Gulf stream goooooonnnnnnneeeee

[TB63]

Anyway, we supply water over the border enough as it is.
Elan valley supplies Brum and Coventry, Bala supplies the scousers..

[petej]

It's a weird thing. A reservoir is probably the most attractive & least disruptive public works structure that you can possibly put into any landscape, but still there's massive resistance.

British Nimbyism is truly world-beating.

Add in celtic nationalism for a truly toxic mix.

Can't think why Wales or Scotland would object to the taking of fresh water as a resource for free while branding them as burdens on the UK finances. What benefit does Wales get for supplying water to Liverpool and Birmingham?

This really depends on the model by how a country uses natural resources whether you are a Norway where the benefit is shared nationally or Russia where regions resources are extracted with no benefit to the region and funnelled to Moscow and oligarchs pockets. I would say we are nearer Russia than Norway particularly with the private water companies and piss poor regulation.

[Biffer]

Build dams people. In Wales. Generate power at the same time as catching rainfall & creating jobs. Simple. Except in UK apparently.

Which part of reduced rainfall did you struggle with?

The UK has absolutely an abundance of fresh water. The problem is building reservoirs may upset people so we dont

It is massively variable across the UK though. A I said earlier, the Southeast has less rainfall than Sydney, but has a population of 18 million. You're right though, it's substantially an infrastructure problem.

The proposed reservoirs in Lincolnshire, Oxfordshire and Cambridgeshire demonstrate the problem. Massive nimbyism.

[Paddington Bear]

Which part of reduced rainfall did you struggle with?

The UK has absolutely an abundance of fresh water. The problem is building reservoirs may upset people so we dont

It's a weird thing. A reservoir is probably the most attractive & least disruptive public works structure that you can possibly put into any landscape, but still there's massive resistance.

This is why there is almost no point having a public consultation angle to major national infrastructure projects. Whether we have enough drinking water supersedes anyone's right to peace and quiet and the character of their neighbourhood. We even have the blueprint from Kielder for creating a massive reservoir system that's also a superb nature reserve, and we won't do it again. AAGH.

[JM2K6]

Wow hopefully getting white vans owners in Uxbridge to pay a extra 4k a year will fix this

Congrats for not even understanding the purpose of ULEZ!

[Sandstorm]

This is why there is almost no point having a public consultation angle to major national infrastructure projects.

Let's follow China's model instead.

[tc27]

British Nimbyism is truly world-beating.

Add in celtic nationalism for a truly toxic mix.

Can't think why Wales or Scotland would object to the taking of fresh water as a resource for free while branding them as burdens on the UK finances. What benefit does Wales get for supplying water to Liverpool and Birmingham?

This really depends on the model by how a country uses natural resources whether you are a Norway where the benefit is shared nationally or Russia where regions resources are extracted with no benefit to the region and funnelled to Moscow and oligarchs pockets. I would say we are nearer Russia than Norway particularly with the private water companies and piss poor regulation.

In terms of fairness I would say the UK is pretty good at redistribution of tax pounds from areas with surpluses into areas with defecits. In practical terms this mostly means from the urbanised parts of England into generally more rural areas like Wales. The fact that infrastructure may be built that benefits everyone in these areas is not a burning injustice in this context.

And in general this level of pooling and sharing of resources is just how any modern nation state has to work.

[Biffer]

Add in celtic nationalism for a truly toxic mix.

Can't think why Wales or Scotland would object to the taking of fresh water as a resource for free while branding them as burdens on the UK finances. What benefit does Wales get for supplying water to Liverpool and Birmingham?

This really depends on the model by how a country uses natural resources whether you are a Norway where the benefit is shared nationally or Russia where regions resources are extracted with no benefit to the region and funnelled to Moscow and oligarchs pockets. I would say we are nearer Russia than Norway particularly with the private water companies and piss poor regulation.

In terms of fairness I would say the UK is pretty good at redistribution of tax pounds from areas with surpluses into areas with defecits. In practical terms this mostly means from the urbanised parts of England into generally more rural areas like Wales. The fact that infrastructure may be built that benefits everyone in these areas is not a burning injustice in this context.

And in general this level of pooling and sharing of resources is just how any modern nation state has to work.

In general for thirty years it was redistribution of oil revenue into tax cuts. Which left us with the shithole infrastructure we have now.

