Oh so as long as the English are desperate their much vaunted Spirit of Cricket doesn't apply to them. Just applies to the Australians.Biffer wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 12:49 pm Stokes knew, but they're desperate.
Sums England's series up imo. Dropped catches lost them the series.
JM2K6 wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 12:50 pmGiven there's 5 matches, the "fairest" it can be is 3-2 to one team. 4-1 is the difference of a single result.Thor Sedan wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 11:47 amReally? Winning 4 tosses in a home series is a massive leg up. Like probably the best leg up.
Australia's bad luck: the toss. Some of the conditions (but not all) they've batted/bowled in. Nathan Lyon's injury. Probably some more, but I'm not an Aussie.
England's bad luck: Leach's injury immediately prior to the series. Ali's finger injury during the first Test. Ali's groin injury during this Test. Robinson's injury during the 3rd Test. Pope's shoulder dislocation in the 2nd Test (made worse by the officials fucking up). Stokes' knee playing up. Brooks getting out bowled when set to a freak dismissal. Root twice getting absolute grubbers out of nowhere. Smith being allowed a catch he grassed. Australia changing the ball in a previous Test and immediately getting more movement and wickets to go with it. Nearly two days of rain when battering Australia making the 4th Test a draw instead of setting up a winner-takes-all final Test.
Do I think England have been lucky at times? Yep. But they've also been very unlucky at times. The whinging about English luck requires ignoring quite a lot of very unfortunate events that you'd be unhappy with happening at any time, let alone several of them happening in the course of a single series.
Haven't had a chance to watch much today, though I did get to see Jimmy bowling pies and Stokes knocking the ball out of his own hand. Don't blame him for leaving it up to the umpires to decide if it was a fair catch, but it's obviously a desperation move.
JM2K6 wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 12:50 pmGiven there's 5 matches, the "fairest" it can be is 3-2 to one team. 4-1 is the difference of a single result.Thor Sedan wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 11:47 amReally? Winning 4 tosses in a home series is a massive leg up. Like probably the best leg up.
Australia's bad luck: the toss. Some of the conditions (but not all) they've batted/bowled in. Nathan Lyon's injury. Probably some more, but I'm not an Aussie.
England's bad luck: Leach's injury immediately prior to the series. Ali's finger injury during the first Test. Ali's groin injury during this Test. Robinson's injury during the 3rd Test. Pope's shoulder dislocation in the 2nd Test (made worse by the officials fucking up). Stokes' knee playing up. Brooks getting out bowled when set to a freak dismissal. Root twice getting absolute grubbers out of nowhere. Smith being allowed a catch he grassed. Australia changing the ball in a previous Test and immediately getting more movement and wickets to go with it. Nearly two days of rain when battering Australia making the 4th Test a draw instead of setting up a winner-takes-all final Test.
Do I think England have been lucky at times? Yep. But they've also been very unlucky at times. The whinging about English luck requires ignoring quite a lot of very unfortunate events that you'd be unhappy with happening at any time, let alone several of them happening in the course of a single series.
Haven't had a chance to watch much today, though I did get to see Jimmy bowling pies and Stokes knocking the ball out of his own hand. Don't blame him for leaving it up to the umpires to decide if it was a fair catch, but it's obviously a desperation move.
What's all the morally virtuous stuff about? Root didn't know if it had bounced or not and didn't claim it, making it very clear he didn't know. Stokes knew he'd caught it cleanly and then lost it when going to celebrate, but review anyway incase the umpires would consider the catch completed.Deepsouth wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 2:13 pmJM2K6 wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 12:50 pmGiven there's 5 matches, the "fairest" it can be is 3-2 to one team. 4-1 is the difference of a single result.Thor Sedan wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 11:47 am
Really? Winning 4 tosses in a home series is a massive leg up. Like probably the best leg up.
Australia's bad luck: the toss. Some of the conditions (but not all) they've batted/bowled in. Nathan Lyon's injury. Probably some more, but I'm not an Aussie.
