The Scottish Politics Thread

[Slick]

I see the Hate Crime Bill is going as well as predicted.

Humza the most reported person, police saying his "white" speech happened before the bill so doesn't count, Tory MSP who found out he was on the list before the Bill came into force saying wut?

[Blackmac]

I see the Hate Crime Bill is going as well as predicted.

Humza the most reported person, police saying his "white" speech happened before the bill so doesn't count, Tory MSP who found out he was on the list before the Bill came into force saying wut?

It was always the reporting and recording issues that were going to be the problem. The whole process is not fit for purpose and the police hours it must be taking to evaluate and respond to approx 2000 complaints a day is astonishing. That will no doubt settle down as the activists on both sides get bored, but we now have a law on the books that the Law Society, Faculty of Advocates and ACPOS say is deeply flawed and completely unworkable, but hey Humza says it's grand.

[Biffer]

I see the Hate Crime Bill is going as well as predicted.

Humza the most reported person, police saying his "white" speech happened before the bill so doesn't count, Tory MSP who found out he was on the list before the Bill came into force saying wut?

It was always the reporting and recording issues that were going to be the problem. The whole process is not fit for purpose and the police hours it must be taking to evaluate and respond to approx 2000 complaints a day is astonishing. That will no doubt settle down as the activists on both sides get bored, but we now have a law on the books that the Law Society, Faculty of Advocates and ACPOS say is deeply flawed and completely unworkable, but hey Humza says it's grand.

Tbh I doubt that number will continue. A lot of the reports that will be coming in right now are from people opposed to the legislation reporting things that are obviously not covered by it.

[Blackmac]

I see the Hate Crime Bill is going as well as predicted.

Humza the most reported person, police saying his "white" speech happened before the bill so doesn't count, Tory MSP who found out he was on the list before the Bill came into force saying wut?

It was always the reporting and recording issues that were going to be the problem. The whole process is not fit for purpose and the police hours it must be taking to evaluate and respond to approx 2000 complaints a day is astonishing. That will no doubt settle down as the activists on both sides get bored, but we now have a law on the books that the Law Society, Faculty of Advocates and ACPOS say is deeply flawed and completely unworkable, but hey Humza says it's grand.

Tbh I doubt that number will continue. A lot of the reports that will be coming in right now are from people opposed to the legislation reporting things that are obviously not covered by it.

It should tail off but then it will flare up at every opportunity where each side feel they can score points. I think JK Rowling seems determined to push things to the limit and get arrested and her team of lawyers will take great delight in ripping the prosecution up for arse paper.

The recording process will also back fire as more and more people complain about having their details held despite not meeting the actionable threshold.

The Vulnerable Persons Database is already a highly questionable process and this will only add to people's disquiet about government overreach.

[Biffer]

It was always the reporting and recording issues that were going to be the problem. The whole process is not fit for purpose and the police hours it must be taking to evaluate and respond to approx 2000 complaints a day is astonishing. That will no doubt settle down as the activists on both sides get bored, but we now have a law on the books that the Law Society, Faculty of Advocates and ACPOS say is deeply flawed and completely unworkable, but hey Humza says it's grand.

Tbh I doubt that number will continue. A lot of the reports that will be coming in right now are from people opposed to the legislation reporting things that are obviously not covered by it.

It should tail off but then it will flare up at every opportunity where each side feel they can score points. I think JK Rowling seems determined to push things to the limit and get arrested and her team of lawyers will take great delight in ripping the prosecution up for arse paper.

The recording process will also back fire as more and more people complain about having their details held despite not meeting the actionable threshold.

The Vulnerable Persons Database is already a highly questionable process and this will only add to people's disquiet about government overreach.

But nothing she's said is within the bounds of the legislation, not by a long way. Freedom of speech is protected explicitly within the bill.

It's just another thing indication of how poorly it's been reported and how little she understands about it.

[Sandstorm]

They're already building houses in Edinburgh at an eyewatering rate of knots.

I'd hate to live on the estates they're building, mind. Miles out of town, a sea of Barrett homes and only a co-op local by way of any facility.

Yeah they never look particularly appealing even by Barrett standards. We need (UK wide) to build denser housing that takes up less green space and is easier to build supporting infrastructure for

Build the infrastructure in new areas first. Train/tram lines, schools, hospitals and parks. Then the house builders will come running.