[Hal Jordan]

You can float solar on reservoirs, too, although the vast acres of warehouse roofs and private dwellings are where we should start.

[petej]

You can float solar on reservoirs, too, although the vast acres of warehouse roofs and private dwellings are where we should start.

It has perplexed me that nearby instead of putting solar on roofs or industrial waste land they seem to want to put them within a site of special scientific interest.

[Guy Smiley]

You can float solar on reservoirs, too, although the vast acres of warehouse roofs and private dwellings are where we should start.

It has perplexed me that nearby instead of putting solar on roofs or industrial waste land they seem to want to put them within a site of special scientific interest.

Depending on the site, a serious rooftop pv install could involve costly strengthening work. The attraction of floating solar arrays is the reduction in evaporation and regulation of temperature...

California and India are talking about solar over waterways like canals citing those advantages. China is installing a chunk of floating solar.

Private dwellings are an obvious option but you have to convince owners of the benefits.... then there's the attractive problem of generation stressing the local grid, as has happened in Western Australia. The local power utility started out offering a reasonable buy back rate for home solar meaning an owner could recoup some of their install costs selling excess back into the grid. The falling costs of pv arrays, increased trade experience and abundant sun has seen the rate of installation outstrip the capacity of the grid to deal with it. Adelaide saw that coming a couple of years ago and embarked on a trial setting up 'smart neighbourhood micro grids' involving something like 50000 households and I think they included batteries as part of that micro grid solution.

That's the way to go... micro grids utilising local generation and storing excess for regular supply.

[Hal Jordan]

Micro-grids, you say? No wonder power companies are so keen to stifle local solar in favour of whanging great arrays they can control....

Or in the US, get a friendly state representative to introduce an off the shelf ALEC drafted piece of legislation to torpedo self-generation.

[Guy Smiley]

Micro-grids, you say? No wonder power companies are so keen to stifle local solar in favour of whanging great arrays they can control....

Corporate thinking doesn't really align well with the impending climate apocalypse.

The US is just fucked.

[Ymx]

Actually, there is a driving factor for corporates to become carbon neutral.

ESG is a very very useful classification for a stock to acquire. For share price reasons …

If the index companies (who classify stocks), deem these companies to be ESG, it means that they become eligible to belong to not only the standard indexes, but to ESG indexes as well.

Why does that matter?

Demand drives share price. Some of the biggest funds are now index trackers. So, just by being in the index can automatically attract billions in investment.

It’s the same for when a stock first hits the FTSE 250.

Suddenly there is automated investment in the company by
Vanguard FTSE 250 fund
Blackrock FTSE 250 fund
Etc

Additional to this are those running ESG mandates where they can only select from ESG qualifying stocks. So these companies are eligible, where they would not have been previously.

I don’t know the exact stats on what avg percentage boost to share price is, but it is significant, and significant enough for these corporates to adopt policies to fulfill it.

MSCI is large index provider who classifies such stocks.

[Hal Jordan]

Plenty of corporate stooges in the state legislatures happy to introduce anti-ESG rules on command, too...

[TB63]

Car parks..

Site solar panels above car parks..

You come back to a cool\dry car.. They generate power.. Plug your car into a charging port powered by the panels.. win win...

[shaggy]

You can float solar on reservoirs, too, although the vast acres of warehouse roofs and private dwellings are where we should start.

Private dwellings are not the same as other solutions as the owner pays for the equipment, unless you are suggesting utilities subsidise the installation of PV on those private dwellings.

[Biffer]

Car parks..

Site solar panels above car parks..

You come back to a cool\dry car.. They generate power.. Plug your car into a charging port powered by the panels.. win win...

The Dutch have developed a road surface that is PV. All roads generating the electricity the cars run on is the idea.

