Kicking off in Israel

[David in Gwent]

I don't think you and others here know the mindset of Hamas. You think you do, but you don't.

Hamas need to be destroyed, utterly and an example set of what happens when you attack a country and commit an attempted genocide on innocent people.

What's really starting to worry me from the non-left/woke side of the West is that people are starting to think the Israeli civvies weren't innocent.

What a load of horse shit. Your attempts at mind reading and pop psychology seems to have come from some fringe bollocks.
Give yourself an upper cut or at least substantiate your musings with actual evidence.

The man seems to live his life in some kind of fatuous cross between a Daily Mail article and a Facebook group. It's all gotchas and slogans.

I posted actual evidence. Any thoughts on that evidence?

Of course you haven't.

[Tilly Orifice]

What a load of horse shit. Your attempts at mind reading and pop psychology seems to have come from some fringe bollocks.
Give yourself an upper cut or at least substantiate your musings with actual evidence.

The man seems to live his life in some kind of fatuous cross between a Daily Mail article and a Facebook group. It's all gotchas and slogans.

I posted actual evidence. Any thoughts on that evidence?

Of course you haven't.

I went through all your posts over the last 2 pages, which is as far as I'm prepared to go on a wild goose chase, and found nothing at all that could remotely be described as evidence.

[laurent]

The man seems to live his life in some kind of fatuous cross between a Daily Mail article and a Facebook group. It's all gotchas and slogans.

I posted actual evidence. Any thoughts on that evidence?

Of course you haven't.

I went through all your posts over the last 2 pages, which is as far as I'm prepared to go on a wild goose chase, and found nothing at all that could remotely be described as evidence.

Evidence of his stupidity

Now please leave the lance-corporal to his spud peeling. An activity much adapted to his cognitive capacity.

[David in Gwent]

The man seems to live his life in some kind of fatuous cross between a Daily Mail article and a Facebook group. It's all gotchas and slogans.

I posted actual evidence. Any thoughts on that evidence?

Of course you haven't.

I went through all your posts over the last 2 pages, which is as far as I'm prepared to go on a wild goose chase, and found nothing at all that could remotely be described as evidence.

Apologies, I thought you were on the ball enough to be referencing the brief swap of posts C69 and I had on the previous page. It would appear that you're just talking shit, randomly. Do carry on.

[Tilly Orifice]

I posted actual evidence. Any thoughts on that evidence?

Of course you haven't.

I went through all your posts over the last 2 pages, which is as far as I'm prepared to go on a wild goose chase, and found nothing at all that could remotely be described as evidence.

Evidence of his stupidity

Now please leave the lance-corporal to his spud peeling. An activity much adapted to his cognitive capacity.

Yip.

[Rhubarb & Custard]

How does one destroy Hamas? Okay Israel can perhaps do something in the North of Gaza, but it's just possible some Hamas fighters will move South, and then how much Israel can push South, hold ground further south and eradicate entire factions isn't clear, even if technically they could do it they'd by then be on the end of huge criticism globally as to the civilian cost, and very likely they'd be under huge pressure from a growing Israeli group around lost hostages, diminishing hopes for peace and loss of Israeli fighters once they start to put boots on the ground even 'just' in the North never mind the South.

And, even if you can destroy Hamas what stops various Palestinians outraged by Israel, Iran, Qatar, and very likely as things stand Russia establishing a new insurgency group?

None of which is helpful commentary because any idiot can see problems, it's just marginally less shit than the loons who are sure they can see answers

[Plim]

What a fucking depressing read this thread is. A country wishes to defend itself from murderous nutters. Cue the outcry.

I posted a long time ago on PR about the Corbynites' antisemitism. The shite that was peddled then by posters - "'Zionists' doesn't mean Jews", "I know a Jew who agrees with me", "it's all manipulated by Israeli propaganda" is oozing out again, here and elsewhere.

