UK Home energy prices

[petej]

A cluster fuck 10 years in the making. So many moronic decisions and terrible policy.

Quick precis anywhere? I've not kept up until it hit the front pages

The energy situation has been fucked for 20 years or more - no one wants to build a power plant and any that are built take a generation for no real reason. Same will happen with drinking water - we refuse to build reservoirs

Indeed you could see from the end of life of the state built power plants. No one wants to build a plant that will maybe pay back in 30 years. UK Gas storage being closed. Mess of policies around house building and energy efficiency. No real drive to back future green industries. Slow on Hinkley C. Post the brexit vote our governments have been absent and incoherent. We just about had time 10 years ago to act but not now so the population will have to suck it up.

Don't we all actually have less reservoirs as some were sold? We certainly don't have the water treatment facilities we require and the whole let's dredge water channels is often a case of just shifting the problem around.

[Paddington Bear]

Quick precis anywhere? I've not kept up until it hit the front pages

The energy situation has been fucked for 20 years or more - no one wants to build a power plant and any that are built take a generation for no real reason. Same will happen with drinking water - we refuse to build reservoirs

Indeed you could see from the end of life of the state built power plants. No one wants to build a plant that will maybe pay back in 30 years. UK Gas storage being closed. Mess of policies around house building and energy efficiency. No real drive to back future green industries. Slow on Hinkley C. Post the brexit vote our governments have been absent and incoherent. We just about had time 10 years ago to act but not now so the population will have to suck it up.

Don't we all actually have less reservoirs as some were sold? We certainly don't have the water treatment facilities we require and the whole let's dredge water channels is often a case of just shifting the problem around.

Green industries is the only bit I’d push back on. Our offshore work is pretty well regarded and we seem to be doing pretty well on electric vehicles. Of course we need power for them…

[tabascoboy]

Meanwhile, I'm sure this will beef up our energy security and lead to lower prices...

National Grid criticised for £4.2bn sale 'of the national silver' to foreign investor
The group has sold a 60% stake in Britain's gas pipeline network to Australian bank Macquarie.

...
Macquarie owned Thames Water for more than a decade, leaving it saddled with debt when it sold the company in 2016.

The bank earned billions in huge dividends from the company, while paying next to no corporation tax.
...

https://news.sky.com/story/national-gri ... r-12576739

[petej]

Meanwhile, I'm sure this will beef up our energy security and lead to lower prices...

National Grid criticised for £4.2bn sale 'of the national silver' to foreign investor
The group has sold a 60% stake in Britain's gas pipeline network to Australian bank Macquarie.

...
Macquarie owned Thames Water for more than a decade, leaving it saddled with debt when it sold the company in 2016.

The bank earned billions in huge dividends from the company, while paying next to no corporation tax.
...

https://news.sky.com/story/national-gri ... r-12576739

Does anyone still believe that this saves cost for consumers?

Were Thames water draining chalk streams and dumping shit?

[fishfoodie]

Meanwhile, I'm sure this will beef up our energy security and lead to lower prices...

National Grid criticised for £4.2bn sale 'of the national silver' to foreign investor
The group has sold a 60% stake in Britain's gas pipeline network to Australian bank Macquarie.

...
Macquarie owned Thames Water for more than a decade, leaving it saddled with debt when it sold the company in 2016.

The bank earned billions in huge dividends from the company, while paying next to no corporation tax.
...

https://news.sky.com/story/national-gri ... r-12576739

Does anyone still believe that this saves cost for consumers?

Were Thames water draining chalk streams and dumping shit?

Since when was that ever a consideration for any private utility company ?....

They share a common playbook; bribe/co-opt the Politicians; buy it cheap; load it up with debt, & do nothing to maintain the actual infrastructure; fuck off over the horizon whistling happy tunes.

[petej]

Meanwhile, I'm sure this will beef up our energy security and lead to lower prices...

Does anyone still believe that this saves cost for consumers?

Were Thames water draining chalk streams and dumping shit?

Since when was that ever a consideration for any private utility company ?....

They share a common playbook; bribe/co-opt the Politicians; buy it cheap; load it up with debt, & do nothing to maintain the actual infrastructure; fuck off over the horizon whistling happy tunes.

