The official NPR Audiophile thread.

[Line6 HXFX]

Think first up, think we have to really establish if "Audiophile" isn't just a term created by HIFI salesmen, to get customers to buy expensive shit through the use of flattery and derision.

"Ahh you must be an "audiophile' and have great ears, (looks at person like they are a fellow audio svengali) let me direct you to my "mugs corner", sooo 300 quid for a bit of cable, and this plastic connector, cheap at twice the price".

You know artists record stuff in their bedrooms, most have gone full on digital, using free or cheap amp modelling software , and yet you are still paying six grand for speakers to "get the authentic tone"...authentic tone of what, a Kemper profile, a free IR speaker cabinet model?

This is before we even look at how ears (and brains) of over forty year olds (people who have all this disposable income) suck.
Seriously suck.

So let's talk Audiophile, and all post up your audiophile level gear and how much you paid, just so that we can all laugh about it.

Cheers.

[Chrysoprase]

Not sure if this fits the aim of this thread, I haven't spent loads on HiFi gear in a long time but I do keep on buying new cans. Recently got these:



and these:



I held off on buying bluetooth cans for a long time because I was concerned about the drop in quality during the transmission. Didn't take the plunge until having a good chat about it with a DJ I happened to be sitting next to on a plane who told me it really wasn't an issue.

The funny thing is, 99% of my listening is to Spotify on my phone

[A6D6E6]

I have some Amazon echos which I use for streaming spotify, but I make sure to only use Russ Andrews SuperKord 500s to plug them in as it makes the sound even fuller, more detailed and more open and natural. I know that £2,290 (with the optional super burn-in plus upgrade) for a power cable sounds like I am being a bit cheap, but the sound is good enough for my aging ears.

https://www.russandrews.com/the-superko ... 50i-ag-hc/

[ASMO]

Bluetooth 5 is the way to go, lower power consumption, better connection and also dual audio meaning that you can connect 2 blutooth devices to the same phone for example and they can listen at the same time.

[Sandstorm]

I have some Amazon echos which I use for streaming spotify, but I make sure to only use Russ Andrews SuperKord 500s to plug them in as it make the sound even fuller, more detailed and more open and natural. I know that £2,290 (with the optional super burn-in plus upgrade) for a power cable sounds like I am being a bit cheap, but the sound is good enough for my aging ears.

https://www.russandrews.com/the-superko ... 50i-ag-hc/

This guy gets it.

[Insane_Homer]

DIY Distributed Mode Speakers. Very interesting.

[Line6 HXFX]

I actually totally subscribe to a hell of a lot of audiophile YouTube channels. I am honestly interested in a lot if this stuff, and think I understand the hobby.
But...the people I subscribe to are all so obviously just HIFI salesmen, pushing this weeks latest and greatest nonsense.
It is undeniably Snakeoil central.
John Darko, the Guttenberg guy (the Audiophiliac) to name a few channels.
I recommend these guys thoughouly. Charming entertaining...hifi salesmen, who do great videos.
But if something comes along, that is reasonably inexpensive, that knocks the socks off all this super expensive stuff, they simply either don't talk about it at all, or let others attack it.
Take the Amazon Echo Studio speaker. It is sold as an Audiophile level speaker, and it really is (I will own two as I have another one coming today ).
It is bang for the buck probably the greatest thing on the market (now going for 149 quid).
These guys obviously cannot review it because they will both just love it, and that will be the end of nearly everyones audiophile journey right there.
"Hi, welcome to my Audiophile channel, buy the Amazon Echo Studio Speaker, right thanks, tarra then, I hear painting is a great hobby".
It plays tidal, Amazon HD music, Dolby Atmos, you can set them up how you like it, I am not too fond of the spacial effect it does by default, but you know, nothing is perfect, turn it off.

So this is it then., welcome to my Audiophile thread, where we discuss all things Audiophile, so just buy the Amazon Echo Studio Speaker, they are on offer right now.. right tarra then, I hear painting is a great hobby".

[Torquemada 1420]

Well.

