RWCR1 Scotland vs Springboks

[Cartman]

What sucks is that if we beat Ireland we play NZ in the QF. I want a NZ-Ire and SA-Fra qf rather.
SH vs NH
But I dont want to lose against Ireland
So Italy must burgle France please

[Bloutoria]

What sucks is that if we beat Ireland we play NZ in the QF. I want a NZ-Ire and SA-Fra qf rather.
SH vs NH
But I dont want to lose against Ireland
So Italy must burgle France please

This is my dilemma too.

[OomStruisbaai]

What sucks is that if we beat Ireland we play NZ in the QF. I want a NZ-Ire and SA-Fra qf rather.
SH vs NH
But I dont want to lose against Ireland
So Italy must burgle France please

This is my dilemma too.

In the WC you dont worry about the other teams. You worry only about your next opponent. One game at a time. Romania it is.

This year URC is a great example. Munster won their last 5 matches away from home to won the URC.

[LoveOfTheGame]

What sucks is that if we beat Ireland we play NZ in the QF. I want a NZ-Ire and SA-Fra qf rather.
SH vs NH
But I dont want to lose against Ireland
So Italy must burgle France please

This is my dilemma too.

In the WC you dont worry about the other teams. You worry only about your next opponent. One game at a time. Romania it is.

This year URC is a great example. Munster won their last 5 matches away from home to won the URC.

Absolutely Oom.

[Sards]

What sucks is that if we beat Ireland we play NZ in the QF. I want a NZ-Ire and SA-Fra qf rather.
SH vs NH
But I dont want to lose against Ireland
So Italy must burgle France please

Did you see how Fiji got burgled by the ref. Man I was thrilled by the match and then completely disgusted when Fiji got the card. These refs can change an outcome. Rather have 1 SH team going through. Even if it means SH vs SH to get there

[Cartman]

What sucks is that if we beat Ireland we play NZ in the QF. I want a NZ-Ire and SA-Fra qf rather.
SH vs NH
But I dont want to lose against Ireland
So Italy must burgle France please

This is my dilemma too.

In the WC you dont worry about the other teams. You worry only about your next opponent. One game at a time. Romania it is.

This year URC is a great example. Munster won their last 5 matches away from home to won the URC.

Ja oom but I mean IF we top the pool

[OomStruisbaai]

Will be nice IF two URC countries make the final.

[_Os_]

This is the really strange thing. I appreciate that no one has a higher opinion of you than yourself, but to spend 2 or 3 pages arguing and contradicting over the minutiae of an incident when every Scottish person on here has said well done, the better team won, is, at best, odd.

Honestly mate, what is wrong with some of you lot? All of us were more than happy to say well done, best team won and leave it at that, but we have had 2 days of some of you running around trying to cause friction and prove tiny points we weren't even bothered about. It's a real look into the psyche of an incredibly thin skinned group.

I'm done with this thread, it's pathetic and not why I watch rugby.

Pre-match you and some others weren't on some moral high ground, it's all on the thread. You were saying the Bok forwards "waddle" around (did you enjoy Du Toit's waddling over the line to score a game breaking try?), exploited water breaks and the ABs test didn't matter and wasn't an indication of anything because the ABs also "humped" the Boks. I pointed out that no, the Springboks could really put a big score on Scotland if they put the hammer down, and part of the reason for that was the Boks respected Scotland more than you did the Boks (because of the URC).

You called me a dick for posting that.

There's nothing wrong with us, we just enjoy this that's all. Saying well done after the match is meaningless to me, most of us will continue as if the match hasn't happened and carry this into the next time the Boks play you i expect, because we know you don't rate the Boks. You think the Boks won because they cheated and the ref, that's what you really think, not some empty words. Our mentality isn't like Kiwis that want to be loved and get precious etc when it doesn't happen (I love those guys, but they're sometimes too much concerned with what people think of them), we enjoy the fight, of course you will get hit yourself in a fight but that's to be expected and part of the fun. Sharks v Stomps match threads can run for a week before the match and a week after it.

This is being noticed by the way, it's not just a forum thing. Nel is a well respected SA rugby journalist (he's not a tabloid in style) with a lot of Bok contacts. He interviewed Rassie pre-RWC, he doesn't do interviews with just any SA journo.



"Just wondering. Has there been a bok-scots test under gregor townsend when he has actually congratulated the better team on the day.
Last time out he and Stuart Hogg both said the Boks never deserved to win? This time its reffing inconsistencies.
Sour grapes overflow.
And in saying that the Kriel incident was missed by officials. Ive only seen one angle but wouldnt have complained if it was looked at again.
But Scotland were dominated, outplayed and beaten. Their fans deserve better than this bleating
And on the incosistencies. That is a bugger discussion. But Scotland - other than 2 linebreaks and 2 scrum pens never had the Boks number in that game. They're a bloody good side but they were beaten by a better one"

[_Os_]

I think you're getting a bit lost in your own nonsense here. You are the one insisting it was a maul at the same time as accepting the Scottish player wasn't bound so it couldn't be a maul. Even a 7 or 8 year Scottish kid knows that's not a maul. So penalty Scotland for pre binding from where we go on to beat a 14 man SA, wonderful stuff.