Those who spend their time being more bothered (and in many cases exclusively bothered) by Israel and the Jewish people's willingness to defend themselves may as well have 'I dislike and distrust Jews and I therefore oppose anything to do with the single, homeland Jewish state" tattooed on their foreheads.

FFS.

[shaggy]

How does one destroy Hamas? Okay Israel can perhaps do something in the North of Gaza, but it's just possible some Hamas fighters will move South, and then how much Israel can push South, hold ground further south and eradicate entire factions isn't clear, even if technically they could do it they'd by then be on the end of huge criticism globally as to the civilian cost, and very likely they'd be under huge pressure from a growing Israeli group around lost hostages, diminishing hopes for peace and loss of Israeli fighters once they start to put boots on the ground even 'just' in the North never mind the South.

And, even if you can destroy Hamas what stops various Palestinians outraged by Israel, Iran, Qatar, and very likely as things stand Russia establishing a new insurgency group?

None of which is helpful commentary because any idiot can see problems, it's just marginally less shit than the loons who are sure they can see answers

You cannot destroy Hamas. You see the next wave of Hamas recruits each time you see a child in hospital in Gaza, groups burying the dead or those in the refugee camps. Each bomb creates a new avenue for further fear and anger in the opposite direction.

Maybe I am wrong, maybe the IDF will succeed in their aim to eradicate the potential for future conflict, but I just cannot see it.

[tc27]

How does one destroy Hamas? Okay Israel can perhaps do something in the North of Gaza, but it's just possible some Hamas fighters will move South, and then how much Israel can push South, hold ground further south and eradicate entire factions isn't clear, even if technically they could do it they'd by then be on the end of huge criticism globally as to the civilian cost, and very likely they'd be under huge pressure from a growing Israeli group around lost hostages, diminishing hopes for peace and loss of Israeli fighters once they start to put boots on the ground even 'just' in the North never mind the South.

And, even if you can destroy Hamas what stops various Palestinians outraged by Israel, Iran, Qatar, and very likely as things stand Russia establishing a new insurgency group?

None of which is helpful commentary because any idiot can see problems, it's just marginally less shit than the loons who are sure they can see answers

You cannot destroy Hamas. You see the next wave of Hamas recruits each time you see a child in hospital in Gaza, groups burying the dead or those in the refugee camps. Each bomb creates a new avenue for further fear and anger in the opposite direction.

Maybe I am wrong, maybe the IDF will succeed in their aim to eradicate the potential for future conflict, but I just cannot see it.

I think the Israelis are aware of this - they will want to stop Hamas being capable of the sophisticated military operation it just pulled off.

[C69]

I don't think you and others here know the mindset of Hamas. You think you do, but you don't.

Hamas need to be destroyed, utterly and an example set of what happens when you attack a country and commit an attempted genocide on innocent people.

What's really starting to worry me from the non-left/woke side of the West is that people are starting to think the Israeli civvies weren't innocent.

What a load of horse shit. You attempts at mind reading and pop psychology seems to have come from some fringe bollocks.
Give yourself an upper cut or at least substantiate your musings with actual evidence.

Actual evidence?

Like senior Labour MPs talking about "from the river to the sea"?

It doesn't matter he's been suspended, the damage has been done.

Wtf has that Labour MPs words got to do with our discourse?
Nothing at all you have no substance, no evidence of hw you know people's mindsets or that the people you randomly generated think the Israeli civilians were not innocent.
Utter shite.

[David in Gwent]

What a load of horse shit. You attempts at mind reading and pop psychology seems to have come from some fringe bollocks.
Give yourself an upper cut or at least substantiate your musings with actual evidence.

Actual evidence?

Like senior Labour MPs talking about "from the river to the sea"?

It doesn't matter he's been suspended, the damage has been done.

Wtf has that Labour MPs words got to do with our discourse?
Nothing at all you have no substance, no evidence of hw you know people's mindsets or that the people you randomly generated think the Israeli civilians were not innocent.
Utter shite.