1) Even as your hearing diminishes with age that doesn't entirely alter the fact that more accurate reproduction is more accurate and still discernible.

2) But, both of those things are diminishing returns: hearing and every extra £ you spend on better equipment.

3) Hi-Fi differs little in that regard to anything else (cameras, cars, wine, whatever).

4) Seeking perfection is actually a pain in the arse. There is no point beyond a certain level buying more expensive kit unless you are prepared to listen in a dedicated environment. I have a sound room purely for listening. For the vast majority, convenience overrides the need for quality quite quickly. Hence why most pics are taken on mobile phones and not a Hasselblad.

5) That there is a massive amount of snake oil stuff out there differs from no other products. BMW owners........

I always stuck to what Rega had on their packaging: "If you can't hear why you should by a Rega, don't". Note that people's preferences for reproduction differ as much as their preferences for colours. Getting what you like does not need to equate to getting faithful reproduction. In that regard I'd consider myself a minority but the point is irrelevant.

[Torquemada 1420]

Take the Amazon Echo Studio speaker. It is sold as an Audiophile level speaker, and it really is (I will own two as I have another one coming today ).
It is bang for the buck probably the greatest thing on the market (now going for 149 quid).
These guys obviously cannot review it because they will both just love it, and that will be the end of nearly everyones audiophile journey right there.

Yeah. This was already covered on another thread (maybe it was on PR?). It really isn't.

{EDIT} Sorry. It was PR. Here
https://forum.planetrugby.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=99512

[sockwithaticket]

The funny thing is, 99% of my listening is to Spotify on my phone

Give me FLAC or Wav lossless or gtfo.

Side note, people who have amazing kit but a crap source confuse me.

Crap kit and crap source, do you even like music?

[Torquemada 1420]

The funny thing is, 99% of my listening is to Spotify on my phone

Give me FLAC or Wav lossless or gtfo.

Side note, people who have amazing kit but a crap source confuse me.

Crap kit and crap source, do you even like music?

Quite.

[clydecloggie]

I've got some reasonably expensive kit - Naim UnitiLite with Bowers & Wilkins CM8 speakers. Went to a high-end shop, asked for a warm sound that essentially lets CDs sound like vinyl on a £3k budget, and ended up with these.

Love them, even if the bass sound could be a little heavier for my liking - but that more reflects the subordinate role of the bass guitar in a lot of rock music productions. Bane of my life. Ghost, NoMeansNo and other bands that give a prominent role to the bass guitar still sound absolutely fine on my system.

Never got the cable fetish, fortunately, so didn't spend on those.

Also frequently use old Sennheiser wireless headphones which transmit on FM rather than Bluetooth - they're getting on a bit and the atmospheric noise is something else, but thanks to those and the corded Sennheisers I bought 30 years ago, I'll probably never consider buying another brand of headphones for my music listening.

Main source of listening is the Foobar'd CD collection with the occasional foray into Spotify if new stuff comes out I might be interested in purchasing.

[sockwithaticket]

I'm a slightly above average earner, so my equipment is a constant balance between affordability and quality. Generally play all music from my computer at home which has Bose Companion 50 speakers and a Creative Soundblaster X-fi HD soundcard. Headphones are Sennhesier HD 280 pro. For out and about I have a Sony Walkman NWZ-A15 with Sennhesier CX300-II 'phones.

My music library is generally ripped from CDs, but it's becoming increasingly easy to buy music from the bands I like digitally in either FLAC or Wav lossless so am doing that more. Spotify is for discovering new stuff, not general listening.

[Line6 HXFX]

I've got some reasonably expensive kit - Naim UnitiLite with Bowers & Wilkins CM8 speakers. Went to a high-end shop, asked for a warm sound that essentially lets CDs sound like vinyl on a £3k budget, and ended up with these.

Love them, even if the bass sound could be a little heavier for my liking - but that more reflects the subordinate role of the bass guitar in a lot of rock music productions. Bane of my life. Ghost, NoMeansNo and other bands that give a prominent role to the bass guitar still sound absolutely fine on my system.

