So, coronavirus...

[Biffer]

World in Data https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/uk-c ... gion=World is yet to be updated for yesterday's figures but had the UK at 2.68 million doses delivered as of 11th January.

Scotland, Wales, NI have been averaging at only 25K per day and need to seriously accelerate (Scotland and Wales anyway) but we should be at around 2.9 million or so delivered in total by now - so nearly 3% of the job completed

Scotland hadn’t been anywhere near 25k a day until yesterday, 26k reported vaccinated on Tuesday. Health secretary stated an aim of 400k per week by the end of Feb, which is fucking ambitious as that’d cover the entire population in 13 weeks! If the UK target is 2 million / week, Scottish equivalent would be about 170k per week. Which is 25k per day if you’re going seven days a week.

Should be able get the central belt done at something like that rate with a few hubs and GP surgeries. Will be more difficult in rural areas may well need logistical support from the army.

Yeah, but I think a lot of rural communities will have an ‘event’ style vaccination programme where there’s a lot of community assistance in getting people jagged.

[Jock42]

New research from Israel suggests the first dose of the Pfizer vaccine lowers infection rates by 50% initially. Which is tremendous news if it’s confirmed by further widespread studies as vax numbers increase.

Thats good. Got a link for that?

Posted above but here it is again

https://en.globes.co.il/en/article-majo ... 1001357016

And another one

https://www.timesofisrael.com/israeli-d ... cine-shot/

Thats not talking about how contagious you are.

[Jock42]

World in Data https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/uk-c ... gion=World is yet to be updated for yesterday's figures but had the UK at 2.68 million doses delivered as of 11th January.

Scotland, Wales, NI have been averaging at only 25K per day and need to seriously accelerate (Scotland and Wales anyway) but we should be at around 2.9 million or so delivered in total by now - so nearly 3% of the job completed

Scotland hadn’t been anywhere near 25k a day until yesterday, 26k reported vaccinated on Tuesday. Health secretary stated an aim of 400k per week by the end of Feb, which is fucking ambitious as that’d cover the entire population in 13 weeks! If the UK target is 2 million / week, Scottish equivalent would be about 170k per week. Which is 25k per day if you’re going seven days a week.

Should be able get the central belt done at something like that rate with a few hubs and GP surgeries. Will be more difficult in rural areas may well need logistical support from the army.

There are loads of us able give the vaccines and I've never heard or seen anything about us helping out elsewhere.

[Biffer]

Thats good. Got a link for that?

Posted above but here it is again

https://en.globes.co.il/en/article-majo ... 1001357016

And another one

https://www.timesofisrael.com/israeli-d ... cine-shot/

Thats not talking about how contagious you are.

No, it’s talking about you not getting infected in the first place.

[Saint]

Including other UK nations that should be north of 200k hopefully.

Needs to be around 300k per day to be on target so still improvement needed - but overall pretty good.

World in Data https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/uk-c ... gion=World is yet to be updated for yesterday's figures but had the UK at 2.68 million doses delivered as of 11th January.

Scotland, Wales, NI have been averaging at only 25K per day and need to seriously accelerate (Scotland and Wales anyway) but we should be at around 2.9 million or so delivered in total by now - so nearly 3% of the job completed

Scotland hadn’t been anywhere near 25k a day until yesterday, 26k reported vaccinated on Tuesday. Health secretary stated an aim of 400k per week by the end of Feb, which is fucking ambitious as that’d cover the entire population in 13 weeks! If the UK target is 2 million / week, Scottish equivalent would be about 170k per week. Which is 25k per day if you’re going seven days a week.

25K per day for the 3 combined. NI is managing 8K per day and is leading the way per capita

[Biffer]

World in Data https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/uk-c ... gion=World is yet to be updated for yesterday's figures but had the UK at 2.68 million doses delivered as of 11th January.

Scotland, Wales, NI have been averaging at only 25K per day and need to seriously accelerate (Scotland and Wales anyway) but we should be at around 2.9 million or so delivered in total by now - so nearly 3% of the job completed

Scotland hadn’t been anywhere near 25k a day until yesterday, 26k reported vaccinated on Tuesday. Health secretary stated an aim of 400k per week by the end of Feb, which is fucking ambitious as that’d cover the entire population in 13 weeks! If the UK target is 2 million / week, Scottish equivalent would be about 170k per week. Which is 25k per day if you’re going seven days a week.

25K per day for the 3 combined. NI is managing 8K per day and is leading the way per capita

Ah right, didn’t pick that up.