Wasn't that the original argument under Thatcher for privatisation that it would lead to better cheaper services for the public.

[BnM]

Had a 3 year deal with Engie but they sold their consumer accounts to Octopus who have been fine apart from pestering me every month for a reading unlike Engie who were happy with every 3 months. The 3 years ended just after prices started to rocket.

Was on £57 now £90 not on a fixed tariff any more, however it was such a mild winter I had heating on about 5 times if you don't include my heated throw. So I've used less than they estimated.

I'm not understanding these ones that have gone from £50 a month to £400 that I'm seeing claimed. I've got from a 3 year tariff to a 58% increase which after 3 years and a bit you'd expect a 15-20% increase ish so it's more but it's not 700%

[Glaston]

Meanwhile, I'm sure this will beef up our energy security and lead to lower prices...

National Grid criticised for £4.2bn sale 'of the national silver' to foreign investor
The group has sold a 60% stake in Britain's gas pipeline network to Australian bank Macquarie.

...
Macquarie owned Thames Water for more than a decade, leaving it saddled with debt when it sold the company in 2016.

The bank earned billions in huge dividends from the company, while paying next to no corporation tax.
...

https://news.sky.com/story/national-gri ... r-12576739

The sale is to pay for their acquisition of Western Power.
National Grid has been selling off gas assets for the last 7 or 8 years

[Glaston]

Had a 3 year deal with Engie but they sold their consumer accounts to Octopus who have been fine apart from pestering me every month for a reading unlike Engie who were happy with every 3 months. The 3 years ended just after prices started to rocket.

Was on £57 now £90 not on a fixed tariff any more, however it was such a mild winter I had heating on about 5 times if you don't include my heated throw. So I've used less than they estimated.

I'm not understanding these ones that have gone from £50 a month to £400 that I'm seeing claimed. I've got from a 3 year tariff to a 58% increase which after 3 years and a bit you'd expect a 15-20% increase ish so it's more but it's not 700%

Seriously how hard is it to read your meter?

I read mine every day, it takes me a total of 5 seconds.

[I like neeps]

Had a 3 year deal with Engie but they sold their consumer accounts to Octopus who have been fine apart from pestering me every month for a reading unlike Engie who were happy with every 3 months. The 3 years ended just after prices started to rocket.

Was on £57 now £90 not on a fixed tariff any more, however it was such a mild winter I had heating on about 5 times if you don't include my heated throw. So I've used less than they estimated.

I'm not understanding these ones that have gone from £50 a month to £400 that I'm seeing claimed. I've got from a 3 year tariff to a 58% increase which after 3 years and a bit you'd expect a 15-20% increase ish so it's more but it's not 700%

I'm with you my heating costs went up 40% and EDF sent a guy round to check because they didn't believe my meter readings. However, I work from the office 5 days per week and my dad only put the heating on at home if two jumpers wasn't warm enough. And slept in a sleeping bag with a duvet on top. So it taught me just not to use heating which is quite helpful at these times.

I go to my friends house and he's in a t shirt all of January. It's ridiculous.

[Grandpa]

Had a 3 year deal with Engie but they sold their consumer accounts to Octopus who have been fine apart from pestering me every month for a reading unlike Engie who were happy with every 3 months. The 3 years ended just after prices started to rocket.

Was on £57 now £90 not on a fixed tariff any more, however it was such a mild winter I had heating on about 5 times if you don't include my heated throw. So I've used less than they estimated.

I'm not understanding these ones that have gone from £50 a month to £400 that I'm seeing claimed. I've got from a 3 year tariff to a 58% increase which after 3 years and a bit you'd expect a 15-20% increase ish so it's more but it's not 700%

I'm with EDF... been £155 per month last two years... currently looking at predicted Standard variable price... £292 per month from May.. so almost doubling... but slightly down from when I last looked... best fixed on offer is £478 per month. Again that is better than when I last checked.

[Paddington Bear]

Had a 3 year deal with Engie but they sold their consumer accounts to Octopus who have been fine apart from pestering me every month for a reading unlike Engie who were happy with every 3 months. The 3 years ended just after prices started to rocket.

Was on £57 now £90 not on a fixed tariff any more, however it was such a mild winter I had heating on about 5 times if you don't include my heated throw. So I've used less than they estimated.

