That was interesting thanks.JM2K6 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 10:51 amhttps://www.espncricinfo.com/story/the- ... me-1269911Thor Sedan wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 10:10 amExplain? And because we are on social media I feel I have to put in the comment - genuinely interested.
What do you mean by immersive here? I ask because it has a particular meaning when it comes to video games that i don't think applies when watching competitive games rather than playing them.Big D wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 12:39 pmThat isn't the idea at all. Video games, LoL, DOTA2 can carry far closer to a guarantee that it will more immersive than test matches can. The issue isn't the "yoof" it is the product they are watching. It is hard to get invested when the countries playing aren't overly invested in it and the umpires are told to run for cover at the sign it is getting a bit dark. Viewing habits and consumption has changed exactly because of youtube, twitch, e-sports etc as anyone can pretty much get instant immersion in what every they want. If a product is dull, they can quickly move onto to something more interesting to them. For some it will be other TV programmes, sports, Netflix or whatever and for others it'll be e-sports, LOL etc. The notion some peddle about cricket being complex or "yoof" can't understand it is pompus bollocks.JM2K6 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 12:12 pm OK well first off this idea that kids and teenagers don't have the attention span for long and complex sports is pulling that out of their arse. It wasn't a problem in the past, and I really must stress that modern video gaming includes stuff that is wildly popular with the yoof that makes Test cricket look like chequers. Kids will happily watch weeks worth of back-to-back DOTA2 or League of Legends.
But here's the point: Test cricket is not going to excite anyone if the county championship is as fucked as it currently is, thanks to the prioritisation of literally everything else ahead of it, because no-one is going to enjoy watching England get shellacked. It's a self-fulfilling prophecy, much like that of county cricket not being able to produce Test cricketers (when it's been moved to the margins of the season and fucked around with as much as is possible)
It also isn't a guarantee that test cricket will excite anyone if the CC was a rip roaring success. 9 or 10 countries play test cricket, many of them aren't very good at it, and it seems a decreasing number of countries are interested in playing tests a good number of tests. This isn't only and England problem, the ECB are clearly only responsible for that part, but test cricket around the globe is fucked.
JM2K6 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 10:51 amhttps://www.espncricinfo.com/story/the- ... me-1269911Thor Sedan wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 10:10 amExplain? And because we are on social media I feel I have to put in the comment - genuinely interested.
Regional rugby anyone?And remember: these new team identities, some of them based many hours from the regions which they supposedly represent, have never produced a player. They have no pathways, no academies and no existing support base. They are parasites feeding on the players and supporters the county game has produced. It's a bizarre act of cannibalism to stage a new competition at the same time as an existing one. Even if the new tournament works, it could push existing teams into obsolescence.
Immersive was a poor word choice given the discussion. Captivated by or be engrossed by is probably more what I should have written. There are often long passages of test matches that aren't captivating or engrossing where as some of the alternative things that are competing for attention can offer that pretty quickly. I think it is also important to distinguish between younger kids and teens. In some cases the battle for teens is lost, but reading comments on the BBC during matches, on here and on twitter etc there is a fair amount of "not for me but my 7/8/9 year old is enjoying it".JM2K6 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 1:05 pmWhat do you mean by immersive here? I ask because it has a particular meaning when it comes to video games that i don't think applies when watching competitive games rather than playing them.Big D wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 12:39 pmThat isn't the idea at all. Video games, LoL, DOTA2 can carry far closer to a guarantee that it will more immersive than test matches can. The issue isn't the "yoof" it is the product they are watching. It is hard to get invested when the countries playing aren't overly invested in it and the umpires are told to run for cover at the sign it is getting a bit dark. Viewing habits and consumption has changed exactly because of youtube, twitch, e-sports etc as anyone can pretty much get instant immersion in what every they want. If a product is dull, they can quickly move onto to something more interesting to them. For some it will be other TV programmes, sports, Netflix or whatever and for others it'll be e-sports, LOL etc. The notion some peddle about cricket being complex or "yoof" can't understand it is pompus bollocks.JM2K6 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 12:12 pm OK well first off this idea that kids and teenagers don't have the attention span for long and complex sports is pulling that out of their arse. It wasn't a problem in the past, and I really must stress that modern video gaming includes stuff that is wildly popular with the yoof that makes Test cricket look like chequers. Kids will happily watch weeks worth of back-to-back DOTA2 or League of Legends.