[Paddington Bear]

They're already building houses in Edinburgh at an eyewatering rate of knots.

I'd hate to live on the estates they're building, mind. Miles out of town, a sea of Barrett homes and only a co-op local by way of any facility.

Yeah they never look particularly appealing even by Barrett standards. We need (UK wide) to build denser housing that takes up less green space and is easier to build supporting infrastructure for

Build the infrastructure in new areas first. Train/tram lines, schools, hospitals and parks. Then the house builders will come running.

I fully support the return of development corporations on a large scale. Given they can borrow at preferential rates there’s a chance they’d even get past Treasury rules

[C69]

They're already building houses in Edinburgh at an eyewatering rate of knots.

I'd hate to live on the estates they're building, mind. Miles out of town, a sea of Barrett homes and only a co-op local by way of any facility.

Yeah they never look particularly appealing even by Barrett standards. We need (UK wide) to build denser housing that takes up less green space and is easier to build supporting infrastructure for

Build the infrastructure in new areas first. Train/tram lines, schools, hospitals and parks. Then the house builders will come running.

Monorail

[Biffer]

Yeah they never look particularly appealing even by Barrett standards. We need (UK wide) to build denser housing that takes up less green space and is easier to build supporting infrastructure for

Build the infrastructure in new areas first. Train/tram lines, schools, hospitals and parks. Then the house builders will come running.

Monorail

(monorail monorail monorail)

[Sandstorm]

“Batman’s a scientist…..”

[Blackmac]

Tbh I doubt that number will continue. A lot of the reports that will be coming in right now are from people opposed to the legislation reporting things that are obviously not covered by it.

It should tail off but then it will flare up at every opportunity where each side feel they can score points. I think JK Rowling seems determined to push things to the limit and get arrested and her team of lawyers will take great delight in ripping the prosecution up for arse paper.

The recording process will also back fire as more and more people complain about having their details held despite not meeting the actionable threshold.

The Vulnerable Persons Database is already a highly questionable process and this will only add to people's disquiet about government overreach.

But nothing she's said is within the bounds of the legislation, not by a long way. Freedom of speech is protected explicitly within the bill.

It's just another thing indication of how poorly it's been reported and how little she understands about it.

No, not at the moment but you get the feeling that she is determined to test that further. As I said earlier in the thread, it's been a complete overreaction to the actual legislation which is barely an extension of the existing laws, however the changes in the process of reporting and recording is a shit show and their claim that every complaint will get responded to was incredibly naive.

[Paddington Bear]

“Batman’s a scientist…..”

I maintain it’s the funniest sitcom episode there is. Incredibly rewatchable

[S/Lt_Phillips]

It should tail off but then it will flare up at every opportunity where each side feel they can score points. I think JK Rowling seems determined to push things to the limit and get arrested and her team of lawyers will take great delight in ripping the prosecution up for arse paper.

The recording process will also back fire as more and more people complain about having their details held despite not meeting the actionable threshold.

The Vulnerable Persons Database is already a highly questionable process and this will only add to people's disquiet about government overreach.

But nothing she's said is within the bounds of the legislation, not by a long way. Freedom of speech is protected explicitly within the bill.

It's just another thing indication of how poorly it's been reported and how little she understands about it.

No, not at the moment but you get the feeling that she is determined to test that further. As I said earlier in the thread, it's been a complete overreaction to the actual legislation which is barely an extension of the existing laws, however the changes in the process of reporting and recording is a shit show and their claim that every complaint will get responded to was incredibly naive.

I enjoyed Jonathan Pie's take on it. He's usually pretty on point.

[Tichtheid]

But nothing she's said is within the bounds of the legislation, not by a long way. Freedom of speech is protected explicitly within the bill.

It's just another thing indication of how poorly it's been reported and how little she understands about it.

No, not at the moment but you get the feeling that she is determined to test that further. As I said earlier in the thread, it's been a complete overreaction to the actual legislation which is barely an extension of the existing laws, however the changes in the process of reporting and recording is a shit show and their claim that every complaint will get responded to was incredibly naive.

I enjoyed Jonathan Pie's take on it. He's usually pretty on point.

I like him too and I agree that he's usually pretty on point.

I think he's missed with that one, though, just down to what Biffer has explained about the bill.

