The Rugby Championship - W3 - 29 July : Aus v NZ / SA v Arg

[boere wors]

Who is backup 13 for the RWC?

Faf

Point is, doesn't help to complain about Kriel getting game time at 13, if Am cannot play due to injury, we need our backup with a few games under the belt.

Sure thing, as limited as he is. Somehow i think they could shift DDA to 13 if necessary, he could do a decent job there. At 12 we would have several options.

[assfly]

Point is, doesn't help to complain....

That is literally what we use this site for.

[Sandstorm]

Point is, doesn't help to complain....

That is literally what we use this site for.

[Sards]

DDA and Kriel are strange selections.
I am sure Rassnabber smokes more weed than me

[Sandstorm]

DDA and Kriel are strange selections.

As many have said already: "They're in the squad and both need game time."

Together at 12/13? Hmmm...not my first pick, but they'll almost certainly play together in one of the 7 matches we play in France (hopefully not the final)

[Sards]

DDA and Kriel are strange selections.

As many have said already: "They're in the squad and both need game time."

Together at 12/13? Hmmm...not my first pick, but they'll almost certainly play together in one of the 7 matches we play in France (hopefully not the final)

My bad . It opened on this page I wasn't scrolling back.
They have played more than Esterhuizen and Am

[Gumboot]

All Blacks named for Bledisloe 1:

1. Ethan de Groot (15)
2. Codie Taylor (78)
3. Tyrel Lomax (25)
4. Brodie Retallick (101)
5. Scott Barrett (60)
6. Shannon Frizell (27)
7. Dalton Papali’i (24)
8. Ardie Savea (72 - captain)
9. Aaron Smith (116)
10. Richie Mo’unga (46)
11. Mark Telea (3)
12. Jordie Barrett (50)
13. Rieko Ioane (61)
14. Will Jordan (22)
15. Beauden Barrett (114)

16. Samisoni Taukei’aho (22)
17. Ofa Tu’ungafasi (51)
18. Nepo Laulala (47)
19. Samuel Whitelock (143)
20. Luke Jacobson (12)
21. Cam Roigard *
22. Anton Lienert-Brown (60)
23. Caleb Clarke (17)

Cane out with a neck strain.

Cam Roigard to debut from the bench.

Clarke somehow retained while DMac misses out again. Seriously, WTF?

[Guy Smiley]

Look, I’ll let you guys have the game plan you want but I get to keep Beaudy Goodbloke and Caleb Mightcomegood.

[Gumboot]

Wallabies:

1-Angus Bell, 2-David Porecki, 3-Allan Alaalatoa (captain), 4-Nick Frost, 5-Will Skelton, 6-Jed Holloway, 7-Tom Hooper, 8-Rob Valetini, 9-Tate McDermott, 10-Carter Gordon, 11-Marika Koroibete, 12-Samu Kerev, 13-Jordan Petaiai, 14-Mark Nawaqanitawase, 15-Andrew Kellaway

16-Jordan Uelese, 17-James Slipper , 18-Taniela Tupou, 19-Richie Arnold, 20-Rob Leota, 21-Nic White, 22-Quade Cooper, 23-Izaia Perese

[convoluted]

Is there any point to Foster any more? Schmidt and Ryan seem to be doing ok?

They're clearly running the show behind the scenes now, but probably want to keep Foster around as the figurehead (and as their escape-goat if it goes pear-shaped again).

Although a Razor advocate during last year's coaching kerfuffle, it was difficult to ignore that senior current All Blacks stated firm belief in Foster.
When made AB coach, Foster had sought Joseph and Brown as assistants.
Their non-acceptance saw him go with Plumtree and Mooar who, on paper, were good choices with overall public approval.
But now there's Schmidt and Ryan (and they) have been able to play a key role in revolutionising the All Blacks.

Their influence has been to specifically toughen the forwards and straighten the running lines, but these two can’t be credited as the architects of this new-look All Blacks team.

They have been working toward Foster’s vision, building him the patterns, plays and basic principles that he wants - and maybe the most valuable thing their arrival has done is unleash the full power of the head coach.


