The Scottish Politics Thread

[tc27]

Is the 'losing the pound' thing - where it is held up as a huge downside of independence - a genuine economic argument or just Rule Britannia bullshitting?

I sort of got it in 2014, back when sterling was a a strong and stable currency beloved of the financial markets. But following the Brexit vote, what's the point of clinging on to a weak currency with an uncertain future?

Its not about £s relative strength vs other currencies its more about the downsides to no longer using it...either trying to unofficially use the £ (and therefore have limited ability to expand money supply or issue debt - IE no way to finance sudden costs like Furlough) or issue a new currency that fucks anyone with debt in sterling and leads to bank runs.


Good primer here: https://www.these-islands.co.uk/publica ... dache.aspx

Basically this is why Salmond tried to convince people that the UK would enter a formal currency union with Scotland in 2014.

[Slick]

I see Boris is addressing Parliament at 12.30.

Nicola on at 12.15

[tc27]

Epic trolling from Nic.

Pubs in Scotland to close at 9.59pm no doubt.

[Slick]

I had duff information..:

[Biffer]

Yeah, today's briefing cancelled, Sturgeon to address the Scottish Parliament at 2.20.

[Slick]

Yeah, today's briefing cancelled, Sturgeon to address the Scottish Parliament at 2.20.

They have done a good job of keeping the plans quiet

[Biffer]

Yeah, today's briefing cancelled, Sturgeon to address the Scottish Parliament at 2.20.

They have done a good job of keeping the plans quiet

Yeah, I had to dig around a bit to find out that there was a statement at 2.20.

[Northern Lights]

So because she never introduced as tough a measure on Glasgow as she did to Aberdeen we are now faced with a massive curb on our lifestyles as the virus has continued to spread and fairly rapidly.

Aberdeenshire has 4 cases per 100,000 at the last count, I'm sure the Islands probably have an even lower case count but because the fucking weegies cant behave themselves we are all fucked.

Not to mention the absolute shambles of what you are and are not allowed to do. Kids under 12 dont count in the 6 person rule, 12 to 18 year old can meet up to 6 different households provided it is outside, everyone else max 2 households only outside and no more than 6. I think that's it but fuck knows, this changes every bloody week.

[Jock42]

So because she never introduced as tough a measure on Glasgow as she did to Aberdeen we are now faced with a massive curb on our lifestyles as the virus has continued to spread and fairly rapidly.

Aberdeenshire has 4 cases per 100,000 at the last count, I'm sure the Islands probably have an even lower case count but because the fucking weegies cant behave themselves we are all fucked.

Not to mention the absolute shambles of what you are and are not allowed to do. Kids under 12 dont count in the 6 person rule, 12 to 18 year old can meet up to 6 different households provided it is outside, everyone else max 2 households only outside and no more than 6. I think that's it but fuck knows, this changes every bloody week.

Can't go round to see my terminally ill mother at home, I can however take her for a bar lunch and sit and get skelped all day

[Northern Lights]

So because she never introduced as tough a measure on Glasgow as she did to Aberdeen we are now faced with a massive curb on our lifestyles as the virus has continued to spread and fairly rapidly.

Aberdeenshire has 4 cases per 100,000 at the last count, I'm sure the Islands probably have an even lower case count but because the fucking weegies cant behave themselves we are all fucked.

Not to mention the absolute shambles of what you are and are not allowed to do. Kids under 12 dont count in the 6 person rule, 12 to 18 year old can meet up to 6 different households provided it is outside, everyone else max 2 households only outside and no more than 6. I think that's it but fuck knows, this changes every bloody week.

Can't go round to see my terminally ill mother at home, I can however take her for a bar lunch and sit and get skelped all day

The kids will be carrying their passports so the coppers dont give them shite for meeting up with more than 5 of their chums.

[westport]

So because she never introduced as tough a measure on Glasgow as she did to Aberdeen we are now faced with a massive curb on our lifestyles as the virus has continued to spread and fairly rapidly.

Aberdeenshire has 4 cases per 100,000 at the last count, I'm sure the Islands probably have an even lower case count but because the fucking weegies cant behave themselves we are all fucked.

Not to mention the absolute shambles of what you are and are not allowed to do. Kids under 12 dont count in the 6 person rule, 12 to 18 year old can meet up to 6 different households provided it is outside, everyone else max 2 households only outside and no more than 6. I think that's it but fuck knows, this changes every bloody week.

Can't go round to see my terminally ill mother at home, I can however take her for a bar lunch and sit and get skelped all day

Ridiculous situation

[MSG#]

How's Krankie's elimination of the virus before the end of summer going then lads?