I think you're struggling with the concept of a chat progressing. Everything you've posted has been after this post:

In an effort to end this.

It could be reffed that the bind is broken because the whole arm isn't in contact, but that's not often given (there's plenty of times at the front of mauls when players end up only gripping a jersey, much like Kitshoff ends up doing). Usually it's only strictly policed on the tail gunner. But the ref could say the bind is broken because it's not full arm contact, I would be a bit annoyed by that, but it could be given.

Thinking about it more it's likely there was no Scottish player bound and moon is correct, it happens in a second, but the Scottish player can't bind to the leg so any grab on lifting tape doesn't matter when he rebinds legally (although this is obscured) Kitshoff is likely ahead of the ball carrier. If a TMO called that, I would be less likely to be annoyed.

Yes I thought Kitshoff was bound, yes I thought so because I've seen players at the front of mauls (and not in the middle of the maul, but hanging on its edge) bound in a similar way and it's never given.

You've then decided to ignore this post, that I made after it was pointed out no Scottish player was bound (which was not the original disagreement, because it wasn't noticed until moon brought it up), I changed my mind "it's likely there was no Scottish player bound and moon is correct". I've told you before when I get it wrong I say "I was wrong", and I was wrong.

But you wanted more, so I gave you what you wanted. You could've replied to that post, but didn't because you're enjoying our chats.

[topofthemoon]

This is being noticed by the way, it's not just a forum thing. Nel is a well respected SA rugby journalist (he's not a tabloid in style) with a lot of Bok contacts. He interviewed Rassie pre-RWC, he doesn't do interviews with just any SA journo.



"Just wondering. Has there been a bok-scots test under gregor townsend when he has actually congratulated the better team on the day.
Last time out he and Stuart Hogg both said the Boks never deserved to win? This time its reffing inconsistencies.
Sour grapes overflow.
And in saying that the Kriel incident was missed by officials. Ive only seen one angle but wouldnt have complained if it was looked at again.
But Scotland were dominated, outplayed and beaten. Their fans deserve better than this bleating
And on the incosistencies. That is a bugger discussion. But Scotland - other than 2 linebreaks and 2 scrum pens never had the Boks number in that game. They're a bloody good side but they were beaten by a better one"

While it's entirely possible Nel has access to more chat than I've seen I'm guessing he's relying on the same World Rugby mandated press conference for quotes from Townsend. The entire thing is available online. The first question asked was about the Kriel tackle because for the journalists a controversial decision is ideal for driving engagement.

He pointed out the frustrating inconsistency (same as anyone else could see) and said he'd no idea if a red card would have made a difference, noting Argentina's struggles the night before. So I'm not sure where anyone can get that he's blaming refereeing inconsistencies for Scotland's defeat.

Similarly from 2021 I've no awareness of quotes from Hogg or Townsend that South Africa didn't deserve to win a game in which they comfortably pulled away in the second half.

Maybe there is a bit of a bunker mentality going on but that's almost always going to be the case after a defeat. It's much easier to be generous about the opposition when you're not having to question your entire preparation, gameplan and execution!

[JM2K6]

Think Os has shown enough to suggest that it's reasonable for that to have been called a maul, fwiw.

But then I'm still bitter about a non-maul called given in a Quins game about 3 years ago that led to a try - absolutely fuming

[_Os_]

While it's entirely possible Nel has access to more chat than I've seen I'm guessing he's relying on the same World Rugby mandated press conference for quotes from Townsend. The entire thing is available online. The first question asked was about the Kriel tackle because for the journalists a controversial decision is ideal for driving engagement.

He pointed out the frustrating inconsistency (same as anyone else could see) and said he'd no idea if a red card would have made a difference, noting Argentina's struggles the night before. So I'm not sure where anyone can get that he's blaming refereeing inconsistencies for Scotland's defeat.

Similarly from 2021 I've no awareness of quotes from Hogg or Townsend that South Africa didn't deserve to win a game in which they comfortably pulled away in the second half.

Maybe there is a bit of a bunker mentality going on but that's almost always going to be the case after a defeat. It's much easier to be generous about the opposition when you're not having to question your entire preparation, gameplan and execution!