[Masterji]

My dad was in Burma in the late 40s, early 50s and most of the people from his area were deported back to Pakistan. We had guys that had businesses, lose everything. When he came to UK, he saved like mad because he feared the same here and built proper homes in PK and invested in property in Islamabad. All he ever did was to remind me not to put all the eggs in one basket, so if the worse comes to worse, off we go to Pakistan, although I have only been once in 43 years

[Biffer]

My dad was in Burma in the late 40s, early 50s and most of the people from his area were deported back to Pakistan. We had guys that had businesses, lose everything. When he came to UK, he saved like mad because he feared the same here and built proper homes in PK and invested in property in Islamabad. All he ever did was to remind me not to put all the eggs in one basket, so if the worse comes to worse, off we go to Pakistan, although I have only been once in 43 years

Pakistan will be ridiculously hot in summer in fifty years. Almost unliveable. From the last IPCC report

Pakistan’s projected temperature increase is expected to be higher than the global average.
Projected temperature increase in northern parts is expected to be higher than the southern parts of the country.
The frequency of hot days and hot nights is expected to increase significantly.
Pakistan’s rainfall projections do not indicate any systematic changing trends.
An increasing trend in the rainfall over the Upper Indus Basin and decreasing trend in the Lower Indus Basin.

Also, the impact of climate change on Himalayan glaciers means probable water shortages.

[robmatic]

You can float solar on reservoirs, too, although the vast acres of warehouse roofs and private dwellings are where we should start.

It has perplexed me that nearby instead of putting solar on roofs or industrial waste land they seem to want to put them within a site of special scientific interest.

Or on productive agricultural land.

[tabascoboy]

You can float solar on reservoirs, too, although the vast acres of warehouse roofs and private dwellings are where we should start.

It has perplexed me that nearby instead of putting solar on roofs or industrial waste land they seem to want to put them within a site of special scientific interest.

Or on productive agricultural land.

Well I remember reading that putting solar on land used by sheep for pasture is very beneficial as the sheep get shade and the grass stays in better condition. 'Agrivoltaic Farms'.

Paywalled, but https://www.newscientist.com/article/23 ... for-sheep/

[Biffer]

It has perplexed me that nearby instead of putting solar on roofs or industrial waste land they seem to want to put them within a site of special scientific interest.

Or on productive agricultural land.

Well I remember reading that putting solar on land used by sheep for pasture is very beneficial as the sheep get shade and the grass stays in better condition. 'Agrivoltaic Farms'.

Paywalled, but https://www.newscientist.com/article/23 ... for-sheep/

Yeah, the sheep aren’t bothered in the slightest and there’s no maintenance costs to keep the grass cut around the panels.

[robmatic]

It has perplexed me that nearby instead of putting solar on roofs or industrial waste land they seem to want to put them within a site of special scientific interest.

Or on productive agricultural land.

Well I remember reading that putting solar on land used by sheep for pasture is very beneficial as the sheep get shade and the grass stays in better condition. 'Agrivoltaic Farms'.

Paywalled, but https://www.newscientist.com/article/23 ... for-sheep/

I grew up on a sheep farm. Not being able to traverse a field with a tractor or vehicle makes it less than ideal for your day-to-day tasks and you won't be able to make hay or silage for the winter. Also, you probably want to maintain productivity in the long term by applying fertiliser, re-seeding etc. periodically.

I can see it being worthwhile for the farmer in terms of diversifying income but there will be an effect in terms of agricultural productivity.

[Masterji]

My dad was in Burma in the late 40s, early 50s and most of the people from his area were deported back to Pakistan. We had guys that had businesses, lose everything. When he came to UK, he saved like mad because he feared the same here and built proper homes in PK and invested in property in Islamabad. All he ever did was to remind me not to put all the eggs in one basket, so if the worse comes to worse, off we go to Pakistan, although I have only been once in 43 years

Pakistan will be ridiculously hot in summer in fifty years. Almost unliveable. From the last IPCC report

Pakistan’s projected temperature increase is expected to be higher than the global average.
Projected temperature increase in northern parts is expected to be higher than the southern parts of the country.
The frequency of hot days and hot nights is expected to increase significantly.
Pakistan’s rainfall projections do not indicate any systematic changing trends.
An increasing trend in the rainfall over the Upper Indus Basin and decreasing trend in the Lower Indus Basin.

Also, the impact of climate change on Himalayan glaciers means probable water shortages.

But as hot PK is and will be, it will remain an option if the worse case scenarios come to be. It will be massive culture shock but hopefully, none comes to be and the worse case scenarios are way overstated.