I'm not understanding these ones that have gone from £50 a month to £400 that I'm seeing claimed. I've got from a 3 year tariff to a 58% increase which after 3 years and a bit you'd expect a 15-20% increase ish so it's more but it's not 700%

I'm with you my heating costs went up 40% and EDF sent a guy round to check because they didn't believe my meter readings. However, I work from the office 5 days per week and my dad only put the heating on at home if two jumpers wasn't warm enough. And slept in a sleeping bag with a duvet on top. So it taught me just not to use heating which is quite helpful at these times.

I go to my friends house and he's in a t shirt all of January. It's ridiculous.

It's far from the main story in all this as I know some people are struggling to afford the energy to have a hot shower/boil water etc, but there's been a weird outcry against energy firms/advisories who have recommended (to people above the poverty line) that they should wear a jumper/trousers/socks around the house. That's just basic common sense, surely? If you want to wear shorts and t-shirt all year round I get it but you should expect to have to pay for the luxury.

[tabascoboy]

Had a 3 year deal with Engie but they sold their consumer accounts to Octopus who have been fine apart from pestering me every month for a reading unlike Engie who were happy with every 3 months. The 3 years ended just after prices started to rocket.

Was on £57 now £90 not on a fixed tariff any more, however it was such a mild winter I had heating on about 5 times if you don't include my heated throw. So I've used less than they estimated.

I'm not understanding these ones that have gone from £50 a month to £400 that I'm seeing claimed. I've got from a 3 year tariff to a 58% increase which after 3 years and a bit you'd expect a 15-20% increase ish so it's more but it's not 700%

I'm with you my heating costs went up 40% and EDF sent a guy round to check because they didn't believe my meter readings. However, I work from the office 5 days per week and my dad only put the heating on at home if two jumpers wasn't warm enough. And slept in a sleeping bag with a duvet on top. So it taught me just not to use heating which is quite helpful at these times.

I go to my friends house and he's in a t shirt all of January. It's ridiculous.

It's far from the main story in all this as I know some people are struggling to afford the energy to have a hot shower/boil water etc, but there's been a weird outcry against energy firms/advisories who have recommended (to people above the poverty line) that they should wear a jumper/trousers/socks around the house. That's just basic common sense, surely? If you want to wear shorts and t-shirt all year round I get it but you should expect to have to pay for the luxury.

Definitely agree although having to wear 5 layers of clothing, two pairs of socks and boots indoors to try and stop shivering just worsens my winter blues! Never had problems with feeling cold while younger but was still wearing winter clothing in last week's warmth and sunshine...

We are fortunate now though to have the option of heating the whole house even at a high cost, it's not like we are living in pre-war slums without even being able to get firewood or afford coal for a fireplace. Imagine living in an unheated old house with even worse insulation and draughty windows than is more normal now...

[Paddington Bear]

I'm with you my heating costs went up 40% and EDF sent a guy round to check because they didn't believe my meter readings. However, I work from the office 5 days per week and my dad only put the heating on at home if two jumpers wasn't warm enough. And slept in a sleeping bag with a duvet on top. So it taught me just not to use heating which is quite helpful at these times.

I go to my friends house and he's in a t shirt all of January. It's ridiculous.

It's far from the main story in all this as I know some people are struggling to afford the energy to have a hot shower/boil water etc, but there's been a weird outcry against energy firms/advisories who have recommended (to people above the poverty line) that they should wear a jumper/trousers/socks around the house. That's just basic common sense, surely? If you want to wear shorts and t-shirt all year round I get it but you should expect to have to pay for the luxury.

Definitely agree although having to wear 5 layers of clothing, two pairs of socks and boots indoors to try and stop shivering just worsens my winter blues! Never had problems with feeling cold while younger but was still wearing winter clothing in last week's warmth and sunshine...

We are fortunate now though to have the option of heating the whole house even at a high cost, it's not like we are living in pre-war slums without even being able to get firewood or afford coal for a fireplace. Imagine living in an unheated old house with even worse insulation and draughty windows than is more normal now...

Yeah there's a limit!

Fortunately my front room needs about 30 minutes to turn into a sauna for hours afterwards which kept costs down through the cold snap.