Never got the cable fetish, fortunately, so didn't spend on those.

Also frequently use old Sennheiser wireless headphones which transmit on FM rather than Bluetooth - they're getting on a bit and the atmospheric noise is something else, but thanks to those and the corded Sennheisers I bought 30 years ago, I'll probably never consider buying another brand of headphones for my music listening.

Main source of listening is the Foobar'd CD collection with the occasional foray into Spotify if new stuff comes out I might be interested in purchasing.

There are a lot of great reasons to having a Vinyl collection. You may like delicate easily breakable, dust gathering objects around the house, and pretty pictures, You love buying second hand stuff and like to screw the artist over, but warmness of tone? Dude, such a cliche..Tidal do master quality audio now, it sounds deliciously warm through a Amazon Echo Studio speaker.

[Margin__Walker]

Meh, I listen to Spotify 90% of the time either through mid range headphones, Roberts istream 94i and 3rd gen Amazon Echo. Find it perfectly enjoyable.

Love music, but not interested in it being a sink for my disposable income at the moment. My old man's got a cracking hi fi setup and I'll get one at some point when other priorities are out of the way. Don't feel it's a massive hole in my life though.

[Line6 HXFX]

Aren't a lot of these new vinyl prints just copies of digital recordings?
The actual masters were destroyed long ago.

Also, the whole Vinyl is warmer thing, yeah complete Snakeoil.

There are lots and lots of vids online completely disproving this.

3000 quid man, think we have a winner.

[Torquemada 1420]

Never got the cable fetish, fortunately, so didn't spend on those.

The (speaker) cable issue is very complex. Spent some years (with some techies) conducting experiments with wire. So here are some of the considerations
1) The longer the wire, the more the bad news.
2) Thinner wire creates more resistance, more heat = sh*ttier outcome.
3) Thicker solid wire creates other problems
- not least, how do you bend it round corners
- higher frequencies will always seek to travel at the outer edges and so will arrive at a different time to low ones
- you are far more likely to induce eddy currents
4) Multistrand brings in the spectre of your signal arriving at slightly times at the end of each filament
5) Not going to bother discussing the stuff around "pipe" (hollow cable) and stuff like induced inductance etc.
6) Any change of medium results in some alteration. For example, if your amp output plugs are silver ---> you use gold plated banana plugs --> which are plated over steel --> which then feeds into copper wire --> reverse the process at the other end........

All these effects are real. I know because we can and have measured them.
But can you hear them? Well, that really depends what you are comparing with what? A 5 strand cable v a copper pipe (yes: I mean the sort used in plumbing). Absolutely (even if you are 70). Gold plated banana plugs v the same plugs naked? Nope.

Where you can hear a difference (on whatever system you are using), the cable becomes no different to any other component i.e. diminishing returns, personal preference.

For many a year I ran with QED 79 (79 strands) which was probably £0.50pm back then. When I built my "ultimate" system, I quite casually switched to a £50pm cable. And was shocked. So much so, that I had a sequence of friends and even the missus blind listening between the old and new. I expected some audible difference (note: I am not saying better) but NOT the extremes that manifested.

So, my counsel is
> have a budget for your cables
> and take the Rega test to establish if there are differences for you and which you prefer

[Torquemada 1420]

Tidal do master quality audio now, it sounds deliciously warm through a Amazon Echo Studio speaker.

If you seriously think an item that retails for £150 (and assuming profit in there although I accept Amazon might be loss leading) that has to function as all of
- a network device
- a DAC
- it's own amplifier
- and a speaker
- at that size
can even compete with a basic Wharfedale Diamond, then you really are an idiot and should walk away from the debate!

[Line6 HXFX]

It's funny, in the guitar world you have lots and lots of people who have invested lots and lots of money into some really expensive, vintage guitar amps.

Unfortunately, a lot of the sounds of these super expensive, rare amps can be now easily captured and replicated perfectly, and you can even download these tones for nothing, shoot them through you Kemper or Preamp Live or HX effects and out through a FRFR speaker and you wouldn't be able to tell the difference between the amp you just paid 3000 quid for and a free digital download.