[Biffer]

No, not at the moment but you get the feeling that she is determined to test that further. As I said earlier in the thread, it's been a complete overreaction to the actual legislation which is barely an extension of the existing laws, however the changes in the process of reporting and recording is a shit show and their claim that every complaint will get responded to was incredibly naive.

I enjoyed Jonathan Pie's take on it. He's usually pretty on point.

I like him too and I agree that he's usually pretty on point.

I think he's missed with that one, though, just down to what Biffer has explained about the bill.

Yeah, he says ‘even the scan test of looks’ and then proceeds to demonstrate that he hasn’t even had that.

[Blackmac]

5 years ago I can guarantee that any masked man walking around Edinburgh asking for women to be decapitated or advocating the rape of lesbians would be lifted under existing legislation. 5 years later PSOS seem to think it's okay.

[Slick]

5 years ago I can guarantee that any masked man walking around Edinburgh asking for women to be decapitated or advocating the rape of lesbians would be lifted under existing legislation. 5 years later PSOS seem to think it's okay.

What's this about?

[Slick]

Tbh I doubt that number will continue. A lot of the reports that will be coming in right now are from people opposed to the legislation reporting things that are obviously not covered by it.

It should tail off but then it will flare up at every opportunity where each side feel they can score points. I think JK Rowling seems determined to push things to the limit and get arrested and her team of lawyers will take great delight in ripping the prosecution up for arse paper.

The recording process will also back fire as more and more people complain about having their details held despite not meeting the actionable threshold.

The Vulnerable Persons Database is already a highly questionable process and this will only add to people's disquiet about government overreach.

But nothing she's said is within the bounds of the legislation, not by a long way. Freedom of speech is protected explicitly within the bill.

It's just another thing indication of how poorly it's been reported and how little she understands about it.

But whatever way you look at it it has been another SG fiasco.

If it's not really much different to existing legislation, why have they spend 4 years worth of time and money on it. If it's being misunderstood, why the fuck have they not been able to explain it better after 4 years of time and money on it.

It's almost a microcosm of this utterly inept government. All the shite that's happening in the country and this is what the focus is on, a policy that they say isn't really going to make much difference

[Blackmac]

5 years ago I can guarantee that any masked man walking around Edinburgh asking for women to be decapitated or advocating the rape of lesbians would be lifted under existing legislation. 5 years later PSOS seem to think it's okay.

What's this about?

Counter protest from Trans activists to the Let Women Speak Rally in Edinburgh. Some absolutely appalling stuff on display.

[S/Lt_Phillips]

Glen Rosa is launching today - although currently still stuck on the slipway due to high winds. And the bottle-breaking machine doesn't work. Kind of sums it all up really.

Edit- after some encouragement, it did work after all.

[Blackmac]

Glen Rosa is launching today - although currently still stuck on the slipway due to high winds. And the bottle-breaking machine doesn't work. Kind of sums it all up really.

Edit- after some encouragement, it did work after all.

I wonder if they have painted on the windows this time.

[Blackmac]

I see Humza has stated that anyone offended by his "white, white, white" speech is far right. That seems to be his default response now to anyone that disagrees with him. Far right or islamaphobic rather than just thinking he is a useless chancer.

I see his BiL has been charged with abduction and extortion in relation to the death of the lad that fell from the window in Dundee. I understand the lad fell whilst trying to escape. These charges are on top of his drug dealing charges.

What a glorious leader we have.

[S/Lt_Phillips]

Glen Rosa is launching today - although currently still stuck on the slipway due to high winds. And the bottle-breaking machine doesn't work. Kind of sums it all up really.

Edit- after some encouragement, it did work after all.

I wonder if they have painted on the windows this time.

I believe they still haven't figured out a sensible way of refuelling them with LNG yet. While using LNG is a helpful way of decarbonising, the current plan of trucking the fuel by road tanker from Kent is not a very environmentally friendly way to do it. They need a bunkering facility somewhere (jetty, LNG tank, pumps, un/loading arms, boil-off gas handling etc) so they can bring the LNG in by ship. So far, it would appear that the Scottish Gov't/Transport Scotland/CMAL haven't even started on this yet.

At least the 4 new ferries being built elsewhere all appear to be on time (admittedly conventionally fuelled, so much simpler).

[Paddington Bear]

If family whatsapps are any guide, middle Scotland is in uproar now that wood burning stoves have been banned…

[inactionman]

If family whatsapps are any guide, middle Scotland is in uproar now that wood burning stoves have been banned…

Have they?