England's bad luck: Leach's injury immediately prior to the series. Ali's finger injury during the first Test. Ali's groin injury during this Test. Robinson's injury during the 3rd Test. Pope's shoulder dislocation in the 2nd Test (made worse by the officials fucking up). Stokes' knee playing up. Brooks getting out bowled when set to a freak dismissal. Root twice getting absolute grubbers out of nowhere. Smith being allowed a catch he grassed. Australia changing the ball in a previous Test and immediately getting more movement and wickets to go with it. Nearly two days of rain when battering Australia making the 4th Test a draw instead of setting up a winner-takes-all final Test.
Do I think England have been lucky at times? Yep. But they've also been very unlucky at times. The whinging about English luck requires ignoring quite a lot of very unfortunate events that you'd be unhappy with happening at any time, let alone several of them happening in the course of a single series.
Haven't had a chance to watch much today, though I did get to see Jimmy bowling pies and Stokes knocking the ball out of his own hand. Don't blame him for leaving it up to the umpires to decide if it was a fair catch, but it's obviously a desperation move.
'Leaving it up to the umpires to decide'. Well just like Root, if Stokes was applying England's morally virtuous position why didn't he inform the umpires? Where is the Spirit of Cricket?
Toilet of a country. You really deserve your tiny little cesspit you are currently stewing in......
It's not a dead rubber - the series result rides on it - and how are multiple in-game injuries not bad luck? And the grubbers? And the historically unseasonable weather?Thor Sedan wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 2:44 pmJM2K6 wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 12:50 pmGiven there's 5 matches, the "fairest" it can be is 3-2 to one team. 4-1 is the difference of a single result.Thor Sedan wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 11:47 am
Really? Winning 4 tosses in a home series is a massive leg up. Like probably the best leg up.
Australia's bad luck: the toss. Some of the conditions (but not all) they've batted/bowled in. Nathan Lyon's injury. Probably some more, but I'm not an Aussie.
England's bad luck: Leach's injury immediately prior to the series. Ali's finger injury during the first Test. Ali's groin injury during this Test. Robinson's injury during the 3rd Test. Pope's shoulder dislocation in the 2nd Test (made worse by the officials fucking up). Stokes' knee playing up. Brooks getting out bowled when set to a freak dismissal. Root twice getting absolute grubbers out of nowhere. Smith being allowed a catch he grassed. Australia changing the ball in a previous Test and immediately getting more movement and wickets to go with it. Nearly two days of rain when battering Australia making the 4th Test a draw instead of setting up a winner-takes-all final Test.
Do I think England have been lucky at times? Yep. But they've also been very unlucky at times. The whinging about English luck requires ignoring quite a lot of very unfortunate events that you'd be unhappy with happening at any time, let alone several of them happening in the course of a single series.
Haven't had a chance to watch much today, though I did get to see Jimmy bowling pies and Stokes knocking the ball out of his own hand. Don't blame him for leaving it up to the umpires to decide if it was a fair catch, but it's obviously a desperation move.
Injuries are injuries.....that doesn't really factor in to my 'leg up' or 'leg downs'??
If you look at the toss and see it as 4-1 as opposed to 3-2 then sure - it doesn't seem so bad. But the fact that the toss was 4-0 until the last dead rubber certainly changes the context of how much England benefited from the toss - in home conditions. Needs to be a ruling that the first game is decided by the toss and then it alternates from that game.....a home side shouldn't have the pick of conditions for the first 4 tests of a 5 match series. Doesn't sit right. Especially in countries like England and India where control of the play can tip odds of winning heavily to one side.
It's a dead rubber - the Ashes have been retained - I don't genuinely think most supporters from either side is going to go full hog celebration mode if this final test is a result. But perhaps you will - and that is fine.JM2K6 wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 2:49 pmIt's not a dead rubber - the series result rides on it - and how are multiple in-game injuries not bad luck? And the grubbers? And the historically unseasonable weather?Thor Sedan wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 2:44 pmJM2K6 wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 12:50 pm
Given there's 5 matches, the "fairest" it can be is 3-2 to one team. 4-1 is the difference of a single result.
Australia's bad luck: the toss. Some of the conditions (but not all) they've batted/bowled in. Nathan Lyon's injury. Probably some more, but I'm not an Aussie.