But here's the point: Test cricket is not going to excite anyone if the county championship is as fucked as it currently is, thanks to the prioritisation of literally everything else ahead of it, because no-one is going to enjoy watching England get shellacked. It's a self-fulfilling prophecy, much like that of county cricket not being able to produce Test cricketers (when it's been moved to the margins of the season and fucked around with as much as is possible)
It also isn't a guarantee that test cricket will excite anyone if the CC was a rip roaring success. 9 or 10 countries play test cricket, many of them aren't very good at it, and it seems a decreasing number of countries are interested in playing tests a good number of tests. This isn't only and England problem, the ECB are clearly only responsible for that part, but test cricket around the globe is fucked.
Definitely agree that the overall issues with test cricket aren't solved by a stronger CC, I just cannot see how the hundred and its impact on the CC (to go with the other recent changes to it) helps rather than hinders.
Would pushing the existing teams further down the chain be a bad thing?Torquemada 1420 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 1:17 pmRegional rugby anyone?And remember: these new team identities, some of them based many hours from the regions which they supposedly represent, have never produced a player. They have no pathways, no academies and no existing support base. They are parasites feeding on the players and supporters the county game has produced. It's a bizarre act of cannibalism to stage a new competition at the same time as an existing one. Even if the new tournament works, it could push existing teams into obsolescence.
Off the chain, into the abyss, not down the chain.Big D wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 1:33 pmWould pushing the existing teams further down the chain be a bad thing?Torquemada 1420 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 1:17 pmRegional rugby anyone?And remember: these new team identities, some of them based many hours from the regions which they supposedly represent, have never produced a player. They have no pathways, no academies and no existing support base. They are parasites feeding on the players and supporters the county game has produced. It's a bizarre act of cannibalism to stage a new competition at the same time as an existing one. Even if the new tournament works, it could push existing teams into obsolescence.
Why does it have to be people who can't understand or follow longer games. That suggests it is a dead end. Why can't it be for people who haven't watched cricket before and also existing cricket fans? You are making it an "or" rather than an "and". In most of my posts I have said this has to be part of a wider ECB strategy for it to have a chance of working.JM2K6 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 1:38 pm OK, that makes sense, thank you.
On the Hundred appealing to people who apparently can't understand or follow longer games - doesn't that make it a bit of an evolutionary dead end? It succeeds in appealing to one group at the expense of another, but that group is apparently ill-suited to liking longer form cricket anyway, so... what's the end goal here? Just hope they switch over when they're old enough (or in the "and women" part of the apparent target market, no longer as feminine?!)
We've talked about the CC before and obviously I disagree with you in the most part, but I would be fine with a reduced number of counties if that also meant giving it some measure of primacy during the core part of the cricket season rather than shunting it to the sidelines as we have now. Otherwise all you're doing is killing a few counties and leaving the rest to fend for themselves, having essentially destroyed their existing methods of surviving via the Hundred murdering the T20 Blast. I just don't see how they survive in that scenario.
Also worth noting county cricket was responsible for England being #1 Test team in the world, T20 world champions, and ODI world champions - it's not like the counties haven't been able to produce all-format players (and some excellent tournaments within these formats).
