Climate Change Thread

[Slick]

A big year coming up for Scotland hosting COP26 in Glasgow - although I’ve no idea how they are going to cope.

UK have just announced they will no longer fund oil & gas or coal projects around the world - don’t necessarily agree with this completely

Biden getting the USA back involved

UK, EU and UN hosting a virtual summit this week: UK to cut emissions by 68%, EU by 55% - Australia have committed to stop lying and been told that’s not enough and asked not to attend...

Climate change: UK to end aid for fossil fuel projects abroad https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-55276769

[Biffer]

All of the restrictions, all the reduction in travel, the decrease of industrial activity, and that reduced global emissions by a mere 7%.

Shows me that we need more than just changes in behaviour, we need fundamental changes to society and the infrastructures of our economies.

[Random1]

All of the restrictions, all the reduction in travel, the decrease of industrial activity, and that reduced global emissions by a mere 7%.

Shows me that we need more than just changes in behaviour, we need fundamental changes to society and the infrastructures of our economies.

Technology is always the answer.

Changing behaviour will take too long - better just to get scientists and politicians on a climate war footing (including funding) and see what they come up with.

Throw some reforestation in, and we’ll be grand.

It might be added, if needed, I know very little about climate change.

I just know that humans aren’t great at behaving their way out of the shit we get ourselves into, so if it isn’t tech, we’re proper screwed!

[Slick]

All of the restrictions, all the reduction in travel, the decrease of industrial activity, and that reduced global emissions by a mere 7%.

Shows me that we need more than just changes in behaviour, we need fundamental changes to society and the infrastructures of our economies.

Technology is always the answer.

Changing behaviour will take too long - better just to get scientists and politicians on a climate war footing (including funding) and see what they come up with.

Throw some reforestation in, and we’ll be grand.

It might be added, if needed, I know very little about climate change.

I just know that humans aren’t great at behaving their way out of the shit we get ourselves into, so if it isn’t tech, we’re proper screwed!

Yup, most people just don’t give a fuck.

Biffer, also surprised and disappointed that it was only 7% and of course everyone was back in their car to travel 1/2 mile as soon as they could

[Fangle]

As renewables get more affordable there will be a natural progression towards them.
I read somewhere that the US emissions have dropped further than Europe largely because of fracking and the greater use of natural gas. But that has a limited life span.

[Niegs]

All of the restrictions, all the reduction in travel, the decrease of industrial activity, and that reduced global emissions by a mere 7%.

Shows me that we need more than just changes in behaviour, we need fundamental changes to society and the infrastructures of our economies.

Technology is always the answer.

Changing behaviour will take too long - better just to get scientists and politicians on a climate war footing (including funding) and see what they come up with.

Throw some reforestation in, and we’ll be grand.

It might be added, if needed, I know very little about climate change.

I just know that humans aren’t great at behaving their way out of the shit we get ourselves into, so if it isn’t tech, we’re proper screwed!

Yup, most people just don’t give a fuck.

Biffer, also surprised and disappointed that it was only 7% and of course everyone was back in their car to travel 1/2 mile as soon as they could

We're fudged, aren't we?

[Slick]

No, because I completely agree with Random that technology will get us out of this.

Frankly, what worries me more is the amount of shit we are putting in the sea. I go most Sunday’s litter picking on the beach with my son and we can easily get a bin bag full of plastic and other assorted crap in 30 minutes

[Biffer]

No, because I completely agree with Random that technology will get us out of this.

Frankly, what worries me more is the amount of shit we are putting in the sea. I go most Sunday’s litter picking on the beach with my son and we can easily get a bin bag full of plastic and other assorted crap in 30 minutes

This year will be the first time that the weight of man made matter is greater than the weight of organic matter.

[Slick]

No, because I completely agree with Random that technology will get us out of this.

Frankly, what worries me more is the amount of shit we are putting in the sea. I go most Sunday’s litter picking on the beach with my son and we can easily get a bin bag full of plastic and other assorted crap in 30 minutes

This year will be the first time that the weight of man made matter is greater than the weight of organic matter.