[Biffer]

My dad was in Burma in the late 40s, early 50s and most of the people from his area were deported back to Pakistan. We had guys that had businesses, lose everything. When he came to UK, he saved like mad because he feared the same here and built proper homes in PK and invested in property in Islamabad. All he ever did was to remind me not to put all the eggs in one basket, so if the worse comes to worse, off we go to Pakistan, although I have only been once in 43 years

Pakistan will be ridiculously hot in summer in fifty years. Almost unliveable. From the last IPCC report

Pakistan’s projected temperature increase is expected to be higher than the global average.
Projected temperature increase in northern parts is expected to be higher than the southern parts of the country.
The frequency of hot days and hot nights is expected to increase significantly.
Pakistan’s rainfall projections do not indicate any systematic changing trends.
An increasing trend in the rainfall over the Upper Indus Basin and decreasing trend in the Lower Indus Basin.

Also, the impact of climate change on Himalayan glaciers means probable water shortages.

But as hot PK is and will be, it will remain an option if the worse case scenarios come to be. It will be massive culture shock but hopefully, none comes to be and the worse case scenarios are way overstated.

Well you'll have less problems from sea level rise I reckon.

[JM2K6]

My dad was in Burma in the late 40s, early 50s and most of the people from his area were deported back to Pakistan. We had guys that had businesses, lose everything. When he came to UK, he saved like mad because he feared the same here and built proper homes in PK and invested in property in Islamabad. All he ever did was to remind me not to put all the eggs in one basket, so if the worse comes to worse, off we go to Pakistan, although I have only been once in 43 years

Pakistan will be ridiculously hot in summer in fifty years. Almost unliveable. From the last IPCC report

Pakistan’s projected temperature increase is expected to be higher than the global average.
Projected temperature increase in northern parts is expected to be higher than the southern parts of the country.
The frequency of hot days and hot nights is expected to increase significantly.
Pakistan’s rainfall projections do not indicate any systematic changing trends.
An increasing trend in the rainfall over the Upper Indus Basin and decreasing trend in the Lower Indus Basin.

Also, the impact of climate change on Himalayan glaciers means probable water shortages.

But as hot PK is and will be, it will remain an option if the worse case scenarios come to be. It will be massive culture shock but hopefully, none comes to be and the worse case scenarios are way overstated.

What does "it will remain an option" mean?

[Hal Jordan]

Given the gutting of environmental policy that will happen if a Republican wins in 2025 (and I mean completely destroying the EPA and giving more roids to the fossil fuel industry), I think we've fucked it no matter what.

[Ymx]

So, the Gulf Stream is not shutting down? It’s the AMOC which is a side street off a B road of the Gulf Stream (Highway)

[Sandstorm]

Given the gutting of environmental policy that will happen if a Republican wins in 2025 (and I mean completely destroying the EPA and giving more roids to the fossil fuel industry), I think we've fucked it no matter what.

The West is cutting back on coal and fossil fuel use while Asia and the Indian sub-continent continue to ramp it up.

It’s no longer okay to say: “Well the West had 75 years to build a developed economy, now it’s their turn”

If this shit continues as it is now, we’re all fucked. Sadly you can’t stop the fucking Boomer shareholders and Chinese billionaires who still run the global markets and influence governments.

So. We’re. Fucked. Proper fucked.

[Guy Smiley]

Given the gutting of environmental policy that will happen if a Republican wins in 2025 (and I mean completely destroying the EPA and giving more roids to the fossil fuel industry), I think we've fucked it no matter what.

The West is cutting back on coal and fossil fuel use while Asia and the Indian sub-continent continue to ramp it up.

It’s no longer okay to say: “Well the West had 75 years to build a developed economy, now it’s their turn”

If this shit continues as it is now, we’re all fucked. Sadly you can’t stop the fucking Boomer shareholders and Chinese billionaires who still run the global markets and influence governments.

So. We’re. Fucked. Proper fucked.

China and India are investing heavily in renewable energy. They’re not ramping up fossil fuel use at all. What they are doing is continuing to use that and even opening up some fossil fuel generators to maintain supply but that is a rapidly decreasing proportion of their overall supply.

[Glaston]

Given the gutting of environmental policy that will happen if a Republican wins in 2025 (and I mean completely destroying the EPA and giving more roids to the fossil fuel industry), I think we've fucked it no matter what.

The West is cutting back on coal and fossil fuel use while Asia and the Indian sub-continent continue to ramp it up.