England's bad luck: Leach's injury immediately prior to the series. Ali's finger injury during the first Test. Ali's groin injury during this Test. Robinson's injury during the 3rd Test. Pope's shoulder dislocation in the 2nd Test (made worse by the officials fucking up). Stokes' knee playing up. Brooks getting out bowled when set to a freak dismissal. Root twice getting absolute grubbers out of nowhere. Smith being allowed a catch he grassed. Australia changing the ball in a previous Test and immediately getting more movement and wickets to go with it. Nearly two days of rain when battering Australia making the 4th Test a draw instead of setting up a winner-takes-all final Test.
Do I think England have been lucky at times? Yep. But they've also been very unlucky at times. The whinging about English luck requires ignoring quite a lot of very unfortunate events that you'd be unhappy with happening at any time, let alone several of them happening in the course of a single series.
Haven't had a chance to watch much today, though I did get to see Jimmy bowling pies and Stokes knocking the ball out of his own hand. Don't blame him for leaving it up to the umpires to decide if it was a fair catch, but it's obviously a desperation move.
Injuries are injuries.....that doesn't really factor in to my 'leg up' or 'leg downs'??
If you look at the toss and see it as 4-1 as opposed to 3-2 then sure - it doesn't seem so bad. But the fact that the toss was 4-0 until the last dead rubber certainly changes the context of how much England benefited from the toss - in home conditions. Needs to be a ruling that the first game is decided by the toss and then it alternates from that game.....a home side shouldn't have the pick of conditions for the first 4 tests of a 5 match series. Doesn't sit right. Especially in countries like England and India where control of the play can tip odds of winning heavily to one side.
As for England benefiting from the conditions, it's massively overblown and requires you to ignore 1) England playing to be batting or bowling when the conditions are in their favour to the extent of throwing away wickets, and 2) the huge, huge impact that the weather's had on the series. And your idea will absolutely guarantee that those countries who are able to doctor pitches - not England - will simply prepare incredibly favourable wickets for the home side with the knowledge that they know exactly who's going to be batting or bowling first weeks and weeks out. It's a very, very silly idea.
Mate, the Aussies haven't won a series over here in decades. It absolutely is not a dead rubber. Winning the series really matters to them, and not losing it will really matter to England. The result of the series is on the line here.Thor Sedan wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 2:58 pmIt's a dead rubber - the Ashes have been retained - I don't genuinely think most supporters from either side is going to go full hog celebration mode if this final test is a result. But perhaps you will - and that is fine.JM2K6 wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 2:49 pmIt's not a dead rubber - the series result rides on it - and how are multiple in-game injuries not bad luck? And the grubbers? And the historically unseasonable weather?Thor Sedan wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 2:44 pm
Injuries are injuries.....that doesn't really factor in to my 'leg up' or 'leg downs'??
If you look at the toss and see it as 4-1 as opposed to 3-2 then sure - it doesn't seem so bad. But the fact that the toss was 4-0 until the last dead rubber certainly changes the context of how much England benefited from the toss - in home conditions. Needs to be a ruling that the first game is decided by the toss and then it alternates from that game.....a home side shouldn't have the pick of conditions for the first 4 tests of a 5 match series. Doesn't sit right. Especially in countries like England and India where control of the play can tip odds of winning heavily to one side.
As for England benefiting from the conditions, it's massively overblown and requires you to ignore 1) England playing to be batting or bowling when the conditions are in their favour to the extent of throwing away wickets, and 2) the huge, huge impact that the weather's had on the series. And your idea will absolutely guarantee that those countries who are able to doctor pitches - not England - will simply prepare incredibly favourable wickets for the home side with the knowledge that they know exactly who's going to be batting or bowling first weeks and weeks out. It's a very, very silly idea.
Regarding the toss issue - yes - perhaps doctored pitches would become a factor - but then that is where the ICC would come in (I'm guessing that would be the body to control it). Countries 'doctoring' pitches need to face investigation and punishments handed out. I'm not saying it is an easy fix - but the home side having first choice of conditions for 4 tests in a row.....nope.....doesn't seem right.
Cool.....best of luck for the final session.JM2K6 wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 3:01 pmMate, the Aussies haven't won a series over here in decades. It absolutely is not a dead rubber. Winning the series really matters to them, and not losing it will really matter to England. The result of the series is on the line here.Thor Sedan wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 2:58 pmIt's a dead rubber - the Ashes have been retained - I don't genuinely think most supporters from either side is going to go full hog celebration mode if this final test is a result. But perhaps you will - and that is fine.JM2K6 wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 2:49 pm
It's not a dead rubber - the series result rides on it - and how are multiple in-game injuries not bad luck? And the grubbers? And the historically unseasonable weather?