Doesn't it scare all you audiophiles that the amps and equipment you use and cherish, and have paid and invested an absolute fortune for, will soon be so easily recreated digitally?
I realise rooms play a massive part etc, but still.
A digital modelling amp, that can store many thousands of HIFI amp Models, which you can then match to hundreds of models of turntables and cassettes and speakers, and be able to do this relatively inexpensively?

Because digital modelling and this new technology absolutely terrifies amp collectors in the guitar world.

[Sinkers]

I’ve still got a vinyl and CD collection because, well I’ve still got my vinyl and CD collection. It’s irreplacable as far as I’m concerned.

I’m Probably at least 10 years out of date on the technology and kit though

[Torquemada 1420]

Doesn't it scare all you audiophiles that the amps and equiptment you use, and have paid and invested an absolute fortune for, will soon be so easily recreated digitally?
I realise rooms play a massive part etc, but still.
A digital modelling amp, that can store many thousands of HIFI amp Models, which you can then match to hundreds of models of turntables and cassettes and speakers, and be able to do this relatively inexpensively?

Because digital modelling and this new technology absolutely terrifies amp collectors in the guitar world.

No. Because my amps upsample any inputs to 40bit/384Khz (2 x professional recording standards), so mapped into the digital domain as accurately as anyone is ever going to need and then I do exactly what you describe.

But you can't do this inexpensively.

[duke]

You could call me a victim of buying local as I have various bits from a local company dotted around the house.
Main system is Naim SuperUniti with Kudos X2 speakers. In the kitchen we have Naim Muso Qb and in our bedroom Naim Uniti Atom with Naim nSats - most of the kit is ex demo or second hand. Have all our cds ripped into a NAS but am increasingly streaming via Tidal or listening to Radio Paradise.

I used to have a fair sized collection of LPs which went about 20 years ago and which I regret but wouldn’t have the room for anyway.

Thinking back, it’s been an interesting journey into music listening all starting with saving up from a Summer job to get Dual 505 deck, NADA 3020 amp and Mission 700 speakers - they did sterling service back in the day.

Can see a time when everything I listen to will be streamed from a subscription service and I have no physical music in the house. Don’t quite know what to think about that prospect.

[Sandstorm]

Amazing how a few years back in work has changed our REFRY. “Let’s talk about my audiophile equipment, lads”

[A6D6E6]

It's funny, in the guitar world you have lots and lots of people who have invested lots and lots of money into some really expensive, vintage guitar amps.

Unfortunately, a lot of the sounds of these super expensive, rare amps can be now easily captured and replicated perfectly, and you can even download these tones for nothing, shoot them through you Kemper or Preamp Live or HX effects and out through a FRFR speaker and you wouldn't be able to tell the difference between the amp you just paid 3000 quid for and a free digital download.

Doesn't it scare all you audiophiles that the amps and equiptment you use, and have paid and invested an absolute fortune for, will soon be so easily recreated digitally?
I realise rooms play a massive part etc, but still.
A digital modelling amp, that can store many thousands of HIFI amp Models, which you can then match to hundreds of models of turntables and cassettes and speakers, and be able to do this relatively inexpensively?

Because digital modelling and this new technology absolutely terrifies amp collectors in the guitar world.

In my time I've owned a few different Marshalls, an AC15 and a MesaBoogie. I now only have a Kemper. It is probably the single best bit of guitar gear I've ever bought. As far as I'm concerned, the battle is over and digital has won. The flexibility and convenience easily makes up for the 1% difference that only I think I can hear (or feel) and that nobody else cares about.

Back on the subject of this thread, I get that buying better stuff will improve the sound quality but the sheer amount of snake oil (like the £2,000+ power cable I linked to earlier) and the "Emperor's new clothes" aspect to the whole audiophile thing puts guitarists and their fetish for 1950s designs and pickups wound by the right employee on the production line at Fender to shame.