Christ that’s a scary stat!

[sockwithaticket]

No, because I completely agree with Random that technology will get us out of this.

Frankly, what worries me more is the amount of shit we are putting in the sea. I go most Sunday’s litter picking on the beach with my son and we can easily get a bin bag full of plastic and other assorted crap in 30 minutes

Wish I were that optimistic.Tech alone will not stop established behaviours, practices and so on that underpin our massive issue. Huge government involvement is required to subsidise and disseminate the tech at the and legislate to curb harmful action at the pace required. They've yet to show any appetitie for doing that.

I'm just hoping things don't get too apocalyptic before I die.

[Random1]

No, because I completely agree with Random that technology will get us out of this.

Frankly, what worries me more is the amount of shit we are putting in the sea. I go most Sunday’s litter picking on the beach with my son and we can easily get a bin bag full of plastic and other assorted crap in 30 minutes

Wish I were that optimistic.Tech alone will not stop established behaviours, practices and so on that underpin our massive issue. Huge government involvement is required to subsidise and disseminate the tech at the and legislate to curb harmful action at the pace required. They've yet to show any appetitie for doing that.

I'm just hoping things don't get too apocalyptic before I die.

What are the behaviours you’re thinking about?

I’m struggling to think of one where there isn’t a load of activity and research into tech designed to mitigate human aresholery

[Random1]

No, because I completely agree with Random that technology will get us out of this.

Frankly, what worries me more is the amount of shit we are putting in the sea. I go most Sunday’s litter picking on the beach with my son and we can easily get a bin bag full of plastic and other assorted crap in 30 minutes

Ah, now, I’m newish to the bored and PR, so are you one of the respected posters?

Or are you one of those trump follower people?

No problem either way, just curious as to what cohort I’ve fallen into.

[Biffer]

No, because I completely agree with Random that technology will get us out of this.

Frankly, what worries me more is the amount of shit we are putting in the sea. I go most Sunday’s litter picking on the beach with my son and we can easily get a bin bag full of plastic and other assorted crap in 30 minutes

Wish I were that optimistic.Tech alone will not stop established behaviours, practices and so on that underpin our massive issue. Huge government involvement is required to subsidise and disseminate the tech at the and legislate to curb harmful action at the pace required. They've yet to show any appetitie for doing that.

I'm just hoping things don't get too apocalyptic before I die.

What are the behaviours you’re thinking about?

I’m struggling to think of one where there isn’t a load of activity and research into tech designed to mitigate human aresholery

Meat eating.

[Sandstorm]

Watch yourself, Biffer!

[Slick]

No, because I completely agree with Random that technology will get us out of this.

Frankly, what worries me more is the amount of shit we are putting in the sea. I go most Sunday’s litter picking on the beach with my son and we can easily get a bin bag full of plastic and other assorted crap in 30 minutes

Ah, now, I’m newish to the bored and PR, so are you one of the respected posters?

Or are you one of those trump follower people?

No problem either way, just curious as to what cohort I’ve fallen into.

I’m kind of the darling poster of both bords, respected and feared in equal measure.

You have done well my son.

[Fangle]

Wish I were that optimistic.Tech alone will not stop established behaviours, practices and so on that underpin our massive issue. Huge government involvement is required to subsidise and disseminate the tech at the and legislate to curb harmful action at the pace required. They've yet to show any appetitie for doing that.

I'm just hoping things don't get too apocalyptic before I die.

What are the behaviours you’re thinking about?

I’m struggling to think of one where there isn’t a load of activity and research into tech designed to mitigate human aresholery

Meat eating.

Wot? No bacon?

[Calculon]

As renewables get more affordable there will be a natural progression towards them.
I read somewhere that the US emissions have dropped further than Europe largely because of fracking and the greater use of natural gas. But that has a limited life span.

That's great, but their emissions are still something like 3 times greater per capita.