[Biffer]

A cluster fuck 10 years in the making. So many moronic decisions and terrible policy.

Quick precis anywhere? I've not kept up until it hit the front pages

The energy situation has been fucked for 20 years or more - no one wants to build a power plant and any that are built take a generation for no real reason. Same will happen with drinking water - we refuse to build reservoirs

Also see guarantees on no more on shore wind, removal of a working renewables incentive scheme to desperately try to produce one that includes nuclear, 'cutting the green crap' a la Cameron thereby making sure no energy efficiency schemes are implemented and there's very little move to community heating / air source or ground source heating etc. Also lack of investment in bootstrap high voltage cabling to take energy from remote parts of scotland to the south where it's needed, purley to neuter arguments about energy production in the independence debate, incredibly slow movement on interconnects to scandanavia for energy storage projects, lack of inveestment in power networks and the grid for efficienct management, and I'll think of more later.

[Insane_Homer]

On the 31st take photos of your meter reading even if you're able to submit online. Almost guaranteed there'll be issues and readings 'losts'

[Ymx]

I saw the sneaky suggestion to add a bit to on to your reading this time around. Effectively pre buying at the cheaper rate.

[Insane_Homer]

I saw the sneaky suggestion to add a bit to on to your reading this time around. Effectively pre buying at the cheaper rate.

be careful.

[fishfoodie]

The EU has launched a legal challenge against the UK over offshore wind farm subsidies – sending a formal complaint to the World Trade Organisation (WTO) for the first time since Brexit.

The European Commission claims new criteria brought in by Boris Johnson’s government related to offshore wind projects breaks agreed subsidy rules.

Brussels told the WTO that the change means the UK is now favouring British companies using domestically-sourced wind turbines – rather the imported “content” – when it comes to subsidies.

“This violates the WTO’s core tenet that imports must be able to compete on an equal footing with domestic products and harms EU suppliers,” the Commission stated.

British officials were said to be puzzled at the timing of the move. “At a time when the West should be united in defeating Putin, this act of envy by Brussels is ill-judged and ill-timed,” a Whitehall source told the Financial Times.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/p ... 46500.html

[dpedin]

The EU has launched a legal challenge against the UK over offshore wind farm subsidies – sending a formal complaint to the World Trade Organisation (WTO) for the first time since Brexit.

The European Commission claims new criteria brought in by Boris Johnson’s government related to offshore wind projects breaks agreed subsidy rules.

Brussels told the WTO that the change means the UK is now favouring British companies using domestically-sourced wind turbines – rather the imported “content” – when it comes to subsidies.

“This violates the WTO’s core tenet that imports must be able to compete on an equal footing with domestic products and harms EU suppliers,” the Commission stated.

British officials were said to be puzzled at the timing of the move. “At a time when the West should be united in defeating Putin, this act of envy by Brussels is ill-judged and ill-timed,” a Whitehall source told the Financial Times.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/p ... 46500.html

I suppose the UK Gov threatening to renege on the withdrawal agreement, to introduce legislation that breaks international law in a 'specific and limited' way, to trigger Article 16 every week and as a result to bring down the GFA is just a bit of friendly banter then? I suspect this is a shot over the bows from the EU to keep the UK in line.

Another way of looking at this would be that the UK should not be using the cover of the Ukrainian War to sneak through breaking the WTO rules and regulations? Using the excuse of Ukraine to break recognised WTO rules and regs is just the sort of thing you expect this Gov to do, isn't it? It sounds like the U Ukrainian situation is now going to be the excuse for every Gov failing or rule breaking now - the equivalent of the 'dog ate my homework'.

[fishfoodie]

The EU has launched a legal challenge against the UK over offshore wind farm subsidies – sending a formal complaint to the World Trade Organisation (WTO) for the first time since Brexit.

The European Commission claims new criteria brought in by Boris Johnson’s government related to offshore wind projects breaks agreed subsidy rules.

Brussels told the WTO that the change means the UK is now favouring British companies using domestically-sourced wind turbines – rather the imported “content” – when it comes to subsidies.

“This violates the WTO’s core tenet that imports must be able to compete on an equal footing with domestic products and harms EU suppliers,” the Commission stated.