It’s no longer okay to say: “Well the West had 75 years to build a developed economy, now it’s their turn”

If this shit continues as it is now, we’re all fucked. Sadly you can’t stop the fucking Boomer shareholders and Chinese billionaires who still run the global markets and influence governments.

So. We’re. Fucked. Proper fucked.

China and India are investing heavily in renewable energy. They’re not ramping up fossil fuel use at all. What they are doing is continuing to use that and even opening up some fossil fuel generators to maintain supply but that is a rapidly decreasing proportion of their overall supply.

Yet Aussie coal exports to Asia are still rising.

[convoluted]

Those of my vintage will recall all of these ...

1960s -- Oil gone in 10 years
1970s -- Another Ice Age in 10 years
1980s -- Acid Rain will destroy all crops in 10 years
1990s -- The Ozone Layer will be gone in 10 years
2000 -- The Ice Caps will be gone in 10 years

[Biffer]

Those of my vintage will recall all of these ...

1960s -- Oil gone in 10 years
1970s -- Another Ice Age in 10 years
1980s -- Acid Rain will destroy all crops in 10 years
1990s -- The Ozone Layer will be gone in 10 years
2000 -- The Ice Caps will be gone in 10 years

Honest people will also remember the concerted action taken to tackle acid rain and ozone depletion.

[Guy Smiley]

Those of my vintage will recall all of these ...

1960s -- Oil gone in 10 years
1970s -- Another Ice Age in 10 years
1980s -- Acid Rain will destroy all crops in 10 years
1990s -- The Ozone Layer will be gone in 10 years
2000 -- The Ice Caps will be gone in 10 years

Honest people will also remember the concerted action taken to tackle acid rain and ozone depletion.

Honest people will also remember that those claims were never made.

[convoluted]

China and India are investing heavily in renewable energy. They’re not ramping up fossil fuel use at all. What they are doing is continuing to use that and even opening up some fossil fuel generators to maintain supply but that is a rapidly decreasing proportion of their overall supply.

^^^ Yup. It 'ain't the Chinese.
Just a few days back, Hillary fingered the true culprits: "the 'MAGA Republicans' are to blame !!!!"

[petej]

Those of my vintage will recall all of these ...

1960s -- Oil gone in 10 years
1970s -- Another Ice Age in 10 years
1980s -- Acid Rain will destroy all crops in 10 years
1990s -- The Ozone Layer will be gone in 10 years
2000 -- The Ice Caps will be gone in 10 years

Honest people will also remember the concerted action taken to tackle acid rain and ozone depletion.

The success of the Montreal Protocol is a reason to support more action not less as it shows that we can have a positive impact.

[convoluted]

FFS, even 'they' don't believe what they fill your passively compliant and obedient heads with, whether it's the necessity of wearing a mask or telling you coastal properties will flood:

Climate activists invest in property on beaches they say are disappearing
From Bill and Melinda Gates to climate envoy John Kerry, climate activists have sounded the alarm about how melting ice will soon raise the ocean to levels that swallow the world’s beaches.
But some of the country's most vocal climate change activists have invested heavily in luxury oceanfront property along beaches they’ve claimed will be underwater one day due to rising sea levels.

https://news.yahoo.com/climate-activist ... 00244.html

[Rhubarb & Custard]

Given the gutting of environmental policy that will happen if a Republican wins in 2025 (and I mean completely destroying the EPA and giving more roids to the fossil fuel industry), I think we've fucked it no matter what.

The West is cutting back on coal and fossil fuel use while Asia and the Indian sub-continent continue to ramp it up.

It’s no longer okay to say: “Well the West had 75 years to build a developed economy, now it’s their turn”

If this shit continues as it is now, we’re all fucked. Sadly you can’t stop the fucking Boomer shareholders and Chinese billionaires who still run the global markets and influence governments.

So. We’re. Fucked. Proper fucked.

China and India are investing heavily in renewable energy. They’re not ramping up fossil fuel use at all. What they are doing is continuing to use that and even opening up some fossil fuel generators to maintain supply but that is a rapidly decreasing proportion of their overall supply.

But their overall generating capacity is well up, so a smaller share can still see the burning of far more fossil fuels. The climate problem comes from maintaining and increasing the fossil fuel burn, end of

Though one should always accept in this a huge part of their burn is to supply products we consume in the west

[GogLais]

Bala supplies the scousers..

My minor claim to fame is that a relative tried to do something about that.