[Niegs]

Wish I were that optimistic.Tech alone will not stop established behaviours, practices and so on that underpin our massive issue. Huge government involvement is required to subsidise and disseminate the tech at the and legislate to curb harmful action at the pace required. They've yet to show any appetitie for doing that.

I'm just hoping things don't get too apocalyptic before I die.

What are the behaviours you’re thinking about?

I’m struggling to think of one where there isn’t a load of activity and research into tech designed to mitigate human aresholery

Meat eating.

I don't know the impacts of each of these things versus some of the massive producers like factories, but can't see individual attitudes shifting on (including my own, if I'm honest, though I have a smaller carbon footprint than most where I live, I think) ...

*driving, especially solo, for non-essential reasons (public transit increases would need large taxpayer input and shifting attitudes toward timing of it... don't think we'll ever give up our cars until fuel is ridiculously expensive)
*single use plastic, and the willy nilly attitude to sorting what we dispose ('contamination' sending recycling to landfill)
*food production and waste (we import so much here and I can't see us ever adapting our diets to 'local' during winter/spring, but even if we had more greenhouses, costs will rise to satisfy people's wage needs... our local farms already rely on immigrant labour from Mexico and the Caribbean as Canadians can't/won't work at the rates farmers pay to get by), not to mention how much gets binned because markets HAVE (our want more than theirs) to have entire racks fully stocked with fruit/veg, meat fridges stocked and looking perfect (I buy from the 'eat it today' shelf/section in the freezer all the time, but can only imagine how much ends up binned)

I'd LOVE for us to shift attitudes and practices, and think I'd be prepared to make a lot of changes personally, but don't think governments proposing big changes will get the support they'd need from the masses until we're staring crisis directly in the face / the majority of people are impacted directly by climate change. (Hence my thought above ... though probably more accurately, the generations that follow us could be 'fudged' because of attitudes now)

[Fangle]

As renewables get more affordable there will be a natural progression towards them.
I read somewhere that the US emissions have dropped further than Europe largely because of fracking and the greater use of natural gas. But that has a limited life span.

That's great, but their emissions are still something like 3 times greater per capita.

Really? I hadn’t realized it was that extreme. Do you have some link or something, not that I’m doubting you? I haven’t read seriously on this, but don’t Canadians consume more? Not that I blame them, living so far north.

[Paddington Bear]

All of the restrictions, all the reduction in travel, the decrease of industrial activity, and that reduced global emissions by a mere 7%.

Shows me that we need more than just changes in behaviour, we need fundamental changes to society and the infrastructures of our economies.

Shows as much as anything that efforts to make cars and planes greener, whilst admirable, miss the point.

[Biffer]

What are the behaviours you’re thinking about?

I’m struggling to think of one where there isn’t a load of activity and research into tech designed to mitigate human aresholery

Meat eating.

I don't know the impacts of each of these things versus some of the massive producers like factories, but can't see individual attitudes shifting on (including my own, if I'm honest, though I have a smaller carbon footprint than most where I live, I think) ...

*driving, especially solo, for non-essential reasons (public transit increases would need large taxpayer input and shifting attitudes toward timing of it... don't think we'll ever give up our cars until fuel is ridiculously expensive)
*single use plastic, and the willy nilly attitude to sorting what we dispose ('contamination' sending recycling to landfill)
*food production and waste (we import so much here and I can't see us ever adapting our diets to 'local' during winter/spring, but even if we had more greenhouses, costs will rise to satisfy people's wage needs... our local farms already rely on immigrant labour from Mexico and the Caribbean as Canadians can't/won't work at the rates farmers pay to get by), not to mention how much gets binned because markets HAVE (our want more than theirs) to have entire racks fully stocked with fruit/veg, meat fridges stocked and looking perfect (I buy from the 'eat it today' shelf/section in the freezer all the time, but can only imagine how much ends up binned)

I'd LOVE for us to shift attitudes and practices, and think I'd be prepared to make a lot of changes personally, but don't think governments proposing big changes will get the support they'd need from the masses until we're staring crisis directly in the face / the majority of people are impacted directly by climate change. (Hence my thought above ... though probably more accurately, the generations that follow us could be 'fudged' because of attitudes now)

Agriculture contributes about a third of human greenhouse gas emissions. A substantial amount of that is land use change and that land being put to growing crops for animal feed. Producing a kilo of beef produces 25-30 times the amount of greenhouse gas than producing a kilo of wheat.

