The Scottish Politics Thread

[Jock42]

Whilst she is probably right in what she says she shouldn't say it publicly but she is only an advisor and not a member or official of the Gov so I presume Wee Nic hasn't any authority over her.

Getting a bit pissed off about folk moaning on about masks - its no feckin problem just do it. As we come out of lock down it makes sense to make masks mandatory as the number of interactions begin to increase. Up to now the number of close interactions has been low and where it was a risk then masks were required i.e. buses, hospitals, care homes, etc. The number of cases in the community is now very low in Scotland and as the community opens up then it makes a lot of sense to require folk to wear masks to avoid the opening up and closer contact in beer gardens etc leading to an increase in community transmission. We have also reached the low level of community infection where local PH teams can actually have an effective Track and Protect system in place to identify and manage local outbreaks. Opening up later than England reflects we were later into community transmission and are keen to get the numbers down low enough to manage. We might not agree with what Sridhar said but she knows what she is talking about and Scotland is in a far better position than England right now.

Eh? You think she is right to say non independance supporting folk are anti Scottish and are angry that Scotland is doing well? I'm sure you don't so maybe I've read that wrong.

Agree on the masks thing, its not really a big deal to stick one on. I think one factor is embarrassment to be honest, which is silly but a real thing. I'm down in England at the moment and went for a haircut yesterday and was the only person (apart from the barbers) wearing one, seems crazy.

I think she has phrased very badly the idea that there are people in the more extreme category of unionist (maybe loyalist would be a better word for them) who are going to howl at anything the Scottish government does whether it’s good bad or indifferent.

Regardless of only being an advisor, she will have some kind of contractual relationship in place, or a terms of reference or such which will have some stipulations around public comment and behaviour in relation to what she’s giving advice on.

Just because the SNP brand themselves a certain way and some of their supporters follow suit doesn't mean that people who argue against everything they and Holyrood do are anti Scottish. It's one of the reasons my Unionism has become so entrenched, this patronising line that I'm a traitor to Scotland because my views of whats best differs. The disdain I have for people like that can't be accurately expressed on here.

[Biffer]

I think she has phrased very badly the idea that there are people in the more extreme category of unionist (maybe loyalist would be a better word for them) who are going to howl at anything the Scottish government does whether it’s good bad or indifferent.

Regardless of only being an advisor, she will have some kind of contractual relationship in place, or a terms of reference or such which will have some stipulations around public comment and behaviour in relation to what she’s giving advice on.

Just because the SNP brand themselves a certain way and some of their supporters follow suit doesn't mean that people who argue against everything they and Holyrood do are anti Scottish. It's one of the reasons my Unionism has become so entrenched, this patronising line that I'm a traitor to Scotland because my views of whats best differs. The disdain I have for people like that can't be accurately expressed on here.

I never said it did and that's what I was trying to suggest in my post. There are loons on both sides - uber nats that would call you a traitor for believing what you do and ultrs-loyalists who would call me the same for believing indy is a better way forward. I have an equal amount of disdain for the people who scream SNP Baaaaaad at every single thing the Scottish Government does.

[Jock42]

I wouldn't equate those that are bigoted towards me with those that dont like anything the SNP do.

[Biffer]

I wouldn't equate those that are bigoted towards me with those that dont like anything the SNP do.

That’s entirely up to you. I have the opinion that there are idiots on both sides who are different cheeks of the same arse. But that shouldn’t a) mean that we tar everyone on the other side of the debate with the same brush or b.) stop trying to discuss sensibly with those that are not on the loony fringes.

[Jock42]

I wouldn't equate those that are bigoted towards me with those that dont like anything the SNP do.

That’s entirely up to you. I have the opinion that there are idiots on both sides who are different cheeks of the same arse. But that shouldn’t a) mean that we tar everyone on the other side of the debate with the same brush or b.) stop trying to discuss sensibly with those that are not on the loony fringes.

I've not said we should do either of those things. I'm simply stating that bigotry towards me being British is not the same as hating a political party. You obviously disagree with that so we should leave it here as I can't be arsed arguing the absurdity of that.

[Biffer]

I wouldn't equate those that are bigoted towards me with those that dont like anything the SNP do.

