The Official Scottish Rugby Thread

[westport]

In the SS, Heriots are destroying Watsonians up 31-0 at half time.

64-0 at full time.

[KingBlairhorn]

Bloody hell, Heriot’s beat Watsonians 64-0 tonight. Maybe the u20s side aren’t that bad after all!
Edit: didn’t see your post Westport

[mos_eisely_]

[dpedin]

My son's (now 30 years old) first game for his school firsts team was when he was in S4. The regular SH was injured and the back up was serving detention so he got the call. It was against Kelvinside Academy away. I couldn't make the game. They did ok, cant remember the result, but asked my son how he did and he said ok but this huge fair haired guy kept killing him at the base of the rucks - it was Ritchie Gray! My son was about 5'6" at the time and Ritchie must have been a foot taller even then! He doesn't hold any grudges.

[I like neeps]

Actually quite hard to watch this. Townsend should play it to the team the week of the Ireland game so the lads lose all respect and fear of the Irish.

[Slick]

I just posted the below on the English thread who were discussing it, did anyone else watch any junior rugby this weekend and notice it? It's regarding the new lower tackle height - we have introduced it, haven't we....

Must admit, I was unaware that it had been introduced across the whole of the "community game" in Scotland. I went to a Premiership game on Saturday and about 20 minutes in I started noticing that there were no higher hits and was a bit confused why everyone was tackling like we did for decades before. When I finally clicked what was happening it was interesting that there was only 1 high tackle called by the ref in the entire game.

It was a 31-31 draw with lots of very good offloading by one one team - I don't know if this was because of the new laws or not, but it was noticeable. 100% didn't spoil the game at all.

[KingBlairhorn]

The lack of chat on this thread is directly correlated to our general attitude to this World Cup, yeah?

I presume we all think the chance of progression is more or less nil and none of us are particularly hyped? I saw the Saffa team announcement the other day and my overriding reaction was of resignation that we definitely won't beat them rather than any kind of hope. I don't think I have ever been this deflated before a tournament even starts.

[Slick]

The lack of chat on this thread is directly correlated to our general attitude to this World Cup, yeah?

I presume we all think the chance of progression is more or less nil and none of us are particularly hyped? I saw the Saffa team announcement the other day and my overriding reaction was of resignation that we definitely won't beat them rather than any kind of hope. I don't think I have ever been this deflated before a tournament even starts.

Strangely, I'm almost exactly the opposite. I have never really got excited about WC's but really looking forward to this one.

Do I fully expect us to go through - No. Do I think we can - yes.

It's just quite nice to be in all the conversations with the big guns.

We obviously have to be realistic and say we probably won't make it out the group but I will be happy if we play to our potential and miss out. I will be devastated if we are shite and get pumped.

I seem to be in a very small minority but I still don't think that SA team is unbeatable or as good as they have been. Unfortunately all history points to the fact they will smother us anyway, but who knows.

[Jock42]

The lack of chat on this thread is directly correlated to our general attitude to this World Cup, yeah?

I presume we all think the chance of progression is more or less nil and none of us are particularly hyped? I saw the Saffa team announcement the other day and my overriding reaction was of resignation that we definitely won't beat them rather than any kind of hope. I don't think I have ever been this deflated before a tournament even starts.

No. I'm hyped about it and think they'll get out of the group. I'm strangely confident about Sunday too.

[TheNatalShark]

SA appear on a steep upward curve, but they've still lost to Ireland and France in the last year, without significantly weaker teams.

And a handful of results this year have been against poor Aus and relatively poor NZ team, in so far that I would say the best 2023 barometer has been the Argies, which they didn't exactly steamroll - but didn't have cohesion seem to have with Kolisi.

I don't see a gap beyond those in prior years. Just a lot of confidence in how they are playing, especially recent NZ. All down to how well the forwards cope for me, little to fear in the backline beyond Kolbe. Scotland by 5

[Slick]

The SRU sent a message to debenture holders this morning that they have a bunch of tickets for the SA game if anyone is out there and needs one or thinking of going.

[Biffer]

Glasgow and Edinburgh kits for the new season have been released.

Edinburgh one seems to be tnding back towards black for reasons I don't understand

[clydecloggie]

The lack of chat on this thread is directly correlated to our general attitude to this World Cup, yeah?

I presume we all think the chance of progression is more or less nil and none of us are particularly hyped? I saw the Saffa team announcement the other day and my overriding reaction was of resignation that we definitely won't beat them rather than any kind of hope. I don't think I have ever been this deflated before a tournament even starts.

I can't wait for it to start, but I have no hope. SA and Ireland are still our kryptonite, despite the real quality in our team just now.