Obviously I need to explain this to your dull head.

I said: Some people (Leftist/Woke) in the West are starting to think that the Hamas attacks were justified.
You Said: You're a fringe nutter, conspiracy theory, yadda, yadda.
I said: A Senior Labour MP is chanting genocidal phrases as in "from the River to the see"
You said: That doesn't mean anything.

I see you, C69

[David in Gwent]

How does one destroy Hamas? Okay Israel can perhaps do something in the North of Gaza, but it's just possible some Hamas fighters will move South, and then how much Israel can push South, hold ground further south and eradicate entire factions isn't clear, even if technically they could do it they'd by then be on the end of huge criticism globally as to the civilian cost, and very likely they'd be under huge pressure from a growing Israeli group around lost hostages, diminishing hopes for peace and loss of Israeli fighters once they start to put boots on the ground even 'just' in the North never mind the South.

And, even if you can destroy Hamas what stops various Palestinians outraged by Israel, Iran, Qatar, and very likely as things stand Russia establishing a new insurgency group?

None of which is helpful commentary because any idiot can see problems, it's just marginally less shit than the loons who are sure they can see answers

It destroys them by months of constant military attacks and then forcing Egypt to take refugees, probably everyone in Gaza, then those refugees making their way West where they will end up living in your town.

It them creates a DMZ around their country.

Tens of thousands will die, then millions more will live in misery, because of Hamas and their cult beliefs.

[David in Gwent]

Another million or so "Refugees" will ignore their fellow Muslim countries and head West. Mark my words.

[David in Gwent]

What a fucking depressing read this thread is. A country wishes to defend itself from murderous nutters. Cue the outcry.

I posted a long time ago on PR about the Corbynites' antisemitism. The shite that was peddled then by posters - "'Zionists' doesn't mean Jews", "I know a Jew who agrees with me", "it's all manipulated by Israeli propaganda" is oozing out again, here and elsewhere.

Those who spend their time being more bothered (and in many cases exclusively bothered) by Israel and the Jewish people's willingness to defend themselves may as well have 'I dislike and distrust Jews and I therefore oppose anything to do with the single, homeland Jewish state" tattooed on their foreheads.

FFS.

‘Enough of this’: Hamas co-founder’s son speaks out

Some in the West, for some reason, are enthralled with Islam and for other unidentified reasons, utterly loathe the state of Israel.

They would ignore this man's words.

[Uncle fester]

What a fucking depressing read this thread is. A country wishes to defend itself from murderous nutters. Cue the outcry.

I posted a long time ago on PR about the Corbynites' antisemitism. The shite that was peddled then by posters - "'Zionists' doesn't mean Jews", "I know a Jew who agrees with me", "it's all manipulated by Israeli propaganda" is oozing out again, here and elsewhere.

Those who spend their time being more bothered (and in many cases exclusively bothered) by Israel and the Jewish people's willingness to defend themselves may as well have 'I dislike and distrust Jews and I therefore oppose anything to do with the single, homeland Jewish state" tattooed on their foreheads.

FFS.

Are there any grounds on which you think it's acceptable to criticize Israel?

[C69]

Actual evidence?

Like senior Labour MPs talking about "from the river to the sea"?

It doesn't matter he's been suspended, the damage has been done.

Wtf has that Labour MPs words got to do with our discourse?
Nothing at all you have no substance, no evidence of hw you know people's mindsets or that the people you randomly generated think the Israeli civilians were not innocent.
Utter shite.

Obviously I need to explain this to your dull head.

I said: Some people (Leftist/Woke) in the West are starting to think that the Hamas attacks were justified.
You Said: You're a fringe nutter, conspiracy theory, yadda, yadda.
I said: A Senior Labour MP is chanting genocidal phrases as in "from the River to the see"
You said: That doesn't mean anything.