That’s entirely up to you. I have the opinion that there are idiots on both sides who are different cheeks of the same arse. But that shouldn’t a) mean that we tar everyone on the other side of the debate with the same brush or b.) stop trying to discuss sensibly with those that are not on the loony fringes.

I've not said we should do either of those things. I'm simply stating that bigotry towards me being British is not the same as hating a political party. You obviously disagree with that so we should leave it here as I can't be arsed arguing the absurdity of that.

Ok, I hadn't picked up that was the distinction you're making, I see what you mean and you're right. The things I was saying are a different discussion that are more relates to some of the other things said earlier int he thread. Apologies for the confusion.

[dpedin]

We all realise she is an American who studied in Miami and Oxford and has been in Edinburgh for barely 6 years? She has spent more time studying and working in Oxford than she has Scotland. She co-authored a book with Chelsea Clinton whislt in Oxford. I hardly think she is a hard edged Nationalist as some are suggesting, she is however pretty outspoken and isn't afraid to speak her mind, as most academics do and fiercely protect their right to do so. I think Wee Nic would have a battle on her hands trying to control what she said!

[Slick]

We all realise she is an American who studied in Miami and Oxford and has been in Edinburgh for barely 6 years? She has spent more time studying and working in Oxford than she has Scotland. She co-authored a book with Chelsea Clinton whislt in Oxford. I hardly think she is a hard edged Nationalist as some are suggesting, she is however pretty outspoken and isn't afraid to speak her mind, as most academics do and fiercely protect their right to do so. I think Wee Nic would have a battle on her hands trying to control what she said!

I completely accept it was a mistake and she didn't know what she was saying. However, she is on the SG payroll and I think it needs to be addressed. Not a drawn out sacking, just a "that doesn't reflect our views" type thing.

[Biffer]

We all realise she is an American who studied in Miami and Oxford and has been in Edinburgh for barely 6 years? She has spent more time studying and working in Oxford than she has Scotland. She co-authored a book with Chelsea Clinton whislt in Oxford. I hardly think she is a hard edged Nationalist as some are suggesting, she is however pretty outspoken and isn't afraid to speak her mind, as most academics do and fiercely protect their right to do so. I think Wee Nic would have a battle on her hands trying to control what she said!

I completely accept it was a mistake and she didn't know what she was saying. However, she is on the SG payroll and I think it needs to be addressed. Not a drawn out sacking, just a "that doesn't reflect our views" type thing.

Not 100% certain that this kind of role actually draws a wage.

[dpedin]

No there will not be any salary or payment etc for this advisory role, probably just any out of pocket expenses. Its more about CVs and kudos etc for University and individual academic.

[Biffer]

No there will not be any salary or payment etc for this advisory role, probably just any out of pocket expenses. Its more about CVs and kudos etc for University and individual academic.

That's what I thought, so more likely a Terms of Reference of some sort that they sign up to which would only have things about not bringing the Scottish government into disrepute etc.

Very different role from the Chief Medical Officer / Chief Scientific Advisor folks who are paid civil servants (usually part time I think, scientific adviser definitely).

[westport]

We all realise she is an American who studied in Miami and Oxford and has been in Edinburgh for barely 6 years? She has spent more time studying and working in Oxford than she has Scotland. She co-authored a book with Chelsea Clinton whislt in Oxford. I hardly think she is a hard edged Nationalist as some are suggesting, she is however pretty outspoken and isn't afraid to speak her mind, as most academics do and fiercely protect their right to do so. I think Wee Nic would have a battle on her hands trying to control what she said!

I completely accept it was a mistake and she didn't know what she was saying. However, she is on the SG payroll and I think it needs to be addressed. Not a drawn out sacking, just a "that doesn't reflect our views" type thing.

Not 100% certain that this kind of role actually draws a wage.

I would assume they will be classed as a special advisor. If they are then they will get a fair few quid chucked their way, going by a quick search of special advisors pay

The Special Adviser Pay Bands and Ranges and the number of Special Advisers within each Pay Band currently in place are:

Pay Band Current Pay Range
1 £39,445 - £52,904
2 £51,041 - £67,709
3 £65,017 - £83,963
3 (premium) £83,549 - £100,942
4 £86,965 - £104,462

[Slick]

No there will not be any salary or payment etc for this advisory role, probably just any out of pocket expenses. Its more about CVs and kudos etc for University and individual academic.