I’m not advocating going completely vegan, but I’m trying to work my way towards the EAT-Lancet diet. The most significant part of it is probably replacing a lot of your protein with nuts and legumes. But it still lines up something a kilo of chicken, half a kilo of red meat and just under a kilo of fish each month per adult. So depending on what you do with it, that is about two portions of chicken, one portion red meat and one or two portions of fish each week, unless you’re a fat bastard size portion every day kind of person. Which I have been in the past.

https://eatforum.org/eat-lancet-commiss ... t-and-you/

https://eatforum.org/content/uploads/20 ... Report.pdf

[Niegs]

Agriculture contributes about a third of human greenhouse gas emissions. A substantial amount of that is land use change and that land being put to growing crops for animal feed. Producing a kilo of beef produces 25-30 times the amount of greenhouse gas than producing a kilo of wheat.

I’m not advocating going completely vegan, but I’m trying to work my way towards the EAT-Lancet diet. The most significant part of it is probably replacing a lot of your protein with nuts and legumes. But it still lines up something a kilo of chicken, half a kilo of red meat and just under a kilo of fish each month per adult. So depending on what you do with it, that is about two portions of chicken, one portion red meat and one or two portions of fish each week, unless you’re a fat bastard size portion every day kind of person. Which I have been in the past.

https://eatforum.org/eat-lancet-commiss ... t-and-you/

https://eatforum.org/content/uploads/20 ... Report.pdf

Interesting. I might already be there, or close to it. I tend to only eat meat at dinner and some days skip... prefer chicken and pork to beef, love fish but am so far inland it’s never fresh or not cheap.

I keep hearing non-meat alternatives are good, getting better. Maybe I should start a grub worm farm like in Blade Runner 2049 to get ready?

The point about land use to feed livestock sticks though. I live on an old horse farm that’s surrounded by crop farms... every single one for kms around and the vast majority in the entire region grow corn or soy for animal feed. Maybe we wouldn’t have to eat like pre-war Canadians (lots of root veg and preserves) with modern technology and better land use?

[Fangle]

What is defined as meat? All flesh or only that from certain species?

[Biffer]

What is defined as meat? All flesh or only that from certain species?

Animal protein.

Edit - I should be clearer on this. There are allowances for dairy and eggs which are also in the animal protein category. If your question is relating to thinks like crocodile, ostrich etc as meats, it’s not really viable to include them in an allowance against 9 billion people. They will have a greenhouse gas impact, I’m not sure what it will be but often smaller suppliers are higher in terms of gas per kilo. If you’re talking about lab grown meat, that’s a whole different ball game.

[Biffer]

There are probably some meats that come at less impact, but pretty much all of them are limited in the amount that can be harvested sustainably. For example venison from Highland Deer here in Scotland is an option, but because this is harvesting wild deer rather than farming, there’s a limit on how much can be produced each year. If you change to a farming model for such animals, if it’s possible, then you will have another calculation about production greenhouse gasses. Same applies to Kangaroos in Australia for example.

[Fangle]

My son has tried the lab meat and both types tasted fine, but the smell of one was off putting. I eat mainly chicken anyway, with a steak only now and then. Chicken is a lot cheaper.

[Biffer]

My son has tried the lab meat and both types tasted fine, but the smell of one was off putting. I eat mainly chicken anyway, with a steak only now and then. Chicken is a lot cheaper.

Yeah, I can deal with two portions of chicken and two of fish each week and veggie after that, but I need the occasional fried breakfast and roast.

One of the things I'm not sure about in that diet is where you'd count things like Black pudding.

[I like neeps]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-58130705

We're f*cked.

[Torquemada 1420]

Australia burned. France burned. The US is burning. Turkey is burning. Greece is burning.