Has she decided that being on tv every day is more important than wiping it out?

[Tattie]

How's Krankie's elimination of the virus ....

Tragic patter.

[Biffer]

How's Krankie's elimination of the virus before the end of summer going then lads?

Has she decided that being on tv every day is more important than wiping it out?

Ruth Davidson?

She’s banging on about independence non stop, like she always does, before she pisses off to the Lords.

[westport]

How's Krankie's elimination of the virus before the end of summer going then lads?

Has she decided that being on tv every day is more important than wiping it out?

Ruth Davidson?

She’s banging on about independence non stop, like she always does, before she pisses off to the Lords.

Funny that she never mentioned it at the wee Nippy show this afternoon

[Biffer]

How's Krankie's elimination of the virus before the end of summer going then lads?

Has she decided that being on tv every day is more important than wiping it out?

Ruth Davidson?

She’s banging on about independence non stop, like she always does, before she pisses off to the Lords.

Funny that she never mentioned it at the wee Nippy show this afternoon

First time for everything. There were more references to independence in the Conservative manifesto than the SNP one at the last Scottish election.

[Northern Lights]

Bunfight getting going in SNP ranks now, that's MacAskill calling for Murrell's (Sturgeon's hubby and chief exec of SNP for those that dont know) suspension.

Shame Covid and Brexit are drowning out this popcorn moment.

[tc27]

Interesting time to be a Scottish student:

[I like neeps]

Interesting time to be a Scottish student:

This is a farce that's fast becoming a tragedy. Not allowed to go home? Not allowed to go to the pub? Not allowed to see friends? What is going on?!

Genuinely this is ridiculous. Absolutely ridiculous. Don't let them go to uni if these are the rules you absolute balloons.

[Jock42]

so a technician with the ambulance service who is residing at GCU through the Scottish Ambulance Academy whilst studying their diploma can't return home or pick up an extra shift over the weekend?

[tc27]

Sturgeon needed tougher policies than the rest of the UK for political reasons...not much time to come up with something post COBR meeting...so here we are.

[Slick]

Some of the students they interviewed on the TV last night were very annoying and smug, taking zero responsibility. In saying that these are 17 year olds away from home for the first time - I would have loved it but some will really struggle. In fairness it’s a very difficult decision for SG to make.

In a tenuous link, it does make giving 16 year olds the vote seem rather rash, they are mainly idiots at that age

[Blackmac]

Interesting time to be a Scottish student:

This is a farce that's fast becoming a tragedy. Not allowed to go home? Not allowed to go to the pub? Not allowed to see friends? What is going on?!

Genuinely this is ridiculous. Absolutely ridiculous. Don't let them go to uni if these are the rules you absolute balloons.

The parents of our Godson asked if he could defer his first year as they feel he will be walking into an absolute clusterfuck. No problem they were told but they will have to still pay for the accomodation they have committed to. Absolute shitshow of a situation.

[I like neeps]

Interesting time to be a Scottish student:

This is a farce that's fast becoming a tragedy. Not allowed to go home? Not allowed to go to the pub? Not allowed to see friends? What is going on?!

Genuinely this is ridiculous. Absolutely ridiculous. Don't let them go to uni if these are the rules you absolute balloons.

The parents of our Godson asked if he could defer his first year as they feel he will be walking into an absolute clusterfuck. No problem they were told but they will have to still pay for the accomodation they have committed to. Absolute shitshow of a situation.

Very concerning BlackMac. It's hard to see who apart from student accommodation providers both institutional and private landlords benefit from the decisions to essentially imprison kids in halls or shared housing to do online learning and forbidden to go anywhere. It's an absolute disgrace. Totally nonsensical to have them go to university when this issue of covid spread amongst thousands of students coming from all over was extraordinarily obvious to anyone.

[Biffer]

University of Glasgow, I believe, has found some ways to soften the blow - food parcels, hot food vans, four week rent holiday, £50 for isolating students for food etc.

University of Edinburgh relied on the police. Rather different approaches.

[westport]

Students who are struggling at university accommodation following a spate of Covid outbreaks have been told they can return home.

But Education Minister Richard Lochhead said he does not expect a "mass exodus" after updated guidance was published by the Scottish government.

The guidance also says students can visit parents if there is a "reasonable excuse" such as a family emergency.

But short stays without one are still deemed an "offence".

The guidelines were issued after a flood of complaints from students who felt they were trapped in university or college accommodation.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland- ... s-54318149

A friend was saying this morning that his grandson is/was at Dundee and apparently there are loads that have buggered off home already

[Slick]

Swinney being sent out to do the needful again.