Well, if Scotland maintains the numbers from yesterday we’re on a good path I think

[Insane_Homer]

[Sandstorm]

Say what you like about the NHS, at least there's a national database of every person in the UK with their personal data stored in one, accessible place.

South Africa is getting the vaccine soon, but there is no plan on how they'll start jabbing people. Or even how they'll contact "all people over the age of 80 to come into the clinic for a vaccine first"

[Biffer]

Say what you like about the NHS, at least there's a national database of every person in the UK with their personal data stored in one, accessible place.

You should be on the stage

[Dogbert]

Scotland hadn’t been anywhere near 25k a day until yesterday, 26k reported vaccinated on Tuesday. Health secretary stated an aim of 400k per week by the end of Feb, which is fucking ambitious as that’d cover the entire population in 13 weeks! If the UK target is 2 million / week, Scottish equivalent would be about 170k per week. Which is 25k per day if you’re going seven days a week.

25K per day for the 3 combined. NI is managing 8K per day and is leading the way per capita

Ah right, didn’t pick that up.

Well, if Scotland maintains the numbers from yesterday we’re on a good path I think

The numbers for Scotland were over 16K today today , as opposed to 12.5K yesterday , so a significant ramping up , as per the JCVI protocol , they have at least vaccinated 80% of care home residents with a first does , and 55% of dare home staff , along with 52% of NHS workers , It will of course be easier once we get down to the less vulnerable , who can attend mass vaccination centres , but that will rely on vaccine supply

[fishfoodie]

Say what you like about the NHS, at least there's a national database of every person in the UK with their personal data stored in one, accessible place.

South Africa is getting the vaccine soon, but there is no plan on how they'll start jabbing people. Or even how they'll contact "all people over the age of 80 to come into the clinic for a vaccine first"

Doesn't SA have a State Pension ?

Hand them a leaflet when they drop by the PO or where ever to collect their pension.

[Biffer]

25K per day for the 3 combined. NI is managing 8K per day and is leading the way per capita

Ah right, didn’t pick that up.

Well, if Scotland maintains the numbers from yesterday we’re on a good path I think

The numbers for Scotland were over 16K today today , as opposed to 12.5K yesterday , so a significant ramping up , as per the JCVI protocol , they have at least vaccinated 80% of care home residents with a first does , and 55% of dare home staff , along with 52% of NHS workers , It will of course be easier once we get down to the less vulnerable , who can attend mass vaccination centres , but that will rely on vaccine supply

Yeah, you’re right, just went back to check it’s 16k. I can’t count.

[The Druid]

What is the info on this new boy from Brazil? Should we be even more worried or just a press overemphasis?

[tc27]

What is the info on this new boy from Brazil? Should we be even more worried or just a press overemphasis?

No idea...but a quick check of Flight 24 shows plenty of flights between Europe and Brazil so obviously not a huge concern.

[Jock42]

Posted above but here it is again

https://en.globes.co.il/en/article-majo ... 1001357016

And another one

https://www.timesofisrael.com/israeli-d ... cine-shot/

Thats not talking about how contagious you are.

No, it’s talking about you not getting infected in the first place.

Thats all expected as per their trial. That won't stop some people carrying the disease which is the original discussion with OS

[Rhubarb & Custard]

Say what you like about the NHS, at least there's a national database of every person in the UK with their personal data stored in one, accessible place.

You should be on the stage

We have looked at it, and indeed spent a fair bit of money on it, and it's possibly come as far as the track and trace system. Other then the technical, security, privacy and cost concerns, and the slight issue of little to no progress it's going well.

That said if you were to look at just how fragmented the delivery of health service is in some countries, even some other western countries (and one thinks of course about the USA), well things could be a lot worse in our record keeping.

[Openside]

Say what you like about the NHS, at least there's a national database of every person in the UK with their personal data stored in one, accessible place.

You should be on the stage

Hmm I was thinking didn't we spunk away endless billions trying to achieve that?

[Dinsdale Piranha]

What is the info on this new boy from Brazil? Should we be even more worried or just a press overemphasis?

Hard to tell yet but it has both the mutations from the SA variant and the British variant which potentially means it's both more transmissible and less responsive to treatments.

There are probably a load of nasty variants out there but only a few countries are doing gene sequencing on a large number of samples so they may well spread and you won't find out until they arrive in a country with decent sequencing capabilities - in this case Japan.

[The Druid]

What is the info on this new boy from Brazil? Should we be even more worried or just a press overemphasis?

Hard to tell yet but it has both the mutations from the SA variant and the British variant which potentially means it's both more transmissible and less responsive to treatments.

There are probably a load of nasty variants out there but only a few countries are doing gene sequencing on a large number of samples so they may well spread and you won't find out until they arrive in a country with decent sequencing capabilities - in this case Japan.