I would guess it's from the press conference. It's more just a point that this is how it's coming across. People that know the Boks aren't liked and never will be, who normally stay out of this stuff, are coming out swinging. Any journo who aren't tabloid in style (not glorified trolls like Keo), depend on access to have a career, so they don't say a load of crazy stuff no one is thinking because their livelihood depends on it.

Think Os has shown enough to suggest that it's reasonable for that to have been called a maul, fwiw.

But then I'm still bitter about a non-maul called given in a Quins game about 3 years ago that led to a try - absolutely fuming

Thanks JM. But I still agree with moon though, that if it had been called for no Scot binding before Kitshoff gets ahead of the ball carrier, then if the TMO called that I wouldn't be complaining. I don't think the ref had any chance of seeing that in real time though, it all happens in under 2 seconds.

[_Os_]

This video is good, clearly shows what I said pre-match. that the Scots have a weak kicking game, so if the defence is good enough and shuts them down close in, then they're going to struggle. If the Scots were able to kick a ball in behind/chase/contest and that's all as strong as their running, then it becomes more dangerous. Great speed work by the Bok waddlers.

It's why Ireland are more of a threat, they put a ball in behind in this situation. Which then means the Boks have to be strong at defending that option by dropping players back, which opens up space for their running options.

[Tichtheid]

I don't think the ref had any chance of seeing that in real time though, it all happens in under 2 seconds.

I was under the, perhaps misguided, impression that the TMO reviews all play leading up to a try.

[assfly]

I've seen the other video on the Kriel tackle.

I retract my earlier comment. Definitely not a red card, play on was the correct call.

Excellent officiating

[Tichtheid]

I've seen the other video on the Kriel tackle.

I retract my earlier comment. Definitely not a red card, play on was the correct call.

Excellent officiating

The Brendan Nel video on YouTube?

It's hogwash.

[assfly]

It's hogwash.

You misspelt correct.

[Tichtheid]

It's hogwash.

You misspelt correct.

There are so many holes in his argument, but I'll just reference one, it doesn't matter if Kriel hit the ball first with his leading shoulder, if there was head to head contact (and Nel says he thinks there was) then that becomes immaterial. When a tackler hits chest first and rides up to make contact with the head, the initial point of contact doesn't matter, it is foul play. Same in the Kriel incident. The only discussion left then is the level of sanction.

It's four days after the game, I've resisted getting sucked into this until now and I'm going to bow out again.

However, there has been a lot of pettiness and a distinct lack of magnanimity on the part of some supporters here, the Boks deserved the win, this bollocks afterwards is not a good look.

[Begbie]

This is being noticed by the way, it's not just a forum thing. Nel is a well respected SA rugby journalist (he's not a tabloid in style) with a lot of Bok contacts. He interviewed Rassie pre-RWC, he doesn't do interviews with just any SA journo.



"Just wondering. Has there been a bok-scots test under gregor townsend when he has actually congratulated the better team on the day.
Last time out he and Stuart Hogg both said the Boks never deserved to win? This time its reffing inconsistencies.
Sour grapes overflow.
And in saying that the Kriel incident was missed by officials. Ive only seen one angle but wouldnt have complained if it was looked at again.
But Scotland were dominated, outplayed and beaten. Their fans deserve better than this bleating
And on the incosistencies. That is a bugger discussion. But Scotland - other than 2 linebreaks and 2 scrum pens never had the Boks number in that game. They're a bloody good side but they were beaten by a better one"

While it's entirely possible Nel has access to more chat than I've seen I'm guessing he's relying on the same World Rugby mandated press conference for quotes from Townsend. The entire thing is available online. The first question asked was about the Kriel tackle because for the journalists a controversial decision is ideal for driving engagement.

He pointed out the frustrating inconsistency (same as anyone else could see) and said he'd no idea if a red card would have made a difference, noting Argentina's struggles the night before. So I'm not sure where anyone can get that he's blaming refereeing inconsistencies for Scotland's defeat.

Similarly from 2021 I've no awareness of quotes from Hogg or Townsend that South Africa didn't deserve to win a game in which they comfortably pulled away in the second half.

Maybe there is a bit of a bunker mentality going on but that's almost always going to be the case after a defeat. It's much easier to be generous about the opposition when you're not having to question your entire preparation, gameplan and execution!

He also said he was more frustrated by Scotland's performance than he was with refereeing inconsistencies. Top journo Nel must have missed that bit too.

[Torquemada 1420]

This video is good, clearly shows what I said pre-match. that the Scots have a weak kicking game,

How dare you slur the messiah?

[OomStruisbaai]

Os filofaxes is excellent.

[JM2K6]

I don't think the ref had any chance of seeing that in real time though, it all happens in under 2 seconds.

I was under the, perhaps misguided, impression that the TMO reviews all play leading up to a try.