That's what I thought, so more likely a Terms of Reference of some sort that they sign up to which would only have things about not bringing the Scottish government into disrepute etc.

Very different role from the Chief Medical Officer / Chief Scientific Advisor folks who are paid civil servants (usually part time I think, scientific adviser definitely).

Ahh, fair enought then, she can say what she likes

[Biffer]

I completely accept it was a mistake and she didn't know what she was saying. However, she is on the SG payroll and I think it needs to be addressed. Not a drawn out sacking, just a "that doesn't reflect our views" type thing.

Not 100% certain that this kind of role actually draws a wage.

I would assume they will be classed as a special advisor. If they are then they will get a fair few quid chucked their way, going by a quick search of special advisors pay

The Special Adviser Pay Bands and Ranges and the number of Special Advisers within each Pay Band currently in place are:

Pay Band Current Pay Range
1 £39,445 - £52,904
2 £51,041 - £67,709
3 £65,017 - £83,963
3 (premium) £83,549 - £100,942
4 £86,965 - £104,462

They're most definitely not full time roles. Usually a couple of hours three or four times a year.

[Northern Lights]

We all realise she is an American who studied in Miami and Oxford and has been in Edinburgh for barely 6 years? She has spent more time studying and working in Oxford than she has Scotland. She co-authored a book with Chelsea Clinton whislt in Oxford. I hardly think she is a hard edged Nationalist as some are suggesting, she is however pretty outspoken and isn't afraid to speak her mind, as most academics do and fiercely protect their right to do so. I think Wee Nic would have a battle on her hands trying to control what she said!

I personally would expect an intelligent person with the profile she has to be able to articulate herself exactly how she wants to be viewed. So I don’t reckon that was a badly worded tweet, that was what she truly felt.
The SNP aren’t interested in bringing the country together though, they will be quite happy to have me and OJ up against the wall once they get their Yes vote.

[dpedin]

Not 100% certain that this kind of role actually draws a wage.

I would assume they will be classed as a special advisor. If they are then they will get a fair few quid chucked their way, going by a quick search of special advisors pay

The Special Adviser Pay Bands and Ranges and the number of Special Advisers within each Pay Band currently in place are:

Pay Band Current Pay Range
1 £39,445 - £52,904
2 £51,041 - £67,709
3 £65,017 - £83,963
3 (premium) £83,549 - £100,942
4 £86,965 - £104,462

They're most definitely not full time roles. Usually a couple of hours three or four times a year.

They are not SPADs, a SPAD is the equivalent of a Dominic Cummings type of role. SPADs are appointed by ministers and do their running and donkey work for them. The likes of Srindha and others are completely different, they are independent and will not be paid by SG other than expenses. There are a whole range of groups and committees that the SG will populate with experts or stakeholders from across the relevant areas and will include academics, trade unions, industry reps, voluntary organisations, etc. They will be there to advise and represent their own stakeholders interests and in many cases might disagree with the Gov position or direction of travel but at the end of the day all they can do is advise and produce reports, papers, etc. for the politicians to make their decisions.

[dpedin]

We all realise she is an American who studied in Miami and Oxford and has been in Edinburgh for barely 6 years? She has spent more time studying and working in Oxford than she has Scotland. She co-authored a book with Chelsea Clinton whislt in Oxford. I hardly think she is a hard edged Nationalist as some are suggesting, she is however pretty outspoken and isn't afraid to speak her mind, as most academics do and fiercely protect their right to do so. I think Wee Nic would have a battle on her hands trying to control what she said!

I personally would expect an intelligent person with the profile she has to be able to articulate herself exactly how she wants to be viewed. So I don’t reckon that was a badly worded tweet, that was what she truly felt.
The SNP aren’t interested in bringing the country together though, they will be quite happy to have me and OJ up against the wall once they get their Yes vote.

I think you are conflating the two issues.

She is an intelligent and well qualified professional who is a expert in the area she has tweeted on. As an individual she is able to express her own views as she wishes. She does not represent the SNP in any way whatsoever. However her employer, who is not the SNP nor the Scot Gov, may take a view about her tweet but that is up to them.