[I like neeps]

SA appear on a steep upward curve, but they've still lost to Ireland and France in the last year, without significantly weaker teams.

And a handful of results this year have been against poor Aus and relatively poor NZ team, in so far that I would say the best 2023 barometer has been the Argies, which they didn't exactly steamroll - but didn't have cohesion seem to have with Kolisi.

I don't see a gap beyond those in prior years. Just a lot of confidence in how they are playing, especially recent NZ. All down to how well the forwards cope for me, little to fear in the backline beyond Kolbe. Scotland by 5

Ireland and France and even a "relatively poor" NZ team are still all excellent.

[I like neeps]

The lack of chat on this thread is directly correlated to our general attitude to this World Cup, yeah?

I presume we all think the chance of progression is more or less nil and none of us are particularly hyped? I saw the Saffa team announcement the other day and my overriding reaction was of resignation that we definitely won't beat them rather than any kind of hope. I don't think I have ever been this deflated before a tournament even starts.

I'd be really excited if we didn't have Ireland and SA.

[Biffer]

The lack of chat on this thread is directly correlated to our general attitude to this World Cup, yeah?

I presume we all think the chance of progression is more or less nil and none of us are particularly hyped? I saw the Saffa team announcement the other day and my overriding reaction was of resignation that we definitely won't beat them rather than any kind of hope. I don't think I have ever been this deflated before a tournament even starts.

I'd be really excited if we didn't have Ireland and SA.

Yeah, any other two teams and I'd think we had a decent shot of getting out of the group, even France and New Zealand.

[TheNatalShark]

Ireland and France and even a "relatively poor" NZ team are still all excellent.

Of course, the point from my perspective I guess is I don't think many were hopeless against them, or others as confident they would win

[TartanBear]

I’m excited about watching some (hopefully) great rugby. Can Scotland get out the group? Yes, it’s possible, but highly unlikely. In my view they would need to play at their absolute best for either game for the full 80. Even then, if Ire or SA are playing at or about their usual levels, it won’t be enough. What’s needed is either some additional and ludicrous “luck”, which may include opposition cards in a key area, or, in the case of SA, a series of injuries to their backs (which I am of course, not expecting or wishing for).

Having said that, even when Ireland were hobbled by injuries during the recent 6N game, they were able to beat Scotland. Some of that may have been down to relative mindsets (winner/champion mentality versus Scottish mentality), so hopefully that’s been addressed.

[I like neeps]

I’m excited about watching some (hopefully) great rugby. Can Scotland get out the group? Yes, it’s possible, but highly unlikely. In my view they would need to play at their absolute best for either game for the full 80. Even then, if Ire or SA are playing at or about their usual levels, it won’t be enough. What’s needed is either some additional and ludicrous “luck”, which may include opposition cards in a key area, or, in the case of SA, a series of injuries to their backs (which I am of course, not expecting or wishing for).

Having said that, even when Ireland were hobbled by injuries during the recent 6N game, they were able to beat Scotland. Some of that may have been down to relative mindsets (winner/champion mentality versus Scottish mentality), so hopefully that’s been addressed.

Mentally Ireland struggle with the pressure of l world cups. They were absolutely crap in Japan. Still annoyed at our performance Vs a bad Ireland team out there.

[TartanBear]

I’m excited about watching some (hopefully) great rugby. Can Scotland get out the group? Yes, it’s possible, but highly unlikely. In my view they would need to play at their absolute best for either game for the full 80. Even then, if Ire or SA are playing at or about their usual levels, it won’t be enough. What’s needed is either some additional and ludicrous “luck”, which may include opposition cards in a key area, or, in the case of SA, a series of injuries to their backs (which I am of course, not expecting or wishing for).

Having said that, even when Ireland were hobbled by injuries during the recent 6N game, they were able to beat Scotland. Some of that may have been down to relative mindsets (winner/champion mentality versus Scottish mentality), so hopefully that’s been addressed.

Mentally Ireland struggle with the pressure of l world cups. They were absolutely crap in Japan. Still annoyed at our performance Vs a bad Ireland team out there.

Isn’t this just the type of evidence that argues against any building optimism? Even a jittery and (by their standards) a misfiring Ireland, Scotland were comfortably dispatched (if not humiliated). Granted, this is a totally different Scotland team in a number of areas and there’s some recent evidence that mindset is changing, but have they come along enough?

[Big D]

Optimistic of good performances but not good results.

2019 was a dumpster fire this one must go better in terms of performance.

[clydecloggie]

Kyle Steyn on the early announcement "it's game week" poster, Kyle Steyn on the official SRU podcast this week - will it be Kyle Steyn over Darcy Graham on Sunday? Or did they just use the Saffer with more free time?