[Chrysoprase]

Doesn't it scare all you audiophiles that the amps and equiptment you use, and have paid and invested an absolute fortune for, will soon be so easily recreated digitally?
I realise rooms play a massive part etc, but still.
A digital modelling amp, that can store many thousands of HIFI amp Models, which you can then match to hundreds of models of turntables and cassettes and speakers, and be able to do this relatively inexpensively?

Because digital modelling and this new technology absolutely terrifies amp collectors in the guitar world.

No. Because my amps upsample any inputs to 40bit/384Khz (2 x professional recording standards), so mapped into the digital domain as accurately as anyone is ever going to need and then I do exactly what you describe.

But you can't do this inexpensively.

I'm curious to know, what do you listen to? This isn't a dig, I'm just thinking that I'm not convinced the kind of music I enjoy would benefit from the kind of investment you're talking about on this thread. There must be some law of diminishing returns around how much better music will sound, especially if it wasn't made to massively exacting standards in the first place.

I doubt many of the indie bands I listen to could afford to make music that would benefit from the kind of kit you're talking about. Happy to be educated though.

[ASMO]

You also have to factor in the capability of the human ear itself, some of the differences between top end stuff and mid range stuff will be hardly discernable to 95% of users and its more about elitist dick waving than anything else

[Torquemada 1420]

I'm curious to know, what do you listen to? This isn't a dig, I'm just thinking that I'm not convinced the kind of music I enjoy would benefit from the kind of investment you're talking about on this thread. There must be some law of diminishing returns around how much better music will sound, especially if it wasn't made to massively exacting standards in the first place.

I doubt many of the indie bands I listen to could afford to make music that would benefit from the kind of kit you're talking about. Happy to be educated though.

Not a helpful answer, I know. But everything. I have several hundred LPs.

I've already, repeatedly, acknowledged the diminishing returns aspect and I am in no way suggesting other people embark upon the same path as I. Or at least the same length of that path. What I'm knocking against is the corollary of diminishing returns; that is, by definition, as you come back down the scale, everyone will experience a noticeable drop in whatever his measure of quality is. That tipping point will also differ for everyone but it is nowhere near the £150 Echo sh*te end suggested in this OP!

[Line6 HXFX]

Tidal do master quality audio now, it sounds deliciously warm through a Amazon Echo Studio speaker.

If you seriously think an item that retails for £150 (and assuming profit in there although I accept Amazon might be loss leading) that has to function as all of
- a network device
- a DAC
- it's own amplifier
- and a speaker
- at that size
can even compete with a basic Wharfedale Diamond, then you really are an idiot and should walk away from the debate!

Any pro audiophile will tell you one bit of kit isn't better than another, it is just different.

So you may say that your Superdooper 3000 quid hifi will create a better soundstage in my "listening" Room (sorry trying not to laugh, listening room..hah!) , than a couple of Amazon Echo Studio Speakers, pushing out Amazon HD audio, but I would have to disagree, and side with audiophiles everywhere and say nope, it isn't better, just different.

Fact is it will always serve my fellow audiophiles to have contempt for my couple of Echo studio speakers, that fires sound in five different directions (ten when put two together).
How dare I have such deliciousness..at such a silly price they will complain..what about our expensive hobby?
Is it dead?
Well..yep.

[Line6 HXFX]

It's funny, in the guitar world you have lots and lots of people who have invested lots and lots of money into some really expensive, vintage guitar amps.

Unfortunately, a lot of the sounds of these super expensive, rare amps can be now easily captured and replicated perfectly, and you can even download these tones for nothing, shoot them through you Kemper or Preamp Live or HX effects and out through a FRFR speaker and you wouldn't be able to tell the difference between the amp you just paid 3000 quid for and a free digital download.

Doesn't it scare all you audiophiles that the amps and equiptment you use, and have paid and invested an absolute fortune for, will soon be so easily recreated digitally?
I realise rooms play a massive part etc, but still.
A digital modelling amp, that can store many thousands of HIFI amp Models, which you can then match to hundreds of models of turntables and cassettes and speakers, and be able to do this relatively inexpensively?

Because digital modelling and this new technology absolutely terrifies amp collectors in the guitar world.