Your second point is your unsubstantiated viewpoint and unrelated to the first point you raise. Of course you are as equally welcome to express your views as you wish, however your second point is probably even more badly worded and has a far more offensive tone to it than the tweet you are complaining about! I suspect irony is not a concept you are acquainted with?

[Slick]

We all realise she is an American who studied in Miami and Oxford and has been in Edinburgh for barely 6 years? She has spent more time studying and working in Oxford than she has Scotland. She co-authored a book with Chelsea Clinton whislt in Oxford. I hardly think she is a hard edged Nationalist as some are suggesting, she is however pretty outspoken and isn't afraid to speak her mind, as most academics do and fiercely protect their right to do so. I think Wee Nic would have a battle on her hands trying to control what she said!

I personally would expect an intelligent person with the profile she has to be able to articulate herself exactly how she wants to be viewed. So I don’t reckon that was a badly worded tweet, that was what she truly felt.
The SNP aren’t interested in bringing the country together though, they will be quite happy to have me and OJ up against the wall once they get their Yes vote.

I think you are conflating the two issues.

She is an intelligent and well qualified professional who is a expert in the area she has tweeted on. As an individual she is able to express her own views as she wishes. She does not represent the SNP in any way whatsoever. However her employer, who is not the SNP nor the Scot Gov, may take a view about her tweet but that is up to them.

Your second point is your unsubstantiated viewpoint and unrelated to the first point you raise. Of course you are as equally welcome to express your views as you wish, however your second point is probably even more badly worded and has a far more offensive tone to it than the tweet you are complaining about! I suspect irony is not a concept you are acquainted with?

Come on, of course she is representing SG, she is very vocal, has done interviews, written opinion pieces about her work with SG, and has been promoted and defended by any number of SNP MSP's.

What's your opinion of her tweet?

[Biffer]

I personally would expect an intelligent person with the profile she has to be able to articulate herself exactly how she wants to be viewed. So I don’t reckon that was a badly worded tweet, that was what she truly felt.
The SNP aren’t interested in bringing the country together though, they will be quite happy to have me and OJ up against the wall once they get their Yes vote.

I think you are conflating the two issues.

She is an intelligent and well qualified professional who is a expert in the area she has tweeted on. As an individual she is able to express her own views as she wishes. She does not represent the SNP in any way whatsoever. However her employer, who is not the SNP nor the Scot Gov, may take a view about her tweet but that is up to them.

Your second point is your unsubstantiated viewpoint and unrelated to the first point you raise. Of course you are as equally welcome to express your views as you wish, however your second point is probably even more badly worded and has a far more offensive tone to it than the tweet you are complaining about! I suspect irony is not a concept you are acquainted with?

Come on, of course she is representing SG, she is very vocal, has done interviews, written opinion pieces about her work with SG, and has been promoted and defended by any number of SNP MSP's.

What's your opinion of her tweet?

Her supporting Scot Gov is different from saying her role is a representative of ScotGov. The advisory committees are selected from all sorts, dependent on their expertise. Political viewpoints shouldn't come into it. Otherwise you wouldn't get decent advice. If you google Scottish Government advisory panel, you'll find dozens of panel members in various areas, and you'll see some who were outspoken in their views against independence 6 years ago.

[Slick]

I think you are conflating the two issues.

She is an intelligent and well qualified professional who is a expert in the area she has tweeted on. As an individual she is able to express her own views as she wishes. She does not represent the SNP in any way whatsoever. However her employer, who is not the SNP nor the Scot Gov, may take a view about her tweet but that is up to them.

Your second point is your unsubstantiated viewpoint and unrelated to the first point you raise. Of course you are as equally welcome to express your views as you wish, however your second point is probably even more badly worded and has a far more offensive tone to it than the tweet you are complaining about! I suspect irony is not a concept you are acquainted with?

Come on, of course she is representing SG, she is very vocal, has done interviews, written opinion pieces about her work with SG, and has been promoted and defended by any number of SNP MSP's.

What's your opinion of her tweet?

