New Zealand Rugby set to ditch SANZAAR, Super Rugby - report

[Enzedder]

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/a ... d=12346317

Rugby's 'Aratipu' review wants Super Rugby scrapped in favour of a transtasman competition, according to a report.

The new competition would also include "a team from the Pacific", while SANZAAR – the southern hemisphere's governing body at the moment – would be left to run the Rugby Championship involving the test teams, Mediaworks reports.

Super Rugby was to have proceeded with teams from New Zealand, Australia, South Africa and Argentina, following the axing of Japan's Sunwolves from 2021.

But Mediaworks says sources have revealed "SANZAAR's days of running the (Super Rugby) competition appear to be over from next year".

"Southern hemisphere rugby's united front could soon be over," it stated.

New Zealand Rugby announced in April that it would expand an existing review into Super Rugby.

Named Aratipu, and chaired by Don Mackinnon from the Blues, it appeared to signal that some radical changes may be on the horizon.

Aratipu also wants any new competition to feed into a bigger international tournament, the report claims. That might involve the winners going into playoffs against the champions from other countries.

"As long as it keeps the qualities that are making this competition really successful," Blues coach Leon Macdonald was quoted as saying.

Meanwhile, Sanzaar boss Andy Marinos remains optimistic about playing the Rugby Championship later this year and that a full Super Rugby competition will continue as normal next year.

[FujiKiwi]

Point of order, but isn't the OP title a bit misleading? NZ rugby would still be in SANZAAR, but SANZAAR would no longer run Super rugby?

[Enzedder]

So, still a conference system if the winners go on to play other competition winners. We'll do it the same way and call it a different name so they won't know the difference (just no inter-conference games during the round robin)

[Quade]

So is there going to be a trans-tasman comp or are NZ going it alone?

[FujiKiwi]

So is there going to be a trans-tasman comp or are NZ going it alone?

I've read somewhere that what's being proposed is teams from NZ and Oz, with one team based in the Pacific.

EDIT: In fact it's in the longer version of the article Enz linked to.

[Enzedder]

So is there going to be a trans-tasman comp or are NZ going it alone?

By the sound of it, you guys can play and the PIs too. Choyyyyyce

[Quade]

So is there going to be a trans-tasman comp or are NZ going it alone?

By the sound of it, you guys can play and the PIs too. Choyyyyyce

Sounds good. Too few teams otherwise.

I am loving prime-time rugby. This will be a much better comp than Super. Interesting to see whether NZ will let players from the Oz teams be selected for the ABs.

[FujiKiwi]

So is there going to be a trans-tasman comp or are NZ going it alone?

By the sound of it, you guys can play and the PIs too. Choyyyyyce

Sounds good. Too few teams otherwise.

I am loving prime-time rugby. This will be a much better comp than Super. Interesting to see whether NZ will let players from the Oz teams be selected for the ABs.

They never have. I don't see any reason they would start now. EDIT: Or is this a whoosh? I was thinking of kiwi players like Daniel Braid who have played in Aussie teams and not been considered for the ABs. Angus Taa'vao, too, originally.

[Quade]

By the sound of it, you guys can play and the PIs too. Choyyyyyce

Sounds good. Too few teams otherwise.

I am loving prime-time rugby. This will be a much better comp than Super. Interesting to see whether NZ will let players from the Oz teams be selected for the ABs.

They never have. I don't see any reason they would start now. EDIT: Or is this a whoosh? I was thinking of kiwi players like Daniel Braid who have played in Aussie teams and not been considered for the ABs. Angus Taa'vao, too, originally.

Not a whoosh - NZ has more quality players, so could even up the comp. And vice versa, OZ players playing in NZ is good for them.

[FujiKiwi]

I see. yes. I see how that could be seen as a win-win for you guys and NZ in some ways. There have to be drawbacks though. Not the least of which would be kiwi players taking spots in Aussie teams and stopping Aussie talent from being developed.

[Quade]

I see. yes. I see how that could be seen as a win-win for you guys and NZ in some ways. There have to be drawbacks though. Not the least of which would be kiwi players taking spots in Aussie teams and stopping Aussie talent from being developed.

There would have to be a limit, but getting thrashed every game doesn't help develop talent either. A major imbalance in the comp would doom it to failure IMO.

[Wignu]

IMO they should try and get a Japanese team into it as well, gotta think of them broadcasting $$$'s (plus it'd be good exposure to try and keep any momentum(??) gained after the RWC.

[stemoc]

we saw with Global rapid rugby that tonga and samoa are incapable of fielding teams and were forced to borrow players from nz and fiji, a PI combined team will work but it will mainly be fijian players so not sure how that will work..obliviously based in Suva as its the only stadium that can host a super rugby level competition in the pacific..

[FujiKiwi]

What would be a cool Fijian name for a team based in Suva? One non-Fijian speakers could pronounce easily enough?

[stemoc]

What would be a cool Fijian name for a team based in Suva? One non-Fijian speakers could pronounce easily enough?

ha, hard to say but the Pacific Warriors name will be easy on the tongue..