I see you, C69

I see you. Wtf does that mean? Are you 10.
Your post is utter bollocks and what you claim I have said only exists in your head. You complain about playing the man.
But by making shit up and your pretend mind reading you are literally doing what you complain about.

[Plim]

What a fucking depressing read this thread is. A country wishes to defend itself from murderous nutters. Cue the outcry.

I posted a long time ago on PR about the Corbynites' antisemitism. The shite that was peddled then by posters - "'Zionists' doesn't mean Jews", "I know a Jew who agrees with me", "it's all manipulated by Israeli propaganda" is oozing out again, here and elsewhere.

Those who spend their time being more bothered (and in many cases exclusively bothered) by Israel and the Jewish people's willingness to defend themselves may as well have 'I dislike and distrust Jews and I therefore oppose anything to do with the single, homeland Jewish state" tattooed on their foreheads.

FFS.

Are there any grounds on which you think it's acceptable to criticize Israel?

Of course. Just like with any country.

But that's not what the bulk of the anti-Israel protestors and critics are about. They have a grotesque, reflexive fixation on Israel. Because they're antisemites. Because Israel is the one and only Jewish state in the world.

So many massive and outrageous wrongs in the world. Yet now in the UK, virtually uniquely, the streets are filled again and again with anti-Israel protestors (including before any action was taken by Israel); posters publicising the kidnapped torn down; money raised for anti-Israel movements; Twitter and the internet generally full of hideous shit about Jews; hate attacks on Jews; revolt in the Labour Party about Israel; etc etc.

Antisemitism.

[Uncle fester]

What a fucking depressing read this thread is. A country wishes to defend itself from murderous nutters. Cue the outcry.

I posted a long time ago on PR about the Corbynites' antisemitism. The shite that was peddled then by posters - "'Zionists' doesn't mean Jews", "I know a Jew who agrees with me", "it's all manipulated by Israeli propaganda" is oozing out again, here and elsewhere.

Those who spend their time being more bothered (and in many cases exclusively bothered) by Israel and the Jewish people's willingness to defend themselves may as well have 'I dislike and distrust Jews and I therefore oppose anything to do with the single, homeland Jewish state" tattooed on their foreheads.

FFS.

Are there any grounds on which you think it's acceptable to criticize Israel?

Of course. Just like with any country.

But that's not what the bulk of the anti-Israel protestors and critics are about. They have a grotesque, reflexive fixation on Israel. Because they're antisemites. Because Israel is the one and only Jewish state in the world.

So many massive and outrageous wrongs in the world. Yet now in the UK, virtually uniquely, the streets are filled again and again with anti-Israel protestors (including before any action was taken by Israel); posters publicising the kidnapped torn down; money raised for anti-Israel movements; Twitter and the internet generally full of hideous shit about Jews; hate attacks on Jews; revolt in the Labour Party about Israel; etc etc.

Antisemitism.

You're aware that this didn't all begin on October 7th?

[Plim]

Are there any grounds on which you think it's acceptable to criticize Israel?

Of course. Just like with any country.

But that's not what the bulk of the anti-Israel protestors and critics are about. They have a grotesque, reflexive fixation on Israel. Because they're antisemites. Because Israel is the one and only Jewish state in the world.

So many massive and outrageous wrongs in the world. Yet now in the UK, virtually uniquely, the streets are filled again and again with anti-Israel protestors (including before any action was taken by Israel); posters publicising the kidnapped torn down; money raised for anti-Israel movements; Twitter and the internet generally full of hideous shit about Jews; hate attacks on Jews; revolt in the Labour Party about Israel; etc etc.

Antisemitism.

You're aware that this didn't all begin on October 7th?

You mean that antisemites have been around for a long time? Yes. I was aware of that.

[Uncle fester]

Hope you feel better after your ungood faith rant.

[Plim]

Hope you feel better after your ungood faith rant.

Weird reply. And very unpleasant.