Her supporting Scot Gov is different from saying her role is a representative of ScotGov. The advisory committees are selected from all sorts, dependent on their expertise. Political viewpoints shouldn't come into it. Otherwise you wouldn't get decent advice. If you google Scottish Government advisory panel, you'll find dozens of panel members in various areas, and you'll see some who were outspoken in their views against independence 6 years ago.

I can't quite believe both of you are going out of your way not to give an opinion on her tweet that said 50%+ of Scots are anti-Scottish, but here we are

[Biffer]

Come on, of course she is representing SG, she is very vocal, has done interviews, written opinion pieces about her work with SG, and has been promoted and defended by any number of SNP MSP's.

What's your opinion of her tweet?

Her supporting Scot Gov is different from saying her role is a representative of ScotGov. The advisory committees are selected from all sorts, dependent on their expertise. Political viewpoints shouldn't come into it. Otherwise you wouldn't get decent advice. If you google Scottish Government advisory panel, you'll find dozens of panel members in various areas, and you'll see some who were outspoken in their views against independence 6 years ago.

I can't quite believe both of you are going out of your way not to give an opinion on her tweet that said 50%+ of Scots are anti-Scottish, but here we are

I gave my opinion on it on the last page. She phrased very badly the view that there are a small number of unionist supporters that scream about anything the Scottish Government does.

[Northern Lights]

We all realise she is an American who studied in Miami and Oxford and has been in Edinburgh for barely 6 years? She has spent more time studying and working in Oxford than she has Scotland. She co-authored a book with Chelsea Clinton whislt in Oxford. I hardly think she is a hard edged Nationalist as some are suggesting, she is however pretty outspoken and isn't afraid to speak her mind, as most academics do and fiercely protect their right to do so. I think Wee Nic would have a battle on her hands trying to control what she said!

I personally would expect an intelligent person with the profile she has to be able to articulate herself exactly how she wants to be viewed. So I don’t reckon that was a badly worded tweet, that was what she truly felt.
The SNP aren’t interested in bringing the country together though, they will be quite happy to have me and OJ up against the wall once they get their Yes vote.

I think you are conflating the two issues.

She is an intelligent and well qualified professional who is a expert in the area she has tweeted on. As an individual she is able to express her own views as she wishes. She does not represent the SNP in any way whatsoever. However her employer, who is not the SNP nor the Scot Gov, may take a view about her tweet but that is up to them.

Your second point is your unsubstantiated viewpoint and unrelated to the first point you raise. Of course you are as equally welcome to express your views as you wish, however your second point is probably even more badly worded and has a far more offensive tone to it than the tweet you are complaining about! I suspect irony is not a concept you are acquainted with?

I'm not complaining about her tweet, far from it, that is what she feels and she is intelligent and articulate enough to express it that way. Whether you like it or not she does represent the SG who because the ruling party is the SNP also therefore represents them, she is prominant and she is outspoken enough to make her views well known, Sturgeon has also not distanced herself from the tweet so it is quite clear that she is happy for this representation.

On my second point, why is it badly worded? Yes it is unsubstantiated because it is opinion and my opinion is the SNP have no interest in bringing the country together and have done more to sow division in Scotland than any other single entity, it doesn't further their aim and they very much view it as us against them and their little cyber warriors love nothing more than a good old pile on and Sturgeon is very good at pointing out which targets she wants taken down.

[Knuckledragger]

So, now that Sunak has announced an immediate Stamp Duty holiday for England, will Holyrood do the same for Scotland?

[Northern Lights]

So that's us into Stage 3.

Most people i know have moved to this stage 2 weeks ago with the meeting inside with more than 1 family but that is purely anecdotal on my part.

[Jock42]

I'd be surprised if that wasn't the norm.

[MoreOrLess]

So, now that Sunak has announced an immediate Stamp Duty holiday for England, will Holyrood do the same for Scotland?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-scotland-53350753

[Knuckledragger]

Any thoughts on why the SNP have not simply followed the same approach as Westminster and why they can’t implement the change immediately?

[Caley_Red]

So, now that Sunak has announced an immediate Stamp Duty holiday for England, will Holyrood do the same for Scotland?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-scotland-53350753

Half the threshold, I'm personally quite annoyed about that: deciding whether to buy in Sydney or Edinburgh and, if the amount had been matched, that would have significantly tipped the scales toward Edinburgh.