Paywall article in full, written after the win over Argentina three weeks ago:

Rugby World Cup 2023: Ian Foster’s All Blacks revolution has finally arrived - Gregor Paul
By Gregor Paul
10 Jul, 2023 03:00 PM
There’s a distinct possibility, now that the All Blacks have had their first encounter of 2023, that they might be on the verge of doing the impossible and turning up in France as a virtually unknown quantity.

The All Blacks, the best-known and most analysed team on the planet, shouldn’t be able to reach a Rugby World Cup with their opponents uncertain about what they could be facing, and yet the scale of the team’s tactical reinvention in Mendoza was so great as to suggest they are going to be playing a brand of rugby that bears little to no resemblance to what they have produced in the last few years.

That the All Blacks have managed to get this close to a World Cup without anyone really knowing who they are is not part of some carefully orchestrated master plan, but rather, quite the happy accident.

Ian Foster came into the head coaching role in late 2019 with the ambition to re-energise and redefine the All Blacks.

He wanted them to be more direct, more physical and more robust. But for multiple reasons, mostly because he wasn’t able to surround himself with the right calibre of coaching personnel, the All Blacks regressed into a softer, more confused version of their previous selves.

Foster’s vision became misunderstood and certainly unfulfilled, and for the last three years, the All Blacks have relied on much the same ideas and patterns they have for the last decade - giving them an element of predictability.

By November last year, the arrival of Jason Ryan as forwards coach and Joe Schmidt as attack coach had at least enabled the All Blacks to present as a tougher team to beat.
They were still largely playing the same way with the same players, but they were executing with more purpose and efficiency.

But now the revolution has seemingly occurred. Having had longer to influence selection and strategy, Ryan and Schmidt have been able to play a key role in revolutionising the All Blacks.

Their influence has been to specifically toughen the forwards and straighten the running lines, but these two can’t be credited as the architects of this new-look All Blacks team.

They have been working toward Foster’s vision, building him the patterns, plays and basic principles that he wants - and maybe the most valuable thing their arrival has done is unleash the full power of the head coach.

Who knows how the team were working in 2020 and 2021, but with two assistant coaches underperforming the way they were, it presumably pulled Foster away from his core role.

The system only works when everyone is pulling their weight, and maybe what we all saw in the first two years of his tenure was Foster-lite - a head coach being stretched too far by having to cover for others.

Obviously Foster never intended for the All Blacks to bumble their way through the first two-and-a-bit seasons of his tenure and incur the reputational damage that they did, but the silver lining of it all is that the team now carries a significant element of surprise.

The likes of France, Ireland, South Africa, Australia and Scotland will need to rethink what they might be facing, as New Zealand’s attack strategy in Mendoza was like a Jonathan Franzen novel, in that it was at times impossible to follow or to predict.

Virtually all the tried and tested patterns were nowhere to be seen. The three-man pod system was conspicuous by its absence. That’s been their go-to starting mechanism for as long as anyone can remember, and while it may not have been given the boot as such, the All Blacks have shown they can attack quite brilliantly without using it.

The pod system, which was revolutionary when it was first introduced, had become more of a liability than an asset for the All Blacks, such was its predictability.

In the opening test of last year, the All Blacks jazzed things up by using Aaron Smith to fire a longer pass to the widest of the three runners in the pod, but it took Ireland one game to suss out how to stop that being effective.

What we saw in Mendoza was the All Blacks forwards producing an array of short passes in and around the contact areas, and close to the ruck in particular. They were supremely good at offloading before or in contact to punch holes.

There was an obvious desire to get the ball in the hands of either Beauden Barrett or Damian McKenzie, rather than work them into plays via the back door pass coming from some lumbering forward, and Aaron Smith was on red alert to attack the blindside.

The bottom line was that Argentina, one of the game’s better defensive teams, were made to look clueless at times, such was the efficiency and variation of the All Blacks attack.

[Gumboot]

So long story short:

Foster's preferred assistants didn't want to work with him.

