The Official English Rugby Thread

[Margin__Walker]

Morning All

[TQoET]

Prefer the other thread tbh :D

[Margin__Walker]

Original and the clearly the best....

So players in revolt at Leicester and LI at pay cuts. Controversial coaching appointments at Gloucester. And no actual rugby to talk about.

Perfect way to start a new bored era

[Dismal Pillock]

Let's talk FVGAZI

[Margin__Walker]

Will probably edit the title and turn it into the Official Fugazi Thread tbf.

[Joost]

Bath losing 16, including a few squad players who’d normally end up playing a decent number of games with internationals/injuries:

[quote] Lucas Noguera, Levi Douglas, Sam Nixon, Will Britton, Matt Garvey, Jack Davies, Freddie Burns, Alex Davies, Aled Brew, Chris Cook, Tom Homer, Jackson Willison, Rhys Webb, Levi Davis, Rhys Davies, Francois Louw[quote]

Homer, in particular, is a surprise and they’ll need to find a replacement for Burns sharping (don’t think there’s any other 10s behind Priestland, unless you count Redpath or De Glanville, who are both centres really).

[Margin__Walker]

Is Homer still Japan bound?

Could do a decent job somewhere

[sockwithaticket]

Only Louw and Burns really stand out in that list as absolute top quality losses. Garvey would have been a couple of seasons ago, but it seems like her barely plays due to injuries these days?

[Joost]

Is Homer still Japan bound?

Could do a decent job somewhere

Hadn’t heard that (Burns definitely is), but hope he lands on his feet; handy player at club level - there’s not much cover for Watson as things stand (McConnochie can cover 15 but is a better winger, Burns is gone, Atkins hasn’t done much since he came through the academy).

On the plus side, Bath’s current 40 man squad for 2020/21 only has 4 non-EQPs - Schoemann, Faletau, Priestland and Matevesi.

[Saint]

Saints announce contract extensions for 19 players

Northampton Saints is delighted to announce a further 19 first-team players have committed their futures to the Club by signing contract extensions.

Seven internationals are amongst those to pen new deals, with England’s Courtney Lawes, Lewis Ludlam, Teimana Harrison, Piers Francis and George Furbank joining Wales fly-half Dan Biggar and Scotland centre Rory Hutchinson in agreeing terms to stay at Franklin’s Gardens.

Alex Mitchell, Alex Moon and Fraser Dingwall – three Saints Academy graduates who all received their first England squad call-up during this year’s Six Nations – have all also put pen to paper on contract extensions.

Meanwhile the likes of Club co-captain Alex Waller, Mikey Haywood, David Ribbans, James Grayson, Ehren Painter, James Fish, and Lewis Bean have all also been rewarded for a string of impressive performances in Black, Green and Gold this term, plus Alex Coles and Samson Ma’asi move from Northampton’s Academy set-up into their first senior contracts.

[Oxbow]

That is excellent news after Gibson's departure. I thought Francis might be off, though I do wonder how many games he'll get through before his next concussion, I'd wager single digits.

[Margin__Walker]

Was some vague story on another forum about Homer selling a car to a blokes mate, saying he was off to Japan.

In other news, the DM suggesting that Ford and Genge have relented and signed on reduced packages at Leicester.

[Hal Jordan]

I see Saints have been infected with the "is" disease.

[Saint]

I see Saints have been infected with the "is" disease.

"Is" is correct in this form I thought. Northampton Saints is a singular club - so "are" would be incorrect.

[Hal Jordan]

All sports teams are plural. I will die on this hill.

[Saint]

Northampton RFC is a singular entity.

[Margin__Walker]

Tuilagi among 6 players who apparently haven't agreed to the new terms at Leicester today (also Bateman, Eastmond, Reid, Taufua and Veainu)

[Saint]

ouch. Not sure where they think they will get their income from

[Joost]

ouch. Not sure where they think they will get their income from

Guess for now they’re still under their existing contracts and Leicester will either need to keep paying them or dismiss them

[Margin__Walker]

Yep, 'stood down' for the moment. I think actually dismissing them could get a bit messy. Assume the likes of Taufua and Veainu may just walk into contracts overseas anyway. Manu may fancy packing it all in for a big payday somewhere too.

[Rhubarb & Custard]

I'd be interested to know if those players who've signed have done so on an equal treatment basis? Which is to say if the club does a deal with Manu for say 90% of his wages to stay does that in turn adjust the lowering of wages for those others who've already signed on?

[Margin__Walker]

Who knows. Other than the odd press snippet, it's hard to figure out what's going on behind the scenes at a lot of these clubs at the moment.

It's Newcastle that have really been screwed by all of this. They weren't the richest anyway, but they are in a position now of not having any match day revenue from March to whenever the 20/21 season starts at the end of the year.

[Joost]

Yep, 'stood down' for the moment. I think actually dismissing them could get a bit messy. Assume the likes of Taufua and Veainu may just walk into contracts overseas anyway. Manu may fancy packing it all in for a big payday somewhere too.

Sports contracts are a bit of a niche area and will be very different from your average employment contract, but assuming these guys are employees they’d have to find a fair reason to dismiss - I don’t see how they could ever be redundant (there’s always going to be a need to put 23 rugby players out!), they’ve not done anything to merit a disciplinary dismissal, they’re fit to work. They’d probably have to tie it to the salary cap reduction but that’d certainly be up for challenge.