[Jock42]

Kyle Steyn on the early announcement "it's game week" poster, Kyle Steyn on the official SRU podcast this week - will it be Kyle Steyn over Darcy Graham on Sunday? Or did they just use the Saffer with more free time?

I wouldn't be surprised if Toony goes conservarive and puts Steyn and Harris in to kill my vibes. If Graham is fit, and I read he is, he should start.

[KingBlairhorn]

All interesting perspectives and glad to see you aren't all as dour as me!

The narrative arc we all want to see is progression from the group followed by a first ever win over NZ to make the semis, I just cannot in any way force myself to believe that is possible.

At least we should go into the Saffa game on a wave of national optimism after the football boys more or less finish the qualification job for the Euro on Friday night.

[Jock42]

All interesting perspectives and glad to see you aren't all as dour as me!

The narrative arc we all want to see is progression from the group followed by a first ever win over NZ to make the semis, I just cannot in any way force myself to believe that is possible.

At least we should go into the Saffa game on a wave of national optimism after the football boys more or less finish the qualification job for the Euro on Friday night.

As much as I want to see them go all the way I'll be content with a QF and a good performance, no dodgy reffing though.

[Tichtheid]

I’m in agreement with the “any other two teams but them” sentiment about our group. I could weep when I see the other half of the draw, a semi final would definitely be achievable there.
I’ll be supporting Big Bill and Boff, big time, I’d love to see Fiji and Argentina go deep into the tournament.

The reality is that our big two opponents are very strong in exactly the areas that can hurt us, I just hope we pick the side to play our game our and if we don’t manage it then at least we’ll know we gave it all we could.

[Simian]

The lack of chat on this thread is directly correlated to our general attitude to this World Cup, yeah?

I presume we all think the chance of progression is more or less nil and none of us are particularly hyped? I saw the Saffa team announcement the other day and my overriding reaction was of resignation that we definitely won't beat them rather than any kind of hope. I don't think I have ever been this deflated before a tournament even starts.

I can't wait for it to start, but I have no hope. SA and Ireland are still our kryptonite, despite the real quality in our team just now.

Pretty much my view too. I’m really looking forward to the tournament but not particularly optimistic about progressing from the group. I’ll settle for giving it a good crack, tbh.

[TartanBear]

I’m in agreement with the “any other two teams but them” sentiment about our group. I could weep when I see the other half of the draw, a semi final would definitely be achievable there.
I’ll be supporting Big Bill and Boff, big time, I’d love to see Fiji and Argentina go deep into the tournament.

The reality is that our big two opponents are very strong in exactly the areas that can hurt us, I just hope we pick the side to play our game our and if we don’t manage it then at least we’ll know we gave it all we could.

I don’t think they’ll do it, but if Scotland was selecting its largest possible pack, one scenario could be the usual front 5 and a BR of Dempsey, Ritchie and Cummings (JR at openside). Bench with second string front row, Skinner, Crosbie and Darge or Fagerson. Obviously bonkers, but I think that would be the most grunt you could get into a 23.

[Jock42]

[KingBlairhorn]

I’m in agreement with the “any other two teams but them” sentiment about our group. I could weep when I see the other half of the draw, a semi final would definitely be achievable there.
I’ll be supporting Big Bill and Boff, big time, I’d love to see Fiji and Argentina go deep into the tournament.

The reality is that our big two opponents are very strong in exactly the areas that can hurt us, I just hope we pick the side to play our game our and if we don’t manage it then at least we’ll know we gave it all we could.

I don’t think they’ll do it, but if Scotland was selecting its largest possible pack, one scenario could be the usual front 5 and a BR of Dempsey, Ritchie and Cummings (JR at openside). Bench with second string front row, Skinner, Crosbie and Darge or Fagerson. Obviously bonkers, but I think that would be the most grunt you could get into a 23.

Hogg doesn't think we'll do it either - in his punditry role for TNT he has said he thinks Ireland and SA will get out the group. Whilst its good he is honest and not just shilling, it possibly gives a glimpse into the mindset in the camp (which he was part of just a couple of months ago). A little disappointing regardless of the likely accuracy of the opinion - I'll bet both SA and Ireland are absolutely sure they will qualify.

On size, interestingly SA have a surprisingly small backline (in height if not weight). Probably an area we should and will try to target both by releasing Duhan quickly down the wings to try to batter over Kolbe and by placing kicks into dangerous wing positions to isolate their smaller defenders / create difficult catch situations. It possibly shines a light on what we were doing in the pre-season against Georgia where we seemed to be spreading it wide more quickly than seemed reasonable in the context of the game.

[Slick]

That's very interesting actually, although I hope it doesn't mean we change the gameplan too much.