As you say it has already been found in Japan. and so probably already in many other countries, unfortunately.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-heal ... SKBN29F08R

[Raggs]

I wish the uk had a system as well run as Israel. Identity card with number. Everything is linked to that number. Hospitals and health insurance can access medical records, police can access criminal records etc etc all connected on a single number but partitioned by requirement/access rights.

[tc27]

I wish the uk had a system as well run as Israel. Identity card with number. Everything is linked to that number. Hospitals and health insurance can access medical records, police can access criminal records etc etc all connected on a single number but partitioned by requirement/access rights.

Blair tried this...the usual suspects (those now telling us no one is dying from CV) lost their shit.

[FalseBayFC]

Say what you like about the NHS, at least there's a national database of every person in the UK with their personal data stored in one, accessible place.

South Africa is getting the vaccine soon, but there is no plan on how they'll start jabbing people. Or even how they'll contact "all people over the age of 80 to come into the clinic for a vaccine first"

Doesn't SA have a State Pension ?

Hand them a leaflet when they drop by the PO or where ever to collect their pension.

They will use the SASSA database which is our social security system. This should cover all state pensioners and disability grant beneficiaries. Just about all of them collect their benefits at centralized points every month so I should imagine that will be the strategy.

The medical aids are pretty efficient and have already allocated funding to pay for their members. They will drive uptake with the more affluent market.

[Jock42]

I wish the uk had a system as well run as Israel. Identity card with number. Everything is linked to that number. Hospitals and health insurance can access medical records, police can access criminal records etc etc all connected on a single number but partitioned by requirement/access rights.

I'd be happy if we could access people's medical records and not just what meds they're on. Anything above that would be a bonus.

[Biffer]

Thats not talking about how contagious you are.

No, it’s talking about you not getting infected in the first place.

Thats all expected as per their trial. That won't stop some people carrying the disease which is the original discussion with OS

Actually, the whole point of that is that it stops people getting infected, so stops them carrying the virus. That was NOT proved in Pfizer’s trial. Their trial demonstrated that it stopped people getting ill, but further research would be needed to establish whether it stopped people being infected. This is the first part of that further research.

[Jock42]

Clearly I need a proper read not a skim but what I did read doesn't suggest that everyone will not be carriers which would still impact our patient care.

[Denny Crane]

I'm pretty sure the people of this thread will be able to make sense of such things but i'm a little confused by the growing doubt over the accuracy of the 'tests' that determine the numbers that fuel the imposed restrictions. As you guys probably know, scientists around the world, including leaders in fields such as immunology and the (deceased) chap who was awarded a nobel prize for developing the PCR process, had warned about RNA amplification beyond 25 cycles reducing accuracy to as little as 3% at around 45 cycles.

The momentum behind the doubt surrounding the accuracy of the positive numbers triggering current drastic measures appears to be gaining ground. The WHO, published an Information Notice for IVD Users in December warning that high cycle thresholds will result in false positives.
https://www.who.int/news/item/14-12-202 ... -ivd-users

The FDA added it's own statement of concern on January 4
https://www.fda.gov/medical-devices/saf ... RHTwitterD

From an interesting legal perspective, you may also be aware that the Lisbon court of appeal, recently ruled that it was illegal to force a German man and his companions to quarantine based on the science supporting the results of PCR Rna amplification in relation to identifying an infection, without a doctor's diagnosis. "In view of current scientific evidence, this test shows itself to be unable to determine beyond reasonable doubt that such positivity corresponds, in fact, to the infection of a person by the SARS-CoV-2 virus." The full text is at

https://translate.google.com/translate? ... 1f003e7b30

Additionally on the legal front,
Consumer protection trial lawyer Dr Reiner Fuellmich, (noted for bringing Deutsche Bank scams and VW diesel fraud to justice) is building a global class action lawsuit against the corporative giants responsible for manipulating the situation to their advantage including the WHO on the basis of supporting the continued use of the PCR test to justify unnecessary restrictions.
There is an interview highlighted below with Dr Fuellmich for anyone open to considering a perspective beyond mainstream media. I figured Fuellmich had done enough good work to warrant hearing what he has to say before it gets removed.

[Biffer]

Clearly I need a proper read not a skim but what I did read doesn't suggest that everyone will not be carriers which would still impact our patient care.

Oh yeah, it doesn’t say that everyone won’t be a carrier, but it says somewhere between 33 and 50 percent of those immunised won’t be. It’s good news.