In my time I've owned a few different Marshalls, an AC15 and a MesaBoogie. I now only have a Kemper. It is probably the single best bit of guitar gear I've ever bought. As far as I'm concerned, the battle is over and digital has won. The flexibility and convenience easily makes up for the 1% difference that only I think I can hear (or feel) and that nobody else cares about.

Back on the subject of this thread, I get that buying better stuff will improve the sound quality but the sheer amount of snake oil (like the £2,000+ power cable I linked to earlier) and the "Emperor's new clothes" aspect to the whole audiophile thing puts guitarists and their fetish for 1950s designs and pickups wound by the right employee on the production line at Fender to shame.

Just pointing out that being able to model all these expensive audiophile type HIFIs (just like they can with guitar amps and speakers) is the future. And that HIFIs will be completely redundant in a few years, like guitar amps.
They won't even have the feel thing to worry about. It will all be about sound.
"Does it sound like it", "Yes it does, exactly".."f'kiingell".
With my Mooer preamp live I can actually tone capture a amp someone is demo'ing on YouTube (or straight of their manufactuers web site) and have a extremely passable and agreeable version of the of the amp ready to go.
It cost me 320 quid.
Some of these amps cost thousands,

[Line6 HXFX]

Amazing how a few years back in work has changed our REFRY. “Let’s talk about my audiophile equipment, lads”

Well, I actually always had lots of mad interests and passions ranging from gardening, flight simming, guitar, movies, audiophile stuff, tone capturing, making the people in my life happy..database developing, rugby, generally being awesome etc..but I was so dehumanised by my "detracters" all I was to the endlessly furious arsewipes out there was a benefits scrounger who they could abuse.


Ps) I am still claiming benefits, Carers allowance.
So pile on if you must.

[Sandstorm]

Amazing how a few years back in work has changed our REFRY. “Let’s talk about my audiophile equipment, lads”

Well, I actually always had lots of mad interests and passions ranging from gardening, flight simming, guitar, movies, audiophile stuff, tone capturing, making the people people in my life happy..database developing, rugby, generally being awesome etc..but I was so dehumanised by my "detracters" all I was to the endlessly furious arsewipes out there was a benefits scrounger who they could abuse.


Ps) I am still claiming benefits, Carers allowance.
So pile on if you must.

Just joshing you, mate. It’s great to see you passionate about something besides burning down the establishment.

[Chrysoprase]

You also have to factor in the capability of the human ear itself, some of the differences between top end stuff and mid range stuff will be hardly discernable to 95% of users and its more about elitist dick waving than anything else

I'm not going to grudge anyone their hobby, if they want to spend thousands on bits of wire then that's totally up to them. But when someone tries to tell me that I can only be a real music lover if I listen to music the way they prescribe then yes, they're just dick waving.

But you know what? Fuck 'em.

[A6D6E6]

It's funny, in the guitar world you have lots and lots of people who have invested lots and lots of money into some really expensive, vintage guitar amps.

Unfortunately, a lot of the sounds of these super expensive, rare amps can be now easily captured and replicated perfectly, and you can even download these tones for nothing, shoot them through you Kemper or Preamp Live or HX effects and out through a FRFR speaker and you wouldn't be able to tell the difference between the amp you just paid 3000 quid for and a free digital download.

Doesn't it scare all you audiophiles that the amps and equiptment you use, and have paid and invested an absolute fortune for, will soon be so easily recreated digitally?
I realise rooms play a massive part etc, but still.
A digital modelling amp, that can store many thousands of HIFI amp Models, which you can then match to hundreds of models of turntables and cassettes and speakers, and be able to do this relatively inexpensively?

Because digital modelling and this new technology absolutely terrifies amp collectors in the guitar world.

In my time I've owned a few different Marshalls, an AC15 and a MesaBoogie. I now only have a Kemper. It is probably the single best bit of guitar gear I've ever bought. As far as I'm concerned, the battle is over and digital has won. The flexibility and convenience easily makes up for the 1% difference that only I think I can hear (or feel) and that nobody else cares about.

