RWCR1 Scotland vs Springboks

[OomStruisbaai]

South Africa v Scotland
Date: Sunday 10th September 2023

Venue: Stade Vélodrome, Marseille

Kick-off: 4:45pm (5:45pm local)

Referee: Angus Gardner (Australia)

[handyman]

Massive game. I'm nervous for this one after the W against NZ. We need to stay humble.

[Jock42]

Scotland need to play for the full 80 for a change.

[Guy Smiley]

We need to stay humble.

[boere wors]

Humbleness?! Keo has a white wedding:

“My winner and score, which must be revisited on 28 October, is for the Boks to complete the most amazing World Cup double and win successive World Cup finals with 20-point differentials.”

[Chilli]

Humbleness?! Keo has a white wedding:

“My winner and score, which must be revisited on 28 October, is for the Boks to complete the most amazing World Cup double and win successive World Cup finals with 20-point differentials.”

He is a New Zealander.

[OomStruisbaai]

The biggest worry is the talented Saffers in Scotlands team. Schoeman, Huw Jones, Duhan and WeePee. Its like a Koos van der Merwe sick joke for me.

This test will set the tone for both teams Winit and you are in the business end.

[clydecloggie]

Judging by the warmups:

Scotland can play absolutely amazing rugby, but haven't yet shown they can do it for 80 minutes. Best showing was against France in St Etienne, where France scored 14 points in 5 minutes just after half time that ultimately won them the game; and Scotland have periods like this in pretty much every game. In their favour, they do look physically it and have a never-say-die attitude that gets them back into the game time after time.

The Boks have been good, and have expanded their game plan without trading in their physical dominance - but are not scoring heavily. Even in the rout of NZ on Friday, they were utterly dominant from the start but didn't score a point until the 18th minute (against 13 men), including a number of fruitless 22 entries before that point. So perhaps a slight question mark on how ruthless they are in converting dominance into points.

Most likely scenario therefore: SA dominating but not running away with it, Scotland erupting into playing the sexiest rugby known to man at some point and making it an equal contest, before SA eventually turns it into a win by a small margin.

If only the Irish can keep being mediocre like in their own warmups, both SA and Scotland will be grand. Big if, though.

[clydecloggie]

The biggest worry is the talented Saffers in Scotlands team. Schoeman, Huw Jones, Duhan and WeePee. Its like a Koos van der Merwe sick joke for me.

This test will set the tone for both teams Winit and you are in the business end.

Huw Jones is not a Saffer. I'll give you the others, but only if we get Kitshoff back. I mean, look at him - the lad's Scottish.

Actually, our Aussies are arguably more important. Tuipolotou at 12 is a great foil for Russell and puts Huw Jones into space time and again, and Jack Dempsey is the 8 we've been missing.

[OomStruisbaai]

The Springboks showed in the previous WC they can recover from a loss in round 1. BUT that was the All Blacks, don't think we'll recover from a Scotland loss.

[OomStruisbaai]

The biggest worry is the talented Saffers in Scotlands team. Schoeman, Huw Jones, Duhan and WeePee. Its like a Koos van der Merwe sick joke for me.

This test will set the tone for both teams Winit and you are in the business end.

Huw Jones is not a Saffer. I'll give you the others, but only if we get Kitshoff back. I mean, look at him - the lad's Scottish.

Actually, our Aussies are arguably more important. Tuipolotou at 12 is a great foil for Russell and puts Huw Jones into space time and again, and Jack Dempsey is the 8 we've been missing.

Huw Jones has been close as a ball hair width from becoming a Springbok. I am sure he can speak Afrikaans.

[Jock42]

The biggest worry is the talented Saffers in Scotlands team. Schoeman, Huw Jones, Duhan and WeePee. Its like a Koos van der Merwe sick joke for me.

This test will set the tone for both teams Winit and you are in the business end.

Google maps doesn't show any record of a Leith in South Africa.

[clydecloggie]

The biggest worry is the talented Saffers in Scotlands team. Schoeman, Huw Jones, Duhan and WeePee. Its like a Koos van der Merwe sick joke for me.

This test will set the tone for both teams Winit and you are in the business end.

