker than the sum of their parts (compared to really top teams through history). Also wondering if they have a fitness issue, especially after the Italy match, falling off at the end of matches is a huge weakness. They're a bit frustrating, watching them I think "they're doing well, but should be doing much better, but they're not".

All teams have injury issues at some point, and international rugby is all about depth of squads, but imo France really miss Woki and Danty in particular. Danty gives France so much front-foot ball from big runs in the centre. So far without those two they haven't looked the attacking force we saw last year.

I like Camille Chat, he is a hard-carrying hooker, maybe one of our French posters can say if he's out of form or injured, but he's not in the squad. At his best he'd give France some good momentum.

tc27 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 10:03 am

assfly wrote: ↑Mon Feb 13, 2023 9:11 am I think that's a fair assessment.

My only worry with Scotland is how they might get on with an injury to Finn Russel. At least Ireland have proved that they have some depth behind Sexton.

Italy look the best they ever have, but I still can't get by head around how they sometimes get the basics so wrong. Like their exit play, it's atrocious for an international team. I think a bit of tightening up here and there and they'll be picking up many more wins.

Italy are interesting right now.

I think Italy's first try for example they would have scored against anyone - it was just a brilliant attacking set. So not relying on individual brilliance or a lucky bounce/mistake to get a try is definitely the sign of a top class side.

On the other hand as you say they fluffed their exits multiple times.

While I agree this is the best and most competitive Italy team for a long time, I'd argue that the Italy team of the late 90s is probably still a high point for them. They were certainly on a par with the other 5N teams at the time and their results were good enough for them to force their way into the 6N. At one point it was even suggested that they should replace England in the 5N (when England signed an exclusive deal with Sky, much to the chagrin of the other home nations).

Before they joined the 6N they beat France in France (40 - 32), Ireland in Ireland and Italy (37 - 29 and 37 - 33) and Scotland (25 - 21) and were unlucky not to beat England in Huddersfield (they lost 23 -15 in the end but had a late try disallowed which would have given them the lead at that point in the match). They also won their first ever game in the 6N, beating Scotland 34 - 20, although by that time many of the team that had got them into the 6N were nearing retirement.

They haven't really had a consistent kicker since Diego Dominguez, a stalwart of their team in the 90s who was instrumental in many of their victories.

It'll be good to see how they improve when Garbisi returns, as he is a class player.