[Insane_Homer]

[JPNZ]

Slightly off-topic but has anyone found any concrete evidence that the Pfizer/BioNTech vaccine or AstraZeneca actually protects against the latest Brazilian/South African mutations of COVID-19? Seems many posters are pinning their hopes on the vaccine when mutations pose a much greater threat than the original.

[Biffer]

Slightly off-topic but has anyone found any concrete evidence that the Pfizer/BioNTech vaccine or AstraZeneca actually protects against the latest Brazilian/South African mutations of COVID-19? Seems many posters are pinning their hopes on the vaccine when mutations pose a much greater threat than the original.

Pfizer have done lad tests against 16 new variants with blood from vaccinated individuals, and they all reported positive results. More work to be done but initial tests look good.

Data on the Kent variant from AstraZeneca suggests it shouldn’t be any less effective, data on SA variant soon https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-heal ... SKBN29I18P

[Raggs]

I'm pretty sure the people of this thread will be able to make sense of such things but i'm a little confused by the growing doubt over the accuracy of the 'tests' that determine the numbers that fuel the imposed restrictions. As you guys probably know, scientists around the world, including leaders in fields such as immunology and the (deceased) chap who was awarded a nobel prize for developing the PCR process, had warned about RNA amplification beyond 25 cycles reducing accuracy to as little as 3% at around 45 cycles.

The momentum behind the doubt surrounding the accuracy of the positive numbers triggering current drastic measures appears to be gaining ground. The WHO, published an Information Notice for IVD Users in December warning that high cycle thresholds will result in false positives.
https://www.who.int/news/item/14-12-202 ... -ivd-users

The FDA added it's own statement of concern on January 4
https://www.fda.gov/medical-devices/saf ... RHTwitterD

From an interesting legal perspective, you may also be aware that the Lisbon court of appeal, recently ruled that it was illegal to force a German man and his companions to quarantine based on the science supporting the results of PCR Rna amplification in relation to identifying an infection, without a doctor's diagnosis. "In view of current scientific evidence, this test shows itself to be unable to determine beyond reasonable doubt that such positivity corresponds, in fact, to the infection of a person by the SARS-CoV-2 virus." The full text is at

https://translate.google.com/translate? ... 1f003e7b30

Additionally on the legal front,
Consumer protection trial lawyer Dr Reiner Fuellmich, (noted for bringing Deutsche Bank scams and VW diesel fraud to justice) is building a global class action lawsuit against the corporative giants responsible for manipulating the situation to their advantage including the WHO on the basis of supporting the continued use of the PCR test to justify unnecessary restrictions.
There is an interview highlighted below with Dr Fuellmich for anyone open to considering a perspective beyond mainstream media. I figured Fuellmich had done enough good work to warrant hearing what he has to say before it gets removed.

Yes, PCR can be inaccurate if done poorly.

We've recorded rates of less than 0.5% positivity in large batches of tests. That quite literally means that the PCR tests are either giving false positive rates of 0.5% or less, or they're giving false negatives in virtually every test, and we're all infected.

EDIT - As for the court case, you can get a positive test result even after you have recovered from Covid, since it's looking for virus particles, not necessarily live viruses.

[Saint]

Scotland hadn’t been anywhere near 25k a day until yesterday, 26k reported vaccinated on Tuesday. Health secretary stated an aim of 400k per week by the end of Feb, which is fucking ambitious as that’d cover the entire population in 13 weeks! If the UK target is 2 million / week, Scottish equivalent would be about 170k per week. Which is 25k per day if you’re going seven days a week.

25K per day for the 3 combined. NI is managing 8K per day and is leading the way per capita

Ah right, didn’t pick that up.

Well, if Scotland maintains the numbers from yesterday we’re on a good path I think

Latest total from gov.uk has us 3.07 million doses delivered - so actually a significant rampup, and would equate to a bit of 1.5 million at 7 days per week

[C69]

Slightly off-topic but has anyone found any concrete evidence that the Pfizer/BioNTech vaccine or AstraZeneca actually protects against the latest Brazilian/South African mutations of COVID-19? Seems many posters are pinning their hopes on the vaccine when mutations pose a much greater threat than the original.

What do you mean by a greater threat?
I am not too sure about the Brazilian variant butt have not heard the others are more virulent.
Tbh most virus become less virulent over time as they evolve.

[JPNZ]

You must have missed most major news outlets that discussed mutations up to 70% more transmissible

What do you mean by a greater threat?
I am not too sure about the Brazilian variant butt have not heard the others are more virulent.
Tbh most virus become less virulent over time as they evolve.

A new variant was reported by U.K. health officials to the World Health Organization on Dec. 14 that is now known formally as “VOC 202012/01” (which stands for “variant of concern, year 2020, month 12, variant 01″).