Huw Jones is not a Saffer. I'll give you the others, but only if we get Kitshoff back. I mean, look at him - the lad's Scottish.

Actually, our Aussies are arguably more important. Tuipolotou at 12 is a great foil for Russell and puts Huw Jones into space time and again, and Jack Dempsey is the 8 we've been missing.

Huw Jones has been close as a ball hair width from becoming a Springbok. I am sure he can speak Afrikaans.

He would have been a great poach for you guys. But still a poach.

[Slick]

The biggest worry is the talented Saffers in Scotlands team. Schoeman, Huw Jones, Duhan and WeePee. Its like a Koos van der Merwe sick joke for me.

This test will set the tone for both teams Winit and you are in the business end.

yeah, if this thread has any chance of continuing stop with the Huw Jones shit RIGHT NOW.

I seem to be in a bit of a minority that wasn't actually all that impressed with SA on Friday night. I still think you will end up squeezing the life out of us but I'm not any more, or less, excited because of that game. "Scotland erupting into playing the sexiest rugby known to man at some point" will make us winners to any but the most hardened Boer anyway.

[Torquemada 1420]

This group is a joke. At least Fra and NZ have the luxury of knowing all they need to do is beat Italy to make the 1/4s. Frankly, I don't think either care which of the higher probability of SA or Ire they face; it's a poison chalice for all 4 teams.

However, SA and Ire have no such luxury. One bad day at the office (a dim red card maybe) and Sco perfectly capable of edging one out. Ergo it's 100% for 2 of 4 pool games and the risk of injuries etc

[LoveOfTheGame]

The biggest worry is the talented Saffers in Scotlands team. Schoeman, Huw Jones, Duhan and WeePee. Its like a Koos van der Merwe sick joke for me.

This test will set the tone for both teams Winit and you are in the business end.

yeah, if this thread has any chance of continuing stop with the Huw Jones shit RIGHT NOW.

I seem to be in a bit of a minority that wasn't actually all that impressed with SA on Friday night. I still think you will end up squeezing the life out of us but I'm not any more, or less, excited because of that game. "Scotland erupting into playing the sexiest rugby known to man at some point" will make us winners to any but the most hardened Boer anyway.

To be fair, if the Boks did not impress you on Friday night, then I'd be pretty stoked to see what they will play like when they in fact do. Hopefully they can raise their game and improve on Friday night, as with any team there is always room for improvement. Looking forward to the Scotland game, they've grown leaps and bounds over the last couple of years, very good team, well coached.

[Jock42]

The biggest worry is the talented Saffers in Scotlands team. Schoeman, Huw Jones, Duhan and WeePee. Its like a Koos van der Merwe sick joke for me.

This test will set the tone for both teams Winit and you are in the business end.

yeah, if this thread has any chance of continuing stop with the Huw Jones shit RIGHT NOW.

I seem to be in a bit of a minority that wasn't actually all that impressed with SA on Friday night. I still think you will end up squeezing the life out of us but I'm not any more, or less, excited because of that game. "Scotland erupting into playing the sexiest rugby known to man at some point" will make us winners to any but the most hardened Boer anyway.

I'm with you there. Wasn't impressed against Wales either, they've played against 2 teams that were rank. Ireland weren't great either but they've got 3 more games to get their act together.

[LoveOfTheGame]

The biggest worry is the talented Saffers in Scotlands team. Schoeman, Huw Jones, Duhan and WeePee. Its like a Koos van der Merwe sick joke for me.

This test will set the tone for both teams Winit and you are in the business end.

yeah, if this thread has any chance of continuing stop with the Huw Jones shit RIGHT NOW.

I seem to be in a bit of a minority that wasn't actually all that impressed with SA on Friday night. I still think you will end up squeezing the life out of us but I'm not any more, or less, excited because of that game. "Scotland erupting into playing the sexiest rugby known to man at some point" will make us winners to any but the most hardened Boer anyway.

I'm with you there. Wasn't impressed against Wales either, they've played against 2 teams that were rank. Ireland weren't great either but they've got 4 more games to get their act together.

Right, so based on the warmups, Scotland are then in fact the team to beat. We're all in agreement.