British officials were said to be puzzled at the timing of the move. “At a time when the West should be united in defeating Putin, this act of envy by Brussels is ill-judged and ill-timed,” a Whitehall source told the Financial Times.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/p ... 46500.html

I suppose the UK Gov threatening to renege on the withdrawal agreement, to introduce legislation that breaks international law in a 'specific and limited' way, to trigger Article 16 every week and as a result to bring down the GFA is just a bit of friendly banter then? I suspect this is a shot over the bows from the EU to keep the UK in line.

Another way of looking at this would be that the UK should not be using the cover of the Ukrainian War to sneak through breaking the WTO rules and regulations? Using the excuse of Ukraine to break recognised WTO rules and regs is just the sort of thing you expect this Gov to do, isn't it? It sounds like the U Ukrainian situation is now going to be the excuse for every Gov failing or rule breaking now - the equivalent of the 'dog ate my homework'.

I saw it more as them seeing the opportunity to follow the Tories "World Beating" PPE procurement project, with a new, "World Beating" wind turbine procurement project, with the same outcome, for the tax payer.

[Jimmy Smallsteps]

I saw the sneaky suggestion to add a bit to on to your reading this time around. Effectively pre buying at the cheaper rate.

be careful.

More like Money Losing Softcock. This week's edition brought to you by...British Gas!

[petej]

As much as I enjoy complaining about this shitty government I am considerably less concerned about procuring UK manufactured wind turbines than I am about dodgy PPE sourced from anywhere while actually ignoring some UK manufacturers who weren't already friendly with a Tory MP.

[fishfoodie]

As much as I enjoy complaining about this shitty government I am considerably less concerned about procuring UK manufactured wind turbines than I am about dodgy PPE sourced from anywhere while actually ignoring some UK manufacturers who weren't already friendly with a Tory MP.

Even if they charge 5x as much as say a French Manufacturer ?

And lets be honest about this, you're almost certainly going to get the PPE situation, where some Tory spiv sets up a company; & bids for a contract, then imports all the bits from the cheapest suppliers, & pockets the difference.

[Ymx]

Meter done, and photographed.

Gas switched off at the mains. Cold showers til the war is over to show solidarity with Ukraine?

[Grandpa]

Meter done, and photographed.

Gas switched off at the mains. Cold showers til the war is over to show solidarity with Ukraine?

And we're having the first proper snow of the winter...

[petej]

As much as I enjoy complaining about this shitty government I am considerably less concerned about procuring UK manufactured wind turbines than I am about dodgy PPE sourced from anywhere while actually ignoring some UK manufacturers who weren't already friendly with a Tory MP.

Even if they charge 5x as much as say a French Manufacturer ?

And lets be honest about this, you're almost certainly going to get the PPE situation, where some Tory spiv sets up a company; & bids for a contract, then imports all the bits from the cheapest suppliers, & pockets the difference.

Not sure why GE, Dong/ørsted or Siemens who I think all manufacture in the UK would be 5x more expensive. On a per capita basis China produces more co2 than the uk and the continual use of coal buying Chinese ones is not good.

[Paddington Bear]

As much as I enjoy complaining about this shitty government I am considerably less concerned about procuring UK manufactured wind turbines than I am about dodgy PPE sourced from anywhere while actually ignoring some UK manufacturers who weren't already friendly with a Tory MP.

Even if they charge 5x as much as say a French Manufacturer ?

And lets be honest about this, you're almost certainly going to get the PPE situation, where some Tory spiv sets up a company; & bids for a contract, then imports all the bits from the cheapest suppliers, & pockets the difference.

1) I don't think this (price range) is true in the main, certainly not from my experience
2) We have a good renewables industry and supporting it would be smart government policy, even if the EU don't like it

[SaintK]

So much for their suggestion of sending in a meter reading.
Both Eon and British Gas websites unavailable and crashing.
Bastard utilities!!!!!

[dpedin]

Octopus website busy too but it has following helpful message:

We're super busy today so you might have a long wait if you call.

The best day to give us a meter reading is this Saturday (our standard variable prices don't change until 00:00 Saturday 2nd April.) Make a note of your readings or take a photo of them on Saturday. When we receive this reading we will apply it to your account from 00:00 midnight on the Saturday. You will have a week to submit them to us, so please don't worry if you can't get it to us that day.