[Slick]

Yemen declare war on Israel

Edit- sorry Houthis

[Slick]

Another million or so "Refugees" will ignore their fellow Muslim countries and head West. Mark my words.

We always get there in the end

[Tichtheid]

So many massive and outrageous wrongs in the world. Yet now in the UK, virtually uniquely, the streets are filled again and again with anti-Israel protestors (including before any action was taken by Israel); posters publicising the kidnapped torn down; money raised for anti-Israel movements; Twitter and the internet generally full of hideous shit about Jews; hate attacks on Jews; revolt in the Labour Party about Israel; etc etc.

Antisemitism.

Just of the top of my head and in no particular order, but we've had protests after a serving police officer raped and murdered a young woman, the poll tax marches, Stop the War in Iraq (I think that is still the biggest ever march in UK history), General Strike, Miners' strike in the 80s, Extinction Rebellion, various CND marches where up to half a million people were involved, Jarrow March - every weekend there are hundreds of marches in London

Protest is nothing new in the UK

Though it may be a thing of the past if the pressure from the current Gov and their lickspittle press get their way and criminalise all protest

[Plim]

So many massive and outrageous wrongs in the world. Yet now in the UK, virtually uniquely, the streets are filled again and again with anti-Israel protestors (including before any action was taken by Israel); posters publicising the kidnapped torn down; money raised for anti-Israel movements; Twitter and the internet generally full of hideous shit about Jews; hate attacks on Jews; revolt in the Labour Party about Israel; etc etc.

Antisemitism.

Just of the top of my head and in no particular order, but we've had protests after a serving police officer raped and murdered a young woman, the poll tax marches, Stop the War in Iraq (I think that is still the biggest ever march in UK history), General Strike, Miners' strike in the 80s, Extinction Rebellion, various CND marches where up to half a million people were involved, Jarrow March - every weekend there are hundreds of marches in London

Protest is nothing new in the UK

Though it may be a thing of the past if the pressure from the current Gov and their lickspittle press get their way and criminalise all protest

And which of those marches and protests was about the policy - or existence - of a foreign country?

[Uncle fester]

Another million or so "Refugees" will ignore their fellow Muslim countries and head West. Mark my words.

We always get there in the end

Same with the yank evangelical right wing "support" for Israel.
It's a 5 act play where the Jews disappear in act 4.

[Uncle fester]

So many massive and outrageous wrongs in the world. Yet now in the UK, virtually uniquely, the streets are filled again and again with anti-Israel protestors (including before any action was taken by Israel); posters publicising the kidnapped torn down; money raised for anti-Israel movements; Twitter and the internet generally full of hideous shit about Jews; hate attacks on Jews; revolt in the Labour Party about Israel; etc etc.

Antisemitism.

Just of the top of my head and in no particular order, but we've had protests after a serving police officer raped and murdered a young woman, the poll tax marches, Stop the War in Iraq (I think that is still the biggest ever march in UK history), General Strike, Miners' strike in the 80s, Extinction Rebellion, various CND marches where up to half a million people were involved, Jarrow March - every weekend there are hundreds of marches in London

Protest is nothing new in the UK

Though it may be a thing of the past if the pressure from the current Gov and their lickspittle press get their way and criminalise all protest

And which of those marches and protests was about the policy - or existence - of a foreign country?

Going back a bit but off the top of my head, anti apartheid protests would fit that bill.

[Tichtheid]

So many massive and outrageous wrongs in the world. Yet now in the UK, virtually uniquely, the streets are filled again and again with anti-Israel protestors (including before any action was taken by Israel); posters publicising the kidnapped torn down; money raised for anti-Israel movements; Twitter and the internet generally full of hideous shit about Jews; hate attacks on Jews; revolt in the Labour Party about Israel; etc etc.

Antisemitism.