[Caley_Red]

Any thoughts on why the SNP have not simply followed the same approach as Westminster and why they can’t implement the change immediately?

No doubt partly motivated by the need for 'optical divergence' from the UK

[MoreOrLess]

Any thoughts on why the SNP have not simply followed the same approach as Westminster and why they can’t implement the change immediately?

I guess they just can't really afford it. Plus Scottish government borrowing is restricted so they can't just add it to the list to deal with later like Westminster can.

Whatever the reason, it's not a great look

[Biffer]

Any thoughts on why the SNP have not simply followed the same approach as Westminster and why they can’t implement the change immediately?

I think, from a quick browse of ONS stats, that it affects roughly the same proportion of house sales. Demonstrates the difference in prices across England and Scotland. So the stimulus applies to the same amount of the the market, so should have roughly the same effect.

[dpedin]

Any thoughts on why the SNP have not simply followed the same approach as Westminster and why they can’t implement the change immediately?

I think, from a quick browse of ONS stats, that it affects roughly the same proportion of house sales. Demonstrates the difference in prices across England and Scotland. So the stimulus applies to the same amount of the the market, so should have roughly the same effect.

Seems sensible, I have no problem in restricting access to those who need it most. The changes in stamp duty should be focused on the bottom end of the market and those most in need, it shouldn't be helping those at upper end of the income bracket or those buying up 2nd homes or Air B&B properties. Outside of a few hotspots £250k will buy you a decent house or flat in Scotland, £500k will get you a pretty big house. The £500k limit down south reflects the huge variation in property prices, skewed by London and SE.

[Northern Lights]

EU students no longer getting free Uni education, Lockhead with a "heavy heart" in his announcement blaming Brexit when in reality they never wanted to have to pay for the EU students but were challenged in the EU courts as i remember it and lost, so ended up having to pay for the EU students as well as our own. Should save £19m and/or give more access to Scots kids so a Brexit benefit if ever there was one, not that the SG will ever admit as much. Same as the fishing industry though which should benefit from being an Independent coastal state and out of CFP. Brexit isnt all bad, not that i am a fan of leaving.

[Biffer]

EU students no longer getting free Uni education, Lockhead with a "heavy heart" in his announcement blaming Brexit when in reality they never wanted to have to pay for the EU students but were challenged in the EU courts as i remember it and lost, so ended up having to pay for the EU students as well as our own. Should save £19m and/or give more access to Scots kids so a Brexit benefit if ever there was one, not that the SG will ever admit as much. Same as the fishing industry though which should benefit from being an Independent coastal state and out of CFP. Brexit isnt all bad, not that i am a fan of leaving.

Think he also said that money would stay with the Universities to enable more Scottish students.

No way we're getting our fishing waters back, it's just irrelevant on a UK GDP scale. It'll get bargained away for services access for banking and insurance. It's a red line for the EU and means nothing to the Tories.

[dpedin]

EU students no longer getting free Uni education, Lockhead with a "heavy heart" in his announcement blaming Brexit when in reality they never wanted to have to pay for the EU students but were challenged in the EU courts as i remember it and lost, so ended up having to pay for the EU students as well as our own. Should save £19m and/or give more access to Scots kids so a Brexit benefit if ever there was one, not that the SG will ever admit as much. Same as the fishing industry though which should benefit from being an Independent coastal state and out of CFP. Brexit isnt all bad, not that i am a fan of leaving.

EU students was a reciprocal arrangement so there is a corresponding loss for Scottish students being able to study abroad. No idea if there is a net saving or net cost but the additional funding may well be needed to cover the costs of Scottish students studying at home who would otherwise have studied abroad. Shame, this is a retrograde and xenophobic step and limits the options for our kids to study abroad. Whats happening with the Erasmus scheme? Don't tell me we are cutting that nose off our face as well?

Fishing is an interesting one. I posted on other thread that a good chunk of what we catch in UK we dont eat so is exported and what we do eat we import a large amount of from Iceland, Norway and elsewhere. For Scotland the EU market is very important for our shellfish, farmed salmon and such like. Again not sure if Brexit will mean we are cutting off our nose to spite our face?