His next-best choices proved to be inadequate when the team played like shit, so he escapegoated them.

Some of his senior players backed him last year because, well, turkeys don't vote for Christmas.

Foster's next-next-best assistant coach choices are proving capable and the team's now making progress.

Which is really all down to the head coach...

Many thanks to Gregor Paul (and convoluted) for reminding me of why I'll never pay for the Herald.

[OomStruisbaai]

Wallabies:

1-Angus Bell, 2-David Porecki, 3-Allan Alaalatoa (captain), 4-Nick Frost, 5-Will Skelton, 6-Jed Holloway, 7-Tom Hooper, 8-Rob Valetini, 9-Tate McDermott, 10-Carter Gordon, 11-Marika Koroibete, 12-Samu Kerev, 13-Jordan Petaiai, 14-Mark Nawaqanitawase, 15-Andrew Kellaway

16-Jordan Uelese, 17-James Slipper , 18-Taniela Tupou, 19-Richie Arnold, 20-Rob Leota, 21-Nic White, 22-Quade Cooper, 23-Izaia Perese

The Wallabies sound more Kiwi by the day.

[Guy Smiley]

^gumboot



Well, yes.

[OomStruisbaai]

Why would they start Kriel?

Who is backup 13 for the RWC?

Who is backup 6 and 8 for the WC?

[convoluted]

So long story short:

Foster's preferred assistants didn't want to work with him.

His next-best choices proved to be inadequate when the team played like shit, so he escapegoated them.

Some of his senior players backed him last year because, well, turkeys don't vote for Christmas.

Foster's next-next-best assistant coach choices are proving capable and the team's now making progress.

Which is really all down to the head coach...

Many thanks to Gregor Paul (and convoluted) for reminding me of why I'll never pay for the Herald.

For myself, I'm fine with admitting I may have misjudged Foster.
But clearly the ultimate nightmare for some on here would be if Razor-McDonald find Foz circa 2023 to be a hard act to follow.

[average joe]

Why would they start Kriel?

Who is backup 13 for the RWC?

Who is backup 6 and 8 for the WC?

Jou laaitjie en sy maaitjie

[Gumboot]

For myself, I'm fine with admitting I may have misjudged Foster.
But clearly the ultimate nightmare for some on here would be if Razor-McDonald find Foz circa 2023 to be a hard act to follow.

For some, perhaps. I'd be delighted if the ABs manage to do well at the RWC. Progressing to the Semis would exceed my expectations. Won't erase the damage Foster's incompetence has already done to "the brand" though. Similar to Laurie Mains' bumbling first years in charge, before he got lucky with generational talent emerging late in his tenure. And then of course there was Lochore coming on board as the RWC campaign manager. But many said at the time that Mains would be a hard act to follow...

[Gumboot]

Mains had his staunch supporters among the senior players, too. The Brooke brothers carried him off the field on their shoulders after his last test as coach, iirc. And he unexpectedly picked Fitzy as captain, so there's that in his favour. Not sure how much he had to do with getting Lomu fit in '95, but let's give him that as well.

However, I could never imagine Foster attempting to blame his team's failure on the biggest stage on an anonymous waitress that nobody's ever been able to identify. Laurie knows the name of his nemesis, just not who she actually is. Super coach.

[Gumboot]

[handyman]

Why would they start Kriel?

Who is backup 13 for the RWC?

Who is backup 6 and 8 for the WC?

How is that relevant to the Kriel discussion?

[Kiap]

Wallabies:

1-Angus Bell, 2-David Porecki, 3-Allan Alaalatoa (captain), 4-Nick Frost, 5-Will Skelton, 6-Jed Holloway, 7-Tom Hooper, 8-Rob Valetini, 9-Tate McDermott, 10-Carter Gordon, 11-Marika Koroibete, 12-Samu Kerev, 13-Jordan Petaiai, 14-Mark Nawaqanitawase, 15-Andrew Kellaway

16-Jordan Uelese, 17-James Slipper , 18-Taniela Tupou, 19-Richie Arnold, 20-Rob Leota, 21-Nic White, 22-Quade Cooper, 23-Izaia Perese

The Wallabies sound more Kiwi by the day.