Back on the subject of this thread, I get that buying better stuff will improve the sound quality but the sheer amount of snake oil (like the £2,000+ power cable I linked to earlier) and the "Emperor's new clothes" aspect to the whole audiophile thing puts guitarists and their fetish for 1950s designs and pickups wound by the right employee on the production line at Fender to shame.

Just pointing out that being able to model all these expensive audiophile type HIFIs (just like they can with guitar amps and speakers) is the future. And that HIFIs will be completely redundant in a few years, like guitar amps.
They won't even have the feel thing to worry about. It will all be about sound.
"Does it sound like it", "Yes it does, exactly".."f'kiingell".
With my Mooer preamp live I can actually tone capture a amp someone is demo'ing on YouTube (or straight of their manufactuers web site) and have a extremely passable and agreeable version of the of the amp ready to go.
It cost me 320 quid.
Some of these amps cost thousands,

I didn't realise that audiophile amps "had a sound" in the same way that guitar amps do - I presumed that audiophile amps were all about "perfect reproduction of the original recording" (whatever that means).

I'd never really considered it before, but you are right - the technology of kemper etc could make audiophile amps (and speakers) obsolete.

[Dismal Pillock]

-----------------

[Dismal Pillock]

another example. Decided I wanted to try the best cheap MC cart there is. Googled around and the reviews all lead back to Denon DL-110. A moving coil cart that you cannot switch out a new stylus for. Once it's worn out, that's it, another $250 please. They last about 2,000 hours. It is literally like a junkie paying for high grade shit to needle into their blood. After my first one wore out I swore to myself, I'm not an audiophile, not that fussy surely, this $30 Audio Technica one over here will do me, good reviews, clicked buy, hooked it up, didnt even last 30 seconds. Even before breaking it in it was obvious the sound was a massive downgrade from the Denon. Couldnt do it. Sorry. Just cannot go back.

[Dismal Pillock]

My old Hitachi TT-550 (1978). Sex on a stick and she broke my fucking heart. I loved this bitch and she never really loved me back. Varying speed issues. An abusive relationship. I'm technically challenged but still dicked around with the trimpots under the hood till I was blue in the fucken face, to no avail. R.I.P to the unrequited love of my life.

#get_a_life

[Dismal Pillock]

---------------------------

[Torquemada 1420]

Amazing how a few years back in work has changed our REFRY. “Let’s talk about my audiophile equipment, lads”

Oh. It's refry. Had I known, I'd not have even bothered answering. An entire posting career on the single subject of "why being poor makes me a victim or somehow superior". This falls into the latter.

[Torquemada 1420]

You also have to factor in the capability of the human ear itself, some of the differences between top end stuff and mid range stuff will be hardly discernable to 95% of users and its more about elitist dick waving than anything else

I'm not going to grudge anyone their hobby, if they want to spend thousands on bits of wire then that's totally up to them. But when someone tries to tell me that I can only be a real music lover if I listen to music the way they prescribe then yes, they're just dick waving.

But you know what? Fuck 'em.

Well, that's clearly as stupid as wine snobbery but no-one here has opined that stance other than REFRY (inversely).

[Torquemada 1420]

I didn't realise that audiophile amps "had a sound" in the same way that guitar amps do - I presumed that audiophile amps were all about "perfect reproduction of the original recording" (whatever that means).

I'd never really considered it before, but you are right - the technology of kemper etc could make audiophile amps (and speakers) obsolete.

The Amp is what takes the input and boosts it to drive (usually: I'm not talking about pre-amps but the impact is the same) the speakers. Anything taking any analogue signal through circuitry is going to have some impact in altering the output. Hence why so many manufacturers attempt to extol the "transparency" of their kit. What has been entirely missed by the OP is that all sound (including digital) has to be converted back into analogue. Speakers don't throw our staircase waveforms (although they could) but even if they did, the human ear would get little delights from a series of silences interspersed with mono-tonal sounds!

Last point on amps, for now, remains incorrect for the reasons I cited earlier. Not at all clear how speakers fit into your same point though.