[MSG#]

University of Glasgow, I believe, has found some ways to soften the blow - food parcels, hot food vans, four week rent holiday, £50 for isolating students for food etc.

University of Edinburgh relied on the police. Rather different approaches.

All they need is their laundry doing. That's the only reason they go home every couple of weeks.

[tc27]

Salmond enquiry 'in crisis'.

[Slick]

The whole thing stinks.

I looks like one of those typical government fuck ups where if they had been truthful from the start it would have been rocky but blown over, but everyone is now in so deep they can't pull back.

[Northern Lights]

The whole thing stinks.

I looks like one of those typical government fuck ups where if they had been truthful from the start it would have been rocky but blown over, but everyone is now in so deep they can't pull back.

That's probably pretty close to the truth. The fuck up in itself probably wasnt that bad but the obstruction and other nonsense is what is making this a bigger mess. Campbell Gunn (one of Salmond's henchmen) said as much in today's P&J, basically disclose everything now and it will be a few days/weeks of bad press which in itself will be blunted by Covid + Brexit so disclose now, couple of people will likely get fired and the they can move on.

[Bimbowomxn]

https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/187 ... ather-tax/


Needs nothing else saying.

[Tichtheid]

I guess he’s talking about MMT, it’s an intriguing idea, but people really struggle to get their heads around it because it requires a completely new way of looking at how money works.

He’s wrong about tax though, under MMT tax is necessary because it acts as a safety valve to avoid inflation.

[tc27]

MMT is interesting but really I think should be treated with skepticism as its relying on repeated brilliant and timely government interventions to stop hyperinflatation. Also doesn't solve the fundamental problem that you can print as much money as you like but we still live in a world of scarcity.

Still the reason some in the Independence movement back it is that all the other currency options are toxic...at least the somewhat magical prospect MMT lets you avoid hard realities of trying to peg to the £ or a free floating currency with realistic borrowing.

[Tichtheid]

MMT is interesting but really I think should be treated with skepticism as its relying on repeated brilliant and timely government interventions to stop hyperinflatation. Also doesn't solve the fundamental problem that you can print as much money as you like but we still live in a world of scarcity.

Still the reason some in the Independence movement back it is that all the other currency options are toxic...at least the somewhat magical prospect MMT lets you avoid hard realities of trying to peg to the £ or a free floating currency with realistic borrowing.

Most advocates of MMT would say that it’s not really about printing money, in fact it’s little more than describing what happens with fiat currencies like the pound or the dollar as things stand, just from perhaps a different viewpoint.

[Bimbowomxn]

MMT completely ignores the international FX markets. It cannot be pulled off in isolation.

[tc27]

MMT is interesting but really I think should be treated with skepticism as its relying on repeated brilliant and timely government interventions to stop hyperinflatation. Also doesn't solve the fundamental problem that you can print as much money as you like but we still live in a world of scarcity.

Still the reason some in the Independence movement back it is that all the other currency options are toxic...at least the somewhat magical prospect MMT lets you avoid hard realities of trying to peg to the £ or a free floating currency with realistic borrowing.

Most advocates of MMT would say that it’s not really about printing money, in fact it’s little more than describing what happens with fiat currencies like the pound or the dollar as things stand, just from perhaps a different viewpoint.

Well when it comes down to brass tacks its basically about printing money instead of borrowing.


Anyway I am sure Argentina or Turkey currently suffering from junk bond status and hyperinflation would love to know they can resolve the problem by 'looking at it a different viewpoint'.

Its an interesting point for discussion bur pretty out there as a plan (and the obvious point is if it would work everyone would be doing it).

[Tichtheid]

Its an interesting point for discussion bur pretty out there as a plan (and the obvious point is if it would work everyone would be doing it).

It was pretty widely adopted in the form of QE.

[Tichtheid]

Anyway I am sure Argentina or Turkey currently suffering from junk bond status and hyperinflation would love to know they can resolve the problem by 'looking at it a different viewpoint'.

I can't tell the reason for being this flippant, but it doesn't display an understanding of what MMT is. MMT is a description of what happens right now, its a description of the relationship between public sector deficit or surplus with the opposite in the private sector, ie when one is in surplus the other is in deficit. It states that taxation is not needed to fund public spending but it is necessary to prevent inflation when the economy is nearing full capacity.

[Tichtheid]

It's been a few years since I read through this, and I'm not advocating it because to be perfectly honest when I did read it it made my head melt, I don't fully understand it all, but if anyone is interested in it, this is a good place to start

http://neweconomicperspectives.org/mode ... rimer.html