Quade Cooper is the most kiwi sounding guy there.

Players you think sound Kiwi more likely have Samoan/Fijian names.

[Guy Smiley]

So long story short:

Foster's preferred assistants didn't want to work with him.

His next-best choices proved to be inadequate when the team played like shit, so he escapegoated them.

Some of his senior players backed him last year because, well, turkeys don't vote for Christmas.

Foster's next-next-best assistant coach choices are proving capable and the team's now making progress.

Which is really all down to the head coach...

Many thanks to Gregor Paul (and convoluted) for reminding me of why I'll never pay for the Herald.

For myself, I'm fine with admitting I may have misjudged Foster.
But clearly the ultimate nightmare for some on here would be if Razor-McDonald find Foz circa 2023 to be a hard act to follow.

It would be great to see the ABs actually perform to their potential under Foster but his record speaks for itself and scraping a win isn’t going to erase that.

It’s a weird sort of flex to be trying to score a point off.

[OomStruisbaai]

Wallabies:

1-Angus Bell, 2-David Porecki, 3-Allan Alaalatoa (captain), 4-Nick Frost, 5-Will Skelton, 6-Jed Holloway, 7-Tom Hooper, 8-Rob Valetini, 9-Tate McDermott, 10-Carter Gordon, 11-Marika Koroibete, 12-Samu Kerev, 13-Jordan Petaiai, 14-Mark Nawaqanitawase, 15-Andrew Kellaway

16-Jordan Uelese, 17-James Slipper , 18-Taniela Tupou, 19-Richie Arnold, 20-Rob Leota, 21-Nic White, 22-Quade Cooper, 23-Izaia Perese

The Wallabies sound more Kiwi by the day.

Quade Cooper is the most kiwi sounding guy there.

Players you think sound Kiwi more likely have Samoan/Fijian names.

Cheers Boet. Glad to have you around.

I am out of touch with the Wallabies. Hope they bring us some joy tomorrow.

[OomStruisbaai]

I always thought Suzie is a woman.

[Gumboot]

I always thought Suzie is a woman.

Yeah, this was the following year, in response to Mains' Suziegate crap. Not a great likeness, but the guy talking is meant to be John Hart.

[Chilli]

I always thought Suzie is a woman.

Wwll when you look at what passes as a woman in NZ......

[OomStruisbaai]

I always thought Suzie is a woman.

Yeah, this was the following year, in response to Mains' Suziegate crap. Not a great likeness, but the guy talking is meant to be John Hart.

It look like Chilli.

[average joe]

Chilli looks like uncle fester with a wig?

[Gumboot]

I always thought Suzie is a woman.

Yeah, this was the following year, in response to Mains' Suziegate crap. Not a great likeness, but the guy talking is meant to be John Hart.

It look like Chilli.

I'm guessing with a name like Chilli he looks more like the chef than the coach?

[LoveOfTheGame]

Yeah, this was the following year, in response to Mains' Suziegate crap. Not a great likeness, but the guy talking is meant to be John Hart.

It look like Chilli.

I'm guessing with a name like Chilli he looks more like the chef than the coach?

By happy circumstance he is actually a chef.

[Chilli]

Yeah, this was the following year, in response to Mains' Suziegate crap. Not a great likeness, but the guy talking is meant to be John Hart.

It look like Chilli.

I'm guessing with a name like Chilli he looks more like the chef than the coach?

Only better looking.

[LoveOfTheGame]

It look like Chilli.

I'm guessing with a name like Chilli he looks more like the chef than the coach?

Only better looking.

Debatable.

[average joe]

A combination of both with a bit more around the middle

[Gumboot]

[LoveOfTheGame]

[Guy Smiley]

[Guy Smiley]

[OomStruisbaai]

Chilli new avatar.

[average joe]

Thats brilliant, now we just need to convince chilli to use it as his avatar.

[Chilli]

Without the mustache