I did wonder if we were trying something new against Georgia in that first half, it just seemed a bit dumb.

[Slick]

Hogg doesn't think we'll do it either - in his punditry role for TNT he has said he thinks Ireland and SA will get out the group. Whilst its good he is honest and not just shilling, it possibly gives a glimpse into the mindset in the camp (which he was part of just a couple of months ago). A little disappointing regardless of the likely accuracy of the opinion - I'll bet both SA and Ireland are absolutely sure they will qualify.

I've seen a few people get their knickers in a twist about this, but I suppose he's damned if he does etc. We want to pundits to be truthful and not just dull, so I'm OK with it. Imagine if every pundit was Irish levels of sycophancy awful.

[KingBlairhorn]

Hogg doesn't think we'll do it either - in his punditry role for TNT he has said he thinks Ireland and SA will get out the group. Whilst its good he is honest and not just shilling, it possibly gives a glimpse into the mindset in the camp (which he was part of just a couple of months ago). A little disappointing regardless of the likely accuracy of the opinion - I'll bet both SA and Ireland are absolutely sure they will qualify.

I've seen a few people get their knickers in a twist about this, but I suppose he's damned if he does etc. We want to pundits to be truthful and not just dull, so I'm OK with it. Imagine if every pundit was Irish levels of sycophancy awful.

I kind of agree - I wouldn't say I am bothered by it and it's good to have honesty in a pundit but equally, he is a special case. He would have expected to be there until very recently and he was part of the camp just weeks ago - I am sure he is still in almost daily contact with guys who are there. His mindset would I would think be well attuned to the camp mindset - if the camp thinks they will lose then they probably will. That's what I am getting at. It's the old Scottish mental fragility again - sure we are underdogs but we are fifth in the world for a reason, we are not utter shit and the boys should have a mindset aligned with that.

[Jock42]

Thats poor and disappointing. I don't believe his opinion will have changed because he's no longer there. I doubt it's an isolated opinion, when you consider he was a senior player.

[Slick]

Yeah, fair points, both

[Biffer]

Hogg doesn't think we'll do it either - in his punditry role for TNT he has said he thinks Ireland and SA will get out the group. Whilst its good he is honest and not just shilling, it possibly gives a glimpse into the mindset in the camp (which he was part of just a couple of months ago). A little disappointing regardless of the likely accuracy of the opinion - I'll bet both SA and Ireland are absolutely sure they will qualify.

I've seen a few people get their knickers in a twist about this, but I suppose he's damned if he does etc. We want to pundits to be truthful and not just dull, so I'm OK with it. Imagine if every pundit was Irish levels of sycophancy awful.

Also, what did he actually say? I mean, we all think Ireland and South Africa will probably get out of the group but that it won't be a massive shock if Scotland manage to. I doubt vbery much he's said 'no way Scotland are getting out of the group, no chance, never, I'll be astonished'.

Just people blowing up about pointless shit

[Begbie]

He probably didn't want to upset any of the sensitive Irish pundits with his "arrogance". Just imagine the podcasts if he'd picked us to get out the group.

[TheNatalShark]

Also, what did he actually say? I mean, we all think Ireland and South Africa will probably get out of the group but that it won't be a massive shock if Scotland manage to. I doubt vbery much he's said 'no way Scotland are getting out of the group, no chance, never, I'll be astonished'.

Just people blowing up about pointless shit

https://www.tntsports.co.uk/rugby/world ... tory.shtml

In the video, he just basically says doesn't expect anyone in the pool to beat SA. He reckons Ireland are the best of the home unions.

06:25 in the video speaks more specifically about Scotland, but you can see he just isn't comfortable talking about it.

Storm, tea cup. Just honest without trying to be fake and say "up the boys"

[Slick]

Also, what did he actually say? I mean, we all think Ireland and South Africa will probably get out of the group but that it won't be a massive shock if Scotland manage to. I doubt vbery much he's said 'no way Scotland are getting out of the group, no chance, never, I'll be astonished'.

Just people blowing up about pointless shit

https://www.tntsports.co.uk/rugby/world ... tory.shtml

In the video, he just basically says doesn't expect anyone in the pool to beat SA. He reckons Ireland are the best of the home unions.

06:25 in the video speaks more specifically about Scotland, but you can see he just isn't comfortable talking about it.

Storm, tea cup. Just honest without trying to be fake and say "up the boys"

Thanks for the link and totally agree.

[Blackmac]

I've been offered a round of golf at the Renaissance at 1500 on Sunday so I will miss the match. To be honest I'm okay with it as I really can't see us getting anything out of it. It will be great to walk off the course and find out otherwise.