[Slick]

The biggest worry is the talented Saffers in Scotlands team. Schoeman, Huw Jones, Duhan and WeePee. Its like a Koos van der Merwe sick joke for me.

This test will set the tone for both teams Winit and you are in the business end.

yeah, if this thread has any chance of continuing stop with the Huw Jones shit RIGHT NOW.

I seem to be in a bit of a minority that wasn't actually all that impressed with SA on Friday night. I still think you will end up squeezing the life out of us but I'm not any more, or less, excited because of that game. "Scotland erupting into playing the sexiest rugby known to man at some point" will make us winners to any but the most hardened Boer anyway.

To be fair, if the Boks did not impress you on Friday night, then I'd be pretty stoked to see what they will play like when they in fact do. Hopefully they can raise their game and improve on Friday night, as with any team there is always room for improvement. Looking forward to the Scotland game, they've grown leaps and bounds over the last couple of years, very good team, well coached.

Well, it was genuinely the worst performance I've ever seen from an NZ team - never seen them mess up so many basics, and SA spent over half the game playing against 14. I'm not belittling the Boks, just don't think they have really clicked yet or been tested.

[Slick]

yeah, if this thread has any chance of continuing stop with the Huw Jones shit RIGHT NOW.

I seem to be in a bit of a minority that wasn't actually all that impressed with SA on Friday night. I still think you will end up squeezing the life out of us but I'm not any more, or less, excited because of that game. "Scotland erupting into playing the sexiest rugby known to man at some point" will make us winners to any but the most hardened Boer anyway.

I'm with you there. Wasn't impressed against Wales either, they've played against 2 teams that were rank. Ireland weren't great either but they've got 4 more games to get their act together.

Right, so based on the warmups, Scotland are then in fact the team to beat. We're all in agreement.

This thread is going to get very boring if you don't actually read what is being written.

[LoveOfTheGame]

yeah, if this thread has any chance of continuing stop with the Huw Jones shit RIGHT NOW.

I seem to be in a bit of a minority that wasn't actually all that impressed with SA on Friday night. I still think you will end up squeezing the life out of us but I'm not any more, or less, excited because of that game. "Scotland erupting into playing the sexiest rugby known to man at some point" will make us winners to any but the most hardened Boer anyway.

To be fair, if the Boks did not impress you on Friday night, then I'd be pretty stoked to see what they will play like when they in fact do. Hopefully they can raise their game and improve on Friday night, as with any team there is always room for improvement. Looking forward to the Scotland game, they've grown leaps and bounds over the last couple of years, very good team, well coached.

Well, it was genuinely the worst performance I've ever seen from an NZ team - never seen them mess up so many basics, and SA spent over half the game playing against 14. I'm not belittling the Boks, just don't think they have really clicked yet or been tested.

No need to further explain, completely understand that the Boks weren't at their best. As I said, always room for improvement. That game is behind us anyway and means nothing, Scotland is the focus now. Based on the good performances from Scotland in the warm ups, the Boks will need to be very clinical, physical and keep the Scots under as much pressure as possible during set pieces.

[LoveOfTheGame]

I'm with you there. Wasn't impressed against Wales either, they've played against 2 teams that were rank. Ireland weren't great either but they've got 4 more games to get their act together.

Right, so based on the warmups, Scotland are then in fact the team to beat. We're all in agreement.

This thread is going to get very boring if you don't actually read what is being written.

What's wrong with you? If neither SA or Ire impressed with their warmup matches, then surely Scotland are favourites based on their recent form?

[Slick]

To be fair, if the Boks did not impress you on Friday night, then I'd be pretty stoked to see what they will play like when they in fact do. Hopefully they can raise their game and improve on Friday night, as with any team there is always room for improvement. Looking forward to the Scotland game, they've grown leaps and bounds over the last couple of years, very good team, well coached.

Well, it was genuinely the worst performance I've ever seen from an NZ team - never seen them mess up so many basics, and SA spent over half the game playing against 14. I'm not belittling the Boks, just don't think they have really clicked yet or been tested.