As for England benefiting from the conditions, it's massively overblown and requires you to ignore 1) England playing to be batting or bowling when the conditions are in their favour to the extent of throwing away wickets, and 2) the huge, huge impact that the weather's had on the series. And your idea will absolutely guarantee that those countries who are able to doctor pitches - not England - will simply prepare incredibly favourable wickets for the home side with the knowledge that they know exactly who's going to be batting or bowling first weeks and weeks out. It's a very, very silly idea.
Regarding the toss issue - yes - perhaps doctored pitches would become a factor - but then that is where the ICC would come in (I'm guessing that would be the body to control it). Countries 'doctoring' pitches need to face investigation and punishments handed out. I'm not saying it is an easy fix - but the home side having first choice of conditions for 4 tests in a row.....nope.....doesn't seem right.
Your plan still sucks. It doesn't fix anything.
Not sure there's going to be one - and if it does, it's likely to peter out as a draw, which is a real shame. Australia have thrown everything at this and it'll be another huge shame if we're robbed of a finish like we had in the first 3 Tests.Thor Sedan wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 3:02 pmCool.....best of luck for the final session.JM2K6 wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 3:01 pmMate, the Aussies haven't won a series over here in decades. It absolutely is not a dead rubber. Winning the series really matters to them, and not losing it will really matter to England. The result of the series is on the line here.Thor Sedan wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 2:58 pm
It's a dead rubber - the Ashes have been retained - I don't genuinely think most supporters from either side is going to go full hog celebration mode if this final test is a result. But perhaps you will - and that is fine.
Regarding the toss issue - yes - perhaps doctored pitches would become a factor - but then that is where the ICC would come in (I'm guessing that would be the body to control it). Countries 'doctoring' pitches need to face investigation and punishments handed out. I'm not saying it is an easy fix - but the home side having first choice of conditions for 4 tests in a row.....nope.....doesn't seem right.
Your plan still sucks. It doesn't fix anything.
It is a shame - I think my only real issue has been the toss - but that is from a neutral POV. Although I am a struggling neutral as I have a sense of loyalty to the Southern Hemisphere, a sense of loyalty to Baz McCullum, an ingrained aversion to Aussie success, no patience for English media and a hatred for anything that makes piers morgan happy.JM2K6 wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 3:05 pmNot sure there's going to be one - and if it does, it's likely to peter out as a draw, which is a real shame. Australia have thrown everything at this and it'll be another huge shame if we're robbed of a finish like we had in the first 3 Tests.Thor Sedan wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 3:02 pmCool.....best of luck for the final session.JM2K6 wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 3:01 pm
Mate, the Aussies haven't won a series over here in decades. It absolutely is not a dead rubber. Winning the series really matters to them, and not losing it will really matter to England. The result of the series is on the line here.
Your plan still sucks. It doesn't fix anything.
It's worth remembering that while the quality hasn't always been there, the drama and excitement has been top notch in this series. It's been a fantastic and compelling contest. People trying to make out that one side's had all the luck, or that this match doesn't matter, or still crying their eyes out over something that happened weeks and weeks ago are missing the point: it's been a joy to watch and the biggest disappointment has been that we've been robbed of the possibility of it being an all-time classic, because of the ridiculous weather. That's where we should be pointing fingers.
Lol you are the one that seems to be upset and screaming para...Don't like being called on England's hypocrisy and cuntishness do you petal lol. So what will this make it? 3-1 this series, 4-0 to Australia last series in OZ. 2-2 last time in England and 5-0 to Australia the time before that in OZJM2K6 wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 2:45 pmWhat's all the morally virtuous stuff about? Root didn't know if it had bounced or not and didn't claim it, making it very clear he didn't know. Stokes knew he'd caught it cleanly and then lost it when going to celebrate, but review anyway incase the umpires would consider the catch completed.Deepsouth wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 2:13 pmJM2K6 wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 12:50 pm
Given there's 5 matches, the "fairest" it can be is 3-2 to one team. 4-1 is the difference of a single result.