But there is no global warming [/ Fat Albert]

[laurent]

Australia burned. France burned. The US is burning. Turkey is burning. Greece is burning.

But there is no global warming [/ Fat Albert]

Add Sweden and Finland + a lot of siberia (ghost fires seem to be great fun).

[Torquemada 1420]

Australia burned. France burned. The US is burning. Turkey is burning. Greece is burning.

But there is no global warming [/ Fat Albert]

Add Sweden and Finland + a lot of siberia (ghost fires seem to be great fun).

And we are worried about COVID FFS

[laurent]

Australia burned. France burned. The US is burning. Turkey is burning. Greece is burning.

But there is no global warming [/ Fat Albert]

Add Sweden and Finland + a lot of siberia (ghost fires seem to be great fun).

And we are worried about COVID FFS

Well it does fill hospitals to the point that they can't treat other people.

[Sandstorm]

1.5 billion extra Chinese and Indians getting electricity and a taste for the finer things in life in the last 15 years hasn’t been good.

[Lobby]

1.5 billion extra Chinese and Indians getting electricity and a taste for the finer things in life in the last 15 years hasn’t been good.

Indeed, look at the rate of growth of Chinese emissions in the last 50 years; from nowhere to the biggest polluter in no time at all.

[Slick]

The main problem is that the vast majority of people just don’t give a shit, even well educated wealthy people who have no excuses.

As a example that does my head in I walked down my street tonight and counted 5 cars in a row parked up with their engines on talking away on their phones. I know it’s a tiny thing in the scheme of things, but it drives me nuts.

[Sandstorm]

The main problem is that the vast majority of people just don’t give a shit, even well educated wealthy people who have no excuses.

As a example that does my head in I walked down my street tonight and counted 5 cars in a row parked up with their engines on talking away on their phones. I know it’s a tiny thing in the scheme of things, but it drives me nuts.

Are you sure it wasn’t a cab rank?

[sockwithaticket]

The main problem is that the vast majority of people just don’t give a shit, even well educated wealthy people who have no excuses.

As a example that does my head in I walked down my street tonight and counted 5 cars in a row parked up with their engines on talking away on their phones. I know it’s a tiny thing in the scheme of things, but it drives me nuts.

Some will claim they do, but in reality it's clearly not enough of a shit for them to change their lives in any way that might be even a minor inconvenience.

[Ymx]

The main problem is that the vast majority of people just don’t give a shit, even well educated wealthy people who have no excuses.

As a example that does my head in I walked down my street tonight and counted 5 cars in a row parked up with their engines on talking away on their phones. I know it’s a tiny thing in the scheme of things, but it drives me nuts.

The UK is small fry in the scheme of things. Until China, India, USA, Russia can change and develop and environmental conscience we are all fucked. It doesn’t matter if we have zero output.

I’m not saying we should give up and do nothing our end fwiw.

[Slick]

The main problem is that the vast majority of people just don’t give a shit, even well educated wealthy people who have no excuses.

As a example that does my head in I walked down my street tonight and counted 5 cars in a row parked up with their engines on talking away on their phones. I know it’s a tiny thing in the scheme of things, but it drives me nuts.

Some will claim they do, but in reality it's clearly not enough of a shit for them to change their lives in any way that might be even a minor inconvenience.

Yup, driving the kids 1/2 mile to school, coming out of Costco with hundreds of bottles of water (in fucking Scotland!) etc etc, it’s maddening.

[Slick]

The main problem is that the vast majority of people just don’t give a shit, even well educated wealthy people who have no excuses.

As a example that does my head in I walked down my street tonight and counted 5 cars in a row parked up with their engines on talking away on their phones. I know it’s a tiny thing in the scheme of things, but it drives me nuts.

The UK is small fry in the scheme of things. Until China, India, USA, Russia can change and develop and environmental conscience we are all fucked. It doesn’t matter if we have zero output.

I’m not saying we should give up and do nothing our end fwiw.

Of course, but even small things we know are doing harm make the local environment a better place to live