No need to further explain, completely understand that the Boks weren't at their best. As I said, always room for improvement. That game is behind us anyway and means nothing, Scotland is the focus now. Based on the good performances from Scotland in the warm ups, the Boks will need to be very clinical, physical and keep the Scots under as much pressure as possible during set pieces.

That's the interesting bit for me. I think you'd struggle to find a Scotsman who truly believes we will win this game, but what gives us a bit of hope is that for the last 3 or 4 years we've felt we could beat anyone on our day except SA and Ireland, because we just can't handle the power. What has changed over the last year is that we have a scrummage that can at the very least hold it's own against anyone, and I think will really challenge Ireland, and seem to have developed a lot more physicality. I just don't think we can keep it going over the whole 80 - although the Bomb Squad has become a bit of a cliché, it's still terrifying when you see them all waddle on.

[Slick]

Right, so based on the warmups, Scotland are then in fact the team to beat. We're all in agreement.

This thread is going to get very boring if you don't actually read what is being written.

What's wrong with you? If neither SA or Ire impressed with their warmup matches, then surely Scotland are favourites based on their recent form?

No. (See above)

[clydecloggie]

Right, so based on the warmups, Scotland are then in fact the team to beat. We're all in agreement.

This thread is going to get very boring if you don't actually read what is being written.

What's wrong with you? If neither SA or Ire impressed with their warmup matches, then surely Scotland are favourites based on their recent form?

SA and Ireland are better teams than Scotland. Not by a gaping chasm, but they are better.
Ireland haven't impressed in their warmups, barely beating a Tier 2 team and jogging to a win over the rankest England side in known history.
SA have impressed but there are still questions. Libbok at 10 is unproven, and I didn't think they were very clinical in putting away 14/13-man NZ who got (rightly) penalised off the park.
Scotland have alternated between 'old Scotland' and god's gift to rugby in their warmups and there is a big question mark over their consistency across the 80 minutes. But if they click, it's beautiful to watch and they will score points fast.

So, SA and Ireland favourites for their respective games against Scotland but it wouldn't be a massive surprise if Scotland took a scalp.

[OomStruisbaai]

This group is a joke. At least Fra and NZ have the luxury of knowing all they need to do is beat Italy to make the 1/4s. Frankly, I don't think either care which of the higher probability of SA or Ire they face; it's a poison chalice for all 4 teams.

However, SA and Ire have no such luxury. One bad day at the office (a dim red card maybe) and Sco perfectly capable of edging one out. Ergo it's 100% for 2 of 4 pool games and the risk of injuries etc

Very true. The difference this year is that we all play in the URC. So everybody know whats coming.

[_Os_]

Well, it was genuinely the worst performance I've ever seen from an NZ team - never seen them mess up so many basics, and SA spent over half the game playing against 14.

The Boks made them do that. Just like Nelspruit last year was also the worst ever All Black performance. Funny how they've suddenly started having their worst ever performances against the Boks.

I seem to be in a bit of a minority that wasn't actually all that impressed with SA on Friday night. I still think you will end up squeezing the life out of us but I'm not any more, or less, excited because of that game. "Scotland erupting into playing the sexiest rugby known to man at some point" will make us winners to any but the most hardened Boer anyway.

If Scotland's plan is running the ball, and I think it is, then the Boks have all the tools to stop that. You can then say it was the worst ever Scotland performance.

[Yr Alban]

Scotland are coming into this RWC arguably the strongest we have ever been (there might be an argument for 1991), and certainly the best prepared. And thanks to the ridiculous draw we will still be eliminated in the group stage.

As has been said, SA and Ireland are better teams. The gap is a lot smaller than it was, but it’s still there, and we still can’t keep the intensity up for the full 80. There’s invariably a 10-20 minute period when we slack off, and a good team will win the game in that time. This was beautifully demonstrated against Ireland in the 6N, where we matched them for 55 minutes, and then went to sleep for 5 minutes and lost the game.

I hate to say it, but our best chance is one of the random red cards we’ve become accustomed to.

[assfly]

Nothing but respect for Scotland and how they've improved in recent years. They are quite capable of winning this game. I hope the Boks have prepared adequately.