Australia's bad luck: the toss. Some of the conditions (but not all) they've batted/bowled in. Nathan Lyon's injury. Probably some more, but I'm not an Aussie.
England's bad luck: Leach's injury immediately prior to the series. Ali's finger injury during the first Test. Ali's groin injury during this Test. Robinson's injury during the 3rd Test. Pope's shoulder dislocation in the 2nd Test (made worse by the officials fucking up). Stokes' knee playing up. Brooks getting out bowled when set to a freak dismissal. Root twice getting absolute grubbers out of nowhere. Smith being allowed a catch he grassed. Australia changing the ball in a previous Test and immediately getting more movement and wickets to go with it. Nearly two days of rain when battering Australia making the 4th Test a draw instead of setting up a winner-takes-all final Test.
Do I think England have been lucky at times? Yep. But they've also been very unlucky at times. The whinging about English luck requires ignoring quite a lot of very unfortunate events that you'd be unhappy with happening at any time, let alone several of them happening in the course of a single series.
Haven't had a chance to watch much today, though I did get to see Jimmy bowling pies and Stokes knocking the ball out of his own hand. Don't blame him for leaving it up to the umpires to decide if it was a fair catch, but it's obviously a desperation move.
'Leaving it up to the umpires to decide'. Well just like Root, if Stokes was applying England's morally virtuous position why didn't he inform the umpires? Where is the Spirit of Cricket?
Toilet of a country. You really deserve your tiny little cesspit you are currently stewing in......
I don't know why you've been quite so damaged by all of this but it is very weird watching you scream and cry about every single thing that happens while trying to maintain some sort of moral high ground. You cried for days over a catch that wasn't claimed because the catcher was not sure whether he caught it, and now you're crying because a catcher who dropped the ball after catching it essentially threw himself at the umpire's mercy with a review, just in case they thought it was legal. Neither player attempted to deceive anyone.
Do you scream about cheats and breaking the spirit of cricket every time Khawaja reviews one that's stone dead LBW / a catch he's hit behind? Do you throw your toys out of the pram every time a tailender reviews one he knows is stone cold out, just on the off chance fate will intervene? What's that? You don't? Oh, well in that case, shut the fuck up then.
Told ya!JM2K6 wrote: Fri Jul 28, 2023 2:46 pmInsane_Homer wrote: Fri Jul 28, 2023 2:41 pm 2-2 series, all a bit disappointing now. Lots to whinge aboutthey're within 100 runs of us and still have 3 wickets to go. It's day 2. Both sides need to bat again. Our spinner is likely out of the game. What exactly do we owe this confidence to?
Absolutely Nostradamused it.Thor Sedan wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 3:15 pm And - I reckon England are going to win this test.
Collapse will happen with new ball due soonish.
Just to be clear, that's 5 overs both sides would've wanted, it's based on a calculation rather than something the umpires (not English, by the way) make up for a laugh, so the original value was wrong and would've been unfair. Something you'd know if you had any idea about the sport and weren't hell-bent on embarrassing yourself with every post.Deepsouth wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 3:50 pm So now not only have the umpires given the English a dodgy replacement ball, they have now stolen 5 overs from us......
I mean I know England is a deeply corrupt nation but this is fuckin ridiculous
3-1? Sorry Corporal Cowardice, ultimately your boys came nowhere near 3-1. 2-2, and were staring humiliation in the face in the game that was rained off. Australia still haven't won a series in England since 2001. 2001!Deepsouth wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 3:19 pm Lol you are the one that seems to be upset and screaming para...Don't like being called on England's hypocrisy and cuntishness do you petal lol. So what will this make it? 3-1 this series, 4-0 to Australia last series in OZ. 2-2 last time in England and 5-0 to Australia the time before that in OZ
You really are the not very good. And yet we were incessantly told that this Bazball England was the second coming
Getting players in August up again after those 5 Tests? I hope the Irish or Netherlands are lined up.JM2K6 wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 5:47 pm And that's the end of the English Test summer. No more Test cricket for England until next year
Never at all on doubt ffsThor Sedan wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 4:09 pmAbsolutely Nostradamused it.Thor Sedan wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 3:15 pm And - I reckon England are going to win this test.
Collapse will happen with new ball due soonish.