You're confusing "popular with matchday crowds" and "capable of producing Test match standard players". County cricket is more about a) providing a living for a number of professional first class English cricketers, and b) providing players for the national side, rather than c) having a full house in every match. County cricket's diminished popularity is a complex problem, not helped by how cricket is managed in this country. I have no idea how you expect counties to survive, with their Test match grounds and large stadia, if they're expected to just be feeder teams for newly created franchises. Will the franchises buy the stadia off them? Will the counties pay their players? What happens to the T20 Blast, a commercially successful and wildly popular tournament? Do you expect the Hundred franchises - sides with no academies, player pathways, or community links - to start producing players outside of the counties? Do the counties get any credit for England's successes or is "Sri Lanka" going to be the answer to everything?Big D wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 2:36 pmWhy does it have to be people who can't understand or follow longer games. That suggests it is a dead end. Why can't it be for people who haven't watched cricket before and also existing cricket fans? You are making it an "or" rather than an "and". In most of my posts I have said this has to be part of a wider ECB strategy for it to have a chance of working.JM2K6 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 1:38 pm OK, that makes sense, thank you.
On the Hundred appealing to people who apparently can't understand or follow longer games - doesn't that make it a bit of an evolutionary dead end? It succeeds in appealing to one group at the expense of another, but that group is apparently ill-suited to liking longer form cricket anyway, so... what's the end goal here? Just hope they switch over when they're old enough (or in the "and women" part of the apparent target market, no longer as feminine?!)
We've talked about the CC before and obviously I disagree with you in the most part, but I would be fine with a reduced number of counties if that also meant giving it some measure of primacy during the core part of the cricket season rather than shunting it to the sidelines as we have now. Otherwise all you're doing is killing a few counties and leaving the rest to fend for themselves, having essentially destroyed their existing methods of surviving via the Hundred murdering the T20 Blast. I just don't see how they survive in that scenario.
Also worth noting county cricket was responsible for England being #1 Test team in the world, T20 world champions, and ODI world champions - it's not like the counties haven't been able to produce all-format players (and some excellent tournaments within these formats).
The CC is a lame duck. How often even during the No.1 test side in the world days were counties getting regularly half full crowds for CC game? As a stand alone product it hasn't worked for a long time even before T20 became a big thing. Why does there need to be so many professional county teams? I am sure they all do great work in their county but that wouldn't have to stop just because there was no professional team. The reason T20 has become so popular is because it is what gets the crowds in around the world.
Considering they have 18 professional sides, one could argue that isn't a great return. Sri Lanka have done two of those things.
The more we have chatted the more I think the battle for test cricket is a bit of a side issue, especially as other nations aren't really bought into it. The ECB can't solve that one alone. The issue is more how can professional cricket in England survive and have a red ball game and whether there is really a fan base for a 4day game to survive with 18 teams. It is at the stage IMO where revolution rather than evolution is required.
Edit: And I do appreciate it is easy for me to say "get rid of counties" or have a tier above them as I don't have any attachment to them.
Not as many people watching the game leads to not as many people playing game and sponsors not investing money, leads to less money in the game and so on. Popularity of the sport directly impacts participation and sponsorship, both of which the counties need to survive. The T20 blast is great for the crowds in attendance but is the poor cousin of the IPL and Big Bash and FTA TV companies don't want to touch it, hence the Hundred was formed, because the existing viewership of tests etc isn't enough for the long term health of the sport. Participation at adult level has dropped from 4 years ago, kids participation has dropped. The Hundred is trying to get more eyes on the game. It won't work by itself and it may not work at all but if it is part of a joined up strategy it might have a chance. They need to try something.JM2K6 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 4:03 pmYou're confusing "popular with matchday crowds" and "capable of producing Test match standard players". County cricket is more about a) providing a living for a number of professional first class English cricketers, and b) providing players for the national side, rather than c) having a full house in every match. County cricket's diminished popularity is a complex problem, not helped by how cricket is managed in this country. I have no idea how you expect counties to survive, with their Test match grounds and large stadia, if they're expected to just be feeder teams for newly created franchises. Will the franchises buy the stadia off them? Will the counties pay their players? What happens to the T20 Blast, a commercially successful and wildly popular tournament? Do you expect the Hundred franchises - sides with no academies, player pathways, or community links - to start producing players outside of the counties? Do the counties get any credit for England's successes or is "Sri Lanka" going to be the answer to everything?Big D wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 2:36 pmWhy does it have to be people who can't understand or follow longer games. That suggests it is a dead end. Why can't it be for people who haven't watched cricket before and also existing cricket fans? You are making it an "or" rather than an "and". In most of my posts I have said this has to be part of a wider ECB strategy for it to have a chance of working.JM2K6 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 1:38 pm OK, that makes sense, thank you.
