Quitting the bottle

[Harveys]

Yea, rehabs would have the same or worse numbers. Its big business and anyone with insurance can go for a holiday.

AA used to claim 50-75% in the early days but this was from small membership numbers (the very beginning when AA was only low bottom, old, chronic alcoholics) it was a statement from the second edition of their book published in 1955. Context is important, contemporary AA (post rehab / recovery boom of the 80s) has never claimed 75%.

“Of alcoholics who came to A.A. and really tried, 50% got sober at once and remained that way; 25% sobered up after some relapses, and among the remainder, those who stayed on with A.A. showed improvement.”

‘Of alcoholics who came to A.A. and really tried” is key. Rehabs sending busloads of people weekly to AA who don’t want to stop drinking let alone be there shouldn’t be counted as AA success or failure but they are, as are people court ordered to go, and countless people who are forced to go years before they really are ready.

[Ymx]

Interesting point.

[Tichtheid]

Article in today's Grauniad

‘The biggest gift I’ve ever given myself is learning to love life without booze’: Grace Dent on being festive and sober

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyl ... -christmas

[Slick]

Article in today's Grauniad

‘The biggest gift I’ve ever given myself is learning to love life without booze’: Grace Dent on being festive and sober

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyl ... -christmas

I went to see her speak last month at an event in Edinburgh to launch her new book. She spoke very articulately about this and was quite inspirational actually.

[Kiwias]

Article in today's Grauniad

‘The biggest gift I’ve ever given myself is learning to love life without booze’: Grace Dent on being festive and sober

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyl ... -christmas

I always say that making the decision to be sober is the best decision ever in my life.

[Ymx]

Article in today's Grauniad

‘The biggest gift I’ve ever given myself is learning to love life without booze’: Grace Dent on being festive and sober

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyl ... -christmas

I always say that making the decision to be sober is the best decision ever in my life.

Wife and kids ?!!

Ahem !!

[Kiwias]

Article in today's Grauniad

‘The biggest gift I’ve ever given myself is learning to love life without booze’: Grace Dent on being festive and sober

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyl ... -christmas

I always say that making the decision to be sober is the best decision ever in my life.

Wife and kids ?!!

Ahem !!

I would no longer be married had I not stopped drinking and I would also not have any grandchildren. Sobriety underlies all the good things happening in my life.

[Ymx]

I was more just teasing you, to save you getting in to trouble with your wife and co. Surely the decision to get married and the decision to have kids would be your top decisions.

But then again, you did say “your” best decision, so they might not qualify.

[Kiwias]

I was more just teasing you, to save you getting in to trouble with your wife and co. Surely the decision to get married and the decision to have kids would be your top decisions.

But then again, you did say “your” best decision, so they might not qualify.

I have had this discussion with my wife and my son and they both agree with my view, realizing how much my drinking had affected their lives and how much better their lives have become due to my sobriety.

[Enzedder]

Made I larf

AA Meeting.jpg (104.04 KiB) Viewed 1884 times

[Line6 HXFX]

Great video by Tim Davies...former pilot.

Don't agree with his politics etc..but he hasn't drunk for a year and has some really interesting things to say about giving up on 1st of January.


[media] [/media]

[Gumboot]

Great video by Tim Davies...former pilot.

Don't agree with his politics etc..but he hasn't drunk for a year and has some really interesting things to say about giving up on 1st of January.


[media] [/media]

[Ymx]

Great video by Tim Davies...former pilot.

Don't agree with his politics etc..but he hasn't drunk for a year and has some really interesting things to say about giving up on 1st of January.


[media] [/media]

Why did refry go in to full psycho mode about you?

It was freaking weird.

[Gumboot]

Why did refry go in to full psycho mode about you?

It was freaking weird.

I think he thinks I'm somehow stalking him, coz I have the temerity of responding to his posts...you know, kinda like some people do on a chat site.

He steadfastly refuses to engage, though. He prefers to imply that I'm just another carnt out to victimise him. It's his standard MO. Granted, I've taken the piss out of him a few times. Not sure what he expects though, given his repetitious sermonising and tedious tinpot theories.

Anywho, this isn't really the thread for such matters...

[Ymx]

Why did refry go in to full psycho mode about you?

It was freaking weird.

I think he thinks I'm somehow stalking him, coz I have the temerity of responding to his posts...you know, kinda like some people do on a chat site.