[Biffer]

The Scotland v South Africa game will depend a lot on the ref. Not for decisions around the breakdown (although that might come in to it) but for how much he allows the South Africans to slow down the pace of play and waddle around the pitch delaying everything. Scotland clearly have a game plan to increase the pace and not give them time to catch their breath, keep[ the ball in play as much as possible and move lineouts and restarts on quickly. South Africa consistently want a slower paced game, not the pace of in-play rugby, but the delays and waits between set pieces, restarts etc. If the ref allows SA to slow the game, they will win comfortably. If he allows Scotland to dictate more of the pace, it'll get interesting.

[C69]

I can't see Scotland progressing to the next stage.
The are just not good enough
SA should have a tough 60 mins then blow them away.
Tough group.

[assfly]

The Scotland v South Africa game will depend a lot on the ref. Not for decisions around the breakdown (although that might come in to it) but for how much he allows the South Africans to slow down the pace of play and waddle around the pitch delaying everything. Scotland clearly have a game plan to increase the pace and not give them time to catch their breath, keep[ the ball in play as much as possible and move lineouts and restarts on quickly. South Africa consistently want a slower paced game, not the pace of in-play rugby, but the delays and waits between set pieces, restarts etc. If the ref allows SA to slow the game, they will win comfortably. If he allows Scotland to dictate more of the pace, it'll get interesting.

[Jock42]

yeah, if this thread has any chance of continuing stop with the Huw Jones shit RIGHT NOW.

I seem to be in a bit of a minority that wasn't actually all that impressed with SA on Friday night. I still think you will end up squeezing the life out of us but I'm not any more, or less, excited because of that game. "Scotland erupting into playing the sexiest rugby known to man at some point" will make us winners to any but the most hardened Boer anyway.

I'm with you there. Wasn't impressed against Wales either, they've played against 2 teams that were rank. Ireland weren't great either but they've got 4 more games to get their act together.

Right, so based on the warmups, Scotland are then in fact the team to beat. We're all in agreement.

It's going to be a long 2 weeks if you're going to be this boring.

[OomStruisbaai]

The Springbok packs are something of a beaut.

[LoveOfTheGame]

Well, it was genuinely the worst performance I've ever seen from an NZ team - never seen them mess up so many basics, and SA spent over half the game playing against 14. I'm not belittling the Boks, just don't think they have really clicked yet or been tested.

No need to further explain, completely understand that the Boks weren't at their best. As I said, always room for improvement. That game is behind us anyway and means nothing, Scotland is the focus now. Based on the good performances from Scotland in the warm ups, the Boks will need to be very clinical, physical and keep the Scots under as much pressure as possible during set pieces.

That's the interesting bit for me. I think you'd struggle to find a Scotsman who truly believes we will win this game, but what gives us a bit of hope is that for the last 3 or 4 years we've felt we could beat anyone on our day except SA and Ireland, because we just can't handle the power. What has changed over the last year is that we have a scrummage that can at the very least hold it's own against anyone, and I think will really challenge Ireland, and seem to have developed a lot more physicality. I just don't think we can keep it going over the whole 80 - although the Bomb Squad has become a bit of a cliché, it's still terrifying when you see them all waddle on.

There is a very good balance in the Scotland team. When I was watching them play France, I was impressed with how much the loss of Zander brought the team together. They actually performed better with 14 men. They obviously have a great shape on attack, Russell is as unpredictable as he is mercurial. They have the ability to match the best in the world physically, have a strong scrum and set piece. Isn't a great to see Scotland so strong? It hasn't just happened over night either, they have been building over many seasons now and credit must go to Townsend and his management team.

It's going to be a great occasion and I'm really looking forward to it. As a Bok supporter I obviously hope the Springboks improve and continue their rise in form. As I said to you above, the do have a lot of work still to do. But based on what I have seen thus far, they will be a very formidable team come the RWC and they are being well managed by the coaches.

[Slick]

Well, it was genuinely the worst performance I've ever seen from an NZ team - never seen them mess up so many basics, and SA spent over half the game playing against 14.

The Boks made them do that. Just like Nelspruit last year was also the worst ever All Black performance. Funny how they've suddenly started having their worst ever performances against the Boks.