Just of the top of my head and in no particular order, but we've had protests after a serving police officer raped and murdered a young woman, the poll tax marches, Stop the War in Iraq (I think that is still the biggest ever march in UK history), General Strike, Miners' strike in the 80s, Extinction Rebellion, various CND marches where up to half a million people were involved, Jarrow March - every weekend there are hundreds of marches in London

Protest is nothing new in the UK

Though it may be a thing of the past if the pressure from the current Gov and their lickspittle press get their way and criminalise all protest

And which of those marches and protests was about the policy - or existence - of a foreign country?

Stop the War was about Iraq, there were demonstrations and protests about Vietnam, there was a constant presence outside the South African Embassy for a long time during Apartheid, plus marches - that's just the first that come to mind without Google

[Slick]

Ukraine

[Tichtheid]

Ukraine

Doh!


Ukraine

[Plim]

Just of the top of my head and in no particular order, but we've had protests after a serving police officer raped and murdered a young woman, the poll tax marches, Stop the War in Iraq (I think that is still the biggest ever march in UK history), General Strike, Miners' strike in the 80s, Extinction Rebellion, various CND marches where up to half a million people were involved, Jarrow March - every weekend there are hundreds of marches in London

Protest is nothing new in the UK

Though it may be a thing of the past if the pressure from the current Gov and their lickspittle press get their way and criminalise all protest

And which of those marches and protests was about the policy - or existence - of a foreign country?

Stop the War was about Iraq, there were demonstrations and protests about Vietnam, there was a constant presence outside the South African Embassy for a long time during Apartheid, plus marches - that's just the first that come to mind without Google

Iraq was about US and UK policy. Vietnam was about US policy.

SA was certainly about a foreign country’s own policy, decades ago.

That’s not convincing. Israel is singled out now because it’s the Jewish state. And, unlike apartheid SA, it’s a liberal democratic state.

[Plim]

Ukraine

Doh!


Ukraine

There were no mass marches in the UK against Russia’s war on Ukraine. And no general dissent - apart from the headbanger left - that Russia is to be despised for gratuitous war.

[Tichtheid]

And which of those marches and protests was about the policy - or existence - of a foreign country?

Stop the War was about Iraq, there were demonstrations and protests about Vietnam, there was a constant presence outside the South African Embassy for a long time during Apartheid, plus marches - that's just the first that come to mind without Google

Iraq was about US and UK policy. Vietnam was about US policy.

SA was certainly about a foreign country’s own policy, decades ago.

That’s not convincing. Israel is singled out now because it’s the Jewish state. And, unlike apartheid SA, it’s a liberal democratic state.

Well, to be honest I'm not convinced that opposition to war equates to antisemitism, which seems to be case those in favour of continuation and escalation are stating - continuation and escalation being euphemisms for thousands of more indescriminate deaths, tens of thousands more.

[Plim]

Stop the War was about Iraq, there were demonstrations and protests about Vietnam, there was a constant presence outside the South African Embassy for a long time during Apartheid, plus marches - that's just the first that come to mind without Google

Iraq was about US and UK policy. Vietnam was about US policy.

SA was certainly about a foreign country’s own policy, decades ago.

That’s not convincing. Israel is singled out now because it’s the Jewish state. And, unlike apartheid SA, it’s a liberal democratic state.

Well, to be honest I'm not convinced that opposition to war equates to antisemitism, which seems to be case those in favour of continuation and escalation are stating - continuation and escalation being euphemisms for thousands of more indescriminate deaths, tens of thousands more.

Selective opposition to action against a group of homicidal maniacs with an express charter to annihilate Israel and all Jews? How could that possibly be antisemitic?

[Tichtheid]

Ukraine

Doh!


Ukraine

There were no mass marches in the UK against Russia’s war on Ukraine. And no general dissent - apart from the headbanger left - that Russia is to be despised for gratuitous war.

Fair enough, the numbers I get from Google vary between 2000 and 5000 for Stop the War marches against Russia - whilst Peter Tatchell counter-protested saying we should arm Ukraine.