The variant was first detected in a patient in Kent, southeast England, in September. It then quickly spread to London. With infections surging in both regions, early analysis suggested it may be up to 70% more transmissible than the old variant that was circulating in the country.

Hot on the heels of the news from the U.K., South Africa’s authorities announced on Dec. 18 the detection of a mutation that was rapidly spreading in Eastern Cape, Western Cape, and KwaZulu-Natal. It has now become the country’s dominant strain of the coronavirus.

South Africa named the variant “501Y.V2” because of the N501Y mutation found in the spike protein. This mutation, among others, was also found in the new U.K. strain and, as such, it is thought to be similarly more transmissible.

The South Africa strain does contain other mutations, and these have prompted some concerns that it could prove more resistant to coronavirus vaccines.

[Saint]

Slightly off-topic but has anyone found any concrete evidence that the Pfizer/BioNTech vaccine or AstraZeneca actually protects against the latest Brazilian/South African mutations of COVID-19? Seems many posters are pinning their hopes on the vaccine when mutations pose a much greater threat than the original.

Pfizer have done lad tests against 16 new variants with blood from vaccinated individuals, and they all reported positive results. More work to be done but initial tests look good.

Data on the Kent variant from AstraZeneca suggests it shouldn’t be any less effective, data on SA variant soon https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-heal ... SKBN29I18P

The major thing is that the antibodies generated against the new strain(s) appear to be the same as those generated against the original strains.

[C69]

You must have missed most major news outlets that discussed mutations up to 70% more transmissible

What do you mean by a greater threat?
I am not too sure about the Brazilian variant butt have not heard the others are more virulent.
Tbh most virus become less virulent over time as they evolve.

A new variant was reported by U.K. health officials to the World Health Organization on Dec. 14 that is now known formally as “VOC 202012/01” (which stands for “variant of concern, year 2020, month 12, variant 01″).

The variant was first detected in a patient in Kent, southeast England, in September. It then quickly spread to London. With infections surging in both regions, early analysis suggested it may be up to 70% more transmissible than the old variant that was circulating in the country.

Hot on the heels of the news from the U.K., South Africa’s authorities announced on Dec. 18 the detection of a mutation that was rapidly spreading in Eastern Cape, Western Cape, and KwaZulu-Natal. It has now become the country’s dominant strain of the coronavirus.

South Africa named the variant “501Y.V2” because of the N501Y mutation found in the spike protein. This mutation, among others, was also found in the new U.K. strain and, as such, it is thought to be similarly more transmissible.

The South Africa strain does contain other mutations, and these have prompted some concerns that it could prove more resistant to coronavirus vaccines.

Err I mentioned virulence not transmissibility and clarified why in my response.
Transmissibility and virulence are completely different.

[JPNZ]

Err I mentioned virulence not transmissibility and clarified why in my response.
Transmissibility and virulence are completely different.

I see, guess you can take your pick of which is more threatening.

[C69]

Err I mentioned virulence not transmissibility and clarified why in my response.
Transmissibility and virulence are completely different.

I see, guess you can take your pick of which is more threatening.

No there is no question that virulence is more threatening

[Biffer]

25K per day for the 3 combined. NI is managing 8K per day and is leading the way per capita

Ah right, didn’t pick that up.

Well, if Scotland maintains the numbers from yesterday we’re on a good path I think

Latest total from gov.uk has us 3.07 million doses delivered - so actually a significant rampup, and would equate to a bit of 1.5 million at 7 days per week

Scottish government vaccination plan published. Plan for 400,000 a week, more than 5,000 vaccinators already in place not including a lot of GPs and some others. All over fifties to have had both doses by July. Ambitious but from what's in there doesn't seem unrealistic.

https://www.gov.scot/publications/coron ... plan-2021/

[Saint]

Ah right, didn’t pick that up.

Well, if Scotland maintains the numbers from yesterday we’re on a good path I think

Latest total from gov.uk has us 3.07 million doses delivered - so actually a significant rampup, and would equate to a bit of 1.5 million at 7 days per week

Scottish government vaccination plan published. Plan for 400,000 a week, more than 5,000 vaccinators already in place not including a lot of GPs and some others. All over fifties to have had both doses by July. Ambitious but from what's in there doesn't seem unrealistic.

https://www.gov.scot/publications/coron ... plan-2021/

If Scotland hit 400k per week then 2 million UK wide comes together easily. I'd been optimistic that we would overachieve that target, but it's genuinely coming together by the looks of it. All over 50s to be doubled doses by July is a serious overachieve