I was just about to get a few quotes as well

[vball]

If family whatsapps are any guide, middle Scotland is in uproar now that wood burning stoves have been banned…

Doesn't apply to me as I no longer burn wood but just use coal on mine!!

[weegie01]

If family whatsapps are any guide, middle Scotland is in uproar now that wood burning stoves have been banned…

But only in new builds. Any existing building can still have them installed.

[weegie01]

If family whatsapps are any guide, middle Scotland is in uproar now that wood burning stoves have been banned…

Have they?

I was just about to get a few quotes as well

See my previous post.

[weegie01]

I have to admit I was unaware of this, despite just having got a building warrant to convert a building to a house. Said building is currently garages / storerooms / offices heated by electric heaters and a wood burner. I assume since no one has said anything we are fine, but we'd better check with the architect.

Does anyone know what insulation standards are now applied to new builds. I know we have been traditionally required poorer insulation standards than many other Northern European countries. I know they have been increased but does anyone know if that is still the case?

[Blackmac]

If family whatsapps are any guide, middle Scotland is in uproar now that wood burning stoves have been banned…

Another piece of Snazi hits the statute books which does the square root of fuck all for the welfare of the Scottish people. Given their forestry rewinding bollocks, no one will have any wood to burn anyway in a few decades as it will be too bloody expensive.

[Tichtheid]

Burning wood is an expensive way to hear your house

It's also really bad for particulate pollution as well as CO2 emissions, however there are situations where it is needed, such as the Highlands and Islands where power cuts occur frequently and these are provided for in the new legislation

The goal, I think, is for electric heating to be as good and reliable as gas and a major area where I disagree with the current Scottish government is their refusal to look at nuclear power, it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.

[weegie01]

Burning wood is an expensive way to hear your house

It's also really bad for particulate pollution as well as CO2 emissions, however there are situations where it is needed, such as the Highlands and Islands where power cuts occur frequently and these are provided for in the new legislation

The goal, I think, is for electric heating to be as good and reliable as gas and a major area where I disagree with the current Scottish government is their refusal to look at nuclear power, it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.

I cannot understand people in flats in Edinburgh putting in wood burners. I doubt if there is a more expensive way to get heat. Here in the Highlands even bought in firewood is relatively cheap when bought in bulk, but for most it is effectively free if people can bothered with the effort of dealing with windfalls, thinnings etc. I have a small wood and even that generates more wood than I can deal with despite having 6 woodburners across various properties and I give it away.

Mains gas of course is just not an option up here.

The amount of wood that is left to rot in commercial forests irritates me. It releases the same amount of CO2 burnt or rotting so burn it, and stop importing wood products from the US to burn. There is a wood fired power station that recently came into operation near us. It only takes standard lengths of trunks as that is what the harvestors are set up to provide. Everything else is left behind.

[inactionman]

Burning wood is an expensive way to hear your house

It's also really bad for particulate pollution as well as CO2 emissions, however there are situations where it is needed, such as the Highlands and Islands where power cuts occur frequently and these are provided for in the new legislation

The goal, I think, is for electric heating to be as good and reliable as gas and a major area where I disagree with the current Scottish government is their refusal to look at nuclear power, it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.

I cannot understand people in flats in Edinburgh putting in wood burners. I doubt if there is a more expensive way to get heat. Here in the Highlands even bought in firewood is relatively cheap when bought in bulk, but for most it is effectively free if people can bothered with the effort of dealing with windfalls, thinnings etc. I have a small wood and even that generates more wood than I can deal with despite having 6 woodburners across various properties and I give it away.

Mains gas of course is just not an option up here.

The amount of wood that is left to rot in commercial forests irritates me. It releases the same amount of CO2 burnt or rotting so burn it, and stop importing wood products from the US to burn. There is a wood fired power station that recently came into operation near us. It only takes standard lengths of trunks as that is what the harvestors are set up to provide. Everything else is left behind.

I'm looking at getting one in a house in Edinburgh to replace a fairly lethal old gas fire, other than that I probably wouldn't bother.

I'd say for most people it's as much a comfort as a heating thing. It's a lot nicer curling up on the sofa in front of a woodburner than in front of a radiator.

[tc27]

I think its reasonable legislation for new builds albeit you would think an exception could have being made for very rural locations by a Scottish Parliament.