On the Hundred appealing to people who apparently can't understand or follow longer games - doesn't that make it a bit of an evolutionary dead end? It succeeds in appealing to one group at the expense of another, but that group is apparently ill-suited to liking longer form cricket anyway, so... what's the end goal here? Just hope they switch over when they're old enough (or in the "and women" part of the apparent target market, no longer as feminine?!)
We've talked about the CC before and obviously I disagree with you in the most part, but I would be fine with a reduced number of counties if that also meant giving it some measure of primacy during the core part of the cricket season rather than shunting it to the sidelines as we have now. Otherwise all you're doing is killing a few counties and leaving the rest to fend for themselves, having essentially destroyed their existing methods of surviving via the Hundred murdering the T20 Blast. I just don't see how they survive in that scenario.
Also worth noting county cricket was responsible for England being #1 Test team in the world, T20 world champions, and ODI world champions - it's not like the counties haven't been able to produce all-format players (and some excellent tournaments within these formats).
The CC is a lame duck. How often even during the No.1 test side in the world days were counties getting regularly half full crowds for CC game? As a stand alone product it hasn't worked for a long time even before T20 became a big thing. Why does there need to be so many professional county teams? I am sure they all do great work in their county but that wouldn't have to stop just because there was no professional team. The reason T20 has become so popular is because it is what gets the crowds in around the world.
Considering they have 18 professional sides, one could argue that isn't a great return. Sri Lanka have done two of those things.
The more we have chatted the more I think the battle for test cricket is a bit of a side issue, especially as other nations aren't really bought into it. The ECB can't solve that one alone. The issue is more how can professional cricket in England survive and have a red ball game and whether there is really a fan base for a 4day game to survive with 18 teams. It is at the stage IMO where revolution rather than evolution is required.
Edit: And I do appreciate it is easy for me to say "get rid of counties" or have a tier above them as I don't have any attachment to them.
The Hundred is explicitly pitched at being for people who struggle to understand or be engaged by other forms of cricket. You know, the ones that aren't capitvated or engrossed by the existing cricket products, to use your terminology.
I think our discussion about Test cricket is somewhat confused because I'm talking about the health of the England side, the pathway to producing players, and the interest that English supporters and potential supporters have in watching and supporting the team, rather than the health of global Test cricket (which I think is doing OK with some exceptions). I don't for a second expect the Hundred to make any impact on the global health of Test cricket. I don't for a second understand how it can possibly help with English Test cricket. I'm not expecting the ECB to fix international Test cricket. I am expecting the ECB to stop making the England Test side measurably worse and building in the flaws that will see it struggle for years.