[Tichtheid]

Iraq was about US and UK policy. Vietnam was about US policy.

SA was certainly about a foreign country’s own policy, decades ago.

That’s not convincing. Israel is singled out now because it’s the Jewish state. And, unlike apartheid SA, it’s a liberal democratic state.

Well, to be honest I'm not convinced that opposition to war equates to antisemitism, which seems to be case those in favour of continuation and escalation are stating - continuation and escalation being euphemisms for thousands of more indescriminate deaths, tens of thousands more.

Selective opposition to action against a group of homicidal maniacs with an express charter to annihilate Israel and all Jews? How could that possibly be antisemitic?

Ceasefire doesn't mean one side stops and one side keeps shooting

Again, the blinkered one-side view so prevalent on this thread


edit - this bit

action against a group of homicidal maniacs

the action isn't just against Hamas, it's against Palestinians of all ages from days and weeks old to octogenarians

Surely it's better to just stop this and seek another pathway?

[Raggs]

What other pathway? How do you remove Hamas?

They're in control of the country. They take whatever supplies they want. They have a network of hundreds of kilometers of tunnels, food, fuel and weapons. They actively state that looking after Palestinians is not their responsibility. They're goal is the eradication of Israel and the expulsion of the Jews. They will not allow elections. How do you remove them?

[Tichtheid]

What other pathway? How do you remove Hamas?

They're in control of the country. They take whatever supplies they want. They have a network of hundreds of kilometers of tunnels, food, fuel and weapons. They actively state that looking after Palestinians is not their responsibility. They're goal is the eradication of Israel and the expulsion of the Jews. They will not allow elections. How do you remove them?

Honestly, I have no idea, I'm a rugby fan who used to build stock-proof fencing for a living, I'm not equipped to suggest an answer to this problem which has been in the making for a heck of a long time.

Having said that, In my limited view of it, I don't think that levelling Gazza and thousands of deaths is the pathway to peace. I don't know how you talk to Hamas, but I'm pretty sure this isn't the way, it looks to me like the Hamas extremists want war and they are achieving that, possibly with the hope of expansion across the region and elsewhere as the world falls into the line expected of them.

edit, it also looks like war suits an Israeli PM wishing to secure his own position.

[Guy Smiley]

What other pathway? How do you remove Hamas?

They're in control of the country. They take whatever supplies they want. They have a network of hundreds of kilometers of tunnels, food, fuel and weapons. They actively state that looking after Palestinians is not their responsibility. They're goal is the eradication of Israel and the expulsion of the Jews. They will not allow elections. How do you remove them?

A start would be retreating from all territory taken from Palestine. Take the settlements down, remove the hardcore settlers who practise barbarity upon the Palestinians still trying to live on their land... and maybe, you know, a stop to the indiscriminate killing of Palestinian citizens.

You know... a backdown from belligerent self righteousness.

[Plim]

What other pathway? How do you remove Hamas?

They're in control of the country. They take whatever supplies they want. They have a network of hundreds of kilometers of tunnels, food, fuel and weapons. They actively state that looking after Palestinians is not their responsibility. They're goal is the eradication of Israel and the expulsion of the Jews. They will not allow elections. How do you remove them?

A start would be retreating from all territory taken from Palestine. Take the settlements down, remove the hardcore settlers who practise barbarity upon the Palestinians still trying to live on their land... and maybe, you know, a stop to the indiscriminate killing of Palestinian citizens.

You know... a backdown from belligerent self righteousness.

I don’t disagree with opposition to the settlements.

But I don’t think for a minute that an end to, and removal of, settlements is likely to stop the Jew-haters of Hamas and Hezbollah, who are Iran’s catspaws, and who wish for the destruction of Jews, settlers or not.

I cannot believe that any sensible person genuinely sees any safety for Israel and Jews while Hamas and Hezbollah continue to carry on their killing with Iranian money and direction.