I seem to be in a bit of a minority that wasn't actually all that impressed with SA on Friday night. I still think you will end up squeezing the life out of us but I'm not any more, or less, excited because of that game. "Scotland erupting into playing the sexiest rugby known to man at some point" will make us winners to any but the most hardened Boer anyway.

If Scotland's plan is running the ball, and I think it is, then the Boks have all the tools to stop that. You can then say it was the worst ever Scotland performance.

A bit touchy there old boy. Didn't NZ hump you a few weeks ago? Kind of suggests they don't always have bad performances against you.

If you think losing to SA in a couple of weeks will make it into the "worst ever Scotland performance" category, you've obviously never had the pleasure of supporting Scotland.

[Slick]

The Scotland v South Africa game will depend a lot on the ref. Not for decisions around the breakdown (although that might come in to it) but for how much he allows the South Africans to slow down the pace of play and waddle around the pitch delaying everything. Scotland clearly have a game plan to increase the pace and not give them time to catch their breath, keep[ the ball in play as much as possible and move lineouts and restarts on quickly. South Africa consistently want a slower paced game, not the pace of in-play rugby, but the delays and waits between set pieces, restarts etc. If the ref allows SA to slow the game, they will win comfortably. If he allows Scotland to dictate more of the pace, it'll get interesting.

It's a fair comment. The hour long half on Friday wasn't a coincidence.

[Slick]

No need to further explain, completely understand that the Boks weren't at their best. As I said, always room for improvement. That game is behind us anyway and means nothing, Scotland is the focus now. Based on the good performances from Scotland in the warm ups, the Boks will need to be very clinical, physical and keep the Scots under as much pressure as possible during set pieces.

That's the interesting bit for me. I think you'd struggle to find a Scotsman who truly believes we will win this game, but what gives us a bit of hope is that for the last 3 or 4 years we've felt we could beat anyone on our day except SA and Ireland, because we just can't handle the power. What has changed over the last year is that we have a scrummage that can at the very least hold it's own against anyone, and I think will really challenge Ireland, and seem to have developed a lot more physicality. I just don't think we can keep it going over the whole 80 - although the Bomb Squad has become a bit of a cliché, it's still terrifying when you see them all waddle on.

There is a very good balance in the Scotland team. When I was watching them play France, I was impressed with how much the loss of Zander brought the team together. They actually performed better with 14 men. They obviously have a great shape on attack, Russell is as unpredictable as he is mercurial. They have the ability to match the best in the world physically, have a strong scrum and set piece. Isn't a great to see Scotland so strong? It hasn't just happened over night either, they have been building over many seasons now and credit must go to Townsend and his management team.

It's going to be a great occasion and I'm really looking forward to it. As a Bok supporter I obviously hope the Springboks improve and continue their rise in form. As I said to you above, the do have a lot of work still to do. But based on what I have seen thus far, they will be a very formidable team come the RWC and they are being well managed by the coaches.

It's the most enjoyable period of supporting Scotland I've had in my 40+ years of doing so. Some of the younger supporters think this is the way it has always been and we should be winning every 6N and WC, the older amongst us know just to enjoy this spell and not get anywhere near ahead of ourselves.

[average joe]

Funny how a losing team is all of a sudden written off as shithouse and therefore the winning team must be slightly less shithouse. Nothing gets said about the pressure the winning team put them under to make them lose.

Anyhows, the Bok's have not lost against Scotland for thirteen years. I'll eat my vellies if we lose to shithouse Scotland on the 10th.

[LoveOfTheGame]

The Scotland v South Africa game will depend a lot on the ref. Not for decisions around the breakdown (although that might come in to it) but for how much he allows the South Africans to slow down the pace of play and waddle around the pitch delaying everything. Scotland clearly have a game plan to increase the pace and not give them time to catch their breath, keep[ the ball in play as much as possible and move lineouts and restarts on quickly. South Africa consistently want a slower paced game, not the pace of in-play rugby, but the delays and waits between set pieces, restarts etc. If the ref allows SA to slow the game, they will win comfortably. If he allows Scotland to dictate more of the pace, it'll get interesting.