[clydecloggie]

I think it's been confirmed that the UK will no longer participate in the Erasmus scheme. It is, indeed, mindless xenophobia.

[Biffer]

EU students no longer getting free Uni education, Lockhead with a "heavy heart" in his announcement blaming Brexit when in reality they never wanted to have to pay for the EU students but were challenged in the EU courts as i remember it and lost, so ended up having to pay for the EU students as well as our own. Should save £19m and/or give more access to Scots kids so a Brexit benefit if ever there was one, not that the SG will ever admit as much. Same as the fishing industry though which should benefit from being an Independent coastal state and out of CFP. Brexit isnt all bad, not that i am a fan of leaving.

EU students was a reciprocal arrangement so there is a corresponding loss for Scottish students being able to study abroad. No idea if there is a net saving or net cost but the additional funding may well be needed to cover the costs of Scottish students studying at home who would otherwise have studied abroad. Shame, this is a retrograde and xenophobic step and limits the options for our kids to study abroad. Whats happening with the Erasmus scheme? Don't tell me we are cutting that nose off our face as well?

Fishing is an interesting one. I posted on other thread that a good chunk of what we catch in UK we dont eat so is exported and what we do eat we import a large amount of from Iceland, Norway and elsewhere. For Scotland the EU market is very important for our shellfish, farmed salmon and such like. Again not sure if Brexit will mean we are cutting off our nose to spite our face?

As cloggie says, we're out of Erasmus.

That's my understanding of fisheries as well. We generally now land stuff that goes to Europe for sale, so we might get our waters back, but selling what we catch will be more difficult.

[Northern Lights]

Fisheries won’t get bargained away. It will be established that we are an independent coastal state that will then allow eu boats access, whether that is access granted/negotiated annually or over longer periods is what is being negotiated. The problem for the eu is that once this is done they know the writing is on the wall and they will have less access as the years pass.

The trade flows are as described now but the eu is of decreasing importance and also what is also not recognised is the 3rd party rights we have (UK) has in the Barents Sea that at the moment is caught by a JV that’s Dutch/Icelandic owned, this will change as well.

There will be a lot of short term pain but it will correct itself pretty quickly too. We’ve been shut out of markets before and we will again, businesses adapt, develop new markets and move on.

Fisheries are a lot more important to Scotland than the UK though and the snp aren’t honest that it is them that will bargain this away for eu access.

[Slick]

EU students no longer getting free Uni education, Lockhead with a "heavy heart" in his announcement blaming Brexit when in reality they never wanted to have to pay for the EU students but were challenged in the EU courts as i remember it and lost, so ended up having to pay for the EU students as well as our own. Should save £19m and/or give more access to Scots kids so a Brexit benefit if ever there was one, not that the SG will ever admit as much. Same as the fishing industry though which should benefit from being an Independent coastal state and out of CFP. Brexit isnt all bad, not that i am a fan of leaving.

EU students was a reciprocal arrangement so there is a corresponding loss for Scottish students being able to study abroad. No idea if there is a net saving or net cost but the additional funding may well be needed to cover the costs of Scottish students studying at home who would otherwise have studied abroad. Shame, this is a retrograde and xenophobic step and limits the options for our kids to study abroad. Whats happening with the Erasmus scheme? Don't tell me we are cutting that nose off our face as well?

Fishing is an interesting one. I posted on other thread that a good chunk of what we catch in UK we dont eat so is exported and what we do eat we import a large amount of from Iceland, Norway and elsewhere. For Scotland the EU market is very important for our shellfish, farmed salmon and such like. Again not sure if Brexit will mean we are cutting off our nose to spite our face?

As cloggie says, we're out of Erasmus.

That's my understanding of fisheries as well. We generally now land stuff that goes to Europe for sale, so we might get our waters back, but selling what we catch will be more difficult.

Are we definitely out of Erasmus? I don’t know but I thought Boris was quite explicit a few months ago that we would remain in the scheme

[dpedin]

'Boris was quite explicit a few months ago that we would remain in the scheme' is not exactly a cast iron guarantee! Bit like no border in the Irish Sea or £350m for the NHS?