Television audiences will always outstrip crowd attendance. We agree that viewing leads to playing - which is why putting English cricket behind the sky paywall is directly linked to the drop in numbers.Big D wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 4:57 pmNot as many people watching the game leads to not as many people playing game and sponsors not investing money, leads to less money in the game and so on. Popularity of the sport directly impacts participation and sponsorship, both of which the counties need to survive. The T20 blast is great for the crowds in attendance but is the poor cousin of the IPL and Big Bash and FTA TV companies don't want to touch it, hence the Hundred was formed, because the existing viewership of tests etc isn't enough for the long term health of the sport. Participation at adult level has dropped from 4 years ago, kids participation has dropped. The Hundred is trying to get more eyes on the game. It won't work by itself and it may not work at all but if it is part of a joined up strategy it might have a chance. They need to try something.JM2K6 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 4:03 pmYou're confusing "popular with matchday crowds" and "capable of producing Test match standard players". County cricket is more about a) providing a living for a number of professional first class English cricketers, and b) providing players for the national side, rather than c) having a full house in every match. County cricket's diminished popularity is a complex problem, not helped by how cricket is managed in this country. I have no idea how you expect counties to survive, with their Test match grounds and large stadia, if they're expected to just be feeder teams for newly created franchises. Will the franchises buy the stadia off them? Will the counties pay their players? What happens to the T20 Blast, a commercially successful and wildly popular tournament? Do you expect the Hundred franchises - sides with no academies, player pathways, or community links - to start producing players outside of the counties? Do the counties get any credit for England's successes or is "Sri Lanka" going to be the answer to everything?Big D wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 2:36 pm
Why does it have to be people who can't understand or follow longer games. That suggests it is a dead end. Why can't it be for people who haven't watched cricket before and also existing cricket fans? You are making it an "or" rather than an "and". In most of my posts I have said this has to be part of a wider ECB strategy for it to have a chance of working.
The CC is a lame duck. How often even during the No.1 test side in the world days were counties getting regularly half full crowds for CC game? As a stand alone product it hasn't worked for a long time even before T20 became a big thing. Why does there need to be so many professional county teams? I am sure they all do great work in their county but that wouldn't have to stop just because there was no professional team. The reason T20 has become so popular is because it is what gets the crowds in around the world.
Considering they have 18 professional sides, one could argue that isn't a great return. Sri Lanka have done two of those things.
The more we have chatted the more I think the battle for test cricket is a bit of a side issue, especially as other nations aren't really bought into it. The ECB can't solve that one alone. The issue is more how can professional cricket in England survive and have a red ball game and whether there is really a fan base for a 4day game to survive with 18 teams. It is at the stage IMO where revolution rather than evolution is required.
Edit: And I do appreciate it is easy for me to say "get rid of counties" or have a tier above them as I don't have any attachment to them.
The Hundred is explicitly pitched at being for people who struggle to understand or be engaged by other forms of cricket. You know, the ones that aren't capitvated or engrossed by the existing cricket products, to use your terminology.
I think our discussion about Test cricket is somewhat confused because I'm talking about the health of the England side, the pathway to producing players, and the interest that English supporters and potential supporters have in watching and supporting the team, rather than the health of global Test cricket (which I think is doing OK with some exceptions). I don't for a second expect the Hundred to make any impact on the global health of Test cricket. I don't for a second understand how it can possibly help with English Test cricket. I'm not expecting the ECB to fix international Test cricket. I am expecting the ECB to stop making the England Test side measurably worse and building in the flaws that will see it struggle for years.
18 counties fully professional and 300+ fully professional players over the decades (in increasing numbers to 18) has sporadically produced world class players and international sides that more often than not has under performed on a global stage given the resources available. There are 9 countries that play test cricket, there is little excuse for England not always being among the best sides. I said moving to franchises would be extreme, probably too extreme, but 18 professional counties is too many.
The issue with wider test cricket is important because you wanting the ECB to "stop making the England Test side measurably worse" relies on test cricket as a concept being worth the hassle.
We obviously don't agree that there are too many counties but always good to enjoy a Wednesday afternoon debate.
New Zealand's stand-in coach Glenn Pocknall believes "there is a huge amount of growth" the team can look forward to from the uncapped pace bowler Ben Sears, who is among the fresh faces selected for the white-ball tours of Pakistan and Bangladesh beginning September.