[FujiKiwi]

What would be a cool Fijian name for a team based in Suva? One non-Fijian speakers could pronounce easily enough?

ha, hard to say but the Pacific Warriors name will be easy on the tongue..

At the risk of sounding “woke”, I don’t like it much. Identifying Polynesians primarily with war and bloodshed. Such a dated and inaccurate image.

[Ellafan]

What would be a cool Fijian name for a team based in Suva? One non-Fijian speakers could pronounce easily enough?

ha, hard to say but the Pacific Warriors name will be easy on the tongue..

At the risk of sounding “woke”, I don’t like it much. Identifying Polynesians primarily with war and bloodshed. Such a dated and inaccurate image.

stemoc = comets

[FujiKiwi]

stemoc = comets

I know it's comets. I just thought as a passionate advocate of Fijian rugby, he'd have something constructive to offer in regard to a good name for a Super team based in Suva.

[stemoc]

well oz/kiwi commemorators already fuck up an easy word like Drua, might as well use a name that won't embarrass THEM.

[Carter's Choice]

I just pray that if they do opt for a PI team, they just base in Fiji and call it Fiji. No-one wants a combined PI abomination. It will need to be based in Fiji to have any chance of commercial success, so just make it a proper Fijian team from the get-go.

[FujiKiwi]

I just pray that if they do opt for a PI team, they just base in Fiji and call it Fiji. No-one wants a combined PI abomination. It will need to be based in Fiji to have any chance of commercial success, so just make it a proper Fijian team from the get-go.

You've said yourself national teams shouldn't play in a competition like this.

Why not just call it the "Suva ________", use a bunch of Fijian players but encourage other players from the islands to play? No different from having the Crusaders based in Christchurch but having Michael Alaalatoa, or the Wellington-based Hurricanes using Kobus Van Wyk, etc.

[FujiKiwi]

well oz/kiwi commemorators already fuck up an easy word like Drua, might as well use a name that won't embarrass THEM.

Fuck them. They can learn to pronounce one word. Bloody embarrassing for everyone to have a team based in Suva with an English name.

Drua is the name for the national team, right? I like it because it's not that tired stereotype of bloodthirsty warriors. Something like the word and image of Drua would be good, imho.

Of course, it should be up to the people to decide, not an outsider like me, I get that. But it shouldn't be some white marketing manager in a suit sitting in an Auckland or Sydney office that makes the call, either.

[Torquemada 1420]

So, still a conference system if the winners go on to play other competition winners. We'll do it the same way and call it a different name so they won't know the difference (just no inter-conference games during the round robin)

Can't help feeling this is a money loser. The whole draw of Soup was watching sides from different countries (the formula of the HEC). I appreciate that in SANZAAR countries, the audience requirements might differ to up here but NZ and SA already have long standing, (potentially) viable comps so there is the danger of more of the same.

All agree Soup was a mess due to greed = far too many teams but going back to earlier formats might fix that. OK, 6 too few but 8 or 10?

[Ellafan]

stemoc = comets

I know it's comets. I just thought as a passionate advocate of Fijian rugby, he'd have something constructive to offer in regard to a good name for a Super team based in Suva.

Give it time. A PI involvement would be good.

The samish time zone is better than what we have now.

I dare say a "cup winners cup" type contest in a knock out format, where the Saffer time zone goes against the Oceania would be good as a brief add on, as opposed to recording games at 3am each weekend all season.

Just imagine, a Saffer team finally after say 6 years of failures get a home final fixture for the Super-Rugby trophy, with a visiting NZ or Aussie (or PI or Japanese or Hong Kong).

You might actually get up at 3am to watch the Saffers lose*.

[* sorry jarpies, but Nigel the neutral is reffing].

[Aficionado]

So, still a conference system if the winners go on to play other competition winners. We'll do it the same way and call it a different name so they won't know the difference (just no inter-conference games during the round robin)

Can't help feeling this is a money loser. The whole draw of Soup was watching sides from different countries (the formula of the HEC). I appreciate that in SANZAAR countries, the audience requirements might differ to up here but NZ and SA already have long standing, (potentially) viable comps so there is the danger of more of the same.

All agree Soup was a mess due to greed = far too many teams but going back to earlier formats might fix that. OK, 6 too few but 8 or 10?

Rumour control has the Saf teams playing in a NH comp. next season, is it the Pro-16?

[FujiKiwi]

A falling out brewing between Australia and NZ as to what the new competition would look like:

https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/sup ... -hard-ball

For some of the reasons already mentioned on this thread. Having five teams from Australia would dilute the competition. That's not really up for debate. How to deal with that is where the disagreement lies.

[Auckman]

we saw with Global rapid rugby that tonga and samoa are incapable of fielding teams and were forced to borrow players from nz and fiji, a PI combined team will work but it will mainly be fijian players so not sure how that will work..obliviously based in Suva as its the only stadium that can host a super rugby level competition in the pacific..

Not quite. Apia Park hosted the Blues in 2017 under lights.

Anyway, those Global teams were run separate from the unions. If they were run by the unions, they'd have been more local players in them.

[Auckman]

A PI team should be run completely separately from the PI Unions but have those Unions have a stake in the team by maybe having their HPU directors involved with the team - and they can supply many of the players in any development team for the franchise.