No-one penalises that from a choke tackle maul, though. It's rare enough they penalise it being deliberately collapsed or people joining illegally very late on. How this was reffed is consistent with the last decade, for good or for bad.

[Sards]

Geez. A good old windup of the Springboks supporters who just love a ref bash

[Big D]

Fuck me is this still going? Match week 2 starts tomorrow.

SA won pretty fair and square and quite comfortably.

Scotland competed bravely without really threatening or embarrassing ourselves as most expected.

Hopefully both sides win their remaining group games.

[Sards]

Hope this loads

[Sards]

Fuck me is this still going? Match week 2 starts tomorrow.

SA won pretty fair and square and quite comfortably.

Scotland competed bravely without really threatening or embarrassing ourselves as most expected.

Hopefully both sides win their remaining group games.

There are some younger Saffers here that have more stamina than us topples who can beat there woopie stick for a good week solid

[LoveOfTheGame]

Hope this loads

You and your FB, give yourself an uppercut maaaaaaate.

[Sards]

Hope this loads

You and your FB, give yourself an uppercut maaaaaaate.

Pity...
Now we can close this thread and focus on Romania

[LenCohen]

So it's confirmed: South Africans are cunts

[Biffer]

Everyone knows you cheat, you just can’t accept it.

What have the Springboks done that you consider cheating?

Every breakdown they've ever entered, pretty much.

[Biffer]

It does not matter oom, they were cheating, and the Scots were too thirsty to bother.

Honestly mate, what is wrong with some of you lot? All of us were more than happy to say well done, best team won and leave it at that, but we have had 2 days of some of you running around trying to cause friction and prove tiny points we weren't even bothered about. It's a real look into the psyche of an incredibly thin skinned group.

I'm done with this thread, it's pathetic and not why I watch rugby.

Says the guy who starts a thread to call our coach a cunt.

Yeah, but globally that's just accepted as fair comment.

[Biffer]

Don't forget the try saving seat belt tackle on Arendse that wasn't even penalised or look at?

That I truly have no recollection of. But sure, that might be a thing too. Still minded to think the blatant red card would be the bigger thing

First contact was with the ball. And since when is it legal to choke players in an attempt to hold them up?

Can you point me to where first contact with the ball is mentioned in current referee guidance?

[TedMaul]

They’ve juiced hard on the preciousness. Tawdry.

[Rhubarb & Custard]

That I truly have no recollection of. But sure, that might be a thing too. Still minded to think the blatant red card would be the bigger thing

First contact was with the ball. And since when is it legal to choke players in an attempt to hold them up?

Can you point me to where first contact with the ball is mentioned in current referee guidance?

Also I'd think the thing about hitting the ball first and that causing contact to be raised would need to relate to the incident. In this one he might have connected with the ball with another part of the body but that's not what caused the head on head class, Kriel's head was always high/illegal, and he planted his head into an opponent as a result. That his arms/torso elsewhere contacted the ball is entirely besides the point, save it would seem for the IRB who have somehow, out of stupidity and/or corruption, used it to fail to follow their own framework

[assfly]

Every breakdown they've ever entered, pretty much.

of course, pretty much.

[Begbie]

https://x.com/IlltudDafydd/status/17022 ... 30988?s=20

[_Os_]

Os filofaxes is excellent.

You'll enjoy this oom, didn't catch it on first viewing. One for the "Springboks are cheats" crowd.

Scots feed the ball in (watch the ball), only the left leg of the Scottish loosehead sees the ball briefly. Saying it's not a straight feed would be being kind, it's a pass to the eightmen. Obviously this means the Scottish hooker doesn't need to hook and can push, making their scrum stronger.

Second time Faf is wise to it and knows what is coming and how fast it'll be, Faf is on the eightman like a rabid Jack Russell and takes him down putting the Scots in a worse position because of their cheating.

[Tichtheid]

This level of obsession can't be healthy

[_Os_]

https://x.com/IlltudDafydd/status/17022 ... 30988?s=20

Good luck to your team against Ireland, just not so much luck the outcome happens whereby the Boks are knocked out. Which admittedly would be hilarious, but also very sad.

[OomStruisbaai]

Os filofaxes is excellent.

You'll enjoy this oom, didn't catch it on first viewing. One for the "Springboks are cheats" crowd.

Scots feed the ball in (watch the ball), only the left leg of the Scottish loosehead sees the ball briefly. Saying it's not a straight feed would be being kind, it's a pass to the eightmen. Obviously this means the Scottish hooker doesn't need to hook and can push, making their scrum stronger.

Second time Faf is wise to it and knows what is coming and how fast it'll be, Faf is on the eightman like a rabid Jack Russell and takes him down putting the Scots in a worse position because of their cheating.

I saw that but thought I gave credit to Scoeman who strummed very well. Usually Fat Frans bend them but not Pierre.