Pocknall is standing in for regular head coach Gary Stead, who is taking a break before he joins the squad alongside batting coach Luke Ronchi for the T20 World Cup in the UAE in October. Also joining the new coaching staff for the Bangladesh and Pakistan tours will be former New Zealand fast bowler Graeme Aldridge, who will be the bowling coach, and the former Sri Lanka batter Thilan Samaraweera, who has been named the batting coach. Samaraweera has previously worked with New Zealand during their tour of Sri Lanka in August 2019.
New Zealand's regular bowling coach Shane Jurgenson will rejoin the squad as head coach for the T20I series against Pakistan.
With a number of first-team players including Kane Williamson, Trent Boult, Kyle Jamieson and Lockie Ferguson unavailable owing to their involvement in the IPL, which clashes with part of the tour, several young players who have shown promise at the domestic level have been drafted into the squad. This includes the top-order batters Finn Allen, who is in all three squads, and Rachin Ravindra, who is in the squads for the T20I tour of Bangladesh and the Pakistan ODIs. (These guys are bloody good)
Sears, who featured in the Under-19 World Cup in 2016 alongside Ravindra and Allen, has come through the NZC pathways system and Pocknall feels he is one to watch out for.
"He is 22 years old, he is still pretty raw in terms of the first-class cricketer. For him, the world's his oyster," Pocknall said. "He has got all the skills and attributes of bowling fast. It is just harnessing his skill and harnessing his mind in the right direction, wherever that takes him, we will see. There is a huge amount of growth that we could all look forward to. It is just a start for him, he will be relishing the opportunity.
"He's got the pace since he was a kid. We just have to harness that, with the body growing in right position and mind growing in the right direction, the outcome that we are looking for at the end of the day is trying to get all the pieces of the puzzle together. "
Pocknall also heaped praise on Allen, who missed out on selection for the T20 World Cup. "At the moment, there is so much depth in New Zealand cricket that you could probably blanket over 25 names. He is still new to international cricket but he did have a great season last year. He is only young and he has got a bright future."
The squad, led by Tom Latham, leaves for Bangladesh on August 23 for the T20I series when they will play five T20Is. This will be followed by the Pakistan tour, which includes three ODIs starting September 17, and five T20Is. Pocknall believes that with depth in the squad, the team will be able to step up to the challenge in the subcontinent. New Zealand will play three ODIs from September 17, followed by five T20Is.
"I can't wait to get over there," Pocknall said. "It's a part of the world I haven't been to - both Bangladesh and Pakistan. There is a challenge in the unknown in terms of conditions. I know we have got a group that has depth. So whatever is thrown at us, we are gonna work together and achieve what we want to achieve. It's an exciting time."
Eh... Curran came on to bowl and bowled two overs for 2 runs, one over for 4, then Rohit (having been beaten a few times) hit 16 off an over. You made it sound like he came on and immediately got walloped!ScarfaceClaw wrote: ↑Thu Aug 12, 2021 11:34 am Curran comes on to bowl and gets taken for 16 off the over. Two great shots through backwards point, a thick edge through fourth slip and then a lovely clip off the legs through mid wicket.
I was in a meeting so that was the first over I saw. Calm down a bit.JM2K6 wrote: ↑Thu Aug 12, 2021 12:08 pmEh... Curran came on to bowl and bowled two overs for 2 runs, one over for 4, then Rohit (having been beaten a few times) hit 16 off an over. You made it sound like he came on and immediately got walloped!ScarfaceClaw wrote: ↑Thu Aug 12, 2021 11:34 am Curran comes on to bowl and gets taken for 16 off the over. Two great shots through backwards point, a thick edge through fourth slip and then a lovely clip off the legs through mid wicket.