He steadfastly refuses to engage, though. He prefers to imply that I'm just another carnt out to victimise him. It's his standard MO. Granted, I've taken the piss out of him a few times. Not sure what he expects though, given his repetitious sermonising and tedious tinpot theories.

Anywho, this isn't really the thread for such matters...

No it’s definitely not. It was just that he posted the weird attack on this thread. Not sure if you read it. But he’s deleted the post.

Anyway …

[Gumboot]

Why did refry go in to full psycho mode about you?

It was freaking weird.

I think he thinks I'm somehow stalking him, coz I have the temerity of responding to his posts...you know, kinda like some people do on a chat site.

He steadfastly refuses to engage, though. He prefers to imply that I'm just another carnt out to victimise him. It's his standard MO. Granted, I've taken the piss out of him a few times. Not sure what he expects though, given his repetitious sermonising and tedious tinpot theories.

Anywho, this isn't really the thread for such matters...

No it’s definitely not. It was just that he posted the weird attack on this thread. Not sure if you read it. But he’s deleted the post.

Anyway …

No, I missed that. Probably for the best - it's fair to say he's not my biggest fan.

[Jim Lahey]

I think I've posted here a few times in the past, flirting with the idea of giving up. But now I feel ready.

My context. Booze has been pretty central to my social life since the age of 14. Everyone in my family drinks. My Mum is fine, likes a glass or 2 of wine but certainly doesn't have a problem with it. My 2 brothers and my Dad drink a lot, and I would regard them as having a problem with it. Not really bad, bjt they would struggle to give it up I reckon.

I'm not sure I have a problem with booze in terms of being unable to control myself around it. I do enjoy a beer to relax, but I rarely go over the top (big events like parties or weddings maybe).

My issue is more for health reasons. When I have a few beers, I don't sleep well. I'm a busy father of 3 that always has something on with work or my kids/wife, so feeling groggy is not fun. I'm also trying to drop 10kgs by the summer for some cycling events I have, and I tend to eat shit food when having a drink, and am likely to continue that into the following day if I over-do it on the sauce.

My big 2 fears are for my social life, and my job. I've read plenty of comments on this thread that friends will quickly accept that you are off the booze, but it still feels quite intimidating. But I guess I just need to get over that. My job has changed into more of a customer/supplier-facing role, which will entail going to corporate events/rugby matches etc., meeting new people that I need to establish strong relationships with, and I guess I'm slightly concerned about them potentially having their guards up to someone that can't relax over a few pints and share some industry insights/gossip. Again I'm aware that this is a weak assumption, and I'm confident that I have an outgoing enough personality to overcome it, but still, it feels a bit intimidating!

So if anyone has any advice on how to get through work jollies without boozing, but still be very much at the centre of things, and with a decent explanation as to why I'm not boozing to guys in an industry where boozing is pretty central to how business is done, I'd very much appreciate it!

Cheers

[Ymx]

I mean you even said it yourself, improve health. So many people do a a few dry months. You may even find another friend might be up for it too. It doesn’t matter that you plan to stick to it longer. Holding and drinking a 0% peroni, around the group you’ll feel no different to usual with them.

Work wise, it sounds like you’re in sales, marketing or certainly leadership. But I’d say, avoid a one on one, invite another from their work or your work. “I’m off the booze” always floats ok. And to be honest, again, if you are drinking 0% beer, they won’t even flinch. Even better, play golf with them instead.

Just a note on the 0% beer. It is sometimes warned against, as it’s a catalyst to starting again . But I just only drink it when I’m out, not at home.

At home, find yourself something to replace the beers or wines that you might slurp at currently. Something enjoyable, not water. And something you can drink a decent volume of. Myself, I use slightly flavoured fizzy water.

[Sandstorm]

I'm also trying to drop 10kgs by the summer for some cycling events I have......

Bingo! Just tell everyone this is why you're just having a soda water tonight. They'll get it. Later, you'll be able to say it without an excuse and it'll become easier.

Second YMX's comment about 0% alcohol - if you drink Guinness Zero you'll be so disgusted at the shitehouse, fake sweetness of it, that you sink 5 litres of the real stuff just to get your taste-bids back again! Fuck knows why they didn't give it more of a coffee flavour instead....

[Jim Lahey]

Cheers gents.

I've developed a taste for Lucky Saint beer, which is the best NA beer I've tasted to-date, so confident I can still do social events with mates etc.