[Hal Jordan]

Meter done, and photographed.

Gas switched off at the mains. Cold showers til the war is over to show solidarity with Ukraine?

And we're having the first proper snow of the winter...

County Championship warm ups are starting, and the kids break up for Easter holidays next week, so naturally the glorious sunshine that's been going on over March has packed up and gone home.

[tabascoboy]

So much for their suggestion of sending in a meter reading.
Both Eon and British Gas websites unavailable and crashing.
Bastard utilities!!!!!

Wonder how much overcharging this leads to and resulting headaches and stress for those trying to get it sorted out later. Since so many consumers were forced to switch to another supplier the companies just haven't been able to cope with the extra admin and "customer support". A fiasco and it's consumers paying the price.

[SaintK]

So much for their suggestion of sending in a meter reading.
Both Eon and British Gas websites unavailable and crashing.
Bastard utilities!!!!!

Wonder how much overcharging this leads to and resulting headaches and stress for those trying to get it sorted out later. Since so many consumers were forced to switch to another supplier the companies just haven't been able to cope with the extra admin and "customer support". A fiasco and it's consumers paying the price.

Quite
I've told both my kids to photograph their meters this evening as back up proof if anything goes wrong.
Just received a text from British Gas saying I can text back my gas meter reading which is a reasonable response as theiur website is down.
Edit: Just got on to the Eon website, hopefully all will be accurate!!

[inactionman]

Assume if I'm on smart mater I don't need to do anything with this reporting to the supplier? Apologies if idiot question, we've inherited all this in our new house and haven't got arse in gear to investigate properly.

(other than stare in horror as the dials - which display in pound and pence - start spinning up like a demented fruit machine)

[tabascoboy]

Assume if I'm on smart mater I don't need to do anything with this reporting to the supplier? Apologies if idiot question, we've inherited all this in our new house and haven't got arse in gear to investigate properly.

(other than stare in horror as the dials - which display in pound and pence - start spinning up like a demented fruit machine)

My gas is on smart meter and it has been updating British Gas info daily as it should - though not showing daily usage and charging on the website since 16th Feb which seems to be a widespread issue. Took the precaution of asking for a new statement as well this week to see where I stood with the bill. Downside is can't "accidentally" misread and give a higher reading to get it billed at the lower rate

[Hal Jordan]

Our smart meter shat its pants during a big lower cut and has refused to reconnect to the meters. My wife is bravely doing battle with the helpline.

[C69]

I've just increased my payments from £170 to £250 a month which was £80 a month less than they suggested.
I suspect Octopus will want a bit more soon.


For me this means nothing as I have no mortgage but for most working people with no margins to work with this means a shit load of hurt.
I really don't think that many people appreciate what this will mean for society as a whole.


Only a matter of time that a wind fall tax will be done if there is any sense.

Another rise in October is going to be brutal, energy/utility Privatisation and the subsequent siphoning off of profits for our shit services being handed to cash machines off shores is a Tory disagrace

[Insane_Homer]

Council Tax rebate for Bands A-D

You'll get £150 automatically if you pay by Direct Debit, if not DD then you need to apply seperately.

Check you local council website for further details.

[tabascoboy]

Well, gas cost for hot water only today ( on timer, not always on ) so far is already equal to the normal cost for the whole day prior to the end of fixed price tariff...

[I like neeps]

I've just increased my payments from £170 to £250 a month which was £80 a month less than they suggested.
I suspect Octopus will want a bit more soon.


For me this means nothing as I have no mortgage but for most working people with no margins to work with this means a shit load of hurt.
I really don't think that many people appreciate what this will mean for society as a whole.


Only a matter of time that a wind fall tax will be done if there is any sense.

Another rise in October is going to be brutal, energy/utility Privatisation and the subsequent siphoning off of profits for our shit services being handed to cash machines off shores is a Tory disagrace

Yeah a windfall tax is inevitable but there's not too much they can do otherwise. Can't borrow too much as interest rates rise and rise they will as energy and food prices rise as much as 100% in the coming months.

I think the world is in line for severe changes. QE'd our way out of the banking crisis and the bill is coming due. Batten down the hatches.