For me, the fundamental reason that England’s test side is a bit shit at the moment (and is going to be really bad when Anderson and Broad retire) is because they don’t play any long form cricket in the height of the English summer. There are no county championship games from the first week of July until the end of August. You will never, ever develop top order batsmen, spin bowlers and genuine quicks if they can’t play at that point in the year. But they want that time for the hundred and t20.JM2K6 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 8:32 pmTelevision audiences will always outstrip crowd attendance. We agree that viewing leads to playing - which is why putting English cricket behind the sky paywall is directly linked to the drop in numbers.Big D wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 4:57 pmNot as many people watching the game leads to not as many people playing game and sponsors not investing money, leads to less money in the game and so on. Popularity of the sport directly impacts participation and sponsorship, both of which the counties need to survive. The T20 blast is great for the crowds in attendance but is the poor cousin of the IPL and Big Bash and FTA TV companies don't want to touch it, hence the Hundred was formed, because the existing viewership of tests etc isn't enough for the long term health of the sport. Participation at adult level has dropped from 4 years ago, kids participation has dropped. The Hundred is trying to get more eyes on the game. It won't work by itself and it may not work at all but if it is part of a joined up strategy it might have a chance. They need to try something.JM2K6 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 4:03 pm
You're confusing "popular with matchday crowds" and "capable of producing Test match standard players". County cricket is more about a) providing a living for a number of professional first class English cricketers, and b) providing players for the national side, rather than c) having a full house in every match. County cricket's diminished popularity is a complex problem, not helped by how cricket is managed in this country. I have no idea how you expect counties to survive, with their Test match grounds and large stadia, if they're expected to just be feeder teams for newly created franchises. Will the franchises buy the stadia off them? Will the counties pay their players? What happens to the T20 Blast, a commercially successful and wildly popular tournament? Do you expect the Hundred franchises - sides with no academies, player pathways, or community links - to start producing players outside of the counties? Do the counties get any credit for England's successes or is "Sri Lanka" going to be the answer to everything?
The Hundred is explicitly pitched at being for people who struggle to understand or be engaged by other forms of cricket. You know, the ones that aren't capitvated or engrossed by the existing cricket products, to use your terminology.
I think our discussion about Test cricket is somewhat confused because I'm talking about the health of the England side, the pathway to producing players, and the interest that English supporters and potential supporters have in watching and supporting the team, rather than the health of global Test cricket (which I think is doing OK with some exceptions). I don't for a second expect the Hundred to make any impact on the global health of Test cricket. I don't for a second understand how it can possibly help with English Test cricket. I'm not expecting the ECB to fix international Test cricket. I am expecting the ECB to stop making the England Test side measurably worse and building in the flaws that will see it struggle for years.
18 counties fully professional and 300+ fully professional players over the decades (in increasing numbers to 18) has sporadically produced world class players and international sides that more often than not has under performed on a global stage given the resources available. There are 9 countries that play test cricket, there is little excuse for England not always being among the best sides. I said moving to franchises would be extreme, probably too extreme, but 18 professional counties is too many.
The issue with wider test cricket is important because you wanting the ECB to "stop making the England Test side measurably worse" relies on test cricket as a concept being worth the hassle.
We obviously don't agree that there are too many counties but always good to enjoy a Wednesday afternoon debate.
As for FTA not wanting to touch the blast, that's simply not true. It's doubly silly to claim that given the BBC signed up to the new tournament that became the hundred back when it was a t20 tournament still!
Trying something that comes at the expense of literally everything good the game in this country has done so far is an act of sheer folly and sabotage. There's simply no reason why it has to be like this. As it is, even if it succeeds it may still fail English cricket in the long run. And if it fails, it takes down everything with it.
Fucksake. We're the odi world champions who won't be playing domestic 50 over matches any more. The previously world #1 test team that has deliberately ruined domestic first class cricket. And a former t20 world champion side, pushing for another title, that just destroyed its own commercially successful and domestically popular t20 tournament in favour of a different form of the game that no one else plays.
We have a new record. Haseeb Hameed's nought is the 14th duck by a top-three England batsman this year in England's 10th Test.