It is interesting as another example of the once slick SNP pr machine slipping up.

[weegie01]

I'm looking at getting one in a house in Edinburgh to replace a fairly lethal old gas fire, other than that I probably wouldn't bother.

I'd say for most people it's as much a comfort as a heating thing. It's a lot nicer curling up on the sofa in front of a woodburner than in front of a radiator.

Where are you planning on getting your wood from? I may be teaching you to suck eggs but it is remarkable how many people buy woodburners without realising how much space is needed to store wood and how expensive urban firewood sources tend to be. Many price comparison sites used bulk firewood costs which makes the price much more favourable than if you are buying it in bags from B&Q.

[weegie01]

I think its reasonable legislation for new builds albeit you would think an exception could have being made for very rural locations by a Scottish Parliament.

It is interesting as another example of the once slick SNP pr machine slipping up.

When Kate Forbes is raising issues she claimed she did not know about before it came into force either they were delinquent in making sure their MPS were briefed or she was not paying attention.

[Tichtheid]

Burning wood is an expensive way to hear your house

It's also really bad for particulate pollution as well as CO2 emissions, however there are situations where it is needed, such as the Highlands and Islands where power cuts occur frequently and these are provided for in the new legislation

The goal, I think, is for electric heating to be as good and reliable as gas and a major area where I disagree with the current Scottish government is their refusal to look at nuclear power, it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.

I cannot understand people in flats in Edinburgh putting in wood burners. I doubt if there is a more expensive way to get heat. Here in the Highlands even bought in firewood is relatively cheap when bought in bulk, but for most it is effectively free if people can bothered with the effort of dealing with windfalls, thinnings etc. I have a small wood and even that generates more wood than I can deal with despite having 6 woodburners across various properties and I give it away.

Mains gas of course is just not an option up here.

The amount of wood that is left to rot in commercial forests irritates me. It releases the same amount of CO2 burnt or rotting so burn it, and stop importing wood products from the US to burn. There is a wood fired power station that recently came into operation near us. It only takes standard lengths of trunks as that is what the harvestors are set up to provide. Everything else is left behind.

Aye imported firewood is another thing, there is the danger of bringing in blights and pests which are very destructive to our native woodlands.

[inactionman]

I'm looking at getting one in a house in Edinburgh to replace a fairly lethal old gas fire, other than that I probably wouldn't bother.

I'd say for most people it's as much a comfort as a heating thing. It's a lot nicer curling up on the sofa in front of a woodburner than in front of a radiator.

Where are you planning on getting your wood from? I may be teaching you to suck eggs but it is remarkable how many people buy woodburners without realising how much space is needed to store wood and how expensive urban firewood sources tend to be. Many price comparison sites used bulk firewood costs which makes the price much more favourable than if you are buying it in bags from B&Q.

In bulk - we did the same when we lived in Bath, we generally got it delivered in 1m^3 bags but that was about all we could fit into our patio garden so couldn't go much larger at that time. We have plenty of space in the garden for wood storage in Edinburgh, and a fair bit of wood from trees we've had to trim back or cut down which we can season and use.

We have bought wood form B&Q when supplies ran low and we were waiting for a delivery, the wood was awful - spat like mad and seemed to burn through in minutes.

We previously had flat in Leith with an open fire, I toyed with the idea of a woodburner (we got such a horrible backdraft and smoke in the room that I stopped using the fire, a woodburner would have least prevented that) but there was just no space, unless I clogged up shared areas. I also didn't much look forward to lugging fuel up to the top floor.

[Blackmac]

I know of two people that have had wood burners installed, effectively as a feature, and had absolutely no idea about the cost of wood and the issue storing it. They are barely ever used.

Apologies re spelling in my previous post. I meant to say rewilding policies. Scotland is per capita the second highest user of wood in the world behind China and unless we look at producing more usable wood of our own, the financial and environmental cost of importing what we need will be astronomical.

[Biffer]

I know of two people that have had wood burners installed, effectively as a feature, and had absolutely no idea about the cost of wood and the issue storing it. They are barely ever used.

Apologies re spelling in my previous post. I meant to say rewilding policies. Scotland is per capita the second highest user of wood in the world behind China and unless we look at producing more usable wood of our own, the financial and environmental cost of importing what we need will be astronomical.

Are we really? How do we use so much - is it burning for fuel?