It could help attract back PI-eligible players from Europe but probably only those players in the lower division Euro leagues as the a PI super team would not be able to command division one salaries in Europe.

[-RB-]

A falling out brewing between Australia and NZ as to what the new competition would look like:

https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/sup ... -hard-ball

For some of the reasons already mentioned on this thread. Having five teams from Australia would dilute the competition. That's not really up for debate. How to deal with that is where the disagreement lies.

Five kiwi teams, NSW, Qland, Melbourne & Force + PI Team.

Allow a quota of foreign players in any team from the participant countries and NZ players to be selected for the AB's from any team in the comp.

Think it would only be good for NZ rugby as more Mitre 10 cup players would get fully professional contracts. Might be issues with kiwis taking spots that could go to Australians but that's their problem. Can't have their cake and eat it too.

The teams need to be competitive.

[FujiKiwi]

You can’t seriously be suggesting no Brumbies in the comp?

[Ellafan]

"South-west brumbies"

[CrazyIslander]

i like it.why not have 12. 5 NZ, 5 Aus, 1 PI, 1 JP

[Monkey Magic]

A falling out brewing between Australia and NZ as to what the new competition would look like:

https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/sup ... -hard-ball

For some of the reasons already mentioned on this thread. Having five teams from Australia would dilute the competition. That's not really up for debate. How to deal with that is where the disagreement lies.

Five kiwi teams, NSW, Qland, Melbourne & Force + PI Team.

Allow a quota of foreign players in any team from the participant countries and NZ players to be selected for the AB's from any team in the comp.

Think it would only be good for NZ rugby as more Mitre 10 cup players would get fully professional contracts. Might be issues with kiwis taking spots that could go to Australians but that's their problem. Can't have their cake and eat it too.

The teams need to be competitive.

Not sure loading up teams with mitre 10 cup players is a good idea, we're diluting the level of all teams to keep it even.

Or you're putting players not good enough for super rugby in nz into an oz team hoping it makes the oz team better?

[-RB-]

You can’t seriously be suggesting no Brumbies in the comp?

Yep. I know their history but tough bikkies. You want the big poulation centres imo and that force dude has $$$

[Koalabyte]

I think it is an idea whose time has come, certainly for Wallabies rugby, we need a return to more simple rugby. To rebuild the grass roots game. It got a little too complicated for your average punter. Let the supporters go back to weekend footy watching your local.

Saffas have a great home product and they have been umming and ahhing about joining a NH league. Argies should look to that too. Japan were pulling out.

I would still incorporate a Fijian side or call it a PI side, to give Islanders a way to get some experience. I think the Drua deserve a team even at the expense of a Aussie side. 5 NZ teams, 4 Oz + Drua/PI

[brumbie_steve]

Nobody going to point out that Fijians are mostly Melanesian?

Brumbies don't get a guernsey and I have watched my last rugby game.

[Biffer]

Super Rugby Aotearoa is the best domestic competition to happen in the Southern Hemisphere for years. You guys have great teams and shit competitions. I think you should stick to domestic comps and then have an international club / region competition afterwards. Same as in Europe - where the competitions are successful with fans, sponsors and broadcasters. If Crusaders v Reds happens twice every year there’s nothing to get excited about and it ends up being a shit competition. Twice a year domestically works because of internal rivalries, national team mates playing each other etc.

[ManhoodObesity]

I think it is an idea whose time has come, certainly for Wallabies rugby, we need a return to more simple rugby. To rebuild the grass roots game. It got a little too complicated for your average punter. Let the supporters go back to weekend footy watching your local.

Saffas have a great home product and they have been umming and ahhing about joining a NH league. Argies should look to that too. Japan were pulling out.

I would still incorporate a Fijian side or call it a PI side, to give Islanders a way to get some experience. I think the Drua deserve a team even at the expense of a Aussie side. 5 NZ teams, 4 Oz + Drua/PI

And another plus is that Australia have to play nice and can’t keep fucking over kiwi teams in Australian competitions.

Personally I am ambivalent on the concept

But hey what will be will be, I just hope we keep the current local conference format. Fuck off will I watch another regular season Waratahs v Blues game

[Ellafan]

Last night we watched two Manly players - Hodge and Meakes - pull the rebels back into the game at Brookvale.

Let's face it, if those blokes hadn't been poached from NSW they would be playing for the 'tahs.

The rot set in when the brumbies were fabricated and started poaching the likes of Sterling Mortlock (Gordon) and George Smith (Manly).

It's time to end the bleeding, and get some quality back into our traditional; teams.

[FujiKiwi]

Last night we watched two Manly players - Hodge and Meakes - pull the rebels back into the game at Brookvale.

Let's face it, if those blokes hadn't been poached from NSW they would be playing for the 'tahs.

The rot set in when the brumbies were fabricated and started poaching the likes of Sterling Mortlock (Gordon) and George Smith (Manly).

It's time to end the bleeding, and get some quality back into our traditional; teams.

Those Brumbie teams were the heart of the success the Australian team achieved in that era.