The work situation is slightly more intimidating, but I think if you can go in hard and confident about being a non-drinker, and not be a uppity twat about it, I think its possible to gain more respect from customers and suppliers. Key thing as YMX suggested is to avoid 1-on-1 events, where my non-drinking migjt mean my guest is also reluctant to drink and feel relaxed.

We'll see how things go!

[Sandstorm]

Cheers gents.

I've developed a taste for Lucky Saint beer, which is the best NA beer I've tasted to-date, so confident I can still do social events with mates etc.

The work situation is slightly more intimidating, but I think if you can go in hard and confident about being a non-drinker, and not be a uppity twat about it, I think its possible to gain more respect from customers and suppliers. Key thing as YMX suggested is to avoid 1-on-1 events, where my non-drinking migjt mean my guest is also reluctant to drink and feel relaxed.

We'll see how things go!

I feel less weird drinking a lager when the other guy is drinking 0%, rather than “I’ll just have a Pepsi please…..”. In the old days at least he had the good grace to have a lager shandy…..

[Kiwias]

Jim Lahey

This is an issue we all face at some point and we share a tendency to overthink it. If you are not taking the full plunge into complete sobriety as many of us have done, then the health reason and your desire to drop some weight are perfectly reasonable and I don't know anyone who would have an issue with that. In the early days, I used the designated driver loophole.

What we all find is that other people are actually not particularly interested in what booze other people in the group are or are not drinking, except for the first round on the first time you are out with that particular group of people. That you have a tonic water with lime or orange juice or mineral water will soon become the standard and you will be able to forget about this and just relax and enjoy their company as you do now.

A key issue to keep uppermost in your mind is that your decision not to drink alcohol is taken for yourself and not for anyone else. As someone noted, it won't be an issue unless you are an 'uppity twat' about it.

I avoid 0% or "alcohol free" drinks because in my own view (others may not agree with this) it seems to be admitting to myself that I still want alcohol of some variety in my life, whereas that it is very much not the case.

Good luck, mate, and pop in whenever you want to chat about it.

[Monkey Magic]

Been quite a while since I posted on here. The booze at work events thing is definitely a mental barrier i struggled with last year.

Having stopped in early September 2022, the xmas functions that year, and even some stuff in March felt awkward and frustrating.

This year they were pretty much normal, no one raised the fact I wasn't drinking, I felt fine just being myself and none of the events escalated so I was still 100% when woken by my kids as usual at 5.30am the next day.

Taking the health kick or sober driver route works well early on with one off meetings can feel like it takes the pressure off- but to be honest I think that pressure is internal and no one actually gives a shit

[Ymx]

On the 0% beers. I agree they do split opinion. And I would not be drinking these at home. I have a rule to only ever have them if I go out, and where I just don’t want to drink more than a pint of lemonade or cola.

Also, if it is a rugby event, I will have several 0% for tradition.

I never have them at home, because I agree they become an easy way to slip. I also do not have the 0.5% ones, because you are then putting alcohol in to your system. So I’d be staying well away from the IPA based ones, which is think was mentioned above.

[Kiwias]

Been quite a while since I posted on here. The booze at work events thing is definitely a mental barrier i struggled with last year.

Having stopped in early September 2022, the xmas functions that year, and even some stuff in March felt awkward and frustrating.

This year they were pretty much normal, no one raised the fact I wasn't drinking, I felt fine just being myself and none of the events escalated so I was still 100% when woken by my kids as usual at 5.30am the next day.

Taking the health kick or sober driver route works well early on with one off meetings can feel like it takes the pressure off- but to be honest I think that pressure is internal and no one actually gives a shit

This has definitely been my experience. Once your friends and colleagues notice how much healthier you look, I would not be surprised if you are not asked about your non-drinking.

Well done, mate, and keep the faith.

[And 1 guest]

Well I decided I would have a drink on Xmas eve and Xmas day. So I did. Fell asleep after a bottle of wine, felt rough in the morning, and was actually relieved to go without on boxing day.
To be honest, I was seeking to prove to myself that I could have a drink, the exact opposite of when I gave it up last march. Each of us is different, of course, but for me I learned a wee bit more about where drink now stands in my life. Take it or leave it? I'll leave it, thank you.

[Kiwias]

Well I decided I would have a drink on Xmas eve and Xmas day. So I did. Fell asleep after a bottle of wine, felt rough in the morning, and was actually relieved to go without on boxing day.
To be honest, I was seeking to prove to myself that I could have a drink, the exact opposite of when I gave it up last march. Each of us is different, of course, but for me I learned a wee bit more about where drink now stands in my life. Take it or leave it? I'll leave it, thank you.

There is no set formula that works for everyone and we all are on our own journeys of self-discovery (as descreibed by Seneca from the other site). Good to hear that you are working out your own ideal relationship with alcohol.

Cheers, mate.

[Monkey Magic]

It's interesting how I feel about drinking compared to this time last year.

One thing I think I've only proper realised is just how much I was thinking of having a couple for some special occasions wasn't really because I felt like I was missing out. My drinking - well the majority of it in the probably the last 5-10 years - is very much an escape if being sober rather than an enjoyment of being drunk.

Of course I'm too lazy to do anything about that, but I'm not making it worse by being hungover/regretting dumb decisions

[Kiwias]

It's interesting how I feel about drinking compared to this time last year.

One thing I think I've only proper realised is just how much I was thinking of having a couple for some special occasions wasn't really because I felt like I was missing out. My drinking - well the majority of it in the probably the last 5-10 years - is very much an escape if being sober rather than an enjoyment of being drunk.

Of course I'm too lazy to do anything about that, but I'm not making it worse by being hungover/regretting dumb decisions

It sounds as of you might be being a tad harsh on yourself. Being aware of this issue and discussing it here with your fellow recovering alcoholics suggests you are actually doing something about it.

Hang in there, mate.

[Kiwias]

7,305 days ago, on 11 January 2004, I woke soaked in sweat from a brutal nightmare involving alcohol. I took our dog for her morning walk and when I sat down for breakfast, my wife passed me the contact information for the local sobriety support group, with a gentle "maybe it is time to give them a call".

That marked the first large step toward a decent life in sobriety and I offer my heart-felt thanks to all those who have supported me on this journey.

[And 1 guest]

20 years. Hats off to you, and thank you for the support you offer on here

[Kiwias]

20 years. Hats off to you, and thank you for the support you offer on here

Thanks. The nightmare was so realistic and brutal that I felt at the time and told my wife today that if there was even a remote chance of it becoming reality, I would rather die.

She softly stroked my cheek and said "I am glad you did not die".

That is a degree of forgiveness that totally humbles me and makes me even more determined to stay sober.

[Ymx]

Congrats kiwias ! 20 years. Wow !!!

[Kiwias]

Congrats kiwias ! 20 years. Wow !!!

I find it hard to believe I have got this far. Shows if a hard-core alkie like me can do, so can anyone.

[Slick]

Well done mate. I'm not sure you realise how much of an inspiration you are to a lot of folk.

[Kiwias]

Well done mate. I'm not sure you realise how much of an inspiration you are to a lot of folk.

I am not bullshitting anyone when I say that I get as much from this thread as anyone. It is an important part of my sobriety .

[Harveys]

On the 0% beers. I agree they do split opinion. And I would not be drinking these at home. I have a rule to only ever have them if I go out, and where I just don’t want to drink more than a pint of lemonade or cola.

Also, if it is a rugby event, I will have several 0% for tradition.

I never have them at home, because I agree they become an easy way to slip. I also do not have the 0.5% ones, because you are then putting alcohol in to your system. So I’d be staying well away from the IPA based ones, which is think was mentioned above.

Its an interesting issue and certainly one that is seriously frowned upon by large parts of AA. I don’t have a strong position on the issue either way other than I’m aware I largely associate my appreciation of the tase for beer with the effect. I have had no desire whatsoever to drink non-alcoholic beer, as harmless as it may be. Saying that I drink my fair share of kombucha knowing there is a tiny percentage of alcohol in it though don’t go around AA making a song and dance about it. I appreciate that what’s OK for me at 15 years sober might not be ok for someone 6 months sober.

[Harveys]

7,305 days ago, on 11 January 2004, I woke soaked in sweat from a brutal nightmare involving alcohol. I took our dog for her morning walk and when I sat down for breakfast, my wife passed me the contact information for the local sobriety support group, with a gentle "maybe it is time to give them a call".

That marked the first large step toward a decent life in sobriety and I offer my heart-felt thanks to all those who have supported me on this journey.

[Kiwias]

Appreciated, mate.

[Slick]

I've committed to a year off it, no ifs, no buts.

Whenever I've stopped in the past there has always been a possible "out" - maybe i'll drink then, lets see how we go - which leads to the inevitable.

Feeling very comfortable about it and been through the possible pinch points and dismissed them.

The hope of course is that after a year it just becomes my life and I don't consider going back to it. I've heard so many stories from folk of this happening.