Maybe it’s a big game of chicken at the moment but it’ll be interesting to see where this goes if the players don’t back down and don’t find deals elsewhere.

[Margin__Walker]

Interesting snippet here from the Telegraph. Some clubs definitely under more pressure than others and as such have pissed off their playing staff more. Guessing the clubs not mentioned are somewhere in the middle.

[Raggs]

It also says that some youngsters may have got a small rise (not as big as they perhaps would have expected), whilst some big paid stars would take a larger hit. Could also cause some upset.

[Margin__Walker]

Yeah, I guess that would make sense. Youngsters will be on the way up and may have been at the point where they are signing a big leap in contract from Senior academy money to a squad wage.

I think in many cases at the worst impacted clubs, players will sign for lack of any other option. As in the column though, the problem will come later on. Retention will be tougher and players will be more inclined to jump ship to a more secure club when the market it less depressed.

[Raggs]

Yeah, I guess that would make sense. Youngsters will be on the way up and may have been at the point where they are signing a big leap in contract from Senior academy money to a squad wage.

I think in many cases at the worst impacted clubs, players will sign for lack of any other option. As in the column though, the problem will come later on. Retention will be tougher and players will be more inclined to jump ship to a more secure club when the market it less depressed.

I'm just relieved Wasps aren't on the bad list. We definitely don't have funds to spare, so I assume the players are happy with the club and how it's been handled.

[Un Pilier]

Good morning lads. Just arrived. Better sort an avatar out.

[Saint]

I think circumstances have favoured Saints quite heavily during this period. At the start of the season we had a couple of large salaries drop off the books due to un-planned retirements, which left a fair amount of breathing room in the cap (and a decent cash saving for the year). Soo we ended up with more flexibility that we might otherwise have had

[Margin__Walker]

I think circumstances have favoured Saints quite heavily during this period. At the start of the season we had a couple of large salaries drop off the books due to un-planned retirements, which left a fair amount of breathing room in the cap (and a decent cash saving for the year). Soo we ended up with more flexibility that we might otherwise have had

Pretty much the opposite for LI. After two successive relegations they actually spent to the cap for the first time in a long time. An all or nothing attempt to make sure they avoided it this time and started at Brentford a Prem team. It actually worked on the pitch, but we needn't have spent so much, given the Sarries situation as it turns out. Throw in a pandemic and having marquee ex All Black wings etc on the books now is actually an unnecessary burden.

[Un Pilier]

The more I think about what has happened at Tigers, the more distant any sort of turnaround seems. Genuinely hard to believe they have messed up on this scale over such an extended period of time.

[Margin__Walker]

Myler leaving LI.

Still in decent nick, but guessing he may well be retiring anyway.

[SaintK]

The more I think about what has happened at Tigers, the more distant any sort of turnaround seems. Genuinely hard to believe they have messed up on this scale over such an extended period of time.

They just keep rearanging the deckchairs in the boardroom where the main problem lies. The coaching appoinments have also been poor over that period
God knows what Borthwick will make of it all?

[Hal Jordan]

I think circumstances have favoured Saints quite heavily during this period. At the start of the season we had a couple of large salaries drop off the books due to un-planned retirements, which left a fair amount of breathing room in the cap (and a decent cash saving for the year). Soo we ended up with more flexibility that we might otherwise have had

We? I thought it was a singular entity. Unless it's the royal we.

;)

On the Leicester front, Tuilagi especially ought to be careful with his injury history, he must have missed half his career to being crocked. Yesterday's superstar quickly becomes today's forgotten legend.

[Saint]

I think circumstances have favoured Saints quite heavily during this period. At the start of the season we had a couple of large salaries drop off the books due to un-planned retirements, which left a fair amount of breathing room in the cap (and a decent cash saving for the year). Soo we ended up with more flexibility that we might otherwise have had

We? I thought it was a singular entity. Unless it's the royal we.

;)

On the Leicester front, Tuilagi especially ought to be careful with his injury history, he must have missed half his career to being crocked. Yesterday's superstar quickly becomes today's forgotten legend.

Club and supporters = we

[Un Pilier]

The more I think about what has happened at Tigers, the more distant any sort of turnaround seems. Genuinely hard to believe they have messed up on this scale over such an extended period of time.

They just keep rearanging the deckchairs in the boardroom where the main problem lies. The coaching appoinments have also been poor over that period
God knows what Borthwick will make of it all?

Yes, I feel sorry for Borthwick. At least The Crumbie Terrace crowd will probably cut him more slack than would normally be the case.

[Saint]

Saints announcement today that everyone at the club, bar low earners, is taking a 10% pay cut for the next 12 months, replacing the 25% temporary cut since April.

[SaintK]

Saints announcement today that everyone at the club, bar low earners, is taking a 10% pay cut for the next 12 months, replacing the 25% temporary cut since April.

Sounds like they've handled all hs pretty well.

[Madness]

Pat Lam said in an interview they were still under the cap with Hughes, SInks and Radarada, so Manu to Bristol??

[Saint]

Saints announcement today that everyone at the club, bar low earners, is taking a 10% pay cut for the next 12 months, replacing the 25% temporary cut since April.

Sounds like they've handled all hs pretty well.

It sounds like there's